Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Iarmeister 01-10-07, 04:04 PM	I know I posted this once before on the FR message boards, but wanted to post here as well. This is my take on what a 3.5 version of a Spellfire Channeler could/should be. This comes after playing a SC in a campaign, and having some legitimate concerns about the class; concerns that I've tried to correct with this version. For example, imo the spellfire mechanic itself was flawed in my mind: Requiring an RTA or TA to hit, but then also allowing a Ref SV whose DC was static was an overzealous attempt by Wizards at balancing out this realms-shaking ability. However, what they in fact made was an ability that was no better than a 5th level spell, and whose usefulness does not scale well with advancing levels. Also, in the Spellfire Trilogy novelizations we see Shandril absorb spellfire many times, some of which she wasn't necessarily prepared for. I've tried to incorporate an ability that allows for this, but also doesn't break the bank, per se. It is my hope that my version of the spellfire channeler ably satisfies the needs most characters have at higher levels, while maintaining abilities that are not so fantastic at lower levels as to be 'broken'. Anyway...I welcome suggestion, complaints, and praises. :D Special shout out to Maverick Wolf for allowing me to use some of feats he presented in his Spellfire Warrior base class; Atomic Jess for the Spellfire Boost class ability idea... There are a couple of other names on these boards that added to my idea when I first posted in the FR message boards, and I will add those names to this post when I go and find them. :P So, w/o further adieu... 3.5 Spellfire Channeler v1.0 Flavor text on its way... Hit Die: d4 Requirements: To qualify to become a spellfire channeler, a character must fulfill the following criteria: Skills: Concentration 8 ranks, knowledge (arcana) 2 ranks, Spellcraft 2 ranks Feats: Endurance, Spellfire Wielder, Weapon Focus (spellfire) Class Skills: Spellfire channeler class skills (and key attribute for each) are Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Disguise (Cha), Heal (Wis), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (arcana) (Int), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Spellcraft (Int), Survival (Wis) Skill Points at Each Level: 2 + Int modifier. Level BAB Fort Ref Will ------------------------------ 1 +0 +2 +0 +2 2 +1 +3 +0 +3 3 +1 +3 +1 +3 4 +2 +4 +1 +4 5 +2 +4 +1 +4 6 +3 +5 +2 +5 7 +3 +5 +2 +5 8 +4 +6 +2 +6 9 +4 +6 +3 +6 10 +5 +7 +3 +7 Level Special Abilities ------------------------------------------------------------------- 1 True Spellfire, Increased Storage 2, Reactive Absorption 1/day 2 Spellfire Ability 3 Increased Storage 3, Drain Magic Item 4 Spellfire Ability 5 Increased Storage 4, Pushing the Limit, Reactive Absorption 2/day 6 Spellfire Ability 7 Increased Storage 5, Spellfire Boost 8 Spellfire Ability 9 Crown of Fire, Reactive Absorption 3/day 10 Spellfire Ability, Spellfire Supreme Class Features: Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Spellfire Channelers are proficient with all simple weapons. They are not proficient with any type of armor or shields. True Spellfire (Su): At first level, the raw magic that a spellfire channeler stores and unleashes is more potent than ever. Now, whenever a spellfire channeler successfully uses spellfire to attack an oppenent, unless it is specifically stated otherwise (under a spellfire ability, for example), the channeler's opponent is no longer allowed a Ref SV for half-damage. And, the spellfire channeler may full-round attack with multiple blasts, provided her base attack bonus is high enough, though the spellfire energy levels she may cumulatively expend is still governed by her Con score. Also, starting at first level, a spellfire channeler becomes a living battery of raw magic and is able to regenerate spellfire energy without the necessity of constantly drawing upon spells or magic items. In the same way a sorcerer recovers her spell-slots, after sleeping for 8 hours a spellfire channeler regains a number of spellfire energy levels equal to her class level x her natural Con modifier (if any, but always at least her class levels), to a maximum equal to her Con score. Increased Storage (Ex): The channeler's capacity for storing spellfire energy levels is multiplied by the listed value. However, spellfire energy levels in excess of the channeler's Con score is dangerous, with different effects depending upon the number of levels stored: Con +1 to Con x2: The channeler's eyes glow brightly and any creature, magic item, or spell effect that touches the channeler causes 1 spellfire energy level to be discharged as a harmless burst of light. Once/day the channeler must make a Constitution check (DC 10) or take 1d6 points of damage as one of her spellfire energy levels backfires. Con x2+1 to Con x3: As above, plus the channeler's skin glows (shedding light as a candle), a touch releases 1d4 spellfire energy levels as light, and the channeler must make the backfire Constitution check every hour. Con x3+1 to Con x4: As above, except the channeler sheds light equal to a torch, feels a burning sensation within her body (treat as if distracted by non-damaging spell, DC 20 to concentrate), and must make the backfire Constitution check every minute. A touch releases 1d6 spellfire energy levels as a flare spell (DC 10 + number of spellfire energy levels expended) against the channeler and all creatures within 5 feet of her. Con x4+1 to Con x5: As above, except the character radiates a palpable (but non-damaging) heat to a radius of 20 feet, is in pain (treat as if distracted by a non-damaging spell, DC 25 to concentrate), and must make the backfire Constitution check every round. A touch releases 2d6 spellfire energy levels as a flare spell (DC 10 + number of spellfire energy levels expended) against the channeler and all creatures within 5 feet of her. The channeler must make a Will SV (DC 25) every round or be forced to expend a maximum-strength blast of energy at a random target within 30 feet in preference to any action. Regardless of the number of spellfire energy levels stored, a character can voluntarily expend only a number of spellfire energy levels per round equal to her Constitution score, plus any when pushing the limit (class ability, see below). Involuntary expenditure, such as that noted above, isn't limited in this way. Reactive Absorption (Ex): A spellfire channeler may absorb an incoming spell even if she hasn't readied herself for it. She may do this once per day, and is an immediate action which still requires her to be aware of the attack. At 5th level she can do this 2/day; at 9th level she can do this 3/day. Spellfire Ability: At 2nd level, and then every even numbered level thereafter, a spellfire channeler may choose a new ability that she has discovered. These abilities help to represent the uniqueness of each channeler, and how spellfire has distinctively manifested within them: Area Absorption (Su): You have learned to absorb spells that you couldn't otherwise. Benefit: Anytime you could absorb a spell, you may absorb the effects of an area spell. You only gain spellfire energy levels equal to 1/2 the level of the spell (rounded down), and the spell is negated only for you. All others in its area are affected normally. Normal: You cannot absorb area spells. Improved Healing (Su): The spellfire channeler can release stored spellfire energy levels to heal by touch. Benefit: This standard action restores 1d4+1 hit points/expended spellfire energy level. Normal: Only 2 hit points/expended spellfire energy level. Improved Reactive Absorption (Ex): You have learned to keep you body ready to absorb spellfire energy levels. Benefit: You may absorb a spell cast at you without readying an action to do so an additional 3 times/day. Special: You may take this ability more than once. Each time you do, you may use reactive absorption an additional 3 times/day. Elemental Control (Su): You are not limited to fire like other spellfire wielders. Prerequisites: One spellfire ability. Benefit: When wielding spellfire, you may make the elemental half of the spellfire damage deal elemental damage of a type other than fire. You may choose acid, electricity, or cold. You may not use this feat to deal sonic damage. Normal: Spellfire damage is half-magic/half-fire only. Spellfire Bolt (Su): Prerequisites: One spellfire ability. Benefit: the spellfire channeler gains the ability to discharge spellfire as a 120' line. This effect costs 3 levels to use and deals 1d6 damage/expended spellfire energy level above the 3 to initiate the spellfire bolt. For example, if the spellfire channeler spends 10 levels of spellfire, she will create a 120' line that deals 7d6 points of spellfire damage. Opponents are allowed a Ref SV for half damage (DC 10 + class level + Cha modifier). Inner fire (Su): Prerequisites: Ability to cast arcane or divine spells, one spellfire ability. Benefit: As a swift action, you may convert your prepared spells (or unused spell-slots) into spellfire energy levels as though you had absorbed a spell of that level. Special: You may convert any number of spells or spell slots totaling up to your Constitution score at one time using this secret. Improved Area Absorption (Su): Your skills in absorbing area spells have increased. Prerequisites: Area Absorption Benefit: As Area Absorption, but you gain spellfire energy levels equal to the level of the spell, rather than 1/2 level of the spell. Greater Area Absorption (Su): You have mastered the art of absorbing area spells. Prerequisites: Area Absorption, Improved Area Absorption Benefit: As Improved Area Absorption, but also you may choose to negate the effects of the entire area spell, rather than negating the effects only for you. Spellfire Counter (Su): You have learned to use spellfire to counter the spells and spellfire of others. Prerequisites: 2 spellfire abilities. Benefit: You may use spellfire to counter a spell. This ability uses normal countering mechanics, except you must spend spellfire energy levels equal to the level of the spell to be countered +1 to counter it. Counter another's spellfire works essentially the same way, but you only have to release a number of spellfire energy levels = to the number used by the other wielder. However, there is no way to know exactly how many are being used by the other wielder, and you may only partially counter. If you use more spellfire energy levels than needed, the extra levels are wasted. Normal: You may not use spellfire to counter spells. Deflect Arrows (Su): Prerequisites: Two spellfire abilities. Benefit: The channeler gains the Deflect Arrows feat, although rather than using a hand, a single spellfire energy level is expended to knock he missile away. This is considered an immediate action, and the spellfire channeler must have at least one stored spellfire energy level to use this ability. Flight (Su): Prerequisites: Two spellfire abilities. Benefit: The channeler can expend spellfire energy levels to fly, as the spell. each spellfire energy level expended allows the channeler to fly for 1 minute. the flying channeler leaves a visible trail of light that fades after one round. Flurry of Fire (Ex): Prerequisites: Three spellfire abilities. Benefit: As a full round action, a channeler may make an additional spellfire blast at her highest attack bonus. All the attacks she make this round, including the extra blast, are made with a -2 penalty, and the maximum spellfire energy levels she may expend in the round is still governed by her Con score (not counting any she may 'push'). Seething Spellfire (Ex): Prerequisites: Three spellfire abilities. Benefit: The crit range for spellfire is increased to 19-20/x2. Maelstrom of Fire (Su): Prerequisites: Four spellfire abilities. Benefit: As a standard action, the channeler can release spellfire energy in all directions as a 20-foot-radius spread, dealing 1d6 damage per spellfire energy level expended to all creatures in the area (Ref SV for half, DC 10 + class level + Cha modifier). Maximize Spellfire (Su): Prerequisites: Four spellfire abilities. Benefit: When using spellfire to create destructive blasts or to use increased healing, you may pay additional spellfire energy levels equal to 1/2 the amount spent on the blasts or healing to maximize these effects (minimum of 1). these levels count toward the limit of spellfire energy levels that can be released at one time. Maximized spellfire deals maximum damage or cures the maximum number of hit points. Drain Magic Item (Sp): At 3rd level and higher, a spellfire channeler can drain power from either touch-charged items (or single-use items such as potions and scrolls) or from permanent magic items simply by touching them. Doing so is a standard action and, when drained in this fashion, a single-use item has no magical properties (a potion becomes water, a scroll becomes blank paper). Only one feature of a multiple-use charged item (such as a scroll with several spells) can be drained per round. An item that creates spell effects (such as boots of speed) loses that function for 24 hours, but is still a magic item (for purposes of making saving throws when damaged, and so on). In each instance, the channeler gains spellfire energy levels equal to half the caster level of the item (rounded down). A creature gets to make a Will SV (DC 10) to prevent one of its held or carried items from being drained. Pushing the Limit (Ex): A spellfire channeler is normally limited in how many stored spellfire energy levels she may expend per round by her Con score. However, starting at 5th level a spellfire channeler may expend spellfire energy levels that exceed her Constitution score. She may do this 1/day per class level, and the additional amount of spellfire energy levels she may push each time are equal to her class level, but restricted by her Cha bonus (if any). When pushing the limit during a spellfire blast, she adds an additional +1d6 to her damage for every spellfire energy level pushed. If she is firing multiple spellfire blasts, then it is only the blast whose invested spellfire energy levels exceed her Con score that is considered pushed. For every two levels she pushes an attack, her opponent must also make a Fort SV (DC 10 + class level + Cha modifier) or be stunned for one round. Thus, if the channeler pushes 4 extra levels, then her opponent must succeed on her Fort SV or be stunned for two consecutive rounds. Opponents who successfully make their Fort SV negate the stun effect, but not the extra damage. When used to heal, she may add the pushed spellfire energy levels to the total hit points healed, or if she has the Improved Healing ability, she may re-roll any 'ones' on the d4s, up to how many spell-levels she pushed. She must take the new rolls regardless of whether or not they come up 'one' again. Pushing the limit is very taxing on the body. For every spellfire energy level a channeler pushes, she takes 1d6 points of sub-dual damage. Spellfire Boost (Su): At 7th level and higher, a spellfire channeler may spend stored spellfire energy levels to temporarily boost her Str, Dex, or Con scores. Boosting in this fashion is a swift action, and the ability remains boosted for one round. She may only boost one ability score at a time, and cannot have more than one ability score boosted at any time via this ability. Each spellfire energy level spent temporarily boosts the chosen ability score by one point, and she may spend spellfire energy levels up to her Cha modifier. Crown of Fire (Su): Starting at 9th level, a channeler can manifest the crown of fire, which appears as a halo of spellfire around her head and provides light equal to a daylight spell, by expending 10 spellfire energy levels. The crown of fire also gives her damage reduction 10/magic and automatically melts all non-magical weapons that strike her (after inflicting damage, if any). The crown of fire grants the channeler spell resistance 32 (as the spell resistance spell). Maintaining the crown of fire requires spending 10 spellfire energy levels each round, which can be done as a swift actioin. The crown of fire does not interfere with the channeler's actions, including using other spellfire abilities. Spellfire Supreme (Su): So in-tune with the flow of raw magic does the channeler become, that at 10th level they gain some truly fanastic abilities. First, she gains the ability to retain her connection with her spellfire even in situations, or areas, where she would normally not be able to use spellfire (such as in an anti-magic area, or dead-magic zone). In order to use her spellfire abilities in such an area, she must succeed on a Concentration check DC 20 + spellfire energy levels she plans to use (including any 'pushed' spellfire energy levels). When pushing the limit, her ability to handle the physical strain improves: she now only takes 1d6 points of sub-dual damage for every two levels of spellfire energy pushed. Lastly, she may amplify her spellfire power by drawing on her own life force. She can increase the die size for any of her damaging spellfire abilities; but, only for a single use. However, using this ability causes Con damage based on how much she increases the die size, as follows: 2 points for d8 damage, 4 points for d10 damage, 6 points for d12 damage (For example, assuming the channeler had an 18 Con score, she may spend 12 spellfire energy levels and deal 6 Con damage to herself in order to launch a 12d12 spellfire blast - or a 9d12 spellfire bolt, if she has the spellfire bolt ability).
