Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Wonton2006 02-27-07, 09:28 PM	Note: Yeah, i realize there's at least two of these currently around, but please tell me what you think anyway! SNIPER “Enemies always call me coward in battle. That’s not true. The cowards are the ones who try to run after I shoot an arrow through their eye into their brain from 1000 feet away.” – Shun’Ith, Elven Sniper There are many ways of conducting battle in the world, even when focusing on mundane, non-magical combat. There are those who rush into melee, and those who prefer to take action from afar. Out of the latter group, no one can hit deadlier or more precisely than sniper. Unlike normal archers, who are usually in sight but out of range when they shoot, the sniper does not worry about range. Snipers can take a target down in one shot from hundreds of feet away with seeming ease. BECOMING A SNIPER Rogues are the most common members of this class. Rangers who take the path of the archer also sometime take this class. Entry Requirements Base Attack Bonus: +6 Skills: Spot 12 ranks, Hide 9 ranks, Concentration 6 ranks Feats: Weapon Focus (any bow), Far Shot Class Skills (4 + Int modifier per level): Balance, Climb, Craft, Concentration (note - i DO plan to include this somehow later, so it won't be completely useless), Disguise, Hide, Jump, Listen, Move Silently, Perform, Profession, Search, Spot Hit die: d6 Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special -------------------------------------------------------- 1 +0 +0 +2 +0 Ranged Sneak Attack +1d6, Snipe (30 ft) 2 +1 +0 +3 +0 Snipe (60 ft) 3 +2 +1 +3 +1 Zoom (1/day), Extreme Far Shot 4 +3 +1 +4 +1 Snipe (120 ft), Far Sneak Attack (60 ft) 5 +3 +1 +4 +1 Ranged Sneak Attack +2d6, Deadly Precision 6 +4 +2 +5 +2 Snipe (240 ft), Deft Strike, Zoom (2/day) 7 +5 +2 +5 +2 Improved Zoom, Long Distance Mastery 8 +6 +2 +6 +2 Snipe (480 ft), Far Sneak Attack (120 ft) 9 +6 +3 +6 +3 Ranged Sneak Attack +3d6 10 +7 +3 +7 +3 Snipe (unlimited), Zoom (3/day), Superior Zoom, Certain Death CLASS FEATURES Ranged Sneak Attack (Ex): This is exactly like the rogue ability of the same name, except the extra damage only applies to ranged attacks. The extra damage dealt increases by +1d6 every four levels (1st, 5th, and 9th). If a sniper gets a sneak attack bonus from another source the bonuses on damage stack. Snipe (Ex): In the hands of a sniper, a ranged weapon can become much more deadly. By concentrating on an enemy for a long amount of time, she begins to discern vital spots, and calculate trajectories on how to hit the enemy. When the sniper is within 30 feet of her target (this distance increases later, and eventually at 10th level, Snipe can be used at any range), she can choose to, as a full-round action, to make a Spot check, the DC of which is equal to 15 + any modifiers for distance + any and all modifiers from the table below. (To be included later) You are moving (in a slowly moving wagon, for example) +5 Vigorous Motion +10 Violent Motion + 15 Extraordinarily Violent Motion +20 Target has cover +10 You are crouching -2 You are prone -4 If the Sniper succeeds this check, she gets a bonus to damage equal to 2d6, and a bonus of +1 to her attack roll for a single ranged attack. The sniper can repeat this action in consecutive rounds, but the maximum bonus she may ever get from this ability is 2d6/sniper level and +1/sniper level. If the sniper fails one of these checks, she does not lose her previous bonuses, she simply wastes a full-round action. If after the sniper has concentrated on a target, she is attacked, she instantly loses all her bonuses from Snipe. The Sniper may not move while focusing on an enemy, not even a 5-foot step. You may not focus on a target that has total cover, or a target that has concealment. If a target moves into total cover or gains concealment after you have started concentrating, you lose your bonuses. Note: This ability is so horrendously complicated that I'll include an example. Bob the rogue 9/sniper 3 is hidden in some foliage, looking at where, about 50 feet away, approximately 15 goblins are at work building something, ordered around by what seems to be their hobgoblin leader. He has his composite longbow drawn, and he spends a full-round action focusing on the leader. The DC for this check is 20 + 