5th-level powers suck. [Archive] - Wizards Community

5th-level powers suck. [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Lycanthromancer
05-31-07, 05:28 PM Am I the only person that really doesn't like the 5th-level list of powers for psions and wilders? Other than psionic true seeing, which can easily be chucked for touchsight in most campaigns, I always use my 5th-level slots for 1st, 2nd, or 3rd-level powers.

We need better 5th-level powers! Who's with me!?
InkBlot
05-31-07, 05:40 PM Adapt body, catapsi, energy current, hail of crystals, incarnate, psionic major creation, mind probe, psionic plane shift, power resistance, psionic revivify, second chance, psionic teleport, and tower of iron will do not suck.
Knight0
05-31-07, 05:47 PM Adapt body
Power Resistence (if you playing transparency)
Plane Shift
True Seeing (can also see creatures that are incorporeal or on the ethereal plane or the plane of shadow which touchsight can't do)
Anticipatory Strike (CPsi)(Ignore the entire initiative system and go when you feel like it)

Disciplines
Egoist:
Psionic Revivify (True res at 5th level for 200xp in a standard action)

Kinetisist:
Fiery discorporation (Cheat Death)
Energy Nullification Field(CPsi)(Negate an element type even if it inflicts ailments other than damage)

Nomad:
Baleful Teleport
Teleport
Teleport Trigger
Temporal Reiteration (CPsi)(Having an extra round of some powers/spells/effects can be very helpful, also can be used on others so you can keep your barbarian raging or if your druids wildshape)

Seer:
Second Chance

Mantles(CPsi)
Energy Manipulation
Celestial Conduit (Fire a beam of positive energy that hurts everyone and deals extra damage to undead, and don't forget that positive energy doesnt suffer from the 50% miss chance for incorporeal creatures)
Shadow Walk

Hope that helps. The really bad level is 2.
Lycanthromancer
05-31-07, 05:49 PM Tower of Iron Will, I suppose I'll grant, but I don't particularly like any of the others. Perhaps I should've mentioned the generalist list, since you generally only get a single power from the devotion lists that's ever any good.

[edit] Oh, and I succeeded on my Will save to disbelieve that Complete Psionic ever existed. It doesn't, do you hear me?! :P

I suppose I'm wanting interesting and unique utility effects, which just aren't there at 5th level. *Psigh.*
InkBlot
05-31-07, 06:08 PM OK, just the general list then. That still leaves adapt body, catapsi, power resistance, and plane shift.

Plane Shift and Adapt Body: These two go together like a horse and cairrage. With these powers you can travel to new and exciting planes of existance, and you don't have to worry if that plane happense to be on fire. Realy cool, but admitantly not the most useful. It's great for getting rid of people you don't like, without killing them.

Power Resistance: How is freely scalling power resistance not the most awesome thing ever?! In case you didn't notice it the first time, this power improves without you spending power points. At 9th level, you pay 9 power points for PR 21. At 19th level, you pay 9 power points for PR 31. You can even manifest this power on other creatures, and give your entire party power resistance.

Catapsi: Okay, so the DC doesn't scale. And it's worthless in a low-psi campaign. Besides that, it great for any psion/wilder who is willing to get up close and personal with other psionic characters (for example, a wilder gish).
Vharuck
05-31-07, 06:24 PM Psionic true seeing is awesome. It is the trump card for most every illusion. Until this power, illusion and divination (or, for psionics, clairsentience) was a game of rock-paper-scissors. This power is like using atom bomb instead.

