Alter Self(Psionic) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Alter Self(Psionic) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Tinari
03-08-08, 04:12 AM Is there any psionic power that is identical or similar to Alter Self? If there isn't, would it be appropriate as a 3rd level Egoist Power that's basically just a copy/paste of the original Alter Self, with appropriate changes for Psionics?

Just curious, because for the character I have as it is now and how I want to play it, having my physical stats change when using Metamorphosis (and the EXP cost) actually leave me in a worse off position than if I just used Alter Self.

So, I asked my DM if it'd be alright to make an Alter Self (Psionic) power that's 3rd level Egoist (I'm an Egoist, if that isn't obvious) to throw in, and he said "Hmm, run it by the forums."

Any info/insight (specially if there actually IS an Alter Self equivalent in Psionics somewhere) would be much appreciated. Thanks.
Fireclave
03-08-08, 06:20 AM Just curious, because for the character I have as it is now and how I want to play it, having my physical stats change when using Metamorphosis (and the EXP cost) actually leave me in a worse off position than if I just used Alter Self.
Quick note. Metamorphsis does not have a XP cost. It's Greater Metamorphsis that does.

I don't know of a psionic equivalent to Alterself, but I can't think of any balance reasons offhand for not creating a psionic version of Alterself.
Bacris
03-08-08, 10:01 AM Considering this thread (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=176246) is devoted to the best ways to get the most out of Alter Self - and the thread is HUGE - I'd say no balance reasons isn't entirely correct. :) Especially for a 2nd level spell.
InkBlot
03-08-08, 11:25 AM The nearest thing to psionic alter self which I know of, is the egoist expanded class option from The Mind's Eye. (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20070314a) It grants you the Minor Change Shape ability (which is what Eberron's doppleganger-descended changelings get), in exchange for your 1st level psion bonus feat.

Minor Change Shape (Su): Changelings have the supernatural ability to alter their appearance as though using a disguise self spell that affects their bodies but not their possessions. This ability is not an illusory effect, but a minor physical alteration of a changeling's facial features, skin color and texture, and size, within the limits described for the spell. A changeling can use this ability at will, and the alteration lasts until she changes shape again. A changeling reverts to her natural form when killed. A true seeing spell reveals her natural form. When using this ability to create a disguise, a changeling receives a +10 circumstance bonus on Disguise checks. Using this ability is a full-round action.
Lycanthromancer
03-08-08, 01:37 PM I'm sure everyone's tired of me saying this by now, but the powers revision in my signature has a (fairly balanced) level 1 version of metamorphosis that will do what you want it to do, AND it will give you some small abilities that might just come in handy.

I feel like a broken record over here.
awaken_D_M_golem
03-08-08, 01:54 PM Erudite w/ Spell to Power option, is able to manifest Alter Self as a psionic power.
In spirit, it'd be nice if it was A-ugmentable and uncapped.

Psicraft check of 15+2, to learn it off of the Erudite and throw in the EXP cost to research. That's the way around for other psionic classes. Oh, and a minor dollop of DM fiat.

Easiliest implemented semi-nerf of Alter Self is requiring to have seen / encounted the thingy you want to Alter Self into, and then have to make the appropriate Knowledge(X) check. Divinations and el-cheapo items circurmvent. Also a minor dollop of DM fiat.

"I feel like a broken record over here." or a CD skipping. (I 2nd the motion)
Fireclave
03-08-08, 01:59 PM Considering this thread (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=176246) is devoted to the best ways to get the most out of Alter Self - and the thread is HUGE - I'd say no balance reasons isn't entirely correct. :) Especially for a 2nd level spell.
I guess I should have been more specific. What I meant was, "I can't think of any balance reasons offhand for not creating a psionic version of Alterself, assuming that your group thinks that the power level of Alterself is fine for your game."

I was hoping to avoid turning this into a "is alterself broken" thread, since there's plenty of those already.
awaken_D_M_golem
03-08-08, 03:37 PM "is alterself broken"
Erudite + Spell to Power + 2 levels later than a Wiz + 1/3rd the spells per day, isn't that bad.
Psion at 5th level + Psicraft check on Erudite + Exp burn to get it, isn't that bad.

Metamorphic Transfer + Metamorph is right around the corner.
Getting there early with Ardent/Caster + psiotheurgist from Dragon #349, is a one trick pony / glass jaw, but maybe a little bok-nee.
jbsaff
03-11-08, 06:33 PM Speaking of sounding like a broken record, what about the Everyman power from Untapped Potential? Close enough? I know it isn't a direct copy, but it might fit for some uses.
CrimsonDeath
03-11-08, 08:10 PM Erudite + Spell to Power + 2 levels later than a Wiz + 1/3rd the spells per day, isn't that bad.
Psion at 5th level + Psicraft check on Erudite + Exp burn to get it, isn't that bad.

Metamorphic Transfer + Metamorph is right around the corner.
Getting there early with Ardent/Caster + psiotheurgist from Dragon #349, is a one trick pony / glass jaw, but maybe a little bok-nee.

