Psi Warrior Tank [Archive] - Wizards Community

Psi Warrior Tank [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Flash10
05-04-07, 02:17 PM So my old DND group got together to do a DND Draft last weekend. (Yes, football, beer and DND do go well together!) ;-)

The basic gist was Good (mostly humans) vs. Evil (undead, Trolls and whatnot) at Lvl 10 characters. Basically, one big fight club!

Half of the characters were pregenerated to speed up time. With each player allowed to customize Feats, Gear, Spells and 25,000 g.p. worth of magical stuff.

Needless to say the Good guys got trounced! Mostly by the Troll Barbarian with (smartly!) protection from fire!!!

I ended playing a Human Fighter 5/Psi War 5 with a Greater Psionic Weapon Holy Greatsword (that's 8d6+ to our evil adversaries once a round). Unfortunately, still not enough.

Anyways, looking back on the fight, we had horrible ACs. So this got me to thinking about a straight up (level 10) Psi Warrior and how much AC I could pack into this tank.

So I'm looking for some ideas. Magical Armor and Shield definitely come to mind. Thought about Dodge and Psionic Dodge (not sure if it's worth two feats for a +2 AC). Precog Defensive seems a must choice for a +4 AC for 10 PP. As well as Greater Condealing Amorpha in actual combat.

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated. I know I don't know all the bonus stacking rules, so I'm looking for some help to make a character with the only idea behind him is high AC/not getting hit in melee combat.
InkBlot
05-04-07, 02:31 PM Stacking is easy.

Numerical bonuses that have a name -- e.g. "+1 insight bonus to AC" -- don't stack with other bonuses that have the same name. The only exception is dodge bonuses. Dodge bonuses always stack, unless they are from the same source (see below).

Multiple numerical bonuses from the same source do not stack. E.g., if you manifest an unaugmented defensive precognition twice you will only get a +1 insight bonus to AC -- not a +2.

Numerical bonuses which are not named always stack, unless they are from the same source (see above). For example, the freedom mantle in CPsi gives you a +10 bonus to speed, and the feat Speed Of Thought gives you a +10 insight bonus to speed. Because the freedom mantle's bonus is unnamed, it stacks with Speed Of Thought. If your base speed was 30, your new speed is 50.

On tanking: A good way not to get hit is to have reach, and the feat Stand Still. The power extend reach from CPsi, and the power expansion from the Expanded Psionics Handbook, are both very good for increasing reach. They also stack (so if you use expansion to become large, and then manifest extend reach, you will have 15 feet of reach). Be sure to read the errata for the expansion power, if you haven't already.

Damage reduction is a very good thing to have while tanking. The 1st level power biofeedback can give you a good amount of DR/-.

Strength of my enemy is one of the best powers a psychic warrior can have. Every strike makes it harder for the enemy to hit you, and lets you hit the enemy harder.
Nephlite
05-04-07, 03:03 PM So my old DND group got together to do a DND Draft last weekend. (Yes, football, beer and DND do go well together!) ;-)

The basic gist was Good (mostly humans) vs. Evil (undead, Trolls and whatnot) at Lvl 10 characters. Basically, one big fight club!

Half of the characters were pregenerated to speed up time. With each player allowed to customize Feats, Gear, Spells and 25,000 g.p. worth of magical stuff.

Needless to say the Good guys got trounced! Mostly by the Troll Barbarian with (smartly!) protection from fire!!!

I ended playing a Human Fighter 5/Psi War 5 with a Greater Psionic Weapon Holy Greatsword (that's 8d6+ to our evil adversaries once a round). Unfortunately, still not enough.

Anyways, looking back on the fight, we had horrible ACs. So this got me to thinking about a straight up (level 10) Psi Warrior and how much AC I could pack into this tank.

So I'm looking for some ideas. Magical Armor and Shield definitely come to mind. Thought about Dodge and Psionic Dodge (not sure if it's worth two feats for a +2 AC). Precog Defensive seems a must choice for a +4 AC for 10 PP. As well as Greater Condealing Amorpha in actual combat.

