Concussion Blast [Archive] - Wizards Community

Concussion Blast [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Malkaf
09-04-07, 12:57 AM I realize this power is a force effect, but is it worth power point cost? It seems over costed for it's ability. I don't know if these was already covered but can anyone give a good reason to take this power?
Tempest Stormwind
09-04-07, 01:14 AM I realize this power is a force effect, but is it worth power point cost? It seems over costed for it's ability. I don't know if these was already covered but can anyone give a good reason to take this power?

Because there's no save attached, because it always hits, because it's medium range (lots of damage powers are close range) and because it's force damage. It can also strike for nonlethal damage, which is always a plus.

It's costly. But worth it within its domain.

To make it a more appealing choice, draw from the Spell Compendium: change it to SR: No (claim you're compressing air and thrusting it at them or similar). I doubt it needs that, but still.
MindFlayerZoidberg
09-04-07, 01:28 AM Depends on what you are comparing it to. I would compare it to similar medium ranged attacks at the save level. No comparing Energy Missile because it is a discipline power.

Recall Agony: Will save for half. Augment: 1 pp/1d6 damage--Every extra 2d6 raises DC by 1.

Efficient against enemies without high wisdom or immune to mind affecting spells. More effective than Mind Thrust.

Energy Push: Ref/Fort for half. Same augment scale as Concussion Blast, except if an enemy fails its strength check and push an enemy back against a wall, then it basically takes 1d6 per/pp. However, the versatility in this power is that it can be used for certain situations, and gives you some strategy in how you position yourself and where you aim the power. Much easier to kill an enemy if its by the edge of a cliff/bridge/tower/floating disc/steel mill.

With Concussion Blast, even though it doesn't deal as much damage, you have some interesting options with it:

Force Effce: Can hit Incorporal enemies.
Can deal nonleathal damage from over 100 ft away. Role playing possibilities with this are enticing.
Can hit subjects in Melee; great for helping our your friends in need. . .from over 100 feet away
Can hit additional targets, but does cost a bit
Can also damage unattended objects, great for breaking through doors.
Only need LoE, so you can hit people with concealment or cover

These are nifty benefits that make the power worthwhile in my view. No point in having a power that can deal a lot of damage with fewer pp if it can't effect the enemy you are trying to hit.
hovnarr
09-04-07, 06:36 AM I've grown more fond of TK Maneuver over Concussion Blast, but it depends a lot on how your DM adjudicates it. Ideally, TK Maneuver should be able to grapple incorporeal foes (though they cannot normally be grappled) since it's a force effect. And if you succeed on a grapple, you can unarmed damage + your INT mod in damage each turn, while incapacitating your enemy. Use solicit psicrystal for greatest effect (useful for many other things too).
InkBlot
09-04-07, 09:04 AM TK maneuver is two levels higher than concussion blast. Of course it's going to be better. It's no point in comparing the two.
hovnarr
09-04-07, 09:24 AM I always compare power-for-level to get around that. The way I see it, you get 36 powers and you want to optimize that. If you have 4 level 2 powers and 4 level 4 powers, are you better off sticking an offensive [force] power in your level 2 slots or your level 4 slots?

You also need to consider when you'll be needing that force power if you start at a low level. A shadow is CR3 creature, as is an allip. How do you intend to damage handle them?

I think CB costs too much to use at low levels, and would rather just go with Matter Agitation or something like that, despite the 50% chance for ineffectiveness. There are enough good powers both at level 2 and level 4 not to bother with either power, but of the two TK Maneuver offers something other powers don't and seems to be the most interesting option.
ck2001wendt
09-04-07, 10:00 AM I keep Concussion blast around for dealing with Incorporeal opponents. I've taken a look at average damage using CB versus Energy Missile, and the 50% miss chance makes CB more valuable if no other feats (such as Transdimensional Power) are modifying the attack.

I forgot about the Non-Lethal...would have been good last night when two of our party got confused by Umber Hulks.
SlanderPanic
09-04-07, 11:36 AM Concussion blast is, essentially, a more powerful and versatile magic missile. It's absolutely worth having around, especially once those pesky incorporeal undead show up (as they inevitably will.) Also, never, ever underestimate the value of being able to do a metric frakton of nonlethal damage from a good distance. It's not always convenient for a party to take prisoners, but it's almost always useful to do so.