Or am I an idiot?
InkBlot
05-31-07, 06:36 PM No, you're correct. Psionic true seeing is a great power. Nobody is saying it isn't. We're just debating wether or not any of the other 5th level powers are worth taking.
hovnarr
05-31-07, 08:17 PM OK, so basically we're talking about SRD powers from the Psion/Wilder list. Not only are there not so many good powers there, there aren't so many powers, period:

Adapt Body: Your body automatically adapts to hostile environments.
Catapsi A: Psychic static inhibits power manifestation.
Ectoplasmic Shambler: Foglike predator deals 1 point of damage/two levels each round to an area.
Incarnate X: Make some powers permanent.
Leech Field A: Leech power points each time you make a saving throw.
Major Creation, Psionic: As psionic minor creation, plus stone and metal.
Plane Shift, Psionic: Travel to other planes.
Power Resistance: Grant PR equal to 12 + level.
Psychic Crush A: Brutally crush subject’s mental essence, reducing subject to -1 hit points.
Shatter Mind Blank: Cancels target’s mind blank effect.
Tower of Iron Will A: Grant PR 19 against mind-affecting powers to all creatures within 10 ft. until your next turn.
True Seeing, Psionic: See all things as they really are.

12 powers to choose from. We might want as many as 4 lvl-5 powers, but one will probably be discipline specific. So we need to find three from that list worth taking. Well,

1) Plane Shift: Naturally you want this one.
2) True Seeing: Instead of or even in addition to touchsight.
3) Take ToIW here, then when you get mindblank you can swap it for more utility such as Major Creation or Adapt Body
4) Power Resistance or a discipline power in this slot

OK, so you get no melee buffs, direct damage or save-or-dies, but you have plenty of those in the other levels. Level 5 powers rounds out utility powers, especially anti-caster stuff.
crizhII
06-01-07, 03:38 AM True Seeing (can also see creatures that are incorporeal or on the ethereal plane or the plane of shadow which touchsight can't do)

Where are you getting plane of shadow from?

I can only see mention of the ethereal in the PHB...
BlaineTog
06-01-07, 03:56 AM I kinda agree. I mean, I wouldn't so much say they suck per se, just that there aren't as many totally cool powers as in some of the other levels.

Adapt Body: Kinda cool, and I actually kinda like it, but the coolness is mitigated substantially by its general lack of use.
Catapsi: Boring and useless.
Ectoplasmic Shambler: Lame, boring, and useless.
Incarnate: It is important that this power exists, but I wouldn't ever want to take it.
Leech Field: Boring and useless.
Major Creation, Psionic: Not useless, but the effect isn't really all that much better than Minor Creation, which is so much more awesome because of its super-low price.
Plane Shift, Psionic: Kinda cool, but far from unique.
Power Resistance: Not useless, but kinda boring.
Psychic Crush: A cool idea, but the bonus to their will save as well as the really lame augment make this power kinda crappy.
Shatter Mind Blank: Really, really lame.
Tower of Iron Will: I just don't like this one.
True Seeing, Psionic: This one is actually really cool, if only because it's cheap.

So that makes One I really like and Two I kinda like. That's way below par. And I'm sure these all have their uses, but that doesn't make me like them.
Lycanthromancer
06-01-07, 03:39 PM Tower of Iron Will, I suppose I'll grant<snip>
Sorry, I was thinking of intellect fortress. Yeah, it sucks.
carnivore
06-01-07, 04:33 PM Ectoplasmic Shambler: Lame, boring, and useless.

i have to take exception to this.....it is a great power(especially in dungeons)

notice:
Ectoplasmic Shambler
Metacreativity (Creation)
Level: Psion/wilder 5
Display: Auditory, material, and olfactory; see text
Manifesting Time: 1 round
Range: Long (400 ft. + 40 ft./level)
Effect: One ectoplasmic manifestation of a size equal to ten 10-ft. cubes (S)
Duration: 1 min./level
Saving Throw: None
Power Resistance: No
Power Points: 9

You fashion an ephemeral, manylegged mass of pseudo-living ectoplasm called an ectoplasmic shambler. You can direct the shambler as a free action. It has a speed of 10 feet. It can completely surround objects (and opponents) over which it is manifested or onto which it moves, because it has the consistency of thick mist. The vision of those within the shambler is limited to 5 feet, and manifesting powers (or casting spells) within the shambler is difficult due to the constant turbulence felt by those caught in the shambler’s form.

Creatures enveloped by the shambler, regardless of Armor Class, take 1 point of damage for every two manifester levels you have in each round they become or remain within the roiling turbulence of the shambler. Anyone trying to manifest a power must make a Concentration check (DC 15 + power’s or spell’s level) to successfully manifest a power or cast a spell inside the shambler.

