Invisibility: What the Heck? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Invisibility: What the Heck? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Tectorman
06-14-07, 01:50 PM So I picked up my XPH (have had it for a while), and I read the Duerger race description. I found out that they have the ability to become invisible as a psi-like ability. So I flipped over to the "I"s in the list of powers and couldn't find it.

So...

What are the official stats for the psionic power Invisibility? Or, how do I convert the spell Invisibility into a power?
Tempest Stormwind
06-14-07, 02:25 PM So I picked up my XPH (have had it for a while), and I read the Duerger race description. I found out that they have the ability to become invisible as a psi-like ability. So I flipped over to the "I"s in the list of powers and couldn't find it.

So...

What are the official stats for the psionic power Invisibility? Or, how do I convert the spell Invisibility into a power?

In some cases, a creature’s psi-like abilities (or abilities listed under a creature’s psionics entry) may include an effect that does not duplicate any listed power. For such abilities, simply use the existing spell description. Treat the creature’s manifester level as the caster level for the spell. The ability is still psionic in origin, so spells and powers that specifically affect psionic powers can negate or reduce its effects as they would any other psionic power.There you go.

For the record, the closest equivalent to invisibility ASIDE from the duergar's is Cloud Mind, but you won't need to reference that due to the passage above.
Fleem
06-15-07, 09:38 AM Fortunately, since Cloud Mind is pathetic, in comparison to Invisibility.
Suldarr'essalar
06-16-07, 03:57 AM Fortunately, since Cloud Mind is pathetic, in comparison to Invisibility.
Not true. It is... different. You cannot detect creatures using cloud mind with true seeing.
BlaineTog
06-16-07, 04:17 AM Not true. It is... different. You cannot detect creatures using cloud mind with true seeing.Different, and suckier. True Seeing isn't gonna come up nearly often enough to justify the restrictions of Cloud Mind.
Tempest Stormwind
06-16-07, 01:55 PM True, but I can Cloud Mind a guard (including the ubiquitous guard dog with Scent) and walk on top of it while smelling of lutefisk and singing I've Got A Lovely Bunch Of Coconuts and it will remain unaware of my presence. Even if it had Touchsight or True Seeing available.

I'm not saying it's incredible. The duration in particular makes it pretty poor, actually. But it does have uses beyond Invisibility.
gotbrain
06-16-07, 11:44 PM True, but I can Cloud Mind a guard (including the ubiquitous guard dog with Scent) and walk on top of it while smelling of lutefisk and singing I've Got A Lovely Bunch Of Coconuts and it will remain unaware of my presence. Even if it had Touchsight or True Seeing available.

I'm not saying it's incredible. The duration in particular makes it pretty poor, actually. But it does have uses beyond Invisibility.

I agree its effectiveness is much better when used for its more limited purpose. No need to move silently or worry about your scent when trying to avoid your foe.

It is actually much better than invisibility when using it one (or very few) foe.
Nifft
06-17-07, 12:18 AM It's great against a guard dog, guard grimlock, or other alternate-seeing guard-critter with a low Will save. It's inferior against multiple foes, or against single foes who have a decent Will save (and no alternate seeing mechanism).

Cheers, -- N
Thomar_of_Uointer
06-17-07, 09:15 PM Different, and suckier. True Seeing isn't gonna come up nearly often enough to justify the restrictions of Cloud Mind.

What? At high levels, it's something every party is packing, and most enemy spellcasters will too. Many high-level baddies get it permanently.

It's also effective against creatures with blindsight, another "see-all" ability.
RavinRay
06-17-07, 09:48 PM What are the official stats for the psionic power Invisibility? Or, how do I convert the spell Invisibility into a power?
Or update the 3.0 invisibility power (http://www.opengamingfoundation.org/srd/srdpsionicpowersiklmnop.rtf) to 3.5.
Suldarr'essalar
06-18-07, 02:53 AM I'd like to see cloud mind as a close range emanation efect centered on the manifester, that has augmentation to increase range.
Nifft
06-18-07, 03:28 AM Many high-level baddies get [True Sight] permanently.

Mostly Outsiders, from what I recall. And those have good Will saves and often SR, which makes cloud mind less useful.

-- N
Lycanthromancer
06-18-07, 10:31 AM I'd like to see cloud mind as a close range emanation efect centered on the manifester, that has augmentation to increase range.Done. :D
Tectorman
06-30-07, 01:50 AM Or update the 3.0 invisibility power (http://www.opengamingfoundation.org/srd/srdpsionicpowersiklmnop.rtf) to 3.5.

For the record, this is the sort of thing I was looking for. All that discussion about the Cloud Mind ability was mildly interesting, but mostly off-topic really.
AntiDjinn
06-30-07, 03:46 AM Cloud Mind (and its Mass big brother) still work better than the version of psionic invisibility that was around in 2E. Remember: It only worked on "opened" minds. To open a mind you had to establish 3 "tangents" with psionic combat. So that was a couple of rounds of lashing at someone's mind to be able to use a power to cause them not to notice you. Way too much effort; 99% of the time it was easier just to kill the other guy, then he certainly would not see you.
Yokinobu
06-30-07, 04:29 AM I may be wrong, but I think that cloud mind was the closest thing to invisibily that the designers could come up and it make sense as a psionic power.

However I'm down with the whole bending-light-using-the-mind concept that the Dark Templar from Starcraft used.