If you just want to smash some unattended objects, though, you're going to get more mileage out of an energy power. Always look above and below: Even if you can't damage an enemy directly, a well-placed sonic energy ray can drop something onto him or drop him onto something. Take ranks in Knowledge (architecture and engineering) if you want to pull off that sort of stunt a lot.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Malkaf 09-04-07, 12:57 AM	I realize this power is a force effect, but is it worth power point cost? It seems over costed for it's ability. I don't know if these was already covered but can anyone give a good reason to take this power?
Tempest Stormwind 09-04-07, 01:14 AM	I realize this power is a force effect, but is it worth power point cost? It seems over costed for it's ability. I don't know if these was already covered but can anyone give a good reason to take this power? Because there's no save attached, because it always hits, because it's medium range (lots of damage powers are close range) and because it's force damage. It can also strike for nonlethal damage, which is always a plus. It's costly. But worth it within its domain. To make it a more appealing choice, draw from the Spell Compendium: change it to SR: No (claim you're compressing air and thrusting it at them or similar). I doubt it needs that, but still.
MindFlayerZoidberg 09-04-07, 01:28 AM	Depends on what you are comparing it to. I would compare it to similar medium ranged attacks at the save level. No comparing Energy Missile because it is a discipline power. Recall Agony: Will save for half. Augment: 1 pp/1d6 damage--Every extra 2d6 raises DC by 1. Efficient against enemies without high wisdom or immune to mind affecting spells. More effective than Mind Thrust. Energy Push: Ref/Fort for half. Same augment scale as Concussion Blast, except if an enemy fails its strength check and push an enemy back against a wall, then it basically takes 1d6 per/pp. However, the versatility in this power is that it can be used for certain situations, and gives you some strategy in how you position yourself and where you aim the power. Much easier to kill an enemy if its by the edge of a cliff/bridge/tower/floating disc/steel mill. With Concussion Blast, even though it doesn't deal as much damage, you have some interesting options with it: Force Effce: Can hit Incorporal enemies. Can deal nonleathal damage from over 100 ft away. Role playing possibilities with this are enticing. Can hit subjects in Melee; great for helping our your friends in need. . .from over 100 feet away Can hit additional targets, but does cost a bit Can also damage unattended objects, great for breaking through doors. Only need LoE, so you can hit people with concealment or cover These are nifty benefits that make the power worthwhile in my view. No point in having a power that can deal a lot of damage with fewer pp if it can't effect the enemy you are trying to hit.
hovnarr 09-04-07, 06:36 AM	I've grown more fond of TK Maneuver over Concussion Blast, but it depends a lot on how your DM adjudicates it. Ideally, TK Maneuver should be able to grapple incorporeal foes (though they cannot normally be grappled) since it's a force effect. And if you succeed on a grapple, you can unarmed damage + your INT mod in damage each turn, while incapacitating your enemy. Use solicit psicrystal for greatest effect (useful for many other things too).
InkBlot 09-04-07, 09:04 AM	TK maneuver is two levels higher than concussion blast. Of course it's going to be better. It's no point in comparing the two.
hovnarr 09-04-07, 09:24 AM	I always compare power-for-level to get around that. The way I see it, you get 36 powers and you want to optimize that. If you have 4 level 2 powers and 4 level 4 powers, are you better off sticking an offensive [force] power in your level 2 slots or your level 4 slots? You also need to consider when you'll be needing that force power if you start at a low level. A shadow is CR3 creature, as is an allip. How do you intend to damage handle them? I think CB costs too much to use at low levels, and would rather just go with Matter Agitation or something like that, despite the 50% chance for ineffectiveness. There are enough good powers both at level 2 and level 4 not to bother with either power, but of the two TK Maneuver offers something other powers don't and seems to be the most interesting option.
ck2001wendt 09-04-07, 10:00 AM	I keep Concussion blast around for dealing with Incorporeal opponents. I've taken a look at average damage using CB versus Energy Missile, and the 50% miss chance makes CB more valuable if no other feats (such as Transdimensional Power) are modifying the attack. I forgot about the Non-Lethal...would have been good last night when two of our party got confused by Umber Hulks.
SlanderPanic 09-04-07, 11:36 AM	Concussion blast is, essentially, a more powerful and versatile magic missile. It's absolutely worth having around, especially once those pesky incorporeal undead show up (as they inevitably will.) Also, never, ever underestimate the value of being able to do a metric frakton of nonlethal damage from a good distance. It's not always convenient for a party to take prisoners, but it's almost always useful to do so. If you just want to smash some unattended objects, though, you're going to get more mileage out of an energy power. Always look above and below: Even if you can't damage an enemy directly, a well-placed sonic energy ray can drop something onto him or drop him onto something. Take ranks in Knowledge (architecture and engineering) if you want to pull off that sort of stunt a lot.