Crucial powers/feats for a psion? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Crucial powers/feats for a psion? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Zombayz1
03-29-07, 12:28 AM I'm making a psion, and I need to know what the most crucial powers/feats are for a psion (first one I've made), so if someone could help me, it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance
Polaris
03-29-07, 04:09 AM I'm making a psion, and I need to know what the most crucial powers/feats are for a psion (first one I've made), so if someone could help me, it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance

This is not going to sound too helpful, but honestly it depends on what you want your Psion to do. A psion looks a lot like a wizard, but a psion is a lot more self contained, and thus can do things a wizard has trouble with (such as healing and self-buffing), but has a lot of trouble with other things (like party support). Psions make excellent blasters, info gatherers, and self-buffers (depending on which specialty you like), but make fairly mediocre healers and poor party support 'casters'. The other problem with a psion is a psion (like a sorcerer only less so) has a limited number of powers he/she can know at any given level, and has a very limited power-point pool for the powers he/she does have. What's worse, a psion has to pay for powers to scale up in power (while a caster gets this for free). On the plus side, a psion can augment powers thus replacing several spells with one power (charm person is an excellent example of this).

I'd recommend asking yourself why you want to be a psion and what you expect your psion to be good at and work from there. The first choice IMHO needs to be your sub-speciality and pay closs attention to the power-list each choice grants. Then look through other psionic powers on other class lists. Unlike casters you can buy these (for a feat...Expanded Knowledge), but if you find you want too many from another class/displine list, then you may have picked the wrong displine to start with.

Also ask if your DM is using Complete Psionic (a wretched book IMHO) and what (if any) errata from it. Complete Psionic does a horrible hatchet job with some of it's 'errata' and is IMX roundly ignored at many tables.

Some good skills (in no particular order):

Concentration: This is essential for almost any psion (even a blaster). If you are near combat, the use is obvious (since Psions like casters can...and often do....manifest defensively). What's more, even Blaster Psions (that might not otherwise be in the thick of combat) often get good milage from the metapsionic feats....but these feats require that you blow your psionic focus...and the only way to get it back is with a concentration check (at DC 20!).

Autohypnosis (check to see if this is a class skill): This skill synergizes with concentration and allows you to do a lot of neat things such as autostabilization (worth at least a feat right there and it's a skill!), resistance to poison and pain, and much, much more.

Psicraft: This skill isn't nearly as good for the Psion as spellcraft is for the wizard, but it's nice.

Knowledge Psionics: Like knowledge Arcana (it's equivalent), it's nice but not quite as good for the Psion as it's equivalent is for the wizard.

Feats: Some good feats in no particular order.

Precise Shot (and PB shot). Great for the blaster-type psion especially at low levels. Yes your powers for the most part are touch attacks but even so.....

Psicrystal Affinity: You get your own pet rock which is better than a wizard's familiar because unlike the familiar, your pet rock actually GETS construct hit-dice and thus feats (and skills). You also get alertness, some very nice abilities, and the ability to take other Psicrystal feats including Psicystal Containment.

Psicrystal Containment: This lets you store two mental foci (one for you and one for the crystal) instead of the normal one. This can be invaluable if you rely on a lot of feats/abilities that blow your mental focus (and is the only way prior to epic levels to stack more than one metapsionic feat onto a power). The problem is that it takes time to set up so make sure (IMHO) you will be using your mental focus a lot before making this investment.

Psionic Meditation: This is almost a "must take" feat especially if you are going to be using a lot of metapsionic feats. Normally it takes a full round action to regain your mental focus after using a metapsionic feat (or using a psionic feat that blows your focus...they will state this if it does). This feat reduces that to a move action. It requires 8 ranks of concentration IIRC (which is no big deal since you should be maxxed out in this skill anyway), but also requires a Wis of 13+ which is annoying for an Int based class.

Skill Focus, Concentration: This is an understated but excellent feat for any psion. It gives +3 to all concentration checks which may well be the most often used skill in the game for you and makes you able to "autocheck" on defensive manifesting much sooner than normal.