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated. I know I don't know all the bonus stacking rules, so I'm looking for some help to make a character with the only idea behind him is high AC/not getting hit in melee combat.

Well: 25 k? That is 1/2 the normal starting gold of a 10th level character: No wonder you guys lost. The game assumes for CR's sake that you have sxtahdard gear.

You should lower the challenges if less gear or game thinks you want a TPK.
So you guys did fine for how poor you guys were.

A Great rule of thumb to judge what is best AC you'll need for tyour level is 15 + level*1.5.
In your case 15 +15=30 AC is the most you'll need or you'll be hit more often than not.

Are you able to craft these yourself (saves a huge amount of money but might lose a level in exchange because of Exp costs).

i'll assume you bought not crafted these:

If you have Mithral Full plate (assuming decent dex) that costs 10k.
If you have low Dex than skip that and go +2 full plate for 5, 800 gp giving 10AC +1 dex bonus: total=11 possible.

Than assumming 2 handed sword: +1 animated Heavy shield for +3 AC for about 9000.
So far we reached: +14. AC great for level 7 or 8, but low for 10.

So we could get a +2 Amulet of natural armor: +2 AC for 8 k.
Giving us +16 AC. AC 26 so good for level 8 or 9 but not good for level 10.

Spent so far: 9+ 5.8 + 8=22.8 K. We have only 2.2 K left.

However, you can always use Precog Defense in battle for +4 AC: upping you to 30AC. However, PP useage should be rationed if more than 1 fight/day (and usually there is).
Plus we need a +1 weapon too :D.

So yeah, we can do it but hard.
Flash10
05-05-07, 07:22 PM Wow! Awesome ideas. Never even considered the Stand Still and Reach options. Definitely worth investing into!

Also hadn't thought of the Mithral Full Plate +1 either. And yes, Dex is 16, so it works out perfectly! Also going for a heavy sheild +3.

So my next question is, would Precog Defense and Mental Barrier stack with the above items? [Do precog def and mental barrier stack even (I'm guessing yes, because one is a deflection bonus while the other is an insight bonus right)?]
Bacris
05-05-07, 07:58 PM So my next question is, would Precog Defense and Mental Barrier stack with the above items? [Do precog def and mental barrier stack even (I'm guessing yes, because one is a deflection bonus while the other is an insight bonus right)?]

Yes and yes. So far, you have armor, shield, natural, and dex to AC. Insight and Deflection would stack.
Nom
05-07-07, 09:32 AM Miscellaneous dumb question: How does one squeeze a troll (6 HD, +5 LA) barbarian (at least 1 HD) into a level 10 cap? It's a minimum ECL 12.
starfire311
05-07-07, 09:39 AM Miscellaneous dumb question: How does one squeeze a troll (6 HD, +5 LA) barbarian (at least 1 HD) into a level 10 cap? It's a minimum ECL 12.

I figured they were not using LA, and it was probably a 4th level barbarian troll, and thus really a 15th level character, no wonder he kicked butt.
RobbyPants
05-07-07, 02:10 PM I ended playing a Human Fighter 5/Psi War 5 with a Greater Psionic Weapon Holy Greatsword (that's 8d6+ to our evil adversaries once a round). Unfortunately, still not enough.
Why fighter 5? That's about the deadest (I made a new word! :P) of the dead levels. Don't 6th level psycic warriors qualify for Weapon Specialization (or was that just 3.0)? If so, there's little reason to take more than two levels of fighter.
CrimsonDeath
05-07-07, 06:34 PM Unlike ToB classes, 3.5 PsyWars do not get Weapon Specialization, although I am in at least one game that allows them to qualify for it at level 8.
primemover003
05-07-07, 10:29 PM Currently my Human PsyWar 11 can get a 42 AC with a little planning.