A wind stronger than 20 miles per hour that blows against the shambler reduces its speed to 0 feet during the first round, and in subsequent rounds moves it in the direction of the wind at a speed of 5 feet. A wind stronger than 20 miles per hour that blows in the direction the shambler travels increases its speed to 15 feet.

it is:
1)Free scaling: damage, range, duration scale with ML, one of the few that do
2)controled as a Free Action..... completely under your control...moveable
3)shapeable effect ..... large are affected....
4)moveable ...... but slowly
5) stackable ..... you can manifest several on top of each other, as it can be in the same space with other creatures even like itself
6)No Save, NO SR-PR ....... affects everything
7)Long Range effect ...... one of the Few long range Psionic Damaging effects

exa:if a 20th lvl Psion Manifests it 2 times ..... he Pays only 18 PP for a Duration of 20 minutes... if he manifests them on top of each other and has them move together..... the effect does 20 points Damage/ round to any inside...takes up Area of 10x10x100.....great for Moveable Battlefield Control

its only drawbacks:
1)slow speed
2)Wind affects it(thus used to best effect in Dungeons/underground/windless areas)

:D
Ogg
06-01-07, 05:05 PM I took Cranial Deludge from Complete Psionics. I know it's Fortitude negates but it's just too fun to have the power from the movie Scanners, besides my psion's always threatening to melt people's brains so it fit.

Yeah & some of the Discipline Powers rock. Personally I took Fiery Discorporation. Fiery Discorporation + Empty Mind + a paladin in the group with a flaming sword= Pretty sure fire way (pun intended) to cheat death.
Psikerlord
06-02-07, 12:57 AM I agree there are few good 5th level powers. I thought plane shift was good until I noticed the psionic version says willing creatures only (different to the PHB version). I think Cpsi has come to the rescue on this one though - ethereal agent is a nice scouting power, psychotic break is a great attacking will save power which is DC augmentable. Anticipatory strike is nice for when you really really need that extra action. Celestial conduit (psion 5th, not mantle only) is a great anti incorporeal foe power (+ve energy effect, does not suffer the usual miss chance, akin to force effect see p.310 MMI, and also later web articles) and is also generaaly useful as a 120' line effect to complement your energy rays or energy missiles. I think incarnate is good for detect magic, darkvision and umbiquitous vision (but after incarnating, would get rid of incarnate with psychic reformation).
BlaineTog
06-02-07, 02:12 AM i have to take exception to this.....it is a great power(especially in dungeons)

notice:

it is:
1)Free scaling: damage, range, duration scale with ML, one of the few that do
2)controled as a Free Action..... completely under your control...moveable
3)shapeable effect ..... large are affected....
4)moveable ...... but slowly
5) stackable ..... you can manifest several on top of each other, as it can be in the same space with other creatures even like itself
6)No Save, NO SR-PR ....... affects everything
7)Long Range effect ...... one of the Few long range Psionic Damaging effects

exa:if a 20th lvl Psion Manifests it 2 times ..... he Pays only 18 PP for a Duration of 20 minutes... if he manifests them on top of each other and has them move together..... the effect does 20 points Damage/ round to any inside...takes up Area of 10x10x100.....great for Moveable Battlefield Control

its only drawbacks:
1)slow speed
2)Wind affects it(thus used to best effect in Dungeons/underground/windless areas)

:DAnd yet, still generally a waste of power points. And still lame and boring. Oh look, I summoned an area that kinda hurts you every round, unless you blow real hard. That's totally as awesome as Cloudkill (also 5th level). Totally.
Fleem
06-03-07, 02:52 AM I'd have to agree about 5th level powers being unimpressive. I used it as an opportunity to pick up some 4th and 3rd level powers I'd skipped. Except for psionic revivify, which might be useful. Someday.
hovnarr
06-03-07, 06:40 AM Except for psionic revivify, which might be useful. Someday.