Expanded Knowledge: This lets you add a power to your known power list (very valuable in itself) even if it's from another class or discipline list! You can only add powers that are at least one level lower than the maximum you currently can manifest, but you use the the power level as judged by the list you are talking it from even if it's duplicated at a higher level on your own list. For example all Psions have Body Adjustment as a third level power, but a psion at fifth level can use an Expanded Knowledge feat to aquire this power from the psychic warrior list. Body Adjustment is only second level for a psychic warrior (and thus a legal power to target for a 5th level psion), and from here on out it's a second level power on your personal power list (which means it takes two less PsPs to manifest it among other things).

There are other good feats if you look for them, but they depend strongly on your build. For example, if you plan on transforming a lot, Metamorphic Transfer (allows the manifester to have an SU ability of the new form when polymorphed) can be a godsend for some types of psions (those that use Metamorphasis). The Metapsionic feats can be useful for many blaster builds. The Psionic feats can be useful for Gish-type hybrids (especially if going with the Slayer PrC).

Powers: Again, your known powers (including any you add with feats per above) will depend strongly on what you want to do in the party. You won't have the known powers to do everything nor the power-points to try....so you shouldn't. This post is lengthy enough so I really don't want to list them all in general (and I am sure others will). Look especially for powers you can augment since those powers will continue to be useful long past the time that spells of the same level would be.

I hope this gives you at least a reasonable start.

-Polaris
carnivore
03-29-07, 10:43 AM you may want to look here:
http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=624041

Polaris has some good suggestions...in addition:

certain disciplines have better skill selection than others:
Telepath and Egoist have the best skill selections....for the rest, you will have to get the skills Cross-classed

try to get at least 1 point in ALL Knowledge Skills(5 in some for Synergy Bonuses)....also try to get at least 1 point in a bunch of trained only skills(5 in Tumble(crossed class if you can).....in the build guide there are several partial builds with equipment that you may want to look at....here:

http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=8968111&postcount=12

as for feats...here are some Must Haves:

Extend Power .................. all Psions need this to make the most of thier PPs

Psicrystal Affinity ................... as mentioned, you get the Feat Alertness for Free, in addition to other things

Psionic Meditation ...................... a must if you take feats that require you to expend focus(most Psionic feats do )

Twin Power ............................. great for Blasting powers

Metamorphic Transfer ............... Great for Egoists or anyone with Metamorphosis Power

:D
cymbolik
03-29-07, 10:59 AM I don't really put as much stock in EK as other players, simply because you can spend a couple of weeks and some experience to learn any power on any list if your DM allows it.

Sure, it takes up one of your powers known slots, but it saves you a feat that you could be spending on something else.
carnivore
03-29-07, 11:16 AM if your DM allows it.

key point.......some DMs dont allow it......i do allow it, but thats me...his DM may be different;)

:D
cymbolik
03-29-07, 12:05 PM key point.......some DMs dont allow it......i do allow it, but thats me...his DM may be different;)

:D
You wouldn't think that I put that clause in there for a specific reason now, would you?
I mean, that would just be a total waste of text, making sure that that caveat was included.
*slaps forehead*

That's about as toned down as I can make that response.
I appreciate that you meant it in a light hearted way, but there really wasn't any reason for you to point that out a second time.
It's along the same lines as posting, "What [insert previous poster's name here] said."
How does that actually contribute to the thread in any way?
Aclahayr
03-29-07, 02:29 PM well if your dm allows it, in unearthed arcana you can gain two extra feats if you take two flaws (i believe they have to be at first level). Now you would have to take a flaw that would be relative to your character or else its kind of broken, but then you have two extra feats. With that one extra feat I would highly suggest taking psionic body which allows you to gain two hit points for every psionic feat that you have, including that one, and every other psionic feat you take from there on out. If you have a lot of psionic feats you gain mucho hp, which is really nice since psions usually dont

o p.s. the reason why i suggest taking the two flaws for two feats is so you can get one more extra psionic feat in there, or something that isnt but useful

