Post/Author/DateTime	Post
malignor 04-08-08, 04:25 PM	I think I may have found the reason why the DD may be useful for a Sorcerer. Any (reasonable) build with at least 8 sorcerer levels and the spell Polymorph known is good. Why? Polymorph is as Alter Self, which says You retain your own ability scores. Your class and level, hit points, alignment, base attack bonus, and base save bonuses all remain the same. You retain all supernatural and spell-like special attacks and qualities of your normal form, except for those requiring a body part that the new form does not have (such as a mouth for a breath weapon or eyes for a gaze attack). You keep all extraordinary special attacks and qualities derived from class levels, but you lose any from your normal form that are not derived from class levels. Polymorph does not override any of this text. Now look at Dragon Disciple. Look at all the bonuses you get from Class Levels. Then look at all the bonus spell slots (which would of course be 4th level or higher), which means alot more polymorphing. You now have a Sorcerer that can eventually Polymorph into monsters with the half-dragon template. Even the wings and natural weapons are extraordinary class features, so they carry across to the next form. Is this old news, or am I (officially) incorrect? I say "officially" because I'm not asking about DM ruling, just about the game mechanics.
IdleAltruism 04-08-08, 06:07 PM	From the SRD http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/polymorph.htm This spell functions like alter self, except that you change the willing subject into another form of living creature. The new form may be of the same type as the subject or any of the following types: aberration, animal, dragon, fey, giant, humanoid, magical beast, monstrous humanoid, ooze, plant, or vermin. The assumed form can’t have more Hit Dice than your caster level (or the subject’s HD, whichever is lower), to a maximum of 15 HD at 15th level. You can’t cause a subject to assume a form smaller than Fine, nor can you cause a subject to assume an incorporeal or gaseous form. The subject’s creature type and subtype (if any) change to match the new form. The subject gains the Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution scores of the new form but retains its own Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma scores. It also gains all extraordinary special attacks possessed by the form but does not gain the extraordinary special qualities possessed by the new form or any supernatural or spell-like abilities. Here is an easy to read version of the polymorph errata http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=589497 The Dragon Disciple is a more martial class with a splash of spellcasting. It can be interesting when combined with a level or 2-4 of Battle Sorcerer/Abjurant Champion. Martial Strikes work very well with the class(along with several feats that all gishes love), since they have a 3/4 BAB. So yeah, you're officially wrong. The polymorph errata hit it pretty good(it's still overpowered though)
StevenO 04-08-08, 06:30 PM	Perhaps one could try that as a Battle Sorcerer but going into DragonD as a pure sorcerer is basically madness. Essentially I read the OP's suggestion as using the DragonD to turn a polymorphing caster into a slightly improved tank. Realistically you'd be better off playing a tanking class into DragonD to begin with or should just continue you spellcasting advancement which would offer more options in the long run.
malignor 04-09-08, 11:25 AM	From the SRD http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/polymorph.htm Here is an easy to read version of the polymorph errata http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=589497 The Dragon Disciple is a more martial class with a splash of spellcasting. It can be interesting when combined with a level or 2-4 of Battle Sorcerer/Abjurant Champion. Martial Strikes work very well with the class(along with several feats that all gishes love), since they have a 3/4 BAB. So yeah, you're officially wrong. The polymorph errata hit it pretty good(it's still overpowered though)The Polymorph Subschool part about turfing class features is what kills it. Lame-ness.