It's perhaps the best ressurect effect in the game, its only drawback being expedient administration (which can be fixed with Time Hopping a fallen comrade). If you rarely get to use it, it means your party members rarely die, which means you're doing well. :)
Slagger the Chuul
06-03-07, 10:11 AM And still lame and boring. Oh look, I summoned an area that kinda hurts you every round, unless you blow real hard. That's totally as awesome as Cloudkill (also 5th level). Totally.

It's a mobile area of concealment that also acts as a spell deterrent (actually a double deterrent, since it deals continuous damage as well as specifically disrupting casters); wind effects can be annoying on a few rare occasions, unless you have control air. Unlike cloudkill, an ectoplasmic shambler can be placed at long range, relocates at your order, allows no save, and deals typeless damage.

It can be lame and boring, but that depends on how you describe or use it. Just don't get too bogged down by the standard description and you can have anything from diaphanous flames to a cloud of hungry ghosts.
Knight0
06-03-07, 05:22 PM In relation to saying that true seeing allows you to see foes on the plane of shadow I apoligise I was thinking of the transdimensional power feat at the time. Actually would manifesting touchsight as a transdimensional power work on shadow and ethereal foes?
InkBlot
06-03-07, 06:08 PM Yes, transdimensional touchsight would let you feel the presence of creatures on the shadow plane. Oddly enough, by a strict reading of the rules, you can't use it to feel objects on the shadow plane. The transdimensional power feat only references creatures.
crizhII
06-04-07, 05:13 AM Yes, transdimensional touchsight would let you feel the presence of creatures on the shadow plane. Oddly enough, by a strict reading of the rules, you can't use it to feel objects on the shadow plane. The transdimensional power feat only references creatures.

"you must have line of effect to a creature or object to discern it." EPH p138

Fantastic power. Better Widened, even better Transdimensional. In certain ways even better than True Seeing.
The_Ditto
06-04-07, 09:20 AM [edit] Oh, and I succeeded on my Will save to disbelieve that Complete Psionic ever existed. It doesn't, do you hear me?! :P

Unfortunately it's not an illusion effect, it's a conjuration(creation) effect ...