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Zombayz1 03-29-07, 12:28 AM	I'm making a psion, and I need to know what the most crucial powers/feats are for a psion (first one I've made), so if someone could help me, it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance
Polaris 03-29-07, 04:09 AM	I'm making a psion, and I need to know what the most crucial powers/feats are for a psion (first one I've made), so if someone could help me, it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance This is not going to sound too helpful, but honestly it depends on what you want your Psion to do. A psion looks a lot like a wizard, but a psion is a lot more self contained, and thus can do things a wizard has trouble with (such as healing and self-buffing), but has a lot of trouble with other things (like party support). Psions make excellent blasters, info gatherers, and self-buffers (depending on which specialty you like), but make fairly mediocre healers and poor party support 'casters'. The other problem with a psion is a psion (like a sorcerer only less so) has a limited number of powers he/she can know at any given level, and has a very limited power-point pool for the powers he/she does have. What's worse, a psion has to pay for powers to scale up in power (while a caster gets this for free). On the plus side, a psion can augment powers thus replacing several spells with one power (charm person is an excellent example of this). I'd recommend asking yourself why you want to be a psion and what you expect your psion to be good at and work from there. The first choice IMHO needs to be your sub-speciality and pay closs attention to the power-list each choice grants. Then look through other psionic powers on other class lists. Unlike casters you can buy these (for a feat...Expanded Knowledge), but if you find you want too many from another class/displine list, then you may have picked the wrong displine to start with. Also ask if your DM is using Complete Psionic (a wretched book IMHO) and what (if any) errata from it. Complete Psionic does a horrible hatchet job with some of it's 'errata' and is IMX roundly ignored at many tables. Some good skills (in no particular order): Concentration: This is essential for almost any psion (even a blaster). If you are near combat, the use is obvious (since Psions like casters can...and often do....manifest defensively). What's more, even Blaster Psions (that might not otherwise be in the thick of combat) often get good milage from the metapsionic feats....but these feats require that you blow your psionic focus...and the only way to get it back is with a concentration check (at DC 20!). Autohypnosis (check to see if this is a class skill): This skill synergizes with concentration and allows you to do a lot of neat things such as autostabilization (worth at least a feat right there and it's a skill!), resistance to poison and pain, and much, much more. Psicraft: This skill isn't nearly as good for the Psion as spellcraft is for the wizard, but it's nice. Knowledge Psionics: Like knowledge Arcana (it's equivalent), it's nice but not quite as good for the Psion as it's equivalent is for the wizard. Feats: Some good feats in no particular order. Precise Shot (and PB shot). Great for the blaster-type psion especially at low levels. Yes your powers for the most part are touch attacks but even so..... Psicrystal Affinity: You get your own pet rock which is better than a wizard's familiar because unlike the familiar, your pet rock actually GETS construct hit-dice and thus feats (and skills). You also get alertness, some very nice abilities, and the ability to take other Psicrystal feats including Psicystal Containment. Psicrystal Containment: This lets you store two mental foci (one for you and one for the crystal) instead of the normal one. This can be invaluable if you rely on a lot of feats/abilities that blow your mental focus (and is the only way prior to epic levels to stack more than one metapsionic feat onto a power). The problem is that it takes time to set up so make sure (IMHO) you will be using your mental focus a lot before making this investment. Psionic Meditation: This is almost a "must take" feat especially if you are going to be using a lot of metapsionic feats. Normally it takes a full round action to regain your mental focus after using a metapsionic feat (or using a psionic feat that blows your focus...they will state this if it does). This feat reduces that to a move action. It requires 8 ranks of concentration IIRC (which is no big deal since you should be maxxed out in this skill anyway), but also requires a Wis of 13+ which is annoying for an Int based class. Skill Focus, Concentration: This is an understated but excellent feat for any psion. It gives +3 to all concentration checks which may well be the most often used skill in the game for you and makes you able to "autocheck" on defensive manifesting much sooner than normal. Expanded Knowledge: This