Improvements Upon a Sandwich [Archive] - Wizards Community

Improvements Upon a Sandwich [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
archerpwr
12-25-07, 02:50 PM Race: kalashtar (DM ruled I wouldn't lose the pp or psilike)
Level: 17
PB: 38
Books: XPH, core, complete(minus champion), races(minus dragon), DMG2, ToB, ToM, MoI, MIC, weapons of legacy
GP: 340k

What I'd like flavorwise:
Thrallherd 10

Starting from scratch again...
Lycanthromancer
12-25-07, 03:12 PM I wouldn't necessarily take telepath; too much overlap with the thrallherd. Seer would be GREAT for this, however, especially if you took EK: metamorphosis and Psicrystal Affinity, turned the psicrystal into a really nasty mount (such as a hydra), and used your buffing skills (such as second chance) to keep your mounted thrall safe while he did his thing (especially if he used his mount for cover, used the mount's saving throws when possible, and so on).
archerpwr
12-25-07, 03:19 PM I wouldn't necessarily take telepath; too much overlap with the thrallherd. Seer would be GREAT for this, however, especially if you took EK: metamorphosis and Psicrystal Affinity, turned the psicrystal into a really nasty mount (such as a hydra), and used your buffing skills (such as second chance) to keep your mounted thrall safe while he did his thing (especially if he used his mount for cover, used the mount's saving throws when possible, and so on).

Are you sure? That means delaying my databank upload with Psychic Chirurgery 4ish levels. Databank has a *lot* of feats to spend on EK. I think I could probably cherry pick enough seer powers to fit my needs. The RP on databank is an investigator and telapath can really help with that as well.
Lycanthromancer
12-25-07, 03:21 PM Are you sure? That means delaying my databank upload with Psychic Chirurgery 4ish levels. Databank has a *lot* of feats to spend on EK. I think I could probably cherry pick enough seer powers to fit my needs. The RP on databank is an investigator and telapath can really help with that as well.There's always Expanded Knowledge, research (!), Use Psionic Device and power stones (!!!!!!!!!), and the erudite.

[edit] Note that you can get psychic chirurgery itself with UPD and a power stone, and you can use your mini-thralls to manifest lower level powers all you want. Shaper might be the way to go, especially if you focus on UPD investment.
archerpwr
12-25-07, 03:25 PM There's always Expanded Knowledge, research (!), Use Psionic Device and power stones (!!!!!!!!!), and the erudite.

So not touching the erudite... That will complicate things way to much. How would I get Psychic Chirurgery from a powerstone? I need to teach myself and my thrall psychic chirurgery in order to get all the powers I want. I'll ask the DM about research.
Lycanthromancer
12-25-07, 03:27 PM So not touching the erudite... That will complicate things way to much. How would I get Psychic Chirurgery from a powerstone? I need to teach myself and my thrall psychic chirurgery in order to get all the powers I want. I'll ask the DM about research.(Note my edit above.)

Your psicrystal can use UPD too, right? So get two power stones of psychic chirurgery, have it manifest one to implant the knowledge in the power stone into you? You should be able to do this, since the psicrystal is emulating the knowledge of having pc to manifest from the stone. You shouldn't even need a second stone for that.
archerpwr
12-25-07, 03:34 PM (Note my edit above.)

Your psicrystal can use UPD too, right? So get two power stones of psychic chirurgery, have it manifest one to implant the knowledge in the power stone into you? You should be able to do this, since the psicrystal is emulating the knowledge of having pc to manifest from the stone. You shouldn't even need a second stone for that.

Let me get this straight:
Psicrystal UPD a powerstone of psychic chirurgery to manifest PC and emulate knowing the power from the other powerstone (draining the stone, I think) giving the PC psychic chirurgery as a power known? That works?
Lycanthromancer
12-25-07, 03:35 PM It should. After all, the psicrystal is using UPD to manifest feign knowing psychic chirurgery in order to manifest it from a power stone. It should carry over.

Your mileage may vary, however.
archerpwr
12-25-07, 03:44 PM It should. After all, the psicrystal is using UPD to manifest feign knowing psychic chirurgery in order to manifest it from a power stone. It should carry over.

Your mileage may vary, however.

Is there a simpler way to learn it? I have a suspicion from the way psionics had to be asked to be allowed in the campaign the DM isn't as knowledgable about psionics as you are and will veto anything he doesn't understand.
Lycanthromancer
12-25-07, 03:46 PM Is there a simpler way to learn it? I have a suspicion from the way psionics had to be asked to be allowed in the campaign the DM isn't as knowledgable about psionics as you are and will veto anything he doesn't understand.Hire someone.
archerpwr
12-25-07, 04:08 PM Hire someone.