5 (for 50 feet). Somehow, he succeeds, so he gets a +1 to hit and +2d6 to damage. The next round, Bob does the exact same thing, and succeeds again, so his bonus is now +4d6 and +2. In the third round, despite his bonus to Spot of +23, Bob fails the DC, so he wasted his round, but the bonuses are still in place. In the fourth round, he tries again and succeeds this time, so now he is maxed out at +6d6 and +3. In the fifth round, he lets the arrow loose, with +3 to hit, and +6d6 to damage. Far Sneak Attack (Ex): At 4th level, and at 8th level, the sniper learns how to sneak attack people at greater distances. The range limit on her ranged sneak attacks increases from 30 to 60, and then at level 8, from 60 to 120. Zoom (Su): Starting at 3th level, once per day, the Sniper can choose to have her vision improve at critical moments. When the sniper is wielding a bow and decides to use Snipe, she can choose to Zoom as a swift action. Using this ability lessens the range penalty to spot checks from -1 per 10 feet to -1 per 20 feet. Zoom lasts for 1 minute after being activated. At 6th level, a Sniper can use Zoom twice per day, and at 10th level, 3 times per day. Extreme Far Shot (Ex): The amazing abilities of the sniper are no use to her if she can’t hit the enemy. At 3rd level, the range increments of all ranged weapons increase from one-and-a-half of their usual value (from the sniper’s Far Shot feat) to double their usual value. Deadly Precision (Ex): At 5th level, the sniper can hit vital spots much more precisely. When she is wielding a bow and using her Snipe ability, the critical multiplier on the weapon increases as such: Old Multiplier | New Multiplier x2 | x3 x3 | x5 x4 | x6 Deft Strike: At 6th level, the Sniper gets Deft Strike (Complete Adventurer) as a bonus feat. The exception is, the range restrictment on her use of this feat is not 30 feet, but whatever the range of her ranged sneak attack. Improved Zoom (Su): Starting at 7th level, when the Sniper uses her Zoom ability, the penalty becomes -1 for every 40 feet. Long Distance Mastery (Ex): By 7th level, shooting at long ranges has become no problem for the sniper. Starting at level 7, the penalty for shooting more than one range increment is reduced from -2 for each range increment to -1. Superior Zoom (Su): By 10th level, the sniper’s eyes have evolved so greatly, that when using their Zoom ability, the range penalties to Spot checks are further reduced to -1 for every 60 feet. Certain Death (Ex): Experienced snipers agree that sometimes simply wishing for an arrow to fly true causes it to be so. At 10th level, once per day, when the Sniper is using a ranged weapon, before rolling an attack roll, she can declare to use this ability. The attack roll is treated for all purposes as it were a natural 20. This means that the sniper automatically hits. She also automatically scores a critical hit (no critical confirmation is required). PLAYING A SNIPER Usually you take out enemies before they can see you. Because of this, some snipers are loners who don't enjoy company, and only want to be left alone, and allowed to do their job. Others are complete opposites, with charismatic personalities, and a nature that's easy to get along with. Others yet are ruthless killers who enjoy the panic and confusion caused on the battlefield when the first arrow hits. Combat You work is best done alone, or with a group of other archers, usually also snipers. You work great in open spaces where cover is available, and you have time to set up beforehand, and rain hell down on the enemy. In dungeon environments, your usefulness is limited, though you do not always have to Snipe, you make a fine archer as is, and simply standing behind the party or to the side can allow you to unleash deadly strikes on enemies. If your party puts your fairly stealthy talents to use as a scout, it is possible that you'll sneak up on someone who's not aware of you, and be able to use your sniper ability to take the enemy down, possibly clearing out a tough enemy. Advancement You have always preferred to use strategy, planning, and distance over brute strength, and the extremely risky melee combat. Even as a child, you were probably the best at simple strategic games such as Capture the Flag, because of your clever tactics and complete willingness to isolate