Erudite feat, too good? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Erudite feat, too good? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
The Livewire
02-28-07, 10:56 PM Ok, I'd posted a while ago how I explain the Erudite's powers known vs powers per day.

Call to Mind set the precident for a deeper subconscious.

Well I explain it as the powers reside in the deep subconscious, and they have to be 'pulled' forward into the conscious mind. Once a power is pulled forward, it resides there until it has a chance to fade back into the subconscious (with 8 hours of sleep) The unconscious is vast compared to the conscious, thus why the conscious mind can only hold a fraction of the knowledge.

So here's my feat:

Expanded Subconscious [Psionic]
Tapping into the universal subconscious, you are able to learn more powers than normal.

Prerequisites: Int 15, Erudite level 1st.

Benefit: You begin play with knowledge of six 1st-level powers plus 1 per point of Intelligence modifier. Each time you gain an erudite level, you may add four spells to your powers known without additional research. In addition, you gain a +2 bonus on all Knowledge (Psionic) checks.

Normal: 1st-level Erudites begin play with knowledge of two First level powers, and can add two powers per level to their powers known.

Special: You can take this feat only as a 1st-level character

Essentially it's a rewrite of Collegiate Wizard. Your thoughts?
Bengal
02-28-07, 11:33 PM I like it, so it's probably broken
Bacris
02-28-07, 11:51 PM My gut reaction is it's too good, but then I have to remember just how limited the erudite is in unique powers per day, so it's probably ok in a game with arcane splatbooks.
Second
03-01-07, 01:35 PM I wish my erudite could use that, but that probably isn't going to happen. I worked it out to saving 8440 exp and 14 days (336 hours) that you would have spent learning all those extra powers. Then there's the cost for buying power stones or getting others to let you learn from their powers known. Assuming you'd always choose powers of the highest level known to you at the time, that's a savings of 67850gp in power stones. Also, you wouldn't have to worry about those pesky Psicraft checks to successfully add new powers known.
The Livewire
03-01-07, 06:33 PM Well it's based on Collegiate Wizard, like I said. Thanks for doing the math. I raised the intelligence requirement since a) This is self learning and b) you'll get 2 hp out of it with the psionic body feat.
myusernameis
03-01-07, 07:04 PM With the Collegiate wizard feat you're saving 42200gp.
Red12
03-01-07, 09:17 PM Hmm. I think you may want to turn the numbers down a bit. It is a good feat for a wizard, and a GREAT feat for an erudite.

Let me put it this way, can you imagine any erudite NOT taking this feat? If not, it is probably too powerful. (As for me, there is no way I'm not taking this feat)

I think if you made it 4 + INT, and then one additional power for everly level of power known.

I.E. Bob the erudite takes this with 17 INT. He gets 7 1st level powers at level 1. When he reaches 3rd level, he gets 3 powers instead of the normal 2. Same at 5th, 7th, 9th, 11th, 13th, 15th, and 17th.

So thats in the ball park of 10 free powers? I think that sounds a lot better than 24. For the price of a SINGLE 1st level feat?
Scion of Coldshard
03-01-07, 10:14 PM Unique powers per day limitation still in place?

If so, I dont see any problems. You get more choices but are still highly limited in their use.

I dont have any problem with the wizard version either. It is actually nice for me as the dm when they take it actually. The player is happy because they have more options :love: and I am happy because they have more options :devil:.
myusernameis
03-02-07, 03:31 PM Thing is, after Collegiate Wizard came out I haven't played a wizard without it.
SlanderPanic
03-02-07, 04:30 PM Like the Horse (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mr._Horse) says, "Yes, sir, I do like it."

I don't see it as unbalanced at all. The fluff text is great. Overall, I call this a win.

And yeah, Collegiate Wizard is a great feat. It adds to a wizard's versatility and gives you an extra element to roleplay with, since that wizard is probably quite proud of his advanced education.
Scion of Coldshard
03-02-07, 04:54 PM Thing is, after Collegiate Wizard came out I haven't played a wizard without it.

I havent either!

But then I havent played a wizard since it came out.. or for awhile before it came out..

Something about low hd, base attack bonus, only one good save, and a certain lack of 'ultimate power at my fingertips' which was supposed to make the class all powerful even given the limitations.