Iarmeister 01-11-07, 02:03 AM	Anything? Any comments or ideas at all??? Hello...?? :cool: :bump:
ShadowSage 01-15-07, 05:46 PM	I've just had the chance to look it over briefly but I like what I see so far. I'll look it over and let you know what my opinions are within the next day or two.
Iarmeister 01-15-07, 06:49 PM	Holy crap...a reply! :D Check it out at your leisure and lemme know what you think. I'm open to all ideas and suggestions. Thanks.
ShadowSage 01-17-07, 10:23 PM	Looks really good to me. I especially like the way that you have a list of spellfire abilities for people to pick and choose from. Lots more options that way. Have you considered taking this class epic? I'd be interested in saeeing what you come up with.
Iarmeister 01-18-07, 12:53 AM	Thank you very much for your kind words. I can't claim full credit for the list of Spellfire Abilities, as, like I said, I borrowed some ideas from Maverick Wolf and a few others. But, it only makes sense to me that as rare an ability as spellfire is supposed to be, it's entirely likely that the way it manifests in different wielders is probably varied and unique, too. In truth, I tried looking up the older thread I posted on so I could give due credit, but it's no longer on the boards...at least I couldn't find it. I honestly hadn't thought about taking it epic, but that's only because we already have 3.5 ready Spellfire Heirophant found in the Players Guide to Faerun. I'd have to see that class again to really know what I'd change (if anything)... ...off the top of my head, however, I remember Shandril, towards the end of Crown of Fire and Hand of Fire, being able to teleport and Dim Door using Spellfire. In 2e's Volo's Guide To All Things Magical, Spellfire was detailed to 18th level. Of course, they made it rather impossible to advance in that dual-class, but some of the powers they outlined were really epic-like. I'd probably make some of those available. I am, of course, open to suggestions. Anything you'd like to see added to the epic-only list??
AtomicJess 01-19-07, 02:19 AM	Looks good!!! I really like how customizable the class is with all of the Spellfire Abilities. Every Spellfire Channeler player would be completely different from every other Spellfire Channeler.
Iarmeister 01-19-07, 02:39 AM	Looks good!!! I really like how customizable the class is with all of the Spellfire Abilities. Every Spellfire Channeler player would be completely different from every other Spellfire Channeler. Which is a bonus, imo. One complaint I hear more than others about PrC's is that two separate characters with the same PrC of the same class levels are pretty much the same. So, I've tried to allow for some variations... Thanks, btw. Very glad you dig it!
enygmatic_me 01-20-07, 02:56 AM	I really like it. I have a player in a FR campaign that I am about to start running that has taken the Spellfire feat and is planning on going into this PrC eventually. If it is ok with you I would like to run your version past him and see what he thinks. If he likes it, and I think he will, I would like to use this for him if you are ok with that.
Iarmeister 01-20-07, 12:53 PM	I really like it. I have a player in a FR campaign that I am about to start running that has taken the Spellfire feat and is planning on going into this PrC eventually. If it is ok with you I would like to run your version past him and see what he thinks. If he likes it, and I think he will, I would like to use this for him if you are ok with that. Yes please!!! Use away. If he likes it, just tell me how it works out for you and your campaign! Thank you! :D
ScottFeatherstone 04-07-07, 01:26 AM	Yea it looks good, Ill try it out. So there is no "official" Spellfire info other than the feat and other info in Magic of Faerun? Thanks
Iarmeister 04-07-07, 01:53 AM	Yea it looks good, Ill try it out. So there is no "official" Spellfire info other than the feat and other info in Magic of Faerun? Thanks Thanks for the compliment; I hope you enjoy my take on the Spellfire Channeler 3.5. In the Player's Guide to Faerun there's the Spellfire Heirophant Epic PrC, but that's about it. I've been playing Dnd for over 15 years, and 3.0 and 3.5 since they were first introduced, and I've yet to play an epic campaign. So, I cannot tell you if the Spellfire Heirophant is any good or not. But, I've played my own SC3.5 and it's wicked fun! :cool:
Empirate 04-30-07, 12:00 PM	It's good, really good. A bit too good, maybe... especially the first level abilities. I can easily see somebody taking a one-level dip in this class and continue as whatever they did before (aothoug the less-than-optimal feat requirements balance this). Still, there is one PC whom I allowed to take Spellfire Wielder in my current group, and I will run this past her, hear what she thinks. Great work, keep it up!
Thrincold 04-30-07, 12:17 PM	Very interesting. Though if I can find the damned thing, I'll PM you a version I worked on based off of the Warlock base class. Pretty nice for a FR Prc though.
Iarmeister 04-30-07, 07:50 PM	It's good, really good. A bit too good, maybe... especially the first level abilities. I can easily see somebody taking a one-level dip in this class and continue as whatever they did before (aothoug the less-than-optimal feat requirements balance this). Still, there is one PC whom I allowed to take Spellfire Wielder in my current group, and I will run this past her, hear what she thinks. Great work, keep it up! Thanks for the props, mate. I hope she does try it out. If so, please holla back every now and again and lemme know what you think. RE: 1st level dipping...There are a couple things that will keep that from happening: 1) Spellfire Wielder feat needs pre-approval from any DM for it to work. Many DM's I've heard or spoke with out and out don't allow Spellfire, nerfed as it was for 3.0., both because it was beat-up so bad by the Nerf-stick, and, well, they have reoccuring visions of Volo's Guide To All Things Magical running in their brains. 2) Spellcaster won't dip this because they'll lose a level of spellcasting progression. Most fighters won't want to take the hit to their BAB, and - as you've already pointed out - the required feats aren't that terribly cool or exciting. For everyone else who would...well, what are they really gaining? The ability to essentially make a specialized ray-like attack, the ability to recharge spellfire energy levels = to their natural Con bonus (if any), the ability to store more spellfire energy levels (but not release more/round), and the ability to make an immediate action to absorb a spell targeted at them direct once per day. I really don't think it's all that good of a dip. I know there are better 1 level dips out there (i.e. Swordsage from ToB = 6 maneuvers! and your other non-MA levels count as 1/2 Initiator levels for determining what level maneuvers you can choose. Wow.). IMO, the best thing that happens at level one is the removal of the Ref SV for a successful Spellfire blast, which is an erroneous rule WoTC levied in the first place; should never have been! Anyway...'nuff ranting. I'm just glad you like the classs and are willing to allow a player to take it out for a spin. :D Thanks again.