.. done by a caster/manifester with a really sucky craft skill!! ;)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Lycanthromancer 05-31-07, 05:28 PM	Am I the only person that really doesn't like the 5th-level list of powers for psions and wilders? Other than psionic true seeing, which can easily be chucked for touchsight in most campaigns, I always use my 5th-level slots for 1st, 2nd, or 3rd-level powers. We need better 5th-level powers! Who's with me!?
InkBlot 05-31-07, 05:40 PM	Adapt body, catapsi, energy current, hail of crystals, incarnate, psionic major creation, mind probe, psionic plane shift, power resistance, psionic revivify, second chance, psionic teleport, and tower of iron will do not suck.
Knight0 05-31-07, 05:47 PM	Adapt body Power Resistence (if you playing transparency) Plane Shift True Seeing (can also see creatures that are incorporeal or on the ethereal plane or the plane of shadow which touchsight can't do) Anticipatory Strike (CPsi)(Ignore the entire initiative system and go when you feel like it) Disciplines Egoist: Psionic Revivify (True res at 5th level for 200xp in a standard action) Kinetisist: Fiery discorporation (Cheat Death) Energy Nullification Field(CPsi)(Negate an element type even if it inflicts ailments other than damage) Nomad: Baleful Teleport Teleport Teleport Trigger Temporal Reiteration (CPsi)(Having an extra round of some powers/spells/effects can be very helpful, also can be used on others so you can keep your barbarian raging or if your druids wildshape) Seer: Second Chance Mantles(CPsi) Energy Manipulation Celestial Conduit (Fire a beam of positive energy that hurts everyone and deals extra damage to undead, and don't forget that positive energy doesnt suffer from the 50% miss chance for incorporeal creatures) Shadow Walk Hope that helps. The really bad level is 2.
Lycanthromancer 05-31-07, 05:49 PM	Tower of Iron Will, I suppose I'll grant, but I don't particularly like any of the others. Perhaps I should've mentioned the generalist list, since you generally only get a single power from the devotion lists that's ever any good. [edit] Oh, and I succeeded on my Will save to disbelieve that Complete Psionic ever existed. It doesn't, do you hear me?! :P I suppose I'm wanting interesting and unique utility effects, which just aren't there at 5th level. Psigh.
InkBlot 05-31-07, 06:08 PM	OK, just the general list then. That still leaves adapt body, catapsi, power resistance, and plane shift. Plane Shift and Adapt Body: These two go together like a horse and cairrage. With these powers you can travel to new and exciting planes of existance, and you don't have to worry if that plane happense to be on fire. Realy cool, but admitantly not the most useful. It's great for getting rid of people you don't like, without killing them. Power Resistance: How is freely scalling power resistance not the most awesome thing ever?! In case you didn't notice it the first time, this power improves without you spending power points. At 9th level, you pay 9 power points for PR 21. At 19th level, you pay 9 power points for PR 31. You can even manifest this power on other creatures, and give your entire party power resistance. Catapsi: Okay, so the DC doesn't scale. And it's worthless in a low-psi campaign. Besides that, it great for any psion/wilder who is willing to get up close and personal with other psionic characters (for example, a wilder gish).
Vharuck 05-31-07, 06:24 PM	Psionic true seeing is awesome. It is the trump card for most every illusion. Until this power, illusion and divination (or, for psionics, clairsentience) was a game of rock-paper-scissors. This power is like using atom bomb instead. Or am I an idiot?
InkBlot 05-31-07, 06:36 PM	No, you're correct. Psionic true seeing is a great power. Nobody is saying it isn't. We're just debating wether or not any of the other 5th level powers are worth taking.
hovnarr 05-31-07, 08:17 PM	OK, so basically we're talking about SRD powers from the Psion/Wilder list. Not only are there not so many good powers there, there aren't so many powers, period: Adapt Body: Your body automatically adapts to hostile environments. Catapsi A: Psychic static inhibits power manifestation. Ectoplasmic Shambler: Foglike predator deals 1 point of damage/two levels each round to an area. Incarnate X: Make some powers permanent. Leech Field A: Leech power points each time you make a saving throw. Major Creation, Psionic: As psionic minor creation, plus stone and metal. Plane Shift, Psionic: Travel to other planes. Power Resistance: Grant PR equal to 12 + level. Psychic Crush A: Brutally crush subject’s mental essence, reducing subject to -1 hit points. Shatter Mind Blank: Cancels target’s mind blank effect. Tower of Iron Will A: Grant PR 19 against mind-affecting powers to all creatures within 10 ft. until your next turn. True Seeing, Psionic: See all things as they really are. 12 powers to choose from. We might want as many as 4 lvl-5 powers, but one will probably be discipline specific. So we need to find three from that list worth taking. Well, 1) Plane Shift: Naturally you want this one. 2) True Seeing: Instead of or even in addition to touchsight. 3) Take ToIW here, then when you get mindblank you can swap it for more utility such as Major Creation or Adapt Body 4) Power Resistance or a discipline power in this slot OK, so you get no melee buffs, direct damage or save-or-dies, but you have plenty of those in the other levels. Level 5 powers rounds out utility powers, especially anti-caster stuff.
