movement with `concealing amorpha' [Archive] - Wizards Community

movement with `concealing amorpha' [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
pxacrake
03-09-08, 08:25 AM I know this has been discussed previously, but the conclusions were unclear. The stat's say "range 0ft" and "centered on you" so if you activate this power then move, does the membrane move with you ?

Drew
The_Ditto
03-09-08, 09:58 AM I know this has been discussed previously, but the conclusions were unclear. The stat's say "range 0ft" and "centered on you" so if you activate this power then move, does the membrane move with you ?

Drew

Typos and poor editing aside ... this power is way too similar to Displacement to be a coincidence ... how does Displacement work?

I suspect both should be (if not already) personal effects ... but not sure about the official word on this ...
AntiDjinn
03-09-08, 06:22 PM Range has nothing to do with mobility; Astral Construct has a range and it is not rooted to the spot where it was manifest. Centered on you means you are the origin of the effect, unless it specifies the effect is immobile or unless it has a duration of concentration (which can affect how fast and far you can move) then you can move normally and the effect stays centered on you.
pxacrake
03-12-08, 08:15 PM Any more opinions ?

Some feel movement is possible, some don't

I've asked `sage advice' on the wizards.com homepage.

They have answered my query but I can't figure out how to access the answer.

(next to the record of my question it just says "solved")

Drew
Lycanthromancer
03-12-08, 10:08 PM The power description doesn't say that the effect is stationary, isn't instantaneous, and it says it encases your form, so it moves with you.
dpmoran
03-13-08, 07:01 AM I kind of agree with The_Ditto in that it is basically psionic displacement yet badly written. My problem is that as it is not an illusion, it foils true seeing. It creates actual ectoplasmic concealment.

Secondly, while I agree with AntiDjinn that movement and range are not equal but why did the writers put range 0ft instead of personal? What is the difference between 'personal' and '0'?

Could it be that to minimise the power's power the writers allowed it to foil true seeing but not allow it to move as the 'ectoplasm' manifests over the person and 'falls off' if they move?

I think the simplest answer is to allow true seeing to foil GCA and change its range to personal.

That's my two cents for what it's worth.
AntiDjinn
03-13-08, 03:27 PM Personal powers affect you. Concealing Amorpha does not. It creates an effect that appears around you, but does not have an effect on you. Look at the Silence spell; even if you center it on yourself it does not change to Range: Personal.
dpmoran
03-17-08, 07:35 AM Ok so I see the difference between personal and 0. Thanks AntiDjinn.

Nevertheless does this power seem a little unbalanced as it provides total concealment (unlike Displacement) and therefore you cannot target the psychic warrior and no attacks of opportunity are provoked by said psychic warrior?

And finally, it foils True Seeing?

Or am I just being picky?
The_Mess
03-17-08, 10:29 AM Does that mean you can create the amphora, step out of it, and let someone else step into it?
Lycanthromancer
03-17-08, 02:09 PM Concealing amorpha provides partial concealment, which is a mere 20% miss chance.

Greater concealing amorpha provides total concealment, but is higher level, shaper and psywar only, and lasts for very little time.

It's not nearly as good as some of the things that a wizard or cleric gets, such as invisibility, and even sanctuary in some ways.

It's nice, but not nearly as overpowered as you might think, as you can still aim into the shaper/psywar's space or hit him with an AoE.

As for letting someone else use it, no. It follows you where e'er you go.
CrimsonDeath
03-17-08, 03:40 PM Hmm... I don't suppose you'd be able to manifest it on someone who's sharing a square with you (or even crawling on you, for creatures that are small enough).
Lycanthromancer
03-17-08, 04:08 PM Probably not, since it's centered on you.

Also, invisibility grants full concealment, and makes the creature visually undetectable. The only benefits that greater concealing amorpha grant above and beyond this is A.) the ability to attack and not end the effect, and B.) it's immune to true seeing. Invisibility has a lot of other benefits that are, strictly-speaking, better than greater concealing amorpha, especially once you get greater invisibility.

Invisibility definitely comes out on top in a great many areas. Seriously. And it's only level 2.
InkBlot
03-17-08, 04:32 PM Does that mean you can create the amphora, step out of it, and let someone else step into it?

Like Eurystheus?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b5/Anforagrega-atenas.jpg
TheKeyofE
03-17-08, 05:26 PM http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m72/thekeyofe/Motivational/motivator5926140.jpg
CrimsonDeath
03-17-08, 07:37 PM http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m72/thekeyofe/Motivational/motivator5926140.jpg

Our PsyWar's player said this for months. And he knew what an amphora was. He thought his character was making an ectoplasmic jar around himself.
InkBlot
03-17-08, 08:08 PM My first psion character (actually a monk14/psion5/crusader1) could manifest concealing amorpha, and the DM consistantly called it concealing amphora even after telling him (on multiple seperate occasions) that it was concealing amorpha. Even after explaining, in detail, the differences between an amphora and an amorpha. Amphora is my rouge due to him, I guess.

Sorry for making a big deal out of it.

Nice motivator!

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
pxacrake 03-09-08, 08:25 AM	I know this has been discussed previously, but the conclusions were unclear. The stat's say "range 0ft" and "centered on you" so if you activate this power then move, does the membrane move with you ? Drew
The_Ditto 03-09-08, 09:58 AM	I know this has been discussed previously, but the conclusions were unclear. The stat's say "range 0ft" and "centered on you" so if you activate this power then move, does the membrane move with you ? Drew Typos and poor editing aside ... this power is way too similar to Displacement to be a coincidence ... how does Displacement work? I suspect both should be (if not already) personal effects ... but not sure about the official word on this ...
AntiDjinn 03-09-08, 06:22 PM	Range has nothing to do with mobility; Astral Construct has a range and it is not rooted to the spot where it was manifest. Centered on you means you are the origin of the effect, unless it specifies the effect is immobile or unless it has a duration of concentration (which can affect how fast and far you can move) then you can move normally and the effect stays centered on you.
pxacrake 03-12-08, 08:15 PM	Any more opinions ? Some feel movement is possible, some don't I've asked `sage advice' on the wizards.com homepage. They have answered my query but I can't figure out how to access the answer. (next to the record of my question it just says "solved") Drew
Lycanthromancer 03-12-08, 10:08 PM	The power description doesn't say that the effect is stationary, isn't instantaneous, and it says it encases your form, so it moves with you.
dpmoran 03-13-08, 07:01 AM	I kind of agree with The_Ditto in that it is basically psionic displacement yet badly written. My problem is that as it is not an illusion, it foils true seeing. It creates actual ectoplasmic concealment. Secondly, while I agree with AntiDjinn that movement and range are not equal but why did the writers put range 0ft instead of personal? What is the difference between 'personal' and '0'? Could it be that to minimise the power's power the writers allowed it to foil true seeing but not allow it to move as the 'ectoplasm' manifests over the person and 'falls off' if they move? I think the simplest answer is to allow true seeing to foil GCA and change its range to personal. That's my two cents for what it's worth.
AntiDjinn 03-13-08, 03:27 PM	Personal powers affect you. Concealing Amorpha does not. It creates an effect that appears around you, but does not have an effect on you. Look at the Silence spell; even if you center it on yourself it does not change to Range: Personal.
dpmoran 03-17-08, 07:35 AM	Ok so I see the difference between personal and 0. Thanks AntiDjinn. Nevertheless does this power seem a little unbalanced as it provides total concealment (unlike Displacement) and therefore you cannot target the psychic warrior and no attacks of opportunity are provoked by said psychic warrior? And finally, it foils True Seeing? Or am I just being picky?
The_Mess 03-17-08, 10:29 AM	Does that mean you can create the amphora, step out of it, and let someone else step into it?
Lycanthromancer 03-17-08, 02:09 PM	Concealing amorpha provides partial concealment, which is a mere 20% miss chance. Greater concealing amorpha provides total concealment, but is higher level, shaper and psywar only, and lasts for very little time. It's not nearly as good as some of the things that a wizard or cleric gets, such as invisibility, and even sanctuary in some ways. It's nice, but not nearly as overpowered as you might think, as you can still aim into the shaper/psywar's space or hit him with an AoE. As for letting someone else use it, no. It follows you where e'er you go.
CrimsonDeath 03-17-08, 03:40 PM	Hmm... I don't suppose you'd be able to manifest it on someone who's sharing a square with you (or even crawling on you, for creatures that are small enough).
Lycanthromancer 03-17-08, 04:08 PM	Probably not, since it's centered on you. Also, invisibility grants full concealment, and makes the creature visually undetectable. The only benefits that greater concealing amorpha grant above and beyond this is A.) the ability to attack and not end the effect, and B.) it's immune to true seeing. Invisibility has a lot of other benefits that are, strictly-speaking, better than greater concealing amorpha, especially once you get greater invisibility. Invisibility definitely comes out on top in a great many areas. Seriously. And it's only level 2.
InkBlot 03-17-08, 04:32 PM	Does that mean you can create the amphora, step out of it, and let someone else step into it? Like Eurystheus? http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b5/Anforagrega-atenas.jpg
TheKeyofE 03-17-08, 05:26 PM	http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m72/thekeyofe/Motivational/motivator5926140.jpg
CrimsonDeath 03-17-08, 07:37 PM	http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m72/thekeyofe/Motivational/motivator5926140.jpg Our PsyWar's player said this for months. And he knew what an amphora was. He thought his character was making an ectoplasmic jar around himself.
InkBlot 03-17-08, 08:08 PM	My first psion character (actually a monk14/psion5/crusader1) could manifest concealing amorpha, and the DM consistantly called it concealing amphora even after telling him (on multiple seperate occasions) that it was concealing amorpha. Even after explaining, in detail, the differences between an amphora and an amorpha. Amphora is my rouge due to him, I guess. Sorry for making a big deal out of it. Nice motivator!