Then again, you might still be visible to creatures with darkvision in that case.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Tectorman 06-14-07, 01:50 PM	So I picked up my XPH (have had it for a while), and I read the Duerger race description. I found out that they have the ability to become invisible as a psi-like ability. So I flipped over to the "I"s in the list of powers and couldn't find it. So... What are the official stats for the psionic power Invisibility? Or, how do I convert the spell Invisibility into a power?
Tempest Stormwind 06-14-07, 02:25 PM	So I picked up my XPH (have had it for a while), and I read the Duerger race description. I found out that they have the ability to become invisible as a psi-like ability. So I flipped over to the "I"s in the list of powers and couldn't find it. So... What are the official stats for the psionic power Invisibility? Or, how do I convert the spell Invisibility into a power? In some cases, a creature’s psi-like abilities (or abilities listed under a creature’s psionics entry) may include an effect that does not duplicate any listed power. For such abilities, simply use the existing spell description. Treat the creature’s manifester level as the caster level for the spell. The ability is still psionic in origin, so spells and powers that specifically affect psionic powers can negate or reduce its effects as they would any other psionic power.There you go. For the record, the closest equivalent to invisibility ASIDE from the duergar's is Cloud Mind, but you won't need to reference that due to the passage above.
Fleem 06-15-07, 09:38 AM	Fortunately, since Cloud Mind is pathetic, in comparison to Invisibility.
Suldarr'essalar 06-16-07, 03:57 AM	Fortunately, since Cloud Mind is pathetic, in comparison to Invisibility. Not true. It is... different. You cannot detect creatures using cloud mind with true seeing.
BlaineTog 06-16-07, 04:17 AM	Not true. It is... different. You cannot detect creatures using cloud mind with true seeing.Different, and suckier. True Seeing isn't gonna come up nearly often enough to justify the restrictions of Cloud Mind.
Tempest Stormwind 06-16-07, 01:55 PM	True, but I can Cloud Mind a guard (including the ubiquitous guard dog with Scent) and walk on top of it while smelling of lutefisk and singing I've Got A Lovely Bunch Of Coconuts and it will remain unaware of my presence. Even if it had Touchsight or True Seeing available. I'm not saying it's incredible. The duration in particular makes it pretty poor, actually. But it does have uses beyond Invisibility.
gotbrain 06-16-07, 11:44 PM	True, but I can Cloud Mind a guard (including the ubiquitous guard dog with Scent) and walk on top of it while smelling of lutefisk and singing I've Got A Lovely Bunch Of Coconuts and it will remain unaware of my presence. Even if it had Touchsight or True Seeing available. I'm not saying it's incredible. The duration in particular makes it pretty poor, actually. But it does have uses beyond Invisibility. I agree its effectiveness is much better when used for its more limited purpose. No need to move silently or worry about your scent when trying to avoid your foe. It is actually much better than invisibility when using it one (or very few) foe.
Nifft 06-17-07, 12:18 AM	It's great against a guard dog, guard grimlock, or other alternate-seeing guard-critter with a low Will save. It's inferior against multiple foes, or against single foes who have a decent Will save (and no alternate seeing mechanism). Cheers, -- N
Thomar_of_Uointer 06-17-07, 09:15 PM	Different, and suckier. True Seeing isn't gonna come up nearly often enough to justify the restrictions of Cloud Mind. What? At high levels, it's something every party is packing, and most enemy spellcasters will too. Many high-level baddies get it permanently. It's also effective against creatures with blindsight, another "see-all" ability.
RavinRay 06-17-07, 09:48 PM	What are the official stats for the psionic power Invisibility? Or, how do I convert the spell Invisibility into a power? Or update the 3.0 invisibility power (http://www.opengamingfoundation.org/srd/srdpsionicpowersiklmnop.rtf) to 3.5.
Suldarr'essalar 06-18-07, 02:53 AM	I'd like to see cloud mind as a close range emanation efect centered on the manifester, that has augmentation to increase range.
Nifft 06-18-07, 03:28 AM	Many high-level baddies get [True Sight] permanently. Mostly Outsiders, from what I recall. And those have good Will saves and often SR, which makes cloud mind less useful. -- N
Lycanthromancer 06-18-07, 10:31 AM	I'd like to see cloud mind as a close range emanation efect centered on the manifester, that has augmentation to increase range.Done. :D
Tectorman 06-30-07, 01:50 AM	Or update the 3.0 invisibility power (http://www.opengamingfoundation.org/srd/srdpsionicpowersiklmnop.rtf) to 3.5. For the record, this is the sort of thing I was looking for. All that discussion about the Cloud Mind ability was mildly interesting, but mostly off-topic really.
AntiDjinn 06-30-07, 03:46 AM	Cloud Mind (and its Mass big brother) still work better than the version of psionic invisibility that was around in 2E. Remember: It only worked on "opened" minds. To open a mind you had to establish 3 "tangents" with psionic combat. So that was a couple of rounds of lashing at someone's mind to be able to use a power to cause them not to notice you. Way too much effort; 99% of the time it was easier just to kill the other guy, then he certainly would not see you.
Yokinobu 06-30-07, 04:29 AM	I may be wrong, but I think that cloud mind was the closest thing to invisibily that the designers could come up and it make sense as a psionic power. However I'm down with the whole bending-light-using-the-mind concept that the Dark Templar from Starcraft used. Then again, you might still be visible to creatures with darkvision in that case.