crizhII 06-01-07, 03:38 AM	True Seeing (can also see creatures that are incorporeal or on the ethereal plane or the plane of shadow which touchsight can't do) Where are you getting plane of shadow from? I can only see mention of the ethereal in the PHB...
BlaineTog 06-01-07, 03:56 AM	I kinda agree. I mean, I wouldn't so much say they suck per se, just that there aren't as many totally cool powers as in some of the other levels. Adapt Body: Kinda cool, and I actually kinda like it, but the coolness is mitigated substantially by its general lack of use. Catapsi: Boring and useless. Ectoplasmic Shambler: Lame, boring, and useless. Incarnate: It is important that this power exists, but I wouldn't ever want to take it. Leech Field: Boring and useless. Major Creation, Psionic: Not useless, but the effect isn't really all that much better than Minor Creation, which is so much more awesome because of its super-low price. Plane Shift, Psionic: Kinda cool, but far from unique. Power Resistance: Not useless, but kinda boring. Psychic Crush: A cool idea, but the bonus to their will save as well as the really lame augment make this power kinda crappy. Shatter Mind Blank: Really, really lame. Tower of Iron Will: I just don't like this one. True Seeing, Psionic: This one is actually really cool, if only because it's cheap. So that makes One I really like and Two I kinda like. That's way below par. And I'm sure these all have their uses, but that doesn't make me like them.
Lycanthromancer 06-01-07, 03:39 PM	Tower of Iron Will, I suppose I'll grant<snip> Sorry, I was thinking of intellect fortress. Yeah, it sucks.
carnivore 06-01-07, 04:33 PM	Ectoplasmic Shambler: Lame, boring, and useless. i have to take exception to this.....it is a great power(especially in dungeons) notice: Ectoplasmic Shambler Metacreativity (Creation) Level: Psion/wilder 5 Display: Auditory, material, and olfactory; see text Manifesting Time: 1 round Range: Long (400 ft. + 40 ft./level) Effect: One ectoplasmic manifestation of a size equal to ten 10-ft. cubes (S) Duration: 1 min./level Saving Throw: None Power Resistance: No Power Points: 9 You fashion an ephemeral, manylegged mass of pseudo-living ectoplasm called an ectoplasmic shambler. You can direct the shambler as a free action. It has a speed of 10 feet. It can completely surround objects (and opponents) over which it is manifested or onto which it moves, because it has the consistency of thick mist. The vision of those within the shambler is limited to 5 feet, and manifesting powers (or casting spells) within the shambler is difficult due to the constant turbulence felt by those caught in the shambler’s form. Creatures enveloped by the shambler, regardless of Armor Class, take 1 point of damage for every two manifester levels you have in each round they become or remain within the roiling turbulence of the shambler. Anyone trying to manifest a power must make a Concentration check (DC 15 + power’s or spell’s level) to successfully manifest a power or cast a spell inside the shambler. A wind stronger than 20 miles per hour that blows against the shambler reduces its speed to 0 feet during the first round, and in subsequent rounds moves it in the direction of the wind at a speed of 5 feet. A wind stronger than 20 miles per hour that blows in the direction the shambler travels increases its speed to 15 feet. it is: 1)Free scaling: damage, range, duration scale with ML, one of the few that do 2)controled as a Free Action..... completely under your control...moveable 3)shapeable effect ..... large are affected.... 4)moveable ...... but slowly 5) stackable ..... you can manifest several on top of each other, as it can be in the same space with other creatures even like itself 6)No Save, NO SR-PR ....... affects everything 7)Long Range effect ...... one of the Few long range Psionic Damaging effects exa:if a 20th lvl Psion Manifests it 2 times ..... he Pays only 18 PP for a Duration of 20 minutes... if he manifests them on top of each other and has them move together..... the effect does 20 points Damage/ round to any inside...takes up Area of 10x10x100.....great for Moveable Battlefield Control its only drawbacks: 1)slow speed 2)Wind affects it(thus used to best effect in Dungeons/underground/windless areas) :D
Ogg 06-01-07, 05:05 PM	I took Cranial Deludge from Complete Psionics. I know it's Fortitude negates but it's just too fun to have the power from the movie Scanners, besides my psion's always threatening to melt people's brains so it fit. Yeah & some of the Discipline Powers rock. Personally I took Fiery Discorporation. Fiery Discorporation + Empty Mind + a paladin in the group with a flaming sword= Pretty sure fire way (pun intended) to cheat death.