*Smacks forehead*
Wow, I should have thought of that...
I'll just hire an NPC to implant psychic chirurgery and do the rest myself. I'll do some thinking. Soon I'll have a powers and feats setup for critique.
archerpwr
12-25-07, 04:41 PM DM banned the sandwich idea... Instead I get to be baleful polymorphed into some sort of bird and pretend to be the familiar.
hovnarr
12-25-07, 06:38 PM So the idea now is basically to get a thrall with a familiar (i.e. a wizard) and have him POA you into a familiar clone? I'm not really seeing the benefit here.

What part did the DM object to? You could always have the Thrall be the object, if your DM has trouble with a PC suit of armor. You'd basically convert the thrall class feature to an intelligent item class feature.

An egoist suit of armor is a great thrall. Databank for powers, psychic revivify on you if you fall in combat, healing support etc. Could also grab EK: Repair Object to heal itself.
archerpwr
12-25-07, 06:51 PM So the idea now is basically to get a thrall with a familiar (i.e. a wizard) and have him POA you into a familiar clone? I'm not really seeing the benefit here.

What part did the DM object to? You could always have the Thrall be the object, if your DM has trouble with a PC suit of armor. You'd basically convert the thrall class feature to an intelligent item class feature.

An egoist suit of armor is a great thrall. Databank for powers, psychic revivify on you if you fall in combat, healing support etc. Could also grab EK: Repair Object to heal itself.

DM threw out the sandwich plan when he noticed the little flavor text at the bottom of astral seed (evil acts and whatnot) and how hard it would be to kill my PC in combat.

The familiar thing is a flavor point that I'd like to pull off. I don't lose much at all the way the DM is playing it and it allows some great RP opportunities.
Lycanthromancer
12-25-07, 07:28 PM Mind seed being [evil] is just stupid. It's basically the only way to undo a mind seed, so preventing a loved one from being seeded is itself an evil act? Dumb.
archerpwr
12-25-07, 07:33 PM Mind seed being [evil] is just stupid. It's basically the only way to undo a mind seed, so preventing a loved one from being seeded is itself an evil act? Dumb.

Basically. I'm running with the familiar idea at this point though. Power selection is going to be tricky.
hovnarr
12-25-07, 07:57 PM I think power selection will be pretty straight forward. A high dex familiar will work well even for ray powers, and probably nets you some nice mobility too. Equipment selection will be tougher. Also, what does your DM say about AMF/NPF/dispel/disjunction that may sort of delete your character concept? Just recast POA and pretend it didn't happen?

Will you be posing as a familiar or actually BE the familiar? As in, will your wizard thrall be able to share spells with you etc? Even if only posing, having duplicate familiars with one as a decoy could be highly confusing for opponents.