But then I like fun and interesting spells so it was either try to play fun and be mostly useless or pick the obscenely powerful spells to make up for the rest.. bah.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
The Livewire 02-28-07, 10:56 PM	Ok, I'd posted a while ago how I explain the Erudite's powers known vs powers per day. Call to Mind set the precident for a deeper subconscious. Well I explain it as the powers reside in the deep subconscious, and they have to be 'pulled' forward into the conscious mind. Once a power is pulled forward, it resides there until it has a chance to fade back into the subconscious (with 8 hours of sleep) The unconscious is vast compared to the conscious, thus why the conscious mind can only hold a fraction of the knowledge. So here's my feat: Expanded Subconscious [Psionic] Tapping into the universal subconscious, you are able to learn more powers than normal. Prerequisites: Int 15, Erudite level 1st. Benefit: You begin play with knowledge of six 1st-level powers plus 1 per point of Intelligence modifier. Each time you gain an erudite level, you may add four spells to your powers known without additional research. In addition, you gain a +2 bonus on all Knowledge (Psionic) checks. Normal: 1st-level Erudites begin play with knowledge of two First level powers, and can add two powers per level to their powers known. Special: You can take this feat only as a 1st-level character Essentially it's a rewrite of Collegiate Wizard. Your thoughts?
Bengal 02-28-07, 11:33 PM	I like it, so it's probably broken
Bacris 02-28-07, 11:51 PM	My gut reaction is it's too good, but then I have to remember just how limited the erudite is in unique powers per day, so it's probably ok in a game with arcane splatbooks.
Second 03-01-07, 01:35 PM	I wish my erudite could use that, but that probably isn't going to happen. I worked it out to saving 8440 exp and 14 days (336 hours) that you would have spent learning all those extra powers. Then there's the cost for buying power stones or getting others to let you learn from their powers known. Assuming you'd always choose powers of the highest level known to you at the time, that's a savings of 67850gp in power stones. Also, you wouldn't have to worry about those pesky Psicraft checks to successfully add new powers known.
The Livewire 03-01-07, 06:33 PM	Well it's based on Collegiate Wizard, like I said. Thanks for doing the math. I raised the intelligence requirement since a) This is self learning and b) you'll get 2 hp out of it with the psionic body feat.
myusernameis 03-01-07, 07:04 PM	With the Collegiate wizard feat you're saving 42200gp.
Red12 03-01-07, 09:17 PM	Hmm. I think you may want to turn the numbers down a bit. It is a good feat for a wizard, and a GREAT feat for an erudite. Let me put it this way, can you imagine any erudite NOT taking this feat? If not, it is probably too powerful. (As for me, there is no way I'm not taking this feat) I think if you made it 4 + INT, and then one additional power for everly level of power known. I.E. Bob the erudite takes this with 17 INT. He gets 7 1st level powers at level 1. When he reaches 3rd level, he gets 3 powers instead of the normal 2. Same at 5th, 7th, 9th, 11th, 13th, 15th, and 17th. So thats in the ball park of 10 free powers? I think that sounds a lot better than 24. For the price of a SINGLE 1st level feat?
Scion of Coldshard 03-01-07, 10:14 PM	Unique powers per day limitation still in place? If so, I dont see any problems. You get more choices but are still highly limited in their use. I dont have any problem with the wizard version either. It is actually nice for me as the dm when they take it actually. The player is happy because they have more options :love: and I am happy because they have more options :devil:.
myusernameis 03-02-07, 03:31 PM	Thing is, after Collegiate Wizard came out I haven't played a wizard without it.
SlanderPanic 03-02-07, 04:30 PM	Like the Horse (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mr._Horse) says, "Yes, sir, I do like it." I don't see it as unbalanced at all. The fluff text is great. Overall, I call this a win. And yeah, Collegiate Wizard is a great feat. It adds to a wizard's versatility and gives you an extra element to roleplay with, since that wizard is probably quite proud of his advanced education.
Scion of Coldshard 03-02-07, 04:54 PM	Thing is, after Collegiate Wizard came out I haven't played a wizard without it. I havent either! But then I havent played a wizard since it came out.. or for awhile before it came out.. Something about low hd, base attack bonus, only one good save, and a certain lack of 'ultimate power at my fingertips' which was supposed to make the class all powerful even given the limitations. But then I like fun and interesting spells so it was either try to play fun and be mostly useless or pick the obscenely powerful spells to make up for the rest.. bah.