Psikerlord 06-02-07, 12:57 AM	I agree there are few good 5th level powers. I thought plane shift was good until I noticed the psionic version says willing creatures only (different to the PHB version). I think Cpsi has come to the rescue on this one though - ethereal agent is a nice scouting power, psychotic break is a great attacking will save power which is DC augmentable. Anticipatory strike is nice for when you really really need that extra action. Celestial conduit (psion 5th, not mantle only) is a great anti incorporeal foe power (+ve energy effect, does not suffer the usual miss chance, akin to force effect see p.310 MMI, and also later web articles) and is also generaaly useful as a 120' line effect to complement your energy rays or energy missiles. I think incarnate is good for detect magic, darkvision and umbiquitous vision (but after incarnating, would get rid of incarnate with psychic reformation).
BlaineTog 06-02-07, 02:12 AM	i have to take exception to this.....it is a great power(especially in dungeons) notice: it is: 1)Free scaling: damage, range, duration scale with ML, one of the few that do 2)controled as a Free Action..... completely under your control...moveable 3)shapeable effect ..... large are affected.... 4)moveable ...... but slowly 5) stackable ..... you can manifest several on top of each other, as it can be in the same space with other creatures even like itself 6)No Save, NO SR-PR ....... affects everything 7)Long Range effect ...... one of the Few long range Psionic Damaging effects exa:if a 20th lvl Psion Manifests it 2 times ..... he Pays only 18 PP for a Duration of 20 minutes... if he manifests them on top of each other and has them move together..... the effect does 20 points Damage/ round to any inside...takes up Area of 10x10x100.....great for Moveable Battlefield Control its only drawbacks: 1)slow speed 2)Wind affects it(thus used to best effect in Dungeons/underground/windless areas) :DAnd yet, still generally a waste of power points. And still lame and boring. Oh look, I summoned an area that kinda hurts you every round, unless you blow real hard. That's totally as awesome as Cloudkill (also 5th level). Totally.
Fleem 06-03-07, 02:52 AM	I'd have to agree about 5th level powers being unimpressive. I used it as an opportunity to pick up some 4th and 3rd level powers I'd skipped. Except for psionic revivify, which might be useful. Someday.
hovnarr 06-03-07, 06:40 AM	Except for psionic revivify, which might be useful. Someday. It's perhaps the best ressurect effect in the game, its only drawback being expedient administration (which can be fixed with Time Hopping a fallen comrade). If you rarely get to use it, it means your party members rarely die, which means you're doing well. :)
Slagger the Chuul 06-03-07, 10:11 AM	And still lame and boring. Oh look, I summoned an area that kinda hurts you every round, unless you blow real hard. That's totally as awesome as Cloudkill (also 5th level). Totally. It's a mobile area of concealment that also acts as a spell deterrent (actually a double deterrent, since it deals continuous damage as well as specifically disrupting casters); wind effects can be annoying on a few rare occasions, unless you have control air. Unlike cloudkill, an ectoplasmic shambler can be placed at long range, relocates at your order, allows no save, and deals typeless damage. It can be lame and boring, but that depends on how you describe or use it. Just don't get too bogged down by the standard description and you can have anything from diaphanous flames to a cloud of hungry ghosts.
Knight0 06-03-07, 05:22 PM	In relation to saying that true seeing allows you to see foes on the plane of shadow I apoligise I was thinking of the transdimensional power feat at the time. Actually would manifesting touchsight as a transdimensional power work on shadow and ethereal foes?
InkBlot 06-03-07, 06:08 PM	Yes, transdimensional touchsight would let you feel the presence of creatures on the shadow plane. Oddly enough, by a strict reading of the rules, you can't use it to feel objects on the shadow plane. The transdimensional power feat only references creatures.
crizhII 06-04-07, 05:13 AM	Yes, transdimensional touchsight would let you feel the presence of creatures on the shadow plane. Oddly enough, by a strict reading of the rules, you can't use it to feel objects on the shadow plane. The transdimensional power feat only references creatures. "you must have line of effect to a creature or object to discern it." EPH p138 Fantastic power. Better Widened, even better Transdimensional. In certain ways even better than True Seeing.
The_Ditto 06-04-07, 09:20 AM	[edit] Oh, and I succeeded on my Will save to disbelieve that Complete Psionic ever existed. It doesn't, do you hear me?! :P Unfortunately it's not an illusion effect, it's a conjuration(creation) effect ... .. done by a caster/manifester with a really sucky craft skill!! ;)