is this legal? Decisive strike+ fists of Iron+ Psionic fist? [Archive] - Wizards Community

is this legal? Decisive strike+ fists of Iron+ Psionic fist? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
ElyasRavenwood
03-16-08, 12:42 PM Is this combo legal?
I am planning ahead for my monk/psi warrior.
I am planning to use Alternate class feature: Decisive strike with the fists of Iron feat and the Psionic fist feat.
So at 7th level with 2 levels of monk and 5 levels of Psi warrior with the Talashaltora
With a full attack action I think I can a) take a -2 on attack to make a decisive strike to do x2 dmg and b) expend 1 use of unarmed strike class feature to use my Fists of iron feat to do an extra 1d6 damage and c) expend my psionic focus to us my psionic fist feat to do an extra 1d6 of psionic damage.
Would this produce a grand total of: (1d8 +Str Md) x2 decisive strike + 1d6 iron fist +1d6 Psionic fist?

I eventually plan to toss into the mix Improved natural attack, Superior unarmed strike, and greater psionic fist.

So at 12th level, if my character survives that long,

(3d8+str mod) x2 decisive strike + 1d6 Fist of iron, + 4d6 greater psionic fist?

Is this combo legal? Is it game balanced? Maybe I am completely off my rocker here or am I descending into a pit of cheesiness from which I will never return. ?
deadkoo
03-16-08, 02:25 PM seems fairly balanced... lvl 12 doing an avg of (depending on str) 45 damage in one round and needs to regain psionic focus to do it again and such aint game breaking.

not sure about legal though
'Dane
03-16-08, 07:26 PM don't really know about the legality either but Psionic fist is +2d6, and you might be able to save yourself a feat if you go with a monks belt instead of supierior unarmed strike
Saiyamantis
03-16-08, 07:34 PM I just built a character who uses pretty much this exact strategy, substituting a witchlight reservoir (MIC) for Fists of Iron. It works just like you think it does, but it always seems like you need it again right after it's used up- Psicrystal Containment and Psionic Meditation go a long way towards clearing up that problem. Deep Impact is also nice, if you find yourself missing a lot.
'Dane
03-16-08, 11:41 PM [QUOTE=Saiyamantis;15355570]...
Deep Impact is also nice, ...QUOTE]
Well he would want Unavoidable Strike actually since its the unarmed one but yea.

And I think he can take Psionic Weapon and Greater Psionic Weapon because unarmed attacks are also counted as manufactured weapons, thats why you can cast Magic Weapon or Magic Fang on them.

soo lets see monk 15, psiwar 5 gets ... 10 feats
so you got lots of room there i supppose, well maybe not lots, 2 to get psicrystal containment, 3 for G. psionic fist and Unavoidable Strike 2 for greater psionc weapon, one for Psionic Meditation, one for imp. natural attack, one for iron fist, and dont bother with superior natural attack Monk's Belt is better, so that leaves you with zero feats... so yea lots of wiggle room for other feats.

but at 20 you'll get to start a battle with 4d8 (6d8 if you're enlarged) +str x2 +9d6, or +5d6 and its a touch attack
The_Mess
03-17-08, 10:04 AM Well he would want Unavoidable Strike actually since its the unarmed one but yea.

And I think he can take Psionic Weapon and Greater Psionic Weapon because unarmed attacks are also counted as manufactured weapons, thats why you can cast Magic Weapon or Magic Fang on them.

Yes, the monk's unarmed strikes count as manufactured weapons for enhancement purposes.

A monk’s unarmed strike is treated both as a manufactured weapon and a natural weapon for the purpose of spells and effects that enhance or improve either manufactured weapons or natural weapons. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/monk.htm#unarmedStrike)

So, why take Psionic Fist or Unavoidable Strike? Despite the fact that they were clearly designed for a monk, they are inferior choices. Take Psionic Weapon and Deep Impact feats and they apply to a monk's unarmed attacks as well as his weapon strikes.

