Minor creation to make power stones? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Minor creation to make power stones? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
heavenisme
11-14-07, 11:51 AM Hello there D&D fans... I am wondering if I can forgo the material components cost of making power stones, and just pay the xp cost. I have these powers that can make stuff, so shouldn't I be able to make power stones instead of going to the market? If you can make poision you should be able to make crafting materials.

Here's what I have:
Imprint Stone
Minor Creation, Psionic
Fabricate, Psionic
PhaedrusXY
11-14-07, 12:33 PM Minor Creation can only make plant-based materials. Stones are not plant-based. Even if they were, the stuff made with Minor Creation is only temporary.

Fabricate would just let you turn one thing into another, so you'd still need the materials to start with. So no, I don't think you can bypass the material requirement.
InkBlot
11-15-07, 01:55 PM You could certainly use fabricate to help you obtain the proper materials. For instance, if you find a cave with natural crystal deposits then you can use fabricate to turn the geodes in the wall into a pile of thumb-sized crystals ready to be imprinted. It still takes the same amount of time and XP. It still takes the same amount of gold, since you could have sold those crystals instead.
AntiDjinn
11-15-07, 06:40 PM As noted, you should be able to use Fabricate to do the work of mining the crystal and converting it into chunks of the appropriate size. If the mineral rights at that site are claimed by someone else, then what you are effectively doing is stealing the material (and its attendant cost) instead of paying for it. Whatever, the power stone you craft will still work the same whether you bought the material, mined it, or filched it out of someone's pocket.

The crystal itself is not the only material cost, however, the character is probably dunking the rock in a variety of reagents, using a tuning fork to test its resonance, and maybe smoking some exotic herbs to achieve the proper state of mind.

In any case, making an empowered item always costs character resources. XP is the most important expense, material cost is another. If you spend time using powers to bypass the cost, then you are just substituting a different character resource: Time. If you spend, for example, two days of character-time fabricating materials on the cheap, it may seem like you have saved a bundle. But consider how much loot a PC can haul out of a dungeon in two days. Consider how much you can earn in 48 hours of tomb robbing, wizard's tower burglary, or simple slaughter and looting. The amount a PC can make in a given time period is nearly absurd compared to what a townie with a day job (like the guy who is selling you your raw crystal supplies) can make. You may find that your loss due to pillaging down time far exceeds what you save in gold. Not to mention the XP you could be earning by adventuring when you are trying to cut corners on costs.
heavenisme
11-17-07, 12:51 AM So I am still wondering if minor creation can make power stones? In the 1001 uses thread people are saying soul crystals and ink, but I am still wondering if its possible to make a powerstone.

PhaedrusXY you said only plant stuff? Is this true?
PhaedrusXY
11-17-07, 01:02 AM SRD: http://www.d20srd.org/Minor Creation, Psionic
Metacreativity (Creation)
Level: Shaper 1
Display: Material
Manifesting Time: 1 minute
Range: 0 ft.
Effect: Unattended, nonpsionic, nonmagical object of nonliving plant matter, up to 1 cu. ft./level
Duration: 1 hour/level (D)
Saving Throw: None
Power Resistance: No
Power Points: 1

As the minor creation spell, except as noted here.
InkBlot
11-17-07, 03:30 AM So I am still wondering if minor creation can make power stones? In the 1001 uses thread people are saying soul crystals and ink, but I am still wondering if its possible to make a powerstone.
Ink can be made from plants. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ink#History_of_ink)

Soul crystal is a psionic power which creates a special crystal. This special crystal can store one power, which can then be used once by anyone as a standard action. Nobody was saying you could make soul crystals using minor creation. We said that storing minor creation in a soul crystal is a good idea.
Lycanthromancer
11-20-07, 06:43 PM I suppose if hardened amber is considered crystalline, you could use that (but only if the DM says so).

There are various plant-based compounds that are crystalline in nature. You could use those, maybe?
Lokiyn
11-20-07, 08:03 PM As a Side note, Major creation could be used to make Fulminating Gold (Gold Hydrazide [AuHNNH2])

While i'm having a pain of a time finding the energy release amount for it, its described as being almost lethal in a Half Ounce amount, its silver counterpart, for example is used in fireworks snaps, those contain only a few milligrams. Multiply that by a thousand or so for a gram, or by tens of thousands for cubic feet of the stuff. The stuff isn't that hard to make, its just a pain to purify. While i don't doubt i could (for example) make the stuff in my kitchen, i like being alive too much.

Gold Hydrazide is a High Explosive that explodes with any percussive strike or heat. However, until i can find and compare its explosive power to blackpowder i don't have any real numbers for in game damage.

however if it was as strong as say, black powder, then a pound of it would do about 2d6, and each cubic foot would be about say ~900-1,200 pounds~......