lets you add a power to your known power list (very valuable in itself) even if it's from another class or discipline list! You can only add powers that are at least one level lower than the maximum you currently can manifest, but you use the the power level as judged by the list you are talking it from even if it's duplicated at a higher level on your own list. For example all Psions have Body Adjustment as a third level power, but a psion at fifth level can use an Expanded Knowledge feat to aquire this power from the psychic warrior list. Body Adjustment is only second level for a psychic warrior (and thus a legal power to target for a 5th level psion), and from here on out it's a second level power on your personal power list (which means it takes two less PsPs to manifest it among other things). There are other good feats if you look for them, but they depend strongly on your build. For example, if you plan on transforming a lot, Metamorphic Transfer (allows the manifester to have an SU ability of the new form when polymorphed) can be a godsend for some types of psions (those that use Metamorphasis). The Metapsionic feats can be useful for many blaster builds. The Psionic feats can be useful for Gish-type hybrids (especially if going with the Slayer PrC). Powers: Again, your known powers (including any you add with feats per above) will depend strongly on what you want to do in the party. You won't have the known powers to do everything nor the power-points to try....so you shouldn't. This post is lengthy enough so I really don't want to list them all in general (and I am sure others will). Look especially for powers you can augment since those powers will continue to be useful long past the time that spells of the same level would be. I hope this gives you at least a reasonable start. -Polaris
carnivore 03-29-07, 10:43 AM	you may want to look here: http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=624041 Polaris has some good suggestions...in addition: certain disciplines have better skill selection than others: Telepath and Egoist have the best skill selections....for the rest, you will have to get the skills Cross-classed try to get at least 1 point in ALL Knowledge Skills(5 in some for Synergy Bonuses)....also try to get at least 1 point in a bunch of trained only skills(5 in Tumble(crossed class if you can).....in the build guide there are several partial builds with equipment that you may want to look at....here: http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=8968111&postcount=12 as for feats...here are some Must Haves: Extend Power .................. all Psions need this to make the most of thier PPs Psicrystal Affinity ................... as mentioned, you get the Feat Alertness for Free, in addition to other things Psionic Meditation ...................... a must if you take feats that require you to expend focus(most Psionic feats do ) Twin Power ............................. great for Blasting powers Metamorphic Transfer ............... Great for Egoists or anyone with Metamorphosis Power :D
cymbolik 03-29-07, 10:59 AM	I don't really put as much stock in EK as other players, simply because you can spend a couple of weeks and some experience to learn any power on any list if your DM allows it. Sure, it takes up one of your powers known slots, but it saves you a feat that you could be spending on something else.
carnivore 03-29-07, 11:16 AM	if your DM allows it. key point.......some DMs dont allow it......i do allow it, but thats me...his DM may be different;) :D
cymbolik 03-29-07, 12:05 PM	key point.......some DMs dont allow it......i do allow it, but thats me...his DM may be different;) :D You wouldn't think that I put that clause in there for a specific reason now, would you? I mean, that would just be a total waste of text, making sure that that caveat was included. slaps forehead That's about as toned down as I can make that response. I appreciate that you meant it in a light hearted way, but there really wasn't any reason for you to point that out a second time. It's along the same lines as posting, "What [insert previous poster's name here] said." How does that actually contribute to the thread in any way?
Aclahayr 03-29-07, 02:29 PM	well if your dm allows it, in unearthed arcana you can gain two extra feats if you take two flaws (i believe they have to be at first level). Now you would have to take a flaw that would be relative to your character or else its kind of broken, but then you have two extra feats. With that one extra feat I would highly suggest taking psionic body which allows you to gain two hit points for every psionic feat that you have, including that one, and every other psionic feat you take from there on out. If you have a lot of psionic feats you gain mucho hp, which is really nice since psions usually dont o p.s. the reason why i suggest taking the two flaws for two feats is so you can get one more extra psionic feat in there, or something that isnt but useful