Metamorphic Transfer with Psionic Alter Self isn't too bad. Consider the Elan Erudite/Slayer using Alter Self to become a Choker. Small size, reach, no change in ability scores, and depending on how you read Metamorphic Transfer, either a few or a lot of extra actions.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Tinari 03-08-08, 04:12 AM	Is there any psionic power that is identical or similar to Alter Self? If there isn't, would it be appropriate as a 3rd level Egoist Power that's basically just a copy/paste of the original Alter Self, with appropriate changes for Psionics? Just curious, because for the character I have as it is now and how I want to play it, having my physical stats change when using Metamorphosis (and the EXP cost) actually leave me in a worse off position than if I just used Alter Self. So, I asked my DM if it'd be alright to make an Alter Self (Psionic) power that's 3rd level Egoist (I'm an Egoist, if that isn't obvious) to throw in, and he said "Hmm, run it by the forums." Any info/insight (specially if there actually IS an Alter Self equivalent in Psionics somewhere) would be much appreciated. Thanks.
Fireclave 03-08-08, 06:20 AM	Just curious, because for the character I have as it is now and how I want to play it, having my physical stats change when using Metamorphosis (and the EXP cost) actually leave me in a worse off position than if I just used Alter Self. Quick note. Metamorphsis does not have a XP cost. It's Greater Metamorphsis that does. I don't know of a psionic equivalent to Alterself, but I can't think of any balance reasons offhand for not creating a psionic version of Alterself.
Bacris 03-08-08, 10:01 AM	Considering this thread (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=176246) is devoted to the best ways to get the most out of Alter Self - and the thread is HUGE - I'd say no balance reasons isn't entirely correct. :) Especially for a 2nd level spell.
InkBlot 03-08-08, 11:25 AM	The nearest thing to psionic alter self which I know of, is the egoist expanded class option from The Mind's Eye. (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20070314a) It grants you the Minor Change Shape ability (which is what Eberron's doppleganger-descended changelings get), in exchange for your 1st level psion bonus feat. Minor Change Shape (Su): Changelings have the supernatural ability to alter their appearance as though using a disguise self spell that affects their bodies but not their possessions. This ability is not an illusory effect, but a minor physical alteration of a changeling's facial features, skin color and texture, and size, within the limits described for the spell. A changeling can use this ability at will, and the alteration lasts until she changes shape again. A changeling reverts to her natural form when killed. A true seeing spell reveals her natural form. When using this ability to create a disguise, a changeling receives a +10 circumstance bonus on Disguise checks. Using this ability is a full-round action.
Lycanthromancer 03-08-08, 01:37 PM	I'm sure everyone's tired of me saying this by now, but the powers revision in my signature has a (fairly balanced) level 1 version of metamorphosis that will do what you want it to do, AND it will give you some small abilities that might just come in handy. I feel like a broken record over here.
awaken_D_M_golem 03-08-08, 01:54 PM	Erudite w/ Spell to Power option, is able to manifest Alter Self as a psionic power. In spirit, it'd be nice if it was A-ugmentable and uncapped. Psicraft check of 15+2, to learn it off of the Erudite and throw in the EXP cost to research. That's the way around for other psionic classes. Oh, and a minor dollop of DM fiat. Easiliest implemented semi-nerf of Alter Self is requiring to have seen / encounted the thingy you want to Alter Self into, and then have to make the appropriate Knowledge(X) check. Divinations and el-cheapo items circurmvent. Also a minor dollop of DM fiat. "I feel like a broken record over here." or a CD skipping. (I 2nd the motion)
Fireclave 03-08-08, 01:59 PM	Considering this thread (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=176246) is devoted to the best ways to get the most out of Alter Self - and the thread is HUGE - I'd say no balance reasons isn't entirely correct. :) Especially for a 2nd level spell. I guess I should have been more specific. What I meant was, "I can't think of any balance reasons offhand for not creating a psionic version of Alterself, assuming that your group thinks that the power level of Alterself is fine for your game." I was hoping to avoid turning this into a "is alterself broken" thread, since there's plenty of those already.
awaken_D_M_golem 03-08-08, 03:37 PM	"is alterself broken" Erudite + Spell to Power + 2 levels later than a Wiz + 1/3rd the spells per day, isn't that bad. Psion at 5th level + Psicraft check on Erudite + Exp burn to get it, isn't that bad. Metamorphic Transfer + Metamorph is right around the corner. Getting there early with Ardent/Caster + psiotheurgist from Dragon #349, is a one trick pony / glass jaw, but maybe a little bok-nee.
jbsaff 03-11-08, 06:33 PM	Speaking of sounding like a broken record, what about the Everyman power from Untapped Potential? Close enough? I know it isn't a direct copy, but it might fit for some uses.
CrimsonDeath 03-11-08, 08:10 PM	Erudite + Spell to Power + 2 levels later than a Wiz + 1/3rd the spells per day, isn't that bad. Psion at 5th level + Psicraft check on Erudite + Exp burn to get it, isn't that bad. Metamorphic Transfer + Metamorph is right around the corner. Getting there early with Ardent/Caster + psiotheurgist from Dragon #349, is a one trick pony / glass jaw, but maybe a little bok-nee. Metamorphic Transfer with Psionic Alter Self isn't too bad. Consider the Elan Erudite/Slayer using Alter Self to become a Choker. Small size, reach, no change in ability scores, and depending on how you read Metamorphic Transfer, either a few or a lot of extra actions.