yourself. Others might have called you a coward, and said your methods are unfair, but your reply was always the same "I'm not breaking any rules: it's just strategy." As an adult, you took up archery, but never enjoyed normal archery which is usually not very far away from melee combat, and you had always wondered about one thing: What happened to an archer when a blade-wielding enemy got too close to him? You were also disgusted by the inaccuracy of normal archers. Your archery skills went in a different direction from those of normal archers, and eventually, you probably started getting training from a more experienced Sniper, though some rare and talented people do figure out these secrets on their own. Your most important skills are obviously Spot and Concentration (more in a later update), but Stealth skills such as Hide and Move Silently, as well as Athletic skills such as Climb and Jump are useful to get yourself in good sniping positions, as well as for making quick getaways. Feat choices should likewise revolve around archery. Precise Shot and Rapid Shot are excellent choices to improve your ability as a normal archer, and Zen Archery is likewise a good choice for many archers. Resources Snipers are often hired by public and private organizations, as well as even government organizations sometimes to conduct assassinations. Some of these are more valiant deeds than others, the type of job a sniper is willing to take on depends solely on her alignment. Some snipers will accept any target, be it head of evil cult, or kind and compassionate king, while other have clear "taboos" on how far they're willing to let other s use their talents. For now, I just want to know what you think of those abilities. Stuff yet to add: The table for Snipe modifiers, all sorts of details to Snipe as in "what happens if..", the rest of the fluff that comes after.
Khatoblepas 02-28-07, 09:18 AM	I think this class has potential, but as is really breakable. You could make a Deepwood Sniper/Sniper combo, and get a x7 ( (x3*2-(x3/2))+2 ) or x8 ( (x3+2)*2-((x3+2)/2) ) critical on your bows depending on how you work it out. =) Nice, and devestating with an enchanted Greatbow on a critical hit, but not absolutely gamebreaking... much. What worries me is the ranged sneak attack and the snipe ability. You get +1d6/level +1/level if you perform a single attack as a full round action, right? That's around 1d8+10d6+10+Str as a base. Minimum 21 damage. But this is also to do with sneak attack! Let's take a Rogue 9/Assassin 1/Sniper 10. (Assassin was used to boost sneak attack, giving us 10d6 at the end, the same as a normal rogue, and to give a real life example. Come on, who WOULDN'T want death attack and poison use before they became a sniper type? It's cool =) ) Assume they're using a +5 Composite Greatbow at 20th level, and enchantments to ensure they can wield it properly. At 20th level, they have 1d10 (base) +10d6 (snipe) +10d6 (SA) +10 (snipe) +5 (Composite Str) +any enchantments. From as far away as you like, NOONE wouldn't be flat footed (apart from rogues and barbarians). This is once per round as long as they can pass a spot check (which is easy to do if you know how). Add onto that Certus Nex, which on it's own isn't that bad, though it could be better replicating the effects of True Strike. Automatically critical x5 once per day? Hurray! So.. yeah.. it's a bit powerful. You might want to keep a cap on the ranged sneak attack, and probably remove the extra dice from snipe... add in Dex to damage as long as you can sneak attack, that's always nice for a boost =)
Wonton2006 02-28-07, 09:57 AM	Ah... you misunderstood Snipe. I added an example to clear up how it works. If you want a +10d6, you need to be 10th level, and succeed 10 spot check, each of which is a full-round action, and then in the 11th round, unleash a single attack. Now, something which is interesting is that I'm starting to realize that going through all that trouble to snipe may not be needed, seeing as you could just fire off 2-3 arrows as a full round action, and have each sneak attack... Which is why I added all those abilities that say "If you're wielding a bow and using Snipe...", but if they're still not enough to make Snipe a worthwhile option, I'll probably have to remove ranged sneak attack and far sneak attack...