Hmm i really need to do a little more research into this so i can build my gnome that kills people with exploding coins.
CryoSilver
11-20-07, 08:52 PM Minor creation could be used to make some kinds of coal, which is mostly carbon, which in theory could be compressed into diamond (which is kind of like crystal). Good luck compressing it enough, but it's probably possible.
TheKeyofE
11-21-07, 02:08 PM Minor creation could be used to make some kinds of coal, which is mostly carbon, which in theory could be compressed into diamond (which is kind of like crystal). Good luck compressing it enough, but it's probably possible.

If you're going to do that, just sell the diamonds and buy as many power stones as you want.
ToastedAmphibian
11-21-07, 07:13 PM Power Sugar Cube?
Pop Rocks?
heavenisme
11-24-07, 07:05 AM So what would a creation power look like that allowed you to make the basic minor creation stuff not just plant material? Like a sword or a quartz or even some sand? Minor effects that could help you in a jam like mud in someones eye..... I guess the psionic equalivelent of prestidigitation & minor creation, that could in essence also make material components for the party's wizard or your powerstones.
Lycanthromancer
11-24-07, 12:28 PM You mean psionic major creation?
CryoSilver
11-24-07, 12:36 PM If you're going to do that, just sell the diamonds and buy as many power stones as you want.

Fine, make it all "sensible" and "efficient." Psh, you're no fun.
Lokiyn
11-24-07, 01:31 PM I think you might be unclear on exactly how creation powers/spells work

Firstly, No creation power makes permenent materials unless the spell is instantaneous that means that no material created through these spells, even the trinkets from prestidigitation are not useable for material components.

Secondly, General creation powers/spells (Minor/Major/True) take a long time to cast/manifest and are generally unuseable in combat, if you want to summon a sword or cast a spray of dirt into someones face, there are specific powers or spells to do this, maybe not in quite the same way, but with the same result.

Finally there is not need to produce stones for imprint stone or any other materials.

The Gold piece cost for items is unavoidable, the actual item to be enchanted is a pittance compared to the rest of the (un declared) reagents.

Crystal and common stone are, as you can imagine, a trivial material to aquire in D&D.