EDIT: Nevermind, saw the other thread.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
archerpwr 12-25-07, 02:50 PM	Race: kalashtar (DM ruled I wouldn't lose the pp or psilike) Level: 17 PB: 38 Books: XPH, core, complete(minus champion), races(minus dragon), DMG2, ToB, ToM, MoI, MIC, weapons of legacy GP: 340k What I'd like flavorwise: Thrallherd 10 Starting from scratch again...
Lycanthromancer 12-25-07, 03:12 PM	I wouldn't necessarily take telepath; too much overlap with the thrallherd. Seer would be GREAT for this, however, especially if you took EK: metamorphosis and Psicrystal Affinity, turned the psicrystal into a really nasty mount (such as a hydra), and used your buffing skills (such as second chance) to keep your mounted thrall safe while he did his thing (especially if he used his mount for cover, used the mount's saving throws when possible, and so on).
archerpwr 12-25-07, 03:19 PM	I wouldn't necessarily take telepath; too much overlap with the thrallherd. Seer would be GREAT for this, however, especially if you took EK: metamorphosis and Psicrystal Affinity, turned the psicrystal into a really nasty mount (such as a hydra), and used your buffing skills (such as second chance) to keep your mounted thrall safe while he did his thing (especially if he used his mount for cover, used the mount's saving throws when possible, and so on). Are you sure? That means delaying my databank upload with Psychic Chirurgery 4ish levels. Databank has a lot of feats to spend on EK. I think I could probably cherry pick enough seer powers to fit my needs. The RP on databank is an investigator and telapath can really help with that as well.
Lycanthromancer 12-25-07, 03:21 PM	Are you sure? That means delaying my databank upload with Psychic Chirurgery 4ish levels. Databank has a lot of feats to spend on EK. I think I could probably cherry pick enough seer powers to fit my needs. The RP on databank is an investigator and telapath can really help with that as well.There's always Expanded Knowledge, research (!), Use Psionic Device and power stones (!!!!!!!!!), and the erudite. [edit] Note that you can get psychic chirurgery itself with UPD and a power stone, and you can use your mini-thralls to manifest lower level powers all you want. Shaper might be the way to go, especially if you focus on UPD investment.
archerpwr 12-25-07, 03:25 PM	There's always Expanded Knowledge, research (!), Use Psionic Device and power stones (!!!!!!!!!), and the erudite. So not touching the erudite... That will complicate things way to much. How would I get Psychic Chirurgery from a powerstone? I need to teach myself and my thrall psychic chirurgery in order to get all the powers I want. I'll ask the DM about research.
Lycanthromancer 12-25-07, 03:27 PM	So not touching the erudite... That will complicate things way to much. How would I get Psychic Chirurgery from a powerstone? I need to teach myself and my thrall psychic chirurgery in order to get all the powers I want. I'll ask the DM about research.(Note my edit above.) Your psicrystal can use UPD too, right? So get two power stones of psychic chirurgery, have it manifest one to implant the knowledge in the power stone into you? You should be able to do this, since the psicrystal is emulating the knowledge of having pc to manifest from the stone. You shouldn't even need a second stone for that.
archerpwr 12-25-07, 03:34 PM	(Note my edit above.) Your psicrystal can use UPD too, right? So get two power stones of psychic chirurgery, have it manifest one to implant the knowledge in the power stone into you? You should be able to do this, since the psicrystal is emulating the knowledge of having pc to manifest from the stone. You shouldn't even need a second stone for that. Let me get this straight: Psicrystal UPD a powerstone of psychic chirurgery to manifest PC and emulate knowing the power from the other powerstone (draining the stone, I think) giving the PC psychic chirurgery as a power known? That works?
Lycanthromancer 12-25-07, 03:35 PM	It should. After all, the psicrystal is using UPD to manifest feign knowing psychic chirurgery in order to manifest it from a power stone. It should carry over. Your mileage may vary, however.
archerpwr 12-25-07, 03:44 PM	It should. After all, the psicrystal is using UPD to manifest feign knowing psychic chirurgery in order to manifest it from a power stone. It should carry over. Your mileage may vary, however. Is there a simpler way to learn it? I have a suspicion from the way psionics had to be asked to be allowed in the campaign the DM isn't as knowledgable about psionics as you are and will veto anything he doesn't understand.
Lycanthromancer 12-25-07, 03:46 PM	Is there a simpler way to learn it? I have a suspicion from the way psionics had to be asked to be allowed in the campaign the DM isn't as knowledgable about psionics as you are and will veto anything he doesn't understand.Hire someone.
archerpwr 12-25-07, 04:08 PM	Hire someone. Smacks forehead Wow, I should have thought of that... I'll just hire an NPC to implant psychic chirurgery and do the rest myself. I'll do some thinking. Soon I'll have a powers and feats setup for critique.
archerpwr 12-25-07, 04:41 PM	DM banned the sandwich idea... Instead I get to be baleful polymorphed into some sort of bird and pretend to be the familiar.
hovnarr 12-25-07, 06:38 PM	So the idea now is basically to get a thrall with a familiar (i.e. a wizard) and have him POA you into a familiar clone? I'm not really seeing the benefit here. What part did the DM object to? You could always have the Thrall be the object, if your DM has trouble with a PC suit of armor. You'd basically convert the thrall class feature to an intelligent item class feature. An egoist suit of armor is a great thrall. Databank for powers, psychic revivify on you if you fall in combat, healing support etc. Could also grab EK: Repair Object to heal itself.
archerpwr 12-25-07, 06:51 PM	So the idea now is basically to get a thrall with a familiar (i.e. a wizard) and have him POA you into a familiar clone? I'm not really seeing the benefit here. What part did the DM object to? You could always have the Thrall be the object, if your DM has trouble with a PC suit of armor. You'd basically convert the thrall class feature to an intelligent item class feature. An egoist suit of armor is a great thrall. Databank for powers, psychic revivify on you if you fall in combat, healing support etc. Could also grab EK: Repair Object to heal itself. DM threw out the sandwich plan when he noticed the little flavor text at the bottom of astral seed (evil acts and whatnot) and how hard it would be to kill my PC in combat. The familiar thing is a flavor point that I'd like to pull off. I don't lose much at all the way the DM is playing it and it allows some great RP opportunities.
Lycanthromancer 12-25-07, 07:28 PM	Mind seed being [evil] is just stupid. It's basically the only way to undo a mind seed, so preventing a loved one from being seeded is itself an evil act? Dumb.
archerpwr 12-25-07, 07:33 PM	Mind seed being [evil] is just stupid. It's basically the only way to undo a mind seed, so preventing a loved one from being seeded is itself an evil act? Dumb. Basically. I'm running with the familiar idea at this point though. Power selection is going to be tricky.
hovnarr 12-25-07, 07:57 PM	I think power selection will be pretty straight forward. A high dex familiar will work well even for ray powers, and probably nets you some nice mobility too. Equipment selection will be tougher. Also, what does your DM say about AMF/NPF/dispel/disjunction that may sort of delete your character concept? Just recast POA and pretend it didn't happen? Will you be posing as a familiar or actually BE the familiar? As in, will your wizard thrall be able to share spells with you etc? Even if only posing, having duplicate familiars with one as a decoy could be highly confusing for opponents. EDIT: Nevermind, saw the other thread.