RobbyPants 02-28-07, 11:09 AM	I like a lot of the ideas here. One thing I'd recomend is changing the Deadly Precision ability to just add +1 to the crit multiplier, rather than following the table. As per 3.5 multiplier math, it would effectively "double" the crit multiplier. Nice job :D
Iarmeister 02-28-07, 01:11 PM	Ditto on RobbyPants' suggestion to make the Crit Multiplier increase only +1. And here's one compelling reason why... Regarding the Snipe Class Ability...it is pretty clunky rules-wise, as is. How about adopting this: From Dragon Magazine issue 310, under Fighter-variants, The Targetteer...Sniper ability: "When using the full attack option, the Sniper can sacrifice attacks to gain deadly accuracty. For each attack from a full attack sacrificed, the threat range of the Sniper's weapon increases by 1. Thus, if the Sniper's ranged attack normally has a threat range of 19 - 20, sacrificing one attack from a full attack would increase the threat range to 18 - 20. A sacrificed attack only enhances the next attack. However, a Sniper can sacrifice multiple attacks to further increase the threat range. A Sniper cannot sacrifice all attacks from a full attack action." -- Wherever Sniper appears in the descriptor of this ability, I changed from Targetteer. Lastly, and especially if you like this ability and decide to incorporate it, Certus Nex must be changed! An automatic threat without rolling dice?? Too strong, imo. Perhaps have Certus Nex completely nullify an opponents cover and concealment or something like that... For realz tho...dig this class!
Wonton2006 03-01-07, 10:20 AM	Small update (more later tonight when I have time)! :D To Iarmeister and Robby Pants - the reason why I didn't simply increase the crit by one is because it would be unfair towards x4 weapons. x2 --> x3 Power increased by 50%. x3 --> x4 Power increased by 33%. x4 --> x5 Power increased by 25%. So while a 18-20/x2 bow is equal to in power to a x4 bow, this would unbalance them. So I just went ahead and made it x 1.5 x2 --> x3 x3 --> x4.5 (I rounded this to 5, and not 4, because x3 weapons are pretty sucky anyway) x4 --> x6 Cheers.
keith187 03-01-07, 10:02 PM	Instead of certain death give the PrC the ability to cast Hunters Mercy x/day. It makes your next hit a confermed crit, but you still need to hit so it balances it out. An unlimited range SA is just too broken. Maybe make it go up from 30ft to 60ft and cap it there.
Wonton2006 03-01-07, 11:47 PM	It seems that most people feel that Certain Death is broken.. hm. What if I reduced it to once/week? I just really like the concept (as in, this could be the turning point of the battle.. don't miss! *and he doesn't*), and I'd like the ability to stay the same. I was kind of thinking about the sneak attack thing too... The reality is my ultimate goal is to make Snipe a powerful, feasible combat option. As it is now, it actually does more damage simply firing two, or three arrows, or whatever with sneak attack then using the blasted Snipe for a whole 10 rounds. My proposed solution is this: I'll reduce sneak attack damage, as well as drastically reducing range. Then I'll maybe power Snipe up a bit. :D Oh and I just realized that while, with a Composite Longbow, they can shoot 10 range increments at 220 feet each, so 2200 feet, but even with Improved Zoom, that's a (brief math) +55 to the DC! I think Zoom and Improved Zoom will soon get their bonuses increased (maybe even doubled). Edit: The new stuff is up. Read it over again. Notice how snipe is 2d6/level. Also thinking of a mechanic, to, if DC is beaten sufficiently well, to speed up the sniping process (I just find it ridiculous to think a level 10 sniper would still have to take 10 rounds to completely analyze a target 60 feet away). Will probably be a "if you beat the DC by x or more" kind of thing. More Edit: Oh and, by the way, Certain Death sounds kinda.. lame, if you ask me It was Certus Nex before, which, according to an online translator is Certain Death in latin, but I have some other possibilities. True Arrow Guided Arrow Arrow from the Heart Certus Nex (why not?) Headshot Perfect Aim One-hit Kill Trueshot Yup, More Edit: Added some more fluff.
Khatoblepas 03-02-07, 07:29 AM	Maybe Snipe should be more like a Death Attack? Snipe (Ex): In the hands of a sniper, a ranged weapon can become much more deadly. By concentrating on an enemy for a long amount of time, she begins to discern vital spots, and calculate trajectories on how to hit the enemy. When the sniper is within 30 feet of her target (this distance increases later, and eventually at 10th level, Snipe can be used at any range), she can choose to, as full-round actions, make a number of Spot checks equal to her class level (one check per round), the DC of which is equal to 15 + any modifiers for distance + any and all modifiers from the table below. (To be included later) For every successful spot check, the Sniper gets a damage bonus equal to 1d6. In addition, for every two checks passed, her threat range increases by 1 (For example, if she succeeds at four checks, her threat range becomes 18-20 instead of just threatening on a 20), to a maximum of (15-20). This doesn't stack with other effects that increase the threat range of a weapon, such as the keen enhancement. Hmm.... that means at 10th level, she'd be critical hitting a quarter of the time. Maybe it should stack with Keen and Improved Critical? Threat range increases tend to indicate greater aptitude at hitting vital areas, though.