Iarmeister 04-30-07, 07:52 PM	Very interesting. Though if I can find the damned thing, I'll PM you a version I worked on based off of the Warlock base class. Pretty nice for a FR Prc though. Werd. PM away, bro. Glad to take a gander at it. And, thanks for stoppin' by. :)
Iarmeister 05-06-07, 12:52 PM	oh, what the hell...!...:bump:
hawkinsthedm 06-14-07, 01:32 PM	To start, I really like this class. Suggestions: You might rename Spellfire Supreme something else like Spellfire Apotheosis. Spellfire Supreme sounds like something you might order at Taco Bell. I also encourage you to pick up a copy of the Player's Guide to Faerun and check out the Spellfire Hierophant and seeing if you can make the two classes compatible. Also, have you thought about creating it as a base class instead of a prestige class? I think it makes a silly prestige class since Spellfire is something you are born with, like a Sorcerer's magic, a Warlock's eldrich blast, and a Wilder's psionics. --Hawkins
Iarmeister 06-14-07, 04:37 PM	To start, I really like this class. Suggestions: You might rename Spellfire Supreme something else like Spellfire Apotheosis. Spellfire Supreme sounds like something you might order at Taco Bell. I also encourage you to pick up a copy of the Player's Guide to Faerun and check out the Spellfire Hierophant and seeing if you can make the two classes compatible. Also, have you thought about creating it as a base class instead of a prestige class? I think it makes a silly prestige class since Spellfire is something you are born with, like a Sorcerer's magic, a Warlock's eldrich blast, and a Wilder's psionics. --Hawkins Those are some really good suggestions, bro. I, too, thought Spellfire Supreme was a bit cheesy, pardon the pun, as a name for a capstone ability. I've looked through the PGtF, and I was largely unimpressed with the Spellfire Heirophant as an epic class. There wasn't anything truly epic about it, as it merely built upon an already busted premise about what Spellfire is. If you really want to see Epic Spellfire, try finding and picking up a copy of 2e's Volo's Guide To All Things Magical, and seeing the Spellfire Abilities contained therein. That's the spellfire I remember reading in the Shandril Sagas... I have also considered creating a Spellfire template that you could apply to any base race/class and it would grant abilities that scale as you gain HD. RE: Spellfire Channeler as a base class...search Maverick Wolf's Spellfire Warrior on these boards...he's already done a great job at creating a base class, and it combines elements of Spellfire Heirophant at upper levels. My intent with my version of a 3.5 SC was to correct the 'mistakes' I think WoTC built into the class, mistakes that really made the published version of SC unplayable at higher levels. I think I've succeeded in fulfilling my o.g. intentions. :cool:
nighttree 06-18-07, 10:50 AM	Crown of Fire (Su): Starting at 9th level, a channeler can manifest the crown of fire, which appears as a halo of spellfire around her head and provides light equal to a daylight spell, by expending 10 spellfire energy levels. The crown of fire also gives her damage reduction 10/magic and automatically melts all non-magical weapons that strike her (after inflicting damage, if any). The crown of fire grants the channeler spell resistance 32 (as the spell resistance spell). Maintaining the crown of fire requires spending 10 spellfire energy levels each round, which can be done as a swift actioin. The crown of fire does not interfere with the channeler's actions, including using other spellfire abilities. I am probably "missing the obviouse"....but why would you need SR/32 when the Spellfire weilder feat already gives you an "unbeatable SR" ??? I noticed this in the original class as well and was confused :confused:
Iarmeister 06-18-07, 11:08 AM	I am probably "missing the obviouse"....but why would you need SR/32 when the Spellfire weilder feat already gives you an "unbeatable SR" ??? I noticed this in the original class as well and was confused :confused: Because spellfire's basic premise is that you may only absorb spells directly targeted at you. This means you would still be subject to damage from a fireball spell if you happened to be caught within the blast radius. Also, for the most part, you need to ready an action to absorb a spell targeted at you. Odds are, you will eventually be caught unawares and still be subject to the effects of a spell. Obviously, I included some ability options in this PrC that could enable you to absorb area effect spells, as well as absorbing a spell (or 3, depending upon what level) without readying an action. But, these are not infallible, and that's part of what makes this class balanced.
nighttree 06-18-07, 11:31 AM	See....I told ya I was probably "missing the obviouse" :D Thanks Iarmeister
Iarmeister 06-18-07, 12:09 PM	See....I told ya I was probably "missing the obviouse" :D Thanks Iarmeister Well, if you're familiar with Ed Greenwood's Shandril Sagas but haven't fully read the published dnd 3.0 'playable' version, then it isn't all that obvious. In the books, Shandril is absorbing spells and spell-like abilities (and even a dracolich's breath) left and right...one would simply assume that if you have the Spellfire ability you'd veritably be a sponge vs spells. Unfortunately, WoTC beat the ability to death with a stick manufactured by NERF. ;)
IAS 06-21-07, 04:44 AM	No offense but i think the changes you suggest are way overpowering, but i shoud exlain myself Requirements: Focus on spellfire its not something you can learn from someone, it takes time and hard work, that why a think it's ok as a prestige class feature, instaed of a general feat. Prestige: True spellfire/reactive absortion Any spell, ability or feat that has a harmfull effect on someone must always a saving throw. You can't ignore that, that one of the implicit rules that keep the balance in the game. A way to change the actually stupid static dc 20 of the blast is this DC=10+1/2 energy levels used+cha. Remember that spellfire is magic so it's DC shoud be alike spell's dc (11+spell lv+cha, int or wis). You say that in the novels Shandril absorved magic even if she did not prepared to. Well i say that a novel writer knows how to cacth the reader with amusing scenes but you can't apply that to the game, its just to much powerfull. I mean if you woud combine this with imporved reactive absortion you woud be practicly inmmune to magic to magic for 6 ROUNDS, a well fought combat ussualy do not last much more than that. Instead of that you may have the reactive counterspell feat to absorve without reading. In order to avoid easy multiclasing from paladin for example the storages increases shoud be in levels 3,5,7 and 9. I agree 100% that the spellfire abilities shoud not be fixed ones but the players may choose from a list, it gives the characters more uniqueness. But again some of theme are just to much;for examle greater, improve, normal area absortion and improved area absortion makes you inmmune to magic. Spellfire even if raw, it's still magic so it must have similar rules to spells. Spellfire can only counter spellfire, not an arcane or divine spell. Maximazing spellfire shoud be the be same as with a spell: 1lv spell becomes 4lv spell maximazed, well then 4 energy levels become 1 maximazed energy level. Pushing the limits and spellfire boost actually are pretty much good class features but i think they shoud be in the list of electible abilities. For the last supreme spellfire just don't work beacuse even if you are a master on spellfire it's still magic and it does use the weave, so there not a chance they gonna work on antimagic or deade zone areas. Just a final thought spellfire is a very rare kind of magic that you can't see turning the corner, is something that you might get killed for but wilding spellfire do not put you at same level than a epic character. The changes you made are fit for the hierophant not the channeler.
Iarmeister 06-22-07, 04:24 AM	No offense but i think the changes you suggest are way overpowering, but i shoud exlain myself Cool...explain away... Requirements: Focus on spellfire its not something you can learn from someone, it takes time and hard work, that why a think it's ok as a prestige class feature, instaed of a general feat. There's nothing in Core that says any of the normal feats you gain are ones that you specifically learned from someone else either. Rather, feats represent an area of intense time of study and hard work. In this instance, they are also an extra requirement that a would-be spellfire channeler must take before attaining the first level of the PrC. In this instance, the also represent a character who has started to move toward the spellfire channeler prc, but has yet to make the full commitment; i.e. level 1. Prestige: True spellfire/reactive absortion Any spell, ability or feat that has a harmfull effect on someone must always a saving throw. You can't ignore that, that one of the implicit rules that keep the balance in the game. Interesting then that Ray spells specifically don't allow a saving throw. Neither do any of the Power Word spells for that matter, albeit their level 9 spells. But, back to the Ray spells: they do require an RTA of the caster, same as spellfire. They also target only a single creature, also like spellfire...hmmm...sounds to me like spellfire is basically a Ray spell. Why then, if it's mechanically a ray spell, should it allow the opponent a reflex saving throw?? Why??? (here's a hint for you: it shouldn't). A way to change the actually stupid static dc 20 of the blast is this DC=10+1/2 energy levels used+cha. Remember that spellfire is magic so it's DC shoud be alike spell's dc (11+spell lv+cha, int or wis). That's not a terrible suggestion. But it isn't a good one either, because of the aforementioned comparison to a ray spell. You say that in the novels Shandril absorved magic even if she did not prepared to. Well i say that a novel writer knows how to cacth the reader with amusing scenes but you can't apply that to the game, its just to much powerfull. To which I say, 'duh'. Of course a writer isn't going to be writing a story asking his or herself if what their hero is doing in-story is supported by game mechanics; that would make for a much less fluid and heroic story. I mean if you woud combine this with imporved reactive absortion you woud be practicly inmmune to magic to magic for 6 ROUNDS, a well fought combat ussualy do not last much more than that. Instead of that you may have the reactive counterspell feat to absorve without reading. Immune to magic you say?? You would still be vulnerable to area effects...and summoned creatures, and pre-existing spell-effects for that matter. In order to avoid easy multiclasing from paladin for example the storages increases shoud be in levels 3,5,7 and 9. Actually, I kept the original storage increase progression from MoF, as I think it's fine as is. I agree 100% that the spellfire abilities shoud not be fixed ones but the players may choose from a list, it gives the characters more uniqueness. Yaaaay...the second thing we agree on, besides the static DC 20 Ref SV being a stoopid idea. But again some of theme are just to much;for examle greater, improve, normal area absortion and improved area absortion makes you inmmune to magic. Potentially, these spellfire talents + improved reactive absorption could make you very very difficult to take down with spells and spell-like effects. But, you are also talking about a healthy investment of acquired spellfire talents, talents which could be better served improving other areas of spellfire. Also, I agree that most combat lasts about 4 - 6 rounds. I also understand that most game sessions are supposed to only have 4 encounters, and not all of them are expected to be combat. However, you're talking about being 'impervious' for really only one encounter. When you're encounters include more than one combat/session, then you're really only uber for one encounter. Also, please remember that spellfire channelers are just as fallible vs. summoned creatures, pre-existing spells and spell-like effects, as well as melee-oriented opponents. Remember, reactive absorption is x-times/day. It does not refresh after every encounter. Spellfire even if raw, it's still magic so it must have similar rules to spells. But, spellfire is not spells, nor even spell-like...it is by definition a supernatural ability. So, it certainly does not have to have similar rules to spells. But, as i've already pointed out, it does: Ray Spells. Spellfire can only counter spellfire, not an arcane or divine spell. Meh. Your opinion, and you are certainly entitled to it. If you don't like that particular spellfire talent that allows this don't include it in your campaigns. Maximazing spellfire shoud be the be same as with a spell: 1lv spell becomes 4lv spell maximazed, well then 4 energy levels become 1 maximazed energy level. So, you are saying that in order to maximize a 5d6 blast of spellfire, you'd need to invest 20 stored spellfire points?? This makes the ability rather useless. Please remember that how many stored spellfire points you may use/round is still limited by your Con score. This includes any 'boosted' abilities (minus 'pushed' levels). Most characters are not going to have a Con score of 18, let alone 20. Pushing the limits and spellfire boost actually are pretty much good class features but i think they shoud be in the list of electible abilities. I don't have a strong opinion about this one way or the other, so if you think it should be selectable spellfire talents, go ahead and make that change in your campaign. For the last supreme spellfire just don't work beacuse even if you are a master on spellfire it's still magic and it does use the weave, so there not a chance they gonna work on antimagic or deade zone areas. Actually, it is feasible for this to work. If you recall, the Chosen of Mystra's Silver Fire is actually considered a lesser form of True Spellfire. One of Silver Fire's vaunted features is its ability to restore magic to dead magic zones. If Silver Fire can actually restore magic to a place such as this, and it's the lesser cousin to True Spellfire, I certainly don't see why True Spellfire couldn't function in a dead magic zone. Just a final thought spellfire is a very rare kind of magic that you can't see turning the corner, is something that you might get killed for but wilding spellfire do not put you at same level than a epic character. The changes you made are fit for the hierophant not the channeler. And, if you'd be so bold as to actually play test the o.g. spellfire channeler class, and then this one, you will see that I've not made an epic PrC by any means. It is certainly more playable and enjoyable than the MoF version, but that's because the original was so busted to begin with. Really now, the Spellfire Heirophant is just a horrible horrible PrC, especially because it's supposed to be EPIC; it's aboslutely not! At higher levels, and especially at epic levels, a character class that is so closely intwined with magic should not be relegated to simply dealing damage, and inadequate damage for a full-round at those levels, imo. Any experienced player of arcane hurler-types will tell you that that is the least effective way to deal death to the opposition. I mean, c'mon, at higher levels and with a Con of, say, 20? 20d6 points of damage for a full round of combat?? Even less if you start dividing spellfire blasts between multiple opponents?? Please, even the ITWF party Rogue potentially deals scarier damage than that! No, IAS, if you want to see a truly Epic version of spellfire, take a gandar at Ed Greenwood's version in 2e's Volo's Guide To All Things Magical. Compare that to the poor effort Wizards gave in converting it to 3.0, and you will see how far short of the mark it is. Again, your suggestions aren't bad, per se, but they're not adequate, imo, to make the spellfire channeler a fun and balanced class, to play. You may disagree with me, but we can certainly agree to do that, too. :cool:
IAS 06-22-07, 10:24 PM	Well friend thanks we can disagree... There's nothing in Core that says any of the normal feats you gain are ones that you specifically learned from someone else either. Rather, feats represent an area of intense time of study and hard work. In this instance, they are also an extra requirement that a would-be spellfire channeler must take before attaining the first level of the PrC. In this instance, the also represent a character who has started to move toward the spellfire channeler prc, but has yet to make the full commitment; i.e. level 1. You do got a point there... but i still think spellfire focus shoud not be a regullary feat beacuse with it you start to show some understanding of how controling the energy. If you tell me that a charaqcter has train a whole year or so ok take the feat, but normally that situation does not occur. Normally after a couple of combats youre be able to take it, with out training. How about then it becomes general feat with DM aproval? Interesting then that Ray spells specifically don't allow a saving throw. Neither do any of the Power Word spells for that matter, albeit their level 9 spells. But, back to the Ray spells: they do require an RTA of the caster, same as spellfire. They also target only a single creature, also like spellfire...hmmm...sounds to me like spellfire is basically a Ray spell. Why then, if it's mechanically a ray spell, should it allow the opponent a reflex saving throw?? Why??? (here's a hint for you: it shouldn't). Spellfire while used offensively is it a blast or a ray? Don't make assumptions, spellfire is not a ray. Perhaps a blast is not fast enough as i ray is, so there must have a ref save. That such a powerfull attack does not have a saving throw is ridiculuos. By the way i have same thought on power word spell...rays are not that much powerfull... To counter this you can some ability like spellfire ray, so one can choose to expend one energy level to make it faster, besides the energy level used to damage. Immune to magic you say?? You would still be vulnerable to area effects...and summoned creatures, and pre-existing spell-effects for that matter. Pardon? Perhaps i did not understand what you meant with the area absorption ability. Area Absorption (Su): You have learned to absorb spells that you couldn't otherwise. Benefit: Anytime you could absorb a spell, you may absorb the effects of an area spell. You only gain spellfire energy levels equal to 1/2 the level of the spell (rounded down), and the spell is negated only for you. All others in its area are affected normally. Normal: You cannot absorb area spells. a summoned creature is no magic but a creature, you can't absorve it. You can negate effects form area spells and react without reding an action, but you can only do it 6 times per day, allowing to focus on offensive, then you become deathmachine... Well let me reformulate, almost immune to magic... But, spellfire is not spells, nor even spell-like...it is by definition a supernatural ability. So, it certainly does not have to have similar rules to spells. I not saying it has similar rules to spell, am saying it shoud have similar because even if it is a supernatural ability is't still magic, but more importantly because it uses Mystra's weave; somehow the "rules" of the weave must apply to spellfire... Meh. Your opinion, and you are certainly entitled to it. If you don't like that particular spellfire talent that allows this don't include it in your campaigns. Is not just my opinion, also the stated rules. Spellfire counters spellfire. Arcane spell are counter by spells by same spell or dispel magic, or another cases by spells of same school of higher level. So, you are saying that in order to maximize a 5d6 blast of spellfire, you'd need to invest 20 stored spellfire points?? This makes the ability rather useless. Please remember that how many stored spellfire points you may use/round is still limited by your Con score. This includes any 'boosted' abilities (minus 'pushed' levels). Most characters are not going to have a Con score of 18, let alone 20. Tough luck if you don't get to con 30, but you can't change the stated rules for maximazing magic just because it's raw magic or because it suit a character better. Besides maximaze sucks if you compared to empower. A reread campaign setting for silverfire a you are right about spellfire and anti magic fields but i woud like to disagree with campaign setting itself about the dead magic zones. Dead zones came to be because the weave broke beyond repair when Karsus casted Karsus avatar and try to fuse with Mystril scence. How can silverfire or spellfire repair the unrepairlable malfunctioning weave? Some final thoughts -The hieropant sucks, no doubt about it. -Combined, the prestige and feat are powerfull and kind of balanced, what i suggest you change is DC formula for the blasts and the ability picking. -At least for me, the fun of playing a character does not come his level of power, but from his companions, his experiences, his attitude. Don't take wrong, i love fighting challenging opponents but i don't need a super-character to have a good time. The fun of playing a spellfire wielder shoud come developing the fear, insecuruty and frustation to inner knowledge (my opinion anyway) -Finnaly this threat is great. I mean silverfire and spellfire have major bugs (it leaves to much thing to self interpretation), it's time someone tried to fix them... Anyway i believe spellfire deserves a more fixed version and better descripted chapter in the magic' books to ve realised.
Iarmeister 06-23-07, 04:54 AM	Well friend thanks we can disagree... Part of the art of compromise. ;) You do got a point there... but i still think spellfire focus shoud not be a regullary feat beacuse with it you start to show some understanding of how controling the energy. If you tell me that a charaqcter has train a whole year or so ok take the feat, but normally that situation does not occur. Normally after a couple of combats youre be able to take it, with out training. How about then it becomes general feat with DM aproval? It sounds like it's more a matter of flavoring issues as to whether or not a spellfire channeler can take weapon focus (spellfire) or not. I certainly don't have any problems with a DM ruling that they must first approve of that particular feat in order for a player to choose it for her character. However, I must point out that the spellfire wielder feat is also a by-dm's-approval-only feat that must be taken at first level (or not at all). My guess would be that any dm that already approved a player taking the spellfire wielder feat would have no qualms whatsoever about granting the weapon focus feat as well. So really, this is less about making a mandatory ruling about who can and can't take the feat, but more about the in-game story about how the character came to focus on their already innate spellfire ability. At that point, dm's should have liberty to require certain 'quests' or other in-game adventuring that further helps develop the hows and whys a character would choose weapon focus (spellfire). This is how I'd handle it anyway. I must point out, however, that my original intent with including Weapon Focus (spellfire) as a prereq to taking this PrC was to make the investment a touch steeper. This means, in the published version a character could take this at 6 and still have one feat at their discretion. With my version, it's most likely to consume your entire feat choices until level 6. Thus, a character wanting to play a spellfire channeler and willing to invest the feats really really wants to play a spellfire channeler. Spellfire while used offensively is it a blast or a ray? Don't make assumptions, spellfire is not a ray. Perhaps a blast is not fast enough as i ray is, so there must have a ref save. That such a powerfull attack does not have a saving throw is ridiculuos. By the way i have same thought on power word spell...rays are not that much powerfull... To counter this you can some ability like spellfire ray, so one can choose to expend one energy level to make it faster, besides the energy level used to damage. The term 'spellfire blast' is really only narrative and flavor. In-game mechanics are resolved identically to a Ray Spell requiring an RTA roll. The only difference is that, as published, spellfire affords your target a chance to save for half-damage (or none, if they have evasion)...That subtle difference is the deal breaker. Throw in the fact that half the damage caused by spellfire is fire damage, and then compare that to how many creatures have resistance and/or immunity to fire, and you're looking at an attack that isn't quite as impressive in practice as it looks on paper. Let's compare the 2nd level spell Scorching Ray to Spellfire. At level 11, a wizard/sorcerer may fire 3 rays at one or three targets (one ray for each target), each ray doing 4d6 points of fire damage. They make an RTA to hit, and their opponent is not allowed a saving throw. So, at one opponent, that is potentially 12d6 points of damage, no save. A spellfire channeler with a Con score of 18 (let's say) can fire one blast, and only one blast, at a single target, potentially dealing 18d6 points of damage, but with a Reflex save allowed. Now, let's assume that both roll average damage, in this case an avg. of 4/die. Scorching Ray deals 48 points of damage, and Spellfire Blast deals 72. If the opponent fails their Save, great! Full damage!! If they succeed, then the spellfire dealt half-damage = 36. That's less than a 2nd level spell... ....and chances are, the channeler is now very nearly or completely depleted of stored spellfire energy levels. Have you read about the dangers of over-storage of spellfire energy levels?? Most Spellfire Channelers won't have more than twice their current Con score in stored spellfire energy levels. Both because it's not likely that every encounter will feature an enemy spellcaster, nor will they always be able to drain significant amounts of magic items. And, well, it can be potentially dangerous to carry around too much spellfire, both to you and to those around you. See, one of the problems with spellfire is that it is a very finite ability. Much more so than spells and/or spell-slots. You can certainly save your Big Boom attack for the baddy at the end, but you will be ineffectual vs the smaller minions for wont of saving stored spellfire energy levels. Or, you can ration out spellfire blasts/healing over the course of the day and pray and hope you'll have enough juice at the end to truly participate against whatever Big Baddy Mr. Dm throws at you. It's a gamble either way. For my $$, I'd certainly prefer to have each blast count. There's nothing like scoring a natural 20 on the To-Hit Roll for a spellfire blast and having a mook with Evasion completely evade damage. Sucks rocks! However, if you'd prefer to still allow opponents a Ref SV vs Spellfire, than your idea about how to calculate the DC is a good option. However, I think you sacrifice too many stored spellfire energy levels, and by necessity make a spellfire channeler akin to a big loaded gun that only has 3 - 4 rounds of ammo, to make the DC anywhere near threatening at higher levels. Pardon? Perhaps i did not understand what you meant with the area absorption ability. No, i understood perfectly, but in the context of what you initially wrote at that specific portion of your post, you made no mention of the area absorption ability. You only included the combo of area absorption + reactive absorption later in your post, to which I then responded to it in full. a summoned creature is no magic but a creature, you can't absorve it. You can negate effects form area spells and react without reding an action, but you can only do it 6 times per day, allowing to focus on offensive, then you become deathmachine... Well let me reformulate, almost immune to magic... My point, which I don't think you understood completely, was that Sure, you could potentially be nigh impervious to magic for 6 rounds out of the entire 24 hours. However, being impervious to magic for a mere 6 rounds is nothing compared to abilities that allow you to be impervious to Sneak Attacks or Critical Hits for...well, ever (Fortification enhancement to armor, for example). I mean, 36 seconds of near invulnerability vs magic still leaves you wide open to buying the farm because a rogue came up and sneaked you to death, or an assassin studied you for 3 rounds unawares and you fail your Fort SV vs his/her death attack, or a Summoned Creature (which can be dispelled through Dispel Magic and GDM, btw) scored a Crit on you... The problem with not including a reactive absorption ability is that you will spend your entire combative rounds Readying an action to absorb an incoming spell that may or may not be cast and may or may not be targeted directly at you. This means, you will spend a great deal more rounds playing defensive than actually hurling a spellfire blast, because doing otherwise means you can't ready an action to absorb an incoming spell. The chances are also greater that an experienced mage is going to hurl death your way in a form other than a flashy evocation spell, and if you aren't readied for it, you're hosed (remember those Power Word spells I mentioned??). Is not just my opinion, also the stated rules. Spellfire counters spellfire. Arcane spell are counter by spells by same spell or dispel magic, or another cases by spells of same school of higher level. Fundamentally, you are correct. But, it is an option that you may or may not choose. Note that the other 'options' you may choose also add-to or bend the basic spellfire mechanic. Tough luck if you don't get to con 30, but you can't change the stated rules for maximazing magic just because it's raw magic or because it suit a character better. Besides maximaze sucks if you compared to empower. Of course I'm changing rules to suit a character better, that is the entire point. It's like saying that at first you can only heal 2 hp worth of damage for every 1 point of stored spellfire energy you spend, but now you heal 1d4 for every 1 point spent. A reread campaign setting for silverfire a you are right about spellfire and anti magic fields but i woud like to disagree with campaign setting itself about the dead magic zones. Dead zones came to be because the weave broke beyond repair when Karsus casted Karsus avatar and try to fuse with Mystril scence. How can silverfire or spellfire repair the unrepairlable malfunctioning weave? When you get a sec, please re-read page 56 in the FRCS about Silver Fire and it's ability to restore 'dead magic zones to normal and dispelling any anti-magic fields' (that's verbatim). As written, it is not one or the other, it affects both! Some final thoughts -The hieropant sucks, no doubt about it. -Combined, the prestige and feat are powerfull and kind of balanced, what i suggest you change is DC formula for the blasts and the ability picking. -At least for me, the fun of playing a character does not come his level of power, but from his companions, his experiences, his attitude. Don't take wrong, i love fighting challenging opponents but i don't need a super-character to have a good time. The fun of playing a spellfire wielder shoud come developing the fear, insecuruty and frustation to inner knowledge (my opinion anyway) -Finnaly this threat is great. I mean silverfire and spellfire have major bugs (it leaves to much thing to self interpretation), it's time someone tried to fix them... Anyway i believe spellfire deserves a more fixed version and better descripted chapter in the magic' books to ve realised. I agree with you about the role-play aspect making gaming experiences fun. However, a huge part of that fun is knowing that your character fully contributes to the story. There is nothing wrong in having a character class that allows you to be heroic. I'm certainly glad you enjoy this thread; I do, too. I can also see where you are coming from in wanting to keep this class balanced. My suggestion to you would be to play test this as-is, and see if it's over-powered. I have play-tested this in my group up to level 4, and it's nowhere close to being overpowering. It is, however, a lot more enjoyable and useable at higher levels than the published version.
IAS 06-23-07, 06:06 PM	quick... -The DM must supervise the progress of the training of the character if his tries to take focus. Only trieng to avoid that a character gain focus only basedon combat experience. - Ray, blast call it whatever you want... but a still think it must allow a saving throw. You compared to schoring ray, well true that a great spell but if you are level 7 channeler with con 18 you are doom. You at least shoud have con 25 and 15 ranks in concetration, so if have to put up a real fight you shoud be able to use your energy reserve. You know the consecuences but that friend is really push the limits... - This prestige you be adecuate if you are in solo mision or with one companion, but for a for people party. It obivous that you can't a thing against a rogue or a monk, then let yor party handle them and handle the others. No others, heal then. The channeler is a all defensive character that wont have to many changes to deal real damage to an enemy party, but will take lots of damage, heal for his party, it will become quite important in a party. Besides i don't think that showing your skills around will do any good yor the channeler... - About silverfire, not saying it does affect dead magic and antimagic field, just pointing that it does not make sense since the weave is broken. Anyway, bye.
Moldiver 06-25-07, 10:57 AM	Rather than fighting about whether spellfire should act as a ray or not. How about finding examples of other abilities anywhere that you make a TA/RTA and give the target a saving throw. I can't think of any off the top of my head, and I'm pretty sure there aren't any. Between the attack, the save, the amount of spellfire a person can hold, and no truly reactive ability to absorb (since this version isn't truly reactive either) spellfire by itself is really not all that powerful. Also, a Warlock's blast is RTA with no saving throw, it's a very similar ability.
Iarmeister 06-25-07, 06:28 PM	Rather than fighting about whether spellfire should act as a ray or not. How about finding examples of other abilities anywhere that you make a TA/RTA and give the target a saving throw. I can't think of any off the top of my head, and I'm pretty sure there aren't any. Between the attack, the save, the amount of spellfire a person can hold, and no truly reactive ability to absorb (since this version isn't truly reactive either) spellfire by itself is really not all that powerful. Also, a Warlock's blast is RTA with no saving throw, it's a very similar ability. No arguing here. In fact, as I said in my previous post, if you like this class, but disagree with something...you may house-rule away. Consider it an Adaptation section. :) Good example, tho', of another class that has a blasting type of ability. Wish I'd thought of it earlier. Doh!
hawkinsthedm 07-02-07, 05:27 PM	RE: Spellfire Channeler as a base class...search Maverick Wolf's Spellfire Warrior on these boards...he's already done a great job at creating a base class, and it combines elements of Spellfire Heirophant at upper levels. Oh, I checked out the Spellfire Warrior, and to be perfectly honest I still like yours better. And I still want to see it as a base class :D
Iarmeister 07-03-07, 02:42 AM	Oh, I checked out the Spellfire Warrior, and to be perfectly honest I still like yours better. And I still want to see it as a base class :D Thank you! :D That's a BIG time compliment, bro. You've got me creative wheels-a-spinnin'...give me a minute (read: a week or two) and I will post a Base Class version of this, and I will borrow liberally from Volo's Guide To All Things Magical to attempt to truly make Spellfire worthy of the awe the mere mention of it should provoke. (Now I just have to try and fine where I put those boxes of 2e supplements...and take an allergy pill before dusting a couple years worth of dirt - ;)) If you have any ideas about what you might like to see from the forthcoming class, by all means, post away!
hawkinsthedm 07-11-07, 03:37 PM	Any progress? I know, I know; I am such a demanding customer :D.
Iarmeister 07-11-07, 04:57 PM	Any progress? I know, I know; I am such a demanding customer :D. No progress yet; I've been moving my things into some new digs. Sooner than later, tho'...hopefully. :cool:
hawkinsthedm 07-19-07, 02:17 PM	Okay, just doing my weekly pestering: :evillaugh So, any more progress?
Iarmeister 07-20-07, 04:02 AM	I'm going through my old dnd boxes so I can try and find Volo's Guide To All Things Magical and reread Ed G's original take and game-version of Spellfire. As a 20 level base class, I want to offer more than what the SC3.5 does, and would like to see if I can make a workable version that incorporates more into this class than just "I blast it to smithereens" and "I heal you". Thanks for the weekly check-up, mate. I promise, it's definitely on my list of things-to-do-sooner-than-later. ;)
hawkinsthedm 07-20-07, 11:53 AM	Don't mind me. It is my goal to ask every week. If I get too obnoxious, let me know.
Iarmeister 07-20-07, 02:15 PM	Don't mind me. It is my goal to ask every week. If I get too obnoxious, let me know. Not obnoxious at all. I'm thrilled that someone digs my work enough to inquire about it on a regular basis. And, I'm into delivering the goods to keep my fan base happy!
hawkinsthedm 07-27-07, 12:28 PM	And, I'm into delivering the goods to keep my fan base happy! While I am honored, I am not sure one person demanding a full class of your PrC counts as a fan base :D. BTW, it is a day or two late :eek:, but here is your weekly pestering :rant:. Now, what does that button do? :bump: . . . . . . . :invasion:
hawkinsthedm 08-02-07, 12:38 PM	And for this week's weekly pestering we have...*whisper* Who we got Bob? What do you mean we don't have a guest this week? Well :censored::rant::censored::banghead:!!!. ..Never mind folks, evidently this weeks show is canceled do to the lack of a guest. Goodnight, and see you next week. BTW: This post is just supposed to be a humorous way to ask how things are coming, just in case some random person sees it.
hawkinsthedm 08-08-07, 01:43 PM	Iarmeister, don't leave me hanging dude! I need to know the status, even if it is "no status." :D
Iarmeister 08-09-07, 03:49 PM	Sorry for the no communicado, brotha, been moving! There was a Spellfire Channeler on the boards that was a 20-level base class that was based off the Warlock. Did you get a chance to check that one out? I read it and thought it was pretty nifty. Has me thinking about basing my 20-level version off the Warlock as well. The combination of Blaster w/some magical aptitude is pretty close to what the SC actually is, mechanically speaking. The real work will be in ironing out some unique 'invocations' and keeping the ability to absorb magic. My initial thoughts are that absorbed magic will further empower the Spellfire Blasts (Eldritch Blasts), and perhaps amp the caster level when using invocations. Thoughts??
hawkinsthedm 08-09-07, 06:02 PM	Can you give me a link to the spellfire wielder based on the warlock class? Then maybe I can give you some opinions. :cool:
Raiden Drake 08-09-07, 07:37 PM	Sorry for the no communicado, brotha, been moving! There was a Spellfire Channeler on the boards that was a 20-level base class that was based off the Warlock. Did you get a chance to check that one out? I read it and thought it was pretty nifty. Has me thinking about basing my 20-level version off the Warlock as well. The combination of Blaster w/some magical aptitude is pretty close to what the SC actually is, mechanically speaking. The real work will be in ironing out some unique 'invocations' and keeping the ability to absorb magic. My initial thoughts are that absorbed magic will further empower the Spellfire Blasts (Eldritch Blasts), and perhaps amp the caster level when using invocations. Thoughts?? How a bout this?... Keep a spellfire blast (eldrich blast) progression same as the warlock but supernatural. Spellfire pool, keep this too you can still absorb spells, etc, etc. You can use those spellfire levels to improve your spellfire blast 1d6 extra per level expended. Spellfire Invocations (sp): This should be similar to normal invocations but if you expend X spellfire levels when casting them the effect gets better for example: Least invocation: Spellfire Light: cast light like the spell, you may expend 1 spellfire level when casting this invocation, you instead cast continual flame like the spell. Lesser invocation: Spellfire flight: You gain fly speed for 24 hrs equal to your land speed with good maneuverability. When under the effects of this invocation as a swift action you may expend 2 or more spellfire levels, this improve your speed by 30ft and give you perfect maneuverability for one round and one extra round for each spellfire level expended after the first 2. And so for the other invocations. One important thing, spellfire invocations cannot be used to recover spellfire levels. something like that may work... i'll try to write it better and show you.
Iarmeister 08-10-07, 12:18 PM	How a bout this?... Keep a spellfire blast (eldrich blast) progression same as the warlock but supernatural. Spellfire pool, keep this too you can still absorb spells, etc, etc. You can use those spellfire levels to improve your spellfire blast 1d6 extra per level expended. Spellfire Invocations (sp): This should be similar to normal invocations but if you expend X spellfire levels when casting them the effect gets better for example: Least invocation: Spellfire Light: cast light like the spell, you may expend 1 spellfire level when casting this invocation, you instead cast continual flame like the spell. Lesser invocation: Spellfire flight: You gain fly speed for 24 hrs equal to your land speed with good maneuverability. When under the effects of this invocation as a swift action you may expend 2 or more spellfire levels, this improve your speed by 30ft and give you perfect maneuverability for one round and one extra round for each spellfire level expended after the first 2. And so for the other invocations. One important thing, spellfire invocations cannot be used to recover spellfire levels. something like that may work... i'll try to write it better and show you. I like these mucho! :D Thanks for the assist in generating ideas. Really good ones, too. Looks like I'm not the only person who's thought of how a FR-version of Spellfire Channeler might look like as a Warlock PrC. Please keep these ideas-a-flowin'...they're great!
hawkinsthedm 08-10-07, 03:39 PM	That sorta works, I really like you you had the different spellfire abilities be like maneuvers in the ToB, where you have to meet certain prereqs before you can use them. Other than that, turning spellfire blasts into invocations does not seem like a bad idea. I would look for similar abilities to spellfire ones in the Desert Wind discipline from the Tome of Battle, and the invocations of the Dragonfire Adept from Dragon Magic. I wish I had money for Dragon Magic, but I just bought three D&D books yesterday. :D I do however have the Tome of Battle, and will see what I do about hooking you up with maneuvers from the Desert Wind discipline. One other thought, not that this is disputed, but the Spellfire Wielder definitely should have to store and expend spellfire levels to use the spellfire "invocations."
Iarmeister 08-10-07, 06:57 PM	That sorta works, I really like you you had the different spellfire abilities be like maneuvers in the ToB, where you have to meet certain prereqs before you can use them. Other than that, turning spellfire blasts into invocations does not seem like a bad idea. I would look for similar abilities to spellfire ones in the Desert Wind discipline from the Tome of Battle, and the invocations of the Dragonfire Adept from Dragon Magic. I wish I had money for Dragon Magic, but I just bought three D&D books yesterday. :D I do however have the Tome of Battle, and will see what I do about hooking you up with maneuvers from the Desert Wind discipline. I have ToB as well, and yea...it's wicked cool! I do not, however, own Dragon Magic. One other thought, not that this is disputed, but the Spellfire Wielder definitely should have to store and expend spellfire levels to use the spellfire "invocations." Actually, I hadn't thought about this yet. I certainly see this being truer to Spellfire Channeler than simply knowing and using invocations unlimited/day, however, I think my initial idea was to simply use stored spellfire energy levels to further empower known invocations to make them do other more unique and powerful things. Again, I haven't given this as much time or attention as would be needed, but I will get to it.
hawkinsthedm 08-10-07, 07:44 PM	I have ToB as well, and yea...it's wicked cool! I do not, however, own Dragon Magic. :censored:, I was hoping you might have it. Well, here is a link (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20060912a) to the excerpt that WotC provided for Dragon Magic. Maybe that will be helpful.
Raiden Drake 08-10-07, 08:13 PM	That sorta works, I really like you you had the different spellfire abilities be like maneuvers in the ToB, where you have to meet certain prereqs before you can use them. Other than that, turning spellfire blasts into invocations does not seem like a bad idea. I would look for similar abilities to spellfire ones in the Desert Wind discipline from the Tome of Battle, and the invocations of the Dragonfire Adept from Dragon Magic. I wish I had money for Dragon Magic, but I just bought three D&D books yesterday. :D I do however have the Tome of Battle, and will see what I do about hooking you up with maneuvers from the Desert Wind discipline. Seems like a good idea we could mix and match some invocations and some maneuvers, Desert wind is a must but maybe we could also add some maneuvers from Devoted spirit. I do have Dragon Magic and ToB. One other thought, not that this is disputed, but the Spellfire Wielder definitely should have to store and expend spellfire levels to use the spellfire "invocations." I think giving him some low level effects that he can use all day, as long as he has at least 1 spellfire level, would be a good idea that way he wouldn't be useless when low in spellfire levels. Actually that could be a good way to balance this out, every ability should have a minimal amount of spellfire levels that the channeler should have in reserve to be able to use it. He could use abilities that require higher reserves by spending one or more spellfire levels.
Iarmeister 08-10-07, 09:17 PM	Seems like a good idea we could mix and match some invocations and some maneuvers, Desert wind is a must but maybe we could also add some maneuvers from Devoted spirit. I do have Dragon Magic and ToB. Sweet! and congrats, you've just been conscripted into our Create-the-Spellfire-Channeler-Base-Class-Army. MWAAAAHAAAAAHAAA!!! :D I think giving him some low level effects that he can use all day, as long as he has at least 1 spellfire level, would be a good idea that way he wouldn't be useless when low in spellfire levels. Actually that could be a good way to balance this out, every ability should have a minimal amount of spellfire levels that the channeler should have in reserve to be able to use it. He could use abilities that require higher reserves by spending one or more spellfire levels. Cool idea. Kinda like the spell reserve feats from CM.
nighttree 08-11-07, 10:06 AM	IMO...the Idea of using the "Warlock" as a base has merit. Maybe something like they gain SP points equal to Con + 1/2 class level, with which to power spellfire blast and spellfire invocations. Plot progression for storage of SP points (by absorption). Convert things like "Crown of fire" and "Mealstrom" into invocations.
Iarmeister 08-11-07, 03:48 PM	IMO...the Idea of using the "Warlock" as a base has merit. Maybe something like they gain SP points equal to Con + 1/2 class level, with which to power spellfire blast and spellfire invocations. Plot progression for storage of SP points (by absorption). Convert things like "Crown of fire" and "Mealstrom" into invocations. Yea, basic/advance abilities associated with Spellfire would be converted to invocations. My initial thought is to keep the Spellfire Blast identical to Eldritch Blast, but make the damage half-untyped magic/half-fire. And, yes, the basic ability to blast would indeed be unlimited as Eldritch Blast is unlimited in use. Any stored spellfire energy levels could be invested into the blast to increase damage and/or effect (through Spellfire Essence and Spellfire Shape invocations) potency. Now it's simply a matter of taking the time and converting things and being creative. I'm sorry to be lagging on spearheading this effort, but Life has been running me all over the place as of late; no time to dedicate to what this undertaking deserves, and for that I apologize. I am, however, absolutely delighted that others have been similarly inspired by the idea of creating a 20-level Spellfire Channeler class, and basing it off the Warlock!
hawkinsthedm 08-22-07, 06:10 PM	Iarmeister, I hope the announcement of 4e does not make you stop developing this class. I still hope to see and use it.
nighttree 10-04-07, 01:52 AM	Not an attempt to "steal" anyones thunder.... But I have been toying with the whole using Warlock as a framework to create a Spellfire wielder base class. I have been working of the premise that the normal EB progression from the Warlock class, as well as a couple of other abilities from the class represent the normal "daily" allotment a Spellfire wielder generates. And that invokations have to pay a "cost" of spellfire points from absorption. This is still VERY rough, but I would rather get input and ideas at this stage, than when I think I have it all figured out. The only invoaction ideas I have looked at so far are abilities from the 3.0 channeler (so those will need to be expanded on), but at the moment I'm just looking for advice on the basic mechanic. Spellfire wielder base class What Is Spellfire? This is the name given to the extremely rare ability of an individual to absorb and then release raw, magical power. If no attempt is made to control its release is made, the energy erupts in the form of bolts of arcane fire of tremendous destructive potential. Spellfire is refined, controlled, raw magic. In beneficent manifestations, it appears as a font of light and healing energy. In battle, it is a searing jet of all-consuming radiance. A person gifted with spellfire can perform amazing deeds, depending upon their skill, talent, and the amount of magical energy they have within them at the time. In general, spellfire can be used to heal, create blasts of destructive fire, or absorb magical effects it contacts, although the exact effects vary by circumstance and user. Talented wielders have developed the ability to release multiple blasts at once or even fly (see the spellfire channeler prestige class). Level 1: Spell Absorption, Spellfire Blast 1D6, Least invocation Level 2: Arcane Sight, Endurance Level 3:Spellfire Blast 2D6, DR 1/-, Level 4:Drain charged item, increased storage x2. Level 5:Spellfire Blast 3D6, Absorb (Su) abilities, Level 6: Level 7:Spellfire Blast 4D6, DR2/-, Level 8:Weapon Focus (spellfire), increased storage x3. Level 9:Spellfire Blast 5D6, Level 10:Rapid blast 2. Level 11: Spellfire Blast 6D6, DR 3/-, Level 12: Drain permanent item, increased storage x4. Level 13: Level 14:Spellfire Blast 7D6, Level 15:increased storage x5, DR 4/-. Level 16:Rapid blast 3. Level 17: Spellfire Blast 8D6, Level 18: Level 19:DR 5/-, Level 20:Spellfire Blast 9D6, Skills (2+Int): Spellfire Wielders class skills (and key attribute for each) are Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Disguise (Cha), Heal (Wis), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (arcana) (Int), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Spellcraft (Int), Survival (Wis) Weapon Selection: The Spellfire wielder is proficient with all simple weaponry and a single martial weapon chosen at 1st level. Access to the whole simple weapons category doesn't make you a fighting machine, but it gives you plenty of options should your spells fail you. Your choice of a single martial weapon lets you augment your weapon selection with one particularly effective weapon. Armor Selection: The Spellfire wielder is proficient with light armor and no shields. Light armor doesn't provide much protection, but it's better than what many spell wielders have available (especially arcane casters). A Spellfire wielder doesn't suffer an arcane spell failure chance when using spellfire. Spell Absorption (Ex)To gain Spellfire slots (used to power spellfire invocations), a wielder of spellfire must absorb magic. The amount of magic that a spellfire-wielder's body can absorb and contain, expressed in spellfire levels, is limited by his or her Constitution score. Anything over their constitution score incurs "overload" penalties detailed below. A spellfire wielder absorbs spells targeted at him as if he were a rod of absorption. He gains one level of spellfire per " level of effect" of the absorbed spell and can store a number of additional spellfire energy levels equal to his Constitution. This is generally in the form of: Spells Cast at the Wielder: Unless actively wanting to accept a spells effects upon themselves, all those with the gift of spellfire absorb any magic (including spell-like abilities) that designates them “as the target” as a default. This essentially is the equivalent of an invincible Spell Resistance rating – any spells directed at a wielder of spellfire are simply absorbed without effect to the wielder, and they gains Spellfire points equal to the "level of effect" of the spell. Each 'plus' of a magical weapon and any single ability of other types of magical items counts as 1 spell level (or more, if the ability is unusually potent). Charges stored in devices represent 1 spell level each, all of which are transferred if the item comes into contact with the wielder. Level of Effect: of direct damage spells is determined by actual number of dice in damage (so a 12D6 fireball, once absorbed would render spellfire points equal to 12), spells with effects not expressed in die damage render spellfire points equal to the spells level. Spells that do not specifically target the Spellfire weilder, or only fractionally overlap the area where they are standing, like being on the trailing edge of an area blasted by a Fireball, are not absorbed, and render no Spellfire Point gain. Supernatural Powers: Upon reaching 5th level in the Spellfire wielder class, (Su) effects produced by creatures can also be absorbed; a dragon's breath weapon, for instance, represents a number of spell levels equal to the dragon's breath weapon. If a Spellfire weilder has reached his limit, any additional levels absorbed incur overload penalties. If his Constitution decrease so that his number of stored spellfire levels is greater than his current Constitution, the excess levels discharge at a random creature in range as destructive spellfire (see below). Stored spellfire energy levels are unavailable in an antimagic field, but are not lost. Once the wielder is out of the antimagic field, the spellfire energy levels are again available for use. Dispel magic and similar effects cannot negate stored spellfire energy levels. A character with stored levels radiates magic as if he were an item with a caster level equal to his number of stored levels. The amount of magic that a spellfire-wielder's body can absorb and contain, expressed in spellfire levels, is limited by his or her Constitution score. Anything over their constitution score incurs "overload" penalties detailed below. A spell (or spell like ability) that is cast in the normal way or triggered through the use of a scroll or a magical item represents a number of spell levels equal to the spell itself. Spellfire Blast (Su): At first level, a blast of spellfire does 1d6 hp damage +1D6 per Spellfire Point released. Spellfire counts as a Supernatural Ability, not a Spell-Like Ability, and so is unaffected by Spell Resistance. It is affected by Dispel Magic spells, items that absorb magic (like a Rod of Absorption), or items that negate it (like a Rod of Negation); counter spelling attempts, however, are ineffective. Spellfire also cannot penetrate an antimagic field or a dead magic zone. Note that it is possible for one spellfire wielder to absorb the spellfire blasts of another wielder. Being a Supernatural Ability, spellfire does not provoke an attack of opportunity when it is used. Spellfire is half fire and half raw magical force, so targets with immunity to fire only halve their damage from being struck by spellfire. Alternately, a spellfire wielder can, as a standard action, heal a target by touch, restoring 2 hit points per D6 of their Spellfire Blast expended for this purpose. This is not considered positive energy, so it does not injure undead. Endurance: At 2nd level, the Spellfire wielder gains Endurance as a bonus feat. Arcane Sight (Sp): At 2nd level, & functions as the spell continuously. Drain charged item (sp): 3rd level .(Wands, Scrolls, Potions,etc...) As a standard action, a Channeler can drain a single charge from a touched charged item (including single-use items such as potions and scrolls), converting the energy into a single stored spellfire energy level. A fully drained item has no magical properties (a potion becomes water). Only one feature of a multiple-use charged item can be drained per round. A creature gets to make a Will save (DC 10) to prevent one of its held or carried items from being drained. Increased Storage (Ex):3rd level: Con +1 to Con x2: The Channeler's eyes glow brightly, and any creature, magic item, or spell effect that touches the channeler causes 1 spellfire energy level to be discharged as a harmless burst of light. Once x/ day the channeler must make a Concentration check (DC 10) or take 1d6 points of damage as one of her Spellfire energy level backfires. Weapon Focus (Spellfire) 8th level: Bonus Feat. +1 bonus on attack rolls. Increased Storage (Ex): 8th level: Con x2+1 to Con x3: As above plus the channeler's skin glows (shedding light as a candle) a touch releases 1d4 spellfire energy levels as light and the channeler must make the backfire Con check every hour. Rapid Blast (su): at 10th level, the channeler can release two blasts of spellfire energy as a full round action. This increase to three at 16th level. Each blast after the first suffers a cumulative -2 penalty to attack rolls. Drain Permanent Item (sp): At 12th level, the wielder can drain power from permanent magic items by touch as a standard action. If the item is held or worn, the channeler must make a melee touch attack to touch it, which provokes an attack of opportunity from the defender. The channeler must make a level check (1d20+class level) against a DC of 11 + the caster level of the item to drain it. A success means the item's properties are suppressed (as if affected by dispel magic) for 24 hours and the channeler gains spellfire energy levels equal to half the item's caster level. Increased Storage (Ex): 12th level: Con x3+1 to Con x4: as above except the channeler sheds light equal to a torch, feels a burning sensation within her body (treat as if distracted from non damaging spell, DC 20 to concentrate). A touch release 1d6 spellfire energy as a flare spell (DC 10 + number of spell levels expended) against all creatures within 5 feet of her. Con check must be made every minute Increased Storage (Ex):15th level: Con x4+1 to x5 as above except the spellfire radiates a non-damaging heat (20ft), is in pain (dc 25 to concentrate) and must make the backfire constitution check every round. A touch releases 2d6 of energy as a flare spell as above. The Channeler must make a Will save DC 25 every round or be forced to expend a maximum-strength blast of energy to a random target within 30 ft in preference to any other action. Rapid Blast (su): 16th level: 3 per round, Each blast after the first suffers a cumulative -2 penalty to attack rolls. Least Spellfire Invocations Deflect Arrows (su): The channeler gains the feat, although rather then using a hand a single spellfire energy level is expended to knock the missile away. Improved Healing (su) the Spellfire channeler can release stored energy to heal by touch. This restores 1d4+ 1 Hit points per spellfire energy expended. Lesser Spellfire Invocations Spellfire Shield (Sp): You can call up Spellfire to surround yourself with a protective barrier, enveloping yourself in magical flames. The channeler is not harmed by these flames, gaining a +4 deflection bonus to Armor Class and Damage Reduction 5/magic, (stacks with existing damage reduction) and Spell Resistance of 15, while they last. Any creature attacking the channeler with a natural weapon or melee weapon that is not a reach weapon takes 2D6 points of Spellfire damage per attack. Maintaining the shield requires spending 2 spellfire energy level per round, which can be done as a swift action. The Spellfire Shield does not interfere with the channelers actions, including using other spellfire abilities. Greater Spellfire invocations Crown of fire (su): By expending 10 spf levels per round (free action), a channeler can manifest the crown of fire, which appears as a halo of spellfire around her and provides light as a daylight spell (bright light in a 60 ft radius, and dim light for an additional 60 feet). The crown of fire gives her damage reduction 10/magic and automatically destroys all non magical weapons that strike her (after inflicting damage, if any). The crown of fire grants the channeler spell resistance 32 (as the spell resistance spell). Maintaining the crown of fire requires spending 10 spellfire energy levels each round, which can be done as a swift action. The crown of fire, does not interfere with the channelers actions, including using other spellfire abilities. Unbind Spell (Su): You can focus spellfire at an existing spell effect, consuming the spell, and liberating it's energies. As a standard action, you can attempt to dispel a single spell effect (even those normally immune to dispel, such as Force Wall). If you succeed on a caster level check (DC 10+ opposing caster's level), the spell effect is immediately unbound. This immediately dispels the effect, and deals 1D6 points of Spellfire damage per level of the dispelled spell to all creatures and objects within 10 feet of the unbound spell. Dread Spellfire invocations Maelstrom of Fire (su): As a standard action, the channeler can release spellfire energy in all directions as a 30-foot-radius spread, dealing 1d6 damage per spellfire energy level expended to all creatures in the area (Ref SV for half, DC 10 + class level + Cha modifier).
nighttree 10-04-07, 01:57 AM	For some reason my table will not translate over :weep: SOOoooo BA same as Warlock, good fort and will save. EB, Invokation, and DR same levels as warlock. I'll go through and make sure that all abilities refrence what level they are available at.
nighttree 10-04-07, 11:48 AM	changed a few of the abilities to invokations (extra-healing, flight, etc...) changed the spellfire shield ability added warlocks progression of DR. still cant figure out why I cant get the table up (even wrapped in code). Any thoughts ?
JoshuaZ 10-04-07, 01:06 PM	Looks very good overall. I like it a lot. One minor note under Deflect Arrows "expended to knock he missile away" should be "expended to knock the missile away".
hawkinsthedm 10-04-07, 01:22 PM	I find Spell Absorption and its subheaders a bit confusing.
nighttree 10-04-07, 10:39 PM	Looks very good overall. I like it a lot. One minor note under Deflect Arrows "expended to knock he missile away" should be "expended to knock the missile away". Er.....it say's THE....although I did notice it said "expanded" instead of "expended" :D
nighttree 10-04-07, 10:41 PM	I find Spell Absorption and its subheaders a bit confusing. You and me both :D I'll see if I can "clean" it up a bit.
nighttree 10-04-07, 11:20 PM	I find Spell Absorption and its subheaders a bit confusing. Is that any better ?
hawkinsthedm 10-05-07, 11:44 AM	Is that any better ? Not perfect, but much better. :)
nighttree 10-05-07, 12:30 PM	Not perfect, but much better. :) LOL....I'm no good at editing, perhaps you could suggest some changes to help make it read smoother :D
nighttree 10-05-07, 12:42 PM	Since I can't get the table to paste over, I listed abilities "by level", the only thing missing at the moment is the invokation progression witch is the same as Warlock. And I have NO idea why some of the "D"'s turned into smiley faces :confused: some day's I really hate computers :mad:
nighttree 10-06-07, 10:27 AM	I had planned for ALL the invokations to require expending absorbed spellfire slot's, but after doing a few more invokations I'm not sure I'm going to go that route. I have posted what few invokations I have come up with so far in the build. Anyone have ideas for more invokations ?
nighttree 05-29-08, 12:50 AM	At the risk of being accused of "thread necromancy" :waits: This is what I have been working on for the last few months, and I thought I'd throw it out there and see what kind of comments people have. Spellfire wielder (V.4) What Is Spellfire? This is the name given to the extremely rare ability of an individual to absorb and then release raw, magical power. If no attempt is made to control its release is made, the energy erupts in the form of bolts of arcane fire of tremendous destructive potential. The amount of magic that a spellfire-wielder's body can absorb and contain, expressed in spellfire points, is limited by his or her Constitution score. Anything over their constitution score incurs "overload" penalties detailed below. A spell (or spell like ability) that is cast in the normal way or triggered through the use of a scroll or a magical item represents a number of spellfire points equal to the spells “caster level”. Each “plus” of a magical weapon and any single ability of other types of magical items counts as 1 spellfire point (or more, if the ability is unusually potent). Charges stored in devices represent 1 spellfire point each, all of which are transferred if the item comes into contact with the wielder. Magical effects produced by creatures can also be absorbed; a dragon's breath weapon, for instance, represents a number of spell levels equal to the dragon's breath weapon DC. A spellfire-wielder's body can hold up to the person's Constitution score in spellfire points without incurring overload penalties. Spellfire is refined, controlled, raw magic, in beneficent manifestations, it appears as a font of light and healing energy, in battle, it is a searing jet of all-consuming radiance. A person gifted with spellfire can perform amazing deeds, depending upon their skill, talent, and the amount of magical energy they have within them at the time. In general, spellfire can be used to heal, create blasts of destructive fire, or absorb magical effects it contacts, although the exact effects vary by circumstance and user. Talented wielders have developed the ability to release multiple blasts at once or even fly. Level BA Fort Ref Will Specials Invocation 1st +0 +2 +0 +2 Spellfire blast 1D6, Healing, Spell Absorption, Spellfire Overload, Least 2nd +1 +3 +0 +3 Detect Magic at will. Least 3rd +2 +3 +1 +3 Endurance (BF) 4th +3 +4 +1 +4 Increased storage +2 Least 5th +3 +4 +1 +4 Weapon focus (spellfire)(BF) 6th +4 +5 +2 +5 Drain charged item, Lesser 7th +5 +5 +2 +5 Spellfire blast 2D6 8th +6 +6 +2 +6 Increased storage +4, Lesser 9th +6 +6 +3 +6 Arcane Sight at will. Rapid Blast. 10th +7 +7 +3 +7 Drain permanent item, Lesser 11th +8 +7 +3 +7 Spellfire blast 3D6 12th +9 +8 +4 +8 Increased storage +6 Greater 13th +9 +8 +4 +8 Rapid Blast 14th +10 +9 +4 +9 Arcane Body Greater 15th +11 +9 +5 +9 Spellfire blast 4D6 16th +12 +10 +5 +10 Increased storage +8. Greater 17th +12 +10 +5 +10 Spellfire Resilience 18th +13 +11 +6 +11 Spellfire Resistance Dark 19th +14 +11 +6 +11 Spellfire Blast 5D6 20th +15 +12 +6 +12 Increased Storage +10 Dark Investment of spellfire points: A spellfire wielder can invest absorbed spellfire points into many of their class abilities, increasing the effectiveness and power of their abilities. A wielder can invest a number of spellfire points per round equal to their constitution score into a class ability. Caster level: A Spellfire wielders caster level is equal to class level. The DC for resisting a Spellfire wielders Spellfire blast or Spellfire invocations is equal to (10+ Con modifier+ Invested Spellfire points). Spellfire Blast (Su): As a standard action, a spellfire wielder may fire a blast of spellfire (equal to their base spellfire blast + spellfire points invested) as a ranged touch attack (maximum range 400 feet), dealing their listed damage + 1d6 per spellfire point invested. Spellfire blast is a “Supernatural touch attack” ability, and so is unaffected by Spell Resistance, and does not provoke an attack of opportunity when used. It is affected by Dispel Magic spells, items that absorb magic (like a Rod of Absorption), or items that negate it (like a Rod of Negation); counterspelling attempts, however, are ineffective. Spellfire also cannot penetrate an antimagic field or a dead magic zone. Note that it is possible for one spellfire wielder to absorb the spellfire blasts of another wielder. Healing (Sp): A spellfire wielder can, as a standard action, heal a target by touch, restoring 2 hit points per spellfire energy level expended for this purpose. This is not considered positive energy, so it does not injure undead. Increased Storage +2 (Ex): For purposes of determining your limit of stored spellfire energy points, overload results, and investment of spellfire, treat your Constitution as if it were 2 points higher than normal. Drain charged item (sp): (Wands, Scrolls, Potions,etc...) As a standard action, a Channeler can drain a number of charges from a touched charged item (including single-use items such as potions or scrolls), converting the energy into stored spellfire energy levels. The limit to the number of charges she can drain is equal to her Charisma bonus (minimum 1), but she can't drain more charges than the item has remaining (each spell on a scroll counts as one charge). A fully drained item has no magical properties (a potion becomes water, a scroll becomes blank