Does astral construct cap at 9th level constructs? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Does astral construct cap at 9th level constructs? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Psionx
10-01-07, 07:54 AM For every 2 additional power points you spend, the level of the astral construct increases by one.

It doesn't seem to state a limit, but the table only shows up to 9th level. If it does continue, do just its strength and abilities increase. As in +1 menu C choice every 2 levels and +3 HD?
jokey665
10-01-07, 08:02 AM There are no rules for constructs over 9th level, but it's certainly reasonable to house rule them in.
Tempest Stormwind
10-01-07, 10:35 AM It only caps because there aren't constructs of level 10 or higher. If those stats existed it would scale.
Psyrus
10-01-07, 01:02 PM Arcane and divine summons are also limited to 9th level.

What you could do is develope an epic spell/power (probably using the transform seed) that lets you augment Astral Constructs that you've summoned. This worked pretty well in the game I play in.

You could also use the Creation or Summoning seeds to create whatever you like.
Psionx
10-01-07, 01:13 PM Hmm, well if tempest's case were true, epic BAB and Save bonuses wouldn't scale upwards (although they do specifically mention it). I'll just make the case that it scales infinitely like all powers do and that it follows a rational progression.
unusualsuspect
10-01-07, 01:21 PM Hmm, well if tempest's case were true, epic BAB and Save bonuses wouldn't scale upwards (although they do specifically mention it). I'll just make the case that it scales infinitely like all powers do and that it follows a rational progression.

I'm not following you. The stats for level 21+ characters (and their progression, both in BAB and Saves) is specifically stated in how it works. Astral Constructs don't follow any exact formula that I could see (though they almost do - a few HD, another 2 or 4 strength, a -2 to dex if it increases size, etc), and they aren't specifically statted how they would work, since they aren't mentioned to exist.

I'm not saying a 10th or 11th level AC is a bad thing to allow, I'm just not seeing a formula you could base such an AC off of.
Scion of Coldshard
10-01-07, 07:36 PM Definately none listed but, as others have said, if they were listed you could make them ;)

Off the top of my head a decent rule of thumb could be something like this:

Each 2 pp beyond the 9th level construct gives the following:
+3 HD
+4 Str
+2 Natural Armor

For every 4 points above the 9th level construct you also get:
+1 Menu C choice
+1 DR/Epic

For every 10 points above the 9th level construct you also get:
+1 size category (with increased space and reach)
+10' movement
-2 Dex
+5 DR/Magic

And that is likely pretty much it. That would mean a level 20 Wilder could surge and get an effective level 13 Astral Construct. Above the 9th level version it would have +12 HD, +16 Str, +8 NA, DR 4/Epic, and +2 Menu C choices. That would make him roughly CR 14/15, although I personally wouldnt even want to fight the CR 10 guy at level 10.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Psionx 10-01-07, 07:54 AM	For every 2 additional power points you spend, the level of the astral construct increases by one. It doesn't seem to state a limit, but the table only shows up to 9th level. If it does continue, do just its strength and abilities increase. As in +1 menu C choice every 2 levels and +3 HD?
jokey665 10-01-07, 08:02 AM	There are no rules for constructs over 9th level, but it's certainly reasonable to house rule them in.
Tempest Stormwind 10-01-07, 10:35 AM	It only caps because there aren't constructs of level 10 or higher. If those stats existed it would scale.
Psyrus 10-01-07, 01:02 PM	Arcane and divine summons are also limited to 9th level. What you could do is develope an epic spell/power (probably using the transform seed) that lets you augment Astral Constructs that you've summoned. This worked pretty well in the game I play in. You could also use the Creation or Summoning seeds to create whatever you like.
Psionx 10-01-07, 01:13 PM	Hmm, well if tempest's case were true, epic BAB and Save bonuses wouldn't scale upwards (although they do specifically mention it). I'll just make the case that it scales infinitely like all powers do and that it follows a rational progression.
unusualsuspect 10-01-07, 01:21 PM	Hmm, well if tempest's case were true, epic BAB and Save bonuses wouldn't scale upwards (although they do specifically mention it). I'll just make the case that it scales infinitely like all powers do and that it follows a rational progression. I'm not following you. The stats for level 21+ characters (and their progression, both in BAB and Saves) is specifically stated in how it works. Astral Constructs don't follow any exact formula that I could see (though they almost do - a few HD, another 2 or 4 strength, a -2 to dex if it increases size, etc), and they aren't specifically statted how they would work, since they aren't mentioned to exist. I'm not saying a 10th or 11th level AC is a bad thing to allow, I'm just not seeing a formula you could base such an AC off of.
Scion of Coldshard 10-01-07, 07:36 PM	Definately none listed but, as others have said, if they were listed you could make them ;) Off the top of my head a decent rule of thumb could be something like this: Each 2 pp beyond the 9th level construct gives the following: +3 HD +4 Str +2 Natural Armor For every 4 points above the 9th level construct you also get: +1 Menu C choice +1 DR/Epic For every 10 points above the 9th level construct you also get: +1 size category (with increased space and reach) +10' movement -2 Dex +5 DR/Magic And that is likely pretty much it. That would mean a level 20 Wilder could surge and get an effective level 13 Astral Construct. Above the 9th level version it would have +12 HD, +16 Str, +8 NA, DR 4/Epic, and +2 Menu C choices. That would make him roughly CR 14/15, although I personally wouldnt even want to fight the CR 10 guy at level 10.