In fact, the only class with an excuse to take Psionic Fist and Unavoidable Strike would be a swordsage focusing on unarmed combat. He doesn't get the line about using his fists as manufactured weapons.
Orenmir
03-17-08, 10:58 AM The OP's combo is perfectly legal. There is no text to refute using them all at the same time. And, it's not imbalanced at all. You have to expend your focus and a use of Stunning fist, so it's not like you'll be using this combo constantly. Remember the King of Smack -- his normal damage at this level is even higher (much higher).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
ElyasRavenwood 03-16-08, 12:42 PM	Is this combo legal? I am planning ahead for my monk/psi warrior. I am planning to use Alternate class feature: Decisive strike with the fists of Iron feat and the Psionic fist feat. So at 7th level with 2 levels of monk and 5 levels of Psi warrior with the Talashaltora With a full attack action I think I can a) take a -2 on attack to make a decisive strike to do x2 dmg and b) expend 1 use of unarmed strike class feature to use my Fists of iron feat to do an extra 1d6 damage and c) expend my psionic focus to us my psionic fist feat to do an extra 1d6 of psionic damage. Would this produce a grand total of: (1d8 +Str Md) x2 decisive strike + 1d6 iron fist +1d6 Psionic fist? I eventually plan to toss into the mix Improved natural attack, Superior unarmed strike, and greater psionic fist. So at 12th level, if my character survives that long, (3d8+str mod) x2 decisive strike + 1d6 Fist of iron, + 4d6 greater psionic fist? Is this combo legal? Is it game balanced? Maybe I am completely off my rocker here or am I descending into a pit of cheesiness from which I will never return. ?
deadkoo 03-16-08, 02:25 PM	seems fairly balanced... lvl 12 doing an avg of (depending on str) 45 damage in one round and needs to regain psionic focus to do it again and such aint game breaking. not sure about legal though
'Dane 03-16-08, 07:26 PM	don't really know about the legality either but Psionic fist is +2d6, and you might be able to save yourself a feat if you go with a monks belt instead of supierior unarmed strike
Saiyamantis 03-16-08, 07:34 PM	I just built a character who uses pretty much this exact strategy, substituting a witchlight reservoir (MIC) for Fists of Iron. It works just like you think it does, but it always seems like you need it again right after it's used up- Psicrystal Containment and Psionic Meditation go a long way towards clearing up that problem. Deep Impact is also nice, if you find yourself missing a lot.
'Dane 03-16-08, 11:41 PM	[QUOTE=Saiyamantis;15355570]... Deep Impact is also nice, ...QUOTE] Well he would want Unavoidable Strike actually since its the unarmed one but yea. And I think he can take Psionic Weapon and Greater Psionic Weapon because unarmed attacks are also counted as manufactured weapons, thats why you can cast Magic Weapon or Magic Fang on them. soo lets see monk 15, psiwar 5 gets ... 10 feats so you got lots of room there i supppose, well maybe not lots, 2 to get psicrystal containment, 3 for G. psionic fist and Unavoidable Strike 2 for greater psionc weapon, one for Psionic Meditation, one for imp. natural attack, one for iron fist, and dont bother with superior natural attack Monk's Belt is better, so that leaves you with zero feats... so yea lots of wiggle room for other feats. but at 20 you'll get to start a battle with 4d8 (6d8 if you're enlarged) +str x2 +9d6, or +5d6 and its a touch attack
The_Mess 03-17-08, 10:04 AM	Well he would want Unavoidable Strike actually since its the unarmed one but yea. And I think he can take Psionic Weapon and Greater Psionic Weapon because unarmed attacks are also counted as manufactured weapons, thats why you can cast Magic Weapon or Magic Fang on them. Yes, the monk's unarmed strikes count as manufactured weapons for enhancement purposes. A monk’s unarmed strike is treated both as a manufactured weapon and a natural weapon for the purpose of spells and effects that enhance or improve either manufactured weapons or natural weapons. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/monk.htm#unarmedStrike) So, why take Psionic Fist or Unavoidable Strike? Despite the fact that they were clearly designed for a monk, they are inferior choices. Take Psionic Weapon and Deep Impact feats and they apply to a monk's unarmed attacks as well as his weapon strikes. In fact, the only class with an excuse to take Psionic Fist and Unavoidable Strike would be a swordsage focusing on unarmed combat. He doesn't get the line about using his fists as manufactured weapons.
Orenmir 03-17-08, 10:58 AM	The OP's combo is perfectly legal. There is no text to refute using them all at the same time. And, it's not imbalanced at all. You have to expend your focus and a use of Stunning fist, so it's not like you'll be using this combo constantly. Remember the King of Smack -- his normal damage at this level is even higher (much higher).