Prehaps i'm simply misunderstanding the thrust of your posts. It would seem to me that since minor creation is explicitly denied the ability to create enhanted items that the concept of conjureing powerstones would die aborning.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
heavenisme 11-14-07, 11:51 AM	Hello there D&D fans... I am wondering if I can forgo the material components cost of making power stones, and just pay the xp cost. I have these powers that can make stuff, so shouldn't I be able to make power stones instead of going to the market? If you can make poision you should be able to make crafting materials. Here's what I have: Imprint Stone Minor Creation, Psionic Fabricate, Psionic
PhaedrusXY 11-14-07, 12:33 PM	Minor Creation can only make plant-based materials. Stones are not plant-based. Even if they were, the stuff made with Minor Creation is only temporary. Fabricate would just let you turn one thing into another, so you'd still need the materials to start with. So no, I don't think you can bypass the material requirement.
InkBlot 11-15-07, 01:55 PM	You could certainly use fabricate to help you obtain the proper materials. For instance, if you find a cave with natural crystal deposits then you can use fabricate to turn the geodes in the wall into a pile of thumb-sized crystals ready to be imprinted. It still takes the same amount of time and XP. It still takes the same amount of gold, since you could have sold those crystals instead.
AntiDjinn 11-15-07, 06:40 PM	As noted, you should be able to use Fabricate to do the work of mining the crystal and converting it into chunks of the appropriate size. If the mineral rights at that site are claimed by someone else, then what you are effectively doing is stealing the material (and its attendant cost) instead of paying for it. Whatever, the power stone you craft will still work the same whether you bought the material, mined it, or filched it out of someone's pocket. The crystal itself is not the only material cost, however, the character is probably dunking the rock in a variety of reagents, using a tuning fork to test its resonance, and maybe smoking some exotic herbs to achieve the proper state of mind. In any case, making an empowered item always costs character resources. XP is the most important expense, material cost is another. If you spend time using powers to bypass the cost, then you are just substituting a different character resource: Time. If you spend, for example, two days of character-time fabricating materials on the cheap, it may seem like you have saved a bundle. But consider how much loot a PC can haul out of a dungeon in two days. Consider how much you can earn in 48 hours of tomb robbing, wizard's tower burglary, or simple slaughter and looting. The amount a PC can make in a given time period is nearly absurd compared to what a townie with a day job (like the guy who is selling you your raw crystal supplies) can make. You may find that your loss due to pillaging down time far exceeds what you save in gold. Not to mention the XP you could be earning by adventuring when you are trying to cut corners on costs.
heavenisme 11-17-07, 12:51 AM	So I am still wondering if minor creation can make power stones? In the 1001 uses thread people are saying soul crystals and ink, but I am still wondering if its possible to make a powerstone. PhaedrusXY you said only plant stuff? Is this true?
PhaedrusXY 11-17-07, 01:02 AM	SRD: http://www.d20srd.org/Minor Creation, Psionic Metacreativity (Creation) Level: Shaper 1 Display: Material Manifesting Time: 1 minute Range: 0 ft. Effect: Unattended, nonpsionic, nonmagical object of nonliving plant matter, up to 1 cu. ft./level Duration: 1 hour/level (D) Saving Throw: None Power Resistance: No Power Points: 1 As the minor creation spell, except as noted here.
InkBlot 11-17-07, 03:30 AM	So I am still wondering if minor creation can make power stones? In the 1001 uses thread people are saying soul crystals and ink, but I am still wondering if its possible to make a powerstone. Ink can be made from plants. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ink#History_of_ink) Soul crystal is a psionic power which creates a special crystal. This special crystal can store one power, which can then be used once by anyone as a standard action. Nobody was saying you could make soul crystals using minor creation. We said that storing minor creation in a soul crystal is a good idea.
Lycanthromancer 11-20-07, 06:43 PM	I suppose if hardened amber is considered crystalline, you could use that (but only if the DM says so). There are various plant-based compounds that are crystalline in nature. You could use those, maybe?
Lokiyn 11-20-07, 08:03 PM	As a Side note, Major creation could be used to make Fulminating Gold (Gold Hydrazide [AuHNNH2]) While i'm having a pain of a time finding the energy release amount for it, its described as being almost lethal in a Half Ounce amount, its silver counterpart, for example is used in fireworks snaps, those contain only a few milligrams. Multiply that by a thousand or so for a gram, or by tens of thousands for cubic feet of the stuff. The stuff isn't that hard to make, its just a pain to purify. While i don't doubt i could (for example) make the stuff in my kitchen, i like being alive too much. Gold Hydrazide is a High Explosive that explodes with any percussive strike or heat. However, until i can find and compare its explosive power to blackpowder i don't have any real numbers for in game damage. however if it was as strong as say, black powder, then a pound of it would do about 2d6, and each cubic foot would be about say ~900-1,200 pounds~...... Hmm i really need to do a little more research into this so i can build my gnome that kills people with exploding coins.
CryoSilver 11-20-07, 08:52 PM	Minor creation could be used to make some kinds of coal, which is mostly carbon, which in theory could be compressed into diamond (which is kind of like crystal). Good luck compressing it enough, but it's probably possible.
TheKeyofE 11-21-07, 02:08 PM	Minor creation could be used to make some kinds of coal, which is mostly carbon, which in theory could be compressed into diamond (which is kind of like crystal). Good luck compressing it enough, but it's probably possible. If you're going to do that, just sell the diamonds and buy as many power stones as you want.
ToastedAmphibian 11-21-07, 07:13 PM	Power Sugar Cube? Pop Rocks?
heavenisme 11-24-07, 07:05 AM	So what would a creation power look like that allowed you to make the basic minor creation stuff not just plant material? Like a sword or a quartz or even some sand? Minor effects that could help you in a jam like mud in someones eye..... I guess the psionic equalivelent of prestidigitation & minor creation, that could in essence also make material components for the party's wizard or your powerstones.
Lycanthromancer 11-24-07, 12:28 PM	You mean psionic major creation?
CryoSilver 11-24-07, 12:36 PM	If you're going to do that, just sell the diamonds and buy as many power stones as you want. Fine, make it all "sensible" and "efficient." Psh, you're no fun.
Lokiyn 11-24-07, 01:31 PM	I think you might be unclear on exactly how creation powers/spells work Firstly, No creation power makes permenent materials unless the spell is instantaneous that means that no material created through these spells, even the trinkets from prestidigitation are not useable for material components. Secondly, General creation powers/spells (Minor/Major/True) take a long time to cast/manifest and are generally unuseable in combat, if you want to summon a sword or cast a spray of dirt into someones face, there are specific powers or spells to do this, maybe not in quite the same way, but with the same result. Finally there is not need to produce stones for imprint stone or any other materials. The Gold piece cost for items is unavoidable, the actual item to be enchanted is a pittance compared to the rest of the (un declared) reagents. Crystal and common stone are, as you can imagine, a trivial material to aquire in D&D. Prehaps i'm simply misunderstanding the thrust of your posts. It would seem to me that since minor creation is explicitly denied the ability to create enhanted items that the concept of conjureing powerstones would die aborning.