Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Mad_Jack 04-28-08, 12:26 AM	I was poking around through Complete Scoundrel and reread the Uncanny Trickster's class features... Something occurred to me. Levels 2 and 3 of the class give you "class features and an increase in effective level as if you had also gained a level in a class to which you belonged before..." It's different from the usual +1 spellcasting text for PrC's in that a level in uncanny trickster gives you all the other class features as well - It's essentially a level in whatever class you were before (minus a few things like hp and BAB), but with a rogue's skill points. This brings up a few questions about what "an increase in effective level" means to a non-spellcaster... In relation to my character, a rogue that's taken a level of swashbuckler and a level of fighter for some combat feats, I was wondering about the following questions. 1. I had to take a second level of fighter later in the character build in order to not take the xp penalty for having a lot more swashbuckler levels than fighter levels. It wasn't all that bad since I needed the feat, but I did take a hit on my skill points. :( Say I took an uncanny trickster level and chose to apply the effective level to my fighter class. Since I get an increase in "effective level" as a fighter, would that count towards not having to deal with the multi-classing xp penalty? If I can just use one of the uncanny tricker levels to take care of that instead of a second fighter level, I'll still end up with a bonus feat but won't get screwed on my skill points. (On a side note, would it also allow me to qualify for things like weapon specialization?) 2. If I chose to gain an "effective level" as a swashbuckler, would that count towards the class-feature-stacking feats such as Daring Outlaw? Obviously, taking the class features of a rogue for that level would count towards SA, since SA is a rogue class feature, but I wasn't quite sure how gaining an "effective level" as a swashbuckler would interact with that... Any thoughts?
Sinfire Titan 04-28-08, 01:46 AM	1: No. 2: Yes. Its that simple. Because you are treating one class as being a few levels higher than it really is for the purposes of class level-dependent abilities, the Daring Outlaw feat improves it as though you really were a level higher in the class. However, the Multiclassing XP Penalties do not incorporate PrCs into the math, and as such any levels gained in a PrC do not count towards your Character Level for the penalty. Because it actually checks your class level in each individual class, it ignores the Uncanny Trickster advancement completely when determining the penalty. XP Penalties are confusing. They add a level of complexity to an all ready complex option (some people are very poor at multiclassing, and don't even consider it an option), and penalize you for trying to make a better character. When the recommended stat generation method in the Core rules all ready penalize you for even playing the game, what is the point of having another rule on top of them all that makes your character weaker than it should be? Favored Classes are an attempt to ignore this penalty, but even they don't cut it, as you cannot choose for half of the races out there. What more, WotC has presented feats and variants of races that help alleviate the penalty, as to do away with it entirely. They are also removing the penalty outright in 4E, as they themselves have said that it was a pointless restriction that many DMs ignore outright (I've even seen RPGA DMs for the WWD&D Game Day eschewing the penalty, rather than enforcing it). (To the side note: Yes.)
Mad_Jack 04-28-08, 11:36 PM	I was pretty sure it wouldn't work for the xp penalty, but I figured I'd throw it out there just in case there was some obscure cheese that made it possible. Now to break out the pencils and scratch paper and see if it's worth it to work the uncanny trickster into my character build...