Wonton2006 03-02-07, 08:02 PM	Hm.. does that mean that you're against the bonus to hit? I'm definitely keeping the bonus to damage, maybe reducing it if people think that 2d6/round/level is overpowered. But the bonus to hit I might remove. So.. what do people think?
Makuta999 03-03-07, 02:19 PM	I like the idea. Names are still up in the air, and the snipe ability does seem a bit overpowered... how about instead of having a set rate of increase (i.e. +5 for each range increment) how about do it exponentially, so it's a +5 for the first range, +10 for the second, +20 for the third, and so on?
Wonton2006 03-04-07, 01:41 PM	Some updates, also some more updates later tonight!
Rymosrac 08-30-07, 05:44 PM	Awesome work! Some of the abilities are perhaps more complicated than necessary, but I think they're all very well balanced. +2d6 damage / round is fine, as you're probably still getting less damage overall compared to if you were just rapid-firing loads of arrows off every round. *Suggestion for revising snipe later. Also, the entry requirements look a bit steep. with a requirement of 12 ranks in spot, you can't even start taking the class until 10th level. You can't finish this prestige class until you're 20th level! Most 10-level prestige classes are built so that you can start taking them at your 6th level. Definetly a very offense-focused sniper here. Could maybe use an ability or two to help them remain hidden. Also, the combination of a x5 critical multiplier with a auto-hit, auto-threat, auto-confirmation sounds a little frightening. If you really want them to be able to pull of that amazing shot with no chance of failure every so often. . . Okay, but I'd prefer if it weren't a guaranteed thing. Maybe change this ability to auto-confirm a threat once or twice a day. As for snipe. . .Let me do some math. At level 10, you've got a maximum snipe damage with a longbow of: d8(longbow) +20d6(snipe) = 74.5 average, without any other modifiers, and an average critical damage of: 92.5 with your x5 multiplier. In all honesty, this is pretty low for the total damage done by a 20th level character in 11 rounds of combat. Yes, you could potentially charge up snipe before combat begins, which makes it better, and you can also do it from a long ways away, which helps. Still, ought to be a hair stronger IMHO. Now here's my suggestion. Remove the deadly precision ability. I like the idea of a sniper have the training to land more powerful criticals, but landing a critical with just any old attack mostly represents luck. My idea would be to get rid of the deadly precision ability and replace the +2d6 / +1 of snipe. Have each round of concentration instead equal a +1 to both the threat range and multiplier of the weapon being used. Sounds scary, huh? Again with the math thing: After 10 rounds of concentration, you've got a critical threat range of 9-20. Yes, you can still roll shots that won't be criticals, but against most enemies appropriate for your 20th level character, you'll either score a threat or miss entirely. Now for the damage. With +10 to the multiplier, you'll be scoring for 13d8 damage. Average of 58.5. Significantly lower than the ability I just said looked weak. Solution: Grab a bigger gun. If you're going to be playing a character who wants to do loads of damage with a single shot, I'd recommend using the Greatbow (Complete Warrior, base damage d10), which will bump your average damage with this ability up to 71.5. Now we're about even with your original ability. Bump it up another notch to the Great Crossbow (Races of Stone) base damage 2d8), and you'll now be rolling 24d8 with each critical, an average damage of 108. Better, I think, though I still might not want to only be able to do that once every 11 rounds at 20th level. Some way of speeding up the concentration is essential, so long as it's not too much. Of course, none of these calculations are taking into account any bonuses or even sneak attack die. I don't have THAT much time. Anyways, I really like a lot of what you've got here. Fun stuff! Edit: Sorry for the thread necromancy. :tongue: