Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Nom 06-03-07, 11:29 PM	I'm looking at the Dorje creation rules from the SRD ( http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/items/creatingPsionicItems.htm ), and having difficulty making head or tail of them. Would someone help me price the following? For each, I've listed the preferred manifester level (affecting duration, max pp expenditure, and occasionally effect) and the number of power points desired to be used. PP sometimes equals the ML (for powers that need to be augmented), but sometimes does not (if I just want the improved ML without paying for augmentation). Please show all working, since I'm at least as interested in understanding the process as the actual results. Level 1 powers (PsyWar 1, min ML 1, base pp 1) * dorje of expansion: ML 3, 3 pp * dorje of bite of the wolf: ML 5, 1 pp * dorje of metaphysical weapon: ML 5, 5 pp Level 2 powers (PsyWar 2, min ML 4, base pp 1) * dorje of animal affinity: ML 4, 3 pp * dorje of animal affinity: ML 8, 8 pp * dorje of energy adaption, specified: ML 9, 3 pp Level 2 powers (Psion / Empath 2, min ML 3, base pp 1) * dorje of animal affinity: ML 3, 3 pp * dorje of animal affinity: ML 8, 8 pp * dorje of energy adaption, specified: ML 9, 3 pp
munin 06-04-07, 09:32 AM	The "number of power points desired to be used" is inseparable from the ML (powers manifested from dorjes are automatically augmentable to their ML), so I've gone with your ML. When determining a dorje's price, for every 2 levels by which you increase the manifester level above the power's minimum manifester level, increase the effective power level by 1 (I know, the wording in Creating Dorjes is atrocious, but that's the intent). I've priced the items as you've listed them, but you should note that although psychic warriors can start learning 2nd-level powers at 4th level, they can choose to manifest them at ML 3rd (the minimum manifester level of 2nd-level powers, irregardless of when a class gains access to them), so you could choose to make some of these a little cheaper if you want. Market price: Level 1 powers (PsyWar 1, min ML 1, base pp 1) * dorje of expansion: ML 3, 3 pp = 750 gp x (1+1) x 3 = 4,500 gp * dorje of bite of the wolf: ML 5, 1 pp = 750 gp x (1+2) x 5 = 11,250 gp * dorje of metaphysical weapon: ML 5, 5 pp = 750 gp x (1+2) x 5 = 11,250 gp Level 2 powers (PsyWar 2, min ML 4, base pp 1) * dorje of animal affinity: ML 4, 3 pp = 750 gp x 2 x 4 = 6,000 gp * dorje of animal affinity: ML 8, 8 pp = 750 gp x (2+2) x 8 = 24,000 gp * dorje of energy adaption, specified: ML 9, 3 pp = not allowed (see below) Level 2 powers (Psion / Empath 2, min ML 3, base pp 1) * dorje of animal affinity: ML 3, 3 pp = 750 gp x 2 x 3 = 4,500 gp * dorje of animal affinity: ML 8, 8 pp = 750 gp x (2+2) x 8 = 24,000 gp * dorje of energy adaption, specified: ML 9, 3 pp = not allowed (see below) The manifester level of a dorje cannot be more than five higher than the minimum manifester level to use the power it contains. Unfortunately, for some reason that line was placed under the section about using dorjes, not in the section about crafting dorjes, but it holds. Note that the example in the EPH errata of a ML 8th dorje of energy missile is equivalent to your ML 8th dorje of animal affinity, and the errata says that should be priced as if it were a 5th-level power, a correction I don't find consistent with the rules. I'm going with "rules trump examples, even examples in the errata".
The_Ditto 06-04-07, 09:40 AM	Base formula: 750 * Manifester Level * Power Level two quotes from the SRD: if you want to have a higher manifester level in the dorje, you must pay for the dorje as if the power was one level higher for each additional two manifester levels you want. The manifester level of a dorje cannot be more than five higher than the minimum manifester level to use the power it contains. Level 1 powers (PsyWar 1, min ML 1, base pp 1) * dorje of expansion: ML 3, 3 pp 750 * 3 * 2 (ML = 3 as stated (+2 over min), PL = 2. 1 base + 1 (due to ML increase of +2 over minimum)) = 4,500 gp * dorje of bite of the wolf: ML 5, 1 pp * dorje of metaphysical weapon: ML 5, 5 pp 750 * 5 * 3 (ML = 5 (+4 over min), PL = 3 (1 base + 2)) = 11,250 Level 2 powers (PsyWar 2, min ML 4, base pp 1) * dorje of animal affinity: ML 4, 3 pp 750 * 4 * 2 (ML = 4, PL = 2 ) = 6,000 * dorje of animal affinity: ML 8, 8 pp 750 * 8 * 4 ( ML = 8 (+4 over min), PL = 4 (2 base + 2)) = 24,000 * dorje of energy adaption, specified: ML 9, 3 pp 750 * 9 * 4 (ML = 9 (allowable since PsyWar min ML for 2nd level is 4th, +5 = 9), PL = 4 (2 base, + 2 )) = 27,000 Level 2 powers (Psion / Empath 2, min ML 3, base pp 1) * dorje of animal affinity: ML 3, 3 pp 750 * 3 * 2 (ML = 3, PL = 2) = 4,500 * dorje of animal affinity: ML 8, 8 pp 750 * 8 * 4 (ML = 8 (+5 over min), PL = 4 (2 base, +2)) = 24,000 * dorje of energy adaption, specified: ML 9, 3 pp [/QUOTE] maximum ML is 8 ... Min for 2nd level manifester is 3. +5 = 8. Those are all "by the book" ... do I agree with them? Not sure ... There's definitely a reason why they say "+1 power level for a +2 ML boost" ... it falls into the idea that Powers tend to be closer to the new level for every +2 ML you augment them ... (look at the DC for the comparison ... a Level 1 power, augmented by +4 pp, has the same DC as a 3rd level power ...) Again, do I agree with this? not sure .. but I understand why they made the rule ... it has been said before that it wouldn't break the game to "ignore" this rule ... :tiphat: I assume it bothers you that a 9th level Psy Warrior can craft a Dorje of a 2nd level power, but a 9th level Psion cannot ?? Yeah, bugs me too ... but I'm still not 100% sure we can just "ignore" the rule .. there is some scaling happening with augmentation that probably does need to be accounted for ...