paper.) A creature gets to make a Will save (DC = 10 + one-half class level + Charisma modifier+ Spellfire points invested) to prevent one of its held or carried items from being drained. Increased Storage +4 (Ex): For purposes of determining your limit of stored spellfire energy points, overload results, and investment of spellfire, treat your Constitution as if it were 4 points higher than normal. Arcane Sight (Ex):As the spell, at will, this ability replaces the Detect Magic ability. Rapid Blast (Su): at 9th level, the channeler can release two blasts of spellfire energy as a full round action. This increases to three at 13th level. Each blast after the first suffers a cumulative -2 penalty to attack rolls. Drain Permanent Item (sp): The channeler can drain power from permanent magic items by touch as a standard action. If the item is held or worn by another, the channeler must make a melee touch attack to touch it, which provokes an attack of opportunity from the defender. The channeler must make a level check (1d20+class level) against a DC of 11 + the caster level of the item to drain it. A success means the item's properties are suppressed (as if affected by dispel magic) for 24 hours and the channeler gains spellfire energy levels equal to the item's caster level. Increased Storage +6 (Ex): For purposes of determining your limit of stored spellfire energy points, overload results, and investment of spellfire, treat your Constitution as if it were 6 points higher than normal. Rapid Blast (su): 3 per round, Each blast after the first suffers a cumulative -2 penalty to attack rolls. Arcane Body (Ex): Increased Storage +8 (Ex): For purposes of determining your limit of stored spellfire energy points, overload results, and investment of spellfire, treat your Constitution as if it were 8 points higher than normal. Spellfire Resilience (Su): As an immediate action, you can reduce the damage you are about to take by 2 points for every 1 spellfire point spent. Spellfire Resistance (Su): As an immediate action, you can spend 1 spellfire point to gain a +4 racial bonus on a saving throws until the beginning of your next turn. Increased Storage +10 (Ex): For purposes of determining your limit of stored spellfire energy points, overload results, and investment of spellfire, treat your Constitution as if it were 10 points higher than normal. Invocations Steal Spell (least 1st) As the Spell thief ability, except that stolen spells are converted to spellfire points. (scales as a spellthief of equal level). A spellfire wielder can siphon spell energy away from his target and use it himself. A spellfire wielder who hits an opponent with a successful melee touch attack can instead absorb a spell, or the potential to cast a spell, from his target. If the target is willing, a spellfire wielder can steal spell energy with a touch as a standard action. The target of a steal spell attack loses one 0-level or 1st-level spell from memory if she prepares spells ahead of time, or one 0-level or 1st-level spell slot if she is a spontaneous caster. If the target has no spells prepared (or has no remaining spell slots, if she is a spontaneous caster), this ability has no effect. A spellfire wielder can choose which level of spell to steal. If a spellfire wielder tries to steal a spell level that isn't available, the stolen spell (or spell slot) is subtracted from among the next lowest spell slot available.. For example, a 1st-level spellfire wielder who uses this ability against a 1st-level sorcerer could choose to steal a first level slot. Assuming the sorcerer had a first level slot available, a successful steal spell attack would eliminate one 1st-level spell slot . If the same spellfire wielder stole magic missile from a wizard who had it prepared, the wizard would lose one prepared magic missile spell (but wouldn't lose any other magic missile spells she might also have prepared). After stealing a spell, a spellfire wielder converts the spell to spellfire energy and can use it himself on a subsequent turn. As a spellfire wielder gains levels, he can choose to steal higher-level spells. At 4th level, he can steal spells of up to 2nd level, and for every two levels gained after 4th, the maximum spell level stolen increases by one (up to a maximum of 9th-level spells at 18th level). This ability works only against spells. It has no effect on psionic powers or spell-like abilities. Steal spell effect (least 2nd) As the spellthief ability, except that stolen effects are converted to spellfire points. A spellfire wielder can siphon an active spell effect from another creature. A spellfire wielder who hits an opponent with a melee touch attack can absorb the effect of a single spell affecting the target. If the target is willing, a spellfire wielder can absorb a spell effect with a touch as a standard action, gaining spellfire points equal to the effects caster level. The stolen spell effect is determined randomly from among those currently in effect on the target. A spellfire wielder can't steal a spell effect if its caster level exceeds his class level + his Charisma modifier. Improved Healing (Lesser 3rd) the Spellfire channeler can release stored energy to heal by touch. This restores 1d4+ 1 Hit points per spellfire energy expanded. Eldritch Chain (lesser 4th; Blast Shape) Spellfire Shield (lesser; 4th): You become wreathed in an aura of spellfire, which extends 5 feet in all directions from your body, and gives of light as a torch, any creature striking with a natural weapon or a non-reach melee weapon takes a number of points of damage equal to your class level, plus spellfire points invested, and adjacent creatures take damage each round on your turn. In addition, the wielder gains DR 1/-, which increases to DR 2/- at 7th level, DR 3/- at 11th level, DR 4/- at 15th level, and DR 5/- at 19th level. Spellfire Infusion (Lesser; 4th): you can infuse magic items with the power of spellfire. Whenever you use a charged magic item (such as a wand or a staff), you can apply one of the following metamagic effects to your next use of the item: empower, enlarge, or widen. These effects work just like the metamagic feats of the same name, and require the expenditure of a number of Spellfire points equal to the increased spell slot for the feat. Alternately you can re-charge lost charges of a magic item at the rate of 1 charge per point of spellfire invested. Using spellfire infusion is a swift action. When you infuse an item with spellfire, it glows briefly with fiery aura. Crown of fire (Greater 5th): By investing 10 spellfire points per round (as a free action), into your “Spellfire Shield” you can manifest the “crown of fire”, which appears as a halo of spellfire around you and provides light as a daylight spell (bright light in a 60 ft radius, and dim light for an additional 60 feet). The crown of fire functions as “Spellfire Shield” but increases your damage reduction to 10/magic, and grants fire resistance 20, in addition it automatically destroys all non magical weapons that strike you (after inflicting damage, if any), and grants the wielder spell resistance 32 (as the spell resistance spell). Whenever someone directs a melee attack against you, you can, as an immediate action, aim a blast of spellfire at that creature. This blast deals damage equal to your Spellfire blast (including additional damage from spellfire points invested in the spellfire blast). This blast automatically strikes the target, which can attempt a reflex saving throw for half damage (DC 10+ ½ your character level + Cha modifier). Maintaining the crown of fire requires spending 10 spellfire energy points each round, which can be done as a swift action. The crown of fire, does not interfere with the channelers actions, including using other spellfire abilities. Maelstrom (Greater 6th; Blast Shape) As the Eldritch Doom invocation. Eldritch Cone (Greater; 5th; Blast Shape) Unbind Spell ( Greater; 6th): You can focus spellfire at an existing spell effect, consuming the spell, and liberating it's energies. As a standard action, you can attempt to dispel a single spell effect (even those normally immune to dispel, such as Force Wall). If you succeed on a caster level check (DC 10+ opposing caster's level), the spell effect is immediately unbound. This immediately dispels the effect, and deals 1D6 points of Spellfire damage per level of the dispelled spell to all creatures and objects within 10 feet of the unbound spell. Devour Magic (Greater; 6th) You can deliver a targeted Greater Dispel Magic (PH 223) with your touch, gaining spellfire point's equal to the caster level of the spell. Maelstrom (Greater 6th; Blast Shape) As the Eldritch Doom invocation. Crown of fire (Greater 5th): By investing 10 spellfire points per round (as a free action), into your “Spellfire Shield” you can manifest the “crown of fire”, which appears as a halo of spellfire around you and provides light as a daylight spell (bright light in a 60 ft radius, and dim light for an additional 60 feet). The crown of fire functions as “Spellfire Shield” but increases your damage reduction to 10/magic, and grants fire resistance 20, in addition it automatically destroys all non magical weapons that strike you (after inflicting damage, if any), and grants the wielder spell resistance 32 (as the spell resistance spell). Whenever someone directs a melee attack against you, you can, as an immediate action, aim a blast of spellfire at that creature. This blast deals damage equal to your Spellfire blast (including additional damage from spellfire points invested in the spellfire blast). This blast automatically strikes the target, which can attempt a reflex saving throw for half damage (DC 10+ ½ your character level + Cha modifier). Maintaining the crown of fire requires spending 10 spellfire energy points each round, which can be done as a swift action. The crown of fire, does not interfere with the channelers actions, including using other spellfire abilities. Maelstrom (Greater 6th; Blast Shape) As the Eldritch Doom invocation. Unbind Spell ( Greater; 6th): You can focus spellfire at an existing spell effect, consuming the spell, and liberating it's energies. As a standard action, you can attempt to dispel a single spell effect (even those normally immune to dispel, such as Force Wall). If you succeed on a caster level check (DC 10+ opposing caster's level), the spell effect is immediately unbound. This immediately dispels the effect, and deals 1D6 points of Spellfire damage per level of the dispelled spell to all creatures and objects within 10 feet of the unbound spell. Devour Magic (Greater; 6th) You can deliver a targeted Greater Dispel Magic (PH 223) with your touch, gaining spellfire point's equal to the caster level of the spell.
hawkinsthedm 05-29-08, 02:36 PM	Looks pretty good. I am a bit confused about "Caster Level." It seems that it could easily unbalance the game by allowing them raise their caster level without any real boundaries by storing up spellfire points. I think it would make more sense to leave the caster level as the class level, and then allow them to up the save DC of their spellfire blasts and invocations by investing spellfire points (i.e. 10 + Con + invested spellfire points). Or something like that. If you have this typed up as a Word document or something, let me know and I will give you my email address, I have an easier time reading stuff like this when it is not on a message board.
nighttree 05-29-08, 09:44 PM	Looks pretty good. I am a bit confused about "Caster Level." It seems that it could easily unbalance the game by allowing them raise their caster level without any real boundaries by storing up spellfire points. I think it would make more sense to leave the caster level as the class level, and then allow them to up the save DC of their spellfire blasts and invocations by investing spellfire points (i.e. 10 + Con + invested spellfire points). Or something like that. If you have this typed up as a Word document or something, let me know and I will give you my email address, I have an easier time reading stuff like this when it is not on a message board. That's a much better way of putting it ;) Thanks Hawkinsthedm :D
nighttree 05-29-08, 10:00 PM	As everyone can tell, I used Warlock as a framework, as well as borrowed some of the incarnum essentia investment ideas. I reduced the Warlocks EB progression significantly, in an attempt to represent a low level of absorption from the ambient energy in the enviroment, but still leave them dependent on absorbption of spell energy to get any of the really BIG effects. I scaled the invocations based on both existing Warlock (and Dragonfire adept) invocations, as well as when the 3.0 Spellfire Channeler would achieve certain effects (most by level 15), so I still need to come up with some "Dark" invocations that fit with the feel. I'm also not satisfied with the "Spellfire Resiliance/Resistance" abilities, as they kind of feel like a STUFF SOMETHING IN THERE ability......:uh-huh: So until I have a :lightbulb moment, I guess it will have to do. I never actually read the third book, anyone have ideas on what should come after Crown of Fire and Maelstrom (aka Dark invocations) ?
jabbawocky 06-19-08, 12:27 AM	I like it muchly, I must say- it's great to see two of my favourite classes combined in such a manner (Spellfire channeller and Warlock). However, you'll have to pardon my ignorance, but what exactly does 'Arcane Body' do? It seems to lack a description- is it anything like what the Incantifer from Planescape gets?