Before Buffing AC 34, t 20, ff 24
+8 Armor (Celestial Chainmail)
+5 Dex 20 (18 + Gloves +2)
+5 Shield (Dragonhide Buckler +3 & Shield Specialization)
+5 Dodge (Combat Expertise)
+1 Natural (amulet +1)

Buffing 4 rounds
+4 Insight (Precog, Defense for 10pp)
+1 Haste (Boots of Speed)
+2 Deflection (Potion Shield of Faith +2)
+1 Dex (Cat's Grace)

total AC 42, t 28, ff 27 and 50% miss chance Greater Concealing Amorpha

And I don't even have Dodge or Psionic Dodge!!!
Vharuck
05-07-07, 10:58 PM Though they have medium BAB progression, it's best to stick with PsyWar the whole time (unless you go into a good PrC). You'll more than make up for it with better tactical options and the ability to buff your abilities to equal that fighter's BAB (you get less attacks on a full attack, but your standard attacks should hit harder and they happen more often).
Lycanthromancer
05-08-07, 09:31 PM Metamorphosis, definitely. And if you can Metamorphosis your psicrystal as well, all the better. EVERYBODY GO HYDRA! WOO! That's a helluvalotuvattacks, there.
Flash10
05-09-07, 11:32 AM Miscellaneous dumb question: How does one squeeze a troll (6 HD, +5 LA) barbarian (at least 1 HD) into a level 10 cap? It's a minimum ECL 12.

We had an extra player on our team (odd number of guys), so I think the DM let it slide.
Flash10
05-09-07, 11:41 AM Though they have medium BAB progression, it's best to stick with PsyWar the whole time (unless you go into a good PrC). You'll more than make up for it with better tactical options and the ability to buff your abilities to equal that fighter's BAB (you get less attacks on a full attack, but your standard attacks should hit harder and they happen more often).

I came to the same conclusion after this whole encounter.

So I was compairing a straight lvl 10 Fighter to a 10 Psi Warrior.... why would anyone want to play a plain fighter? If the two went toe to toe, wouldn't a Psi Warrior always win? His buffs are awesome. Sure he has a d8 for HP, but that doesn't seem a big difference if ya ask me. BAB is a little better with a fighter, but with buffs, PsiWar is better. Just wondering....
Nephlite
05-09-07, 11:51 AM I came to the same conclusion after this whole encounter.

So I was compairing a straight lvl 10 Fighter to a 10 Psi Warrior.... why would anyone want to play a plain fighter? If the two went toe to toe, wouldn't a Psi Warrior always win? His buffs are awesome. Sure he has a d8 for HP, but that doesn't seem a big difference if ya ask me. BAB is a little better with a fighter, but with buffs, PsiWar is better. Just wondering....

Fighters require expert planning (more so than wizards when preparing spells/day).
They are not beginner classes: which is funny because they are the Core warrior PC class.

Fighter has more tricks than the Psi-Warr and the Psi-warr can run out of PP in 4 encounters/day. The Fighter could in theory still be stronger (except that some powers have long durations).
PhaedrusXY
05-09-07, 12:00 PM So I was compairing a straight lvl 10 Fighter to a 10 Psi Warrior.... why would anyone want to play a plain fighter?If you actually have the recommended 4 encounters per day, the psiwarrior will either be hurting badly for (or out of) power points by the end, or he'll have to be very conservative with them. That makes them about equal, as far as combat ability, on average. Of course, the psiwarrior has alot more options, and can burn all his power points on a single encounter to be signifigantly better than the fighter, if he needs to. So yeah, overall I think they are better than fighters. But fighters are arguably the weakest class in the core rules at all but the lowest levels of the game.
Nom
05-09-07, 08:43 PM We had an extra player on our team (odd number of guys), so I think the DM let it slide.Don't forget the D&D rule of thumb that 2 levels approximately equals 2 characters. Thus, if this guy was Barb 1 (ECL 12) then he's about equal to 2 PCs. If he was Barb 5 or 6 then he theoretically is equal to your entire party.

Note that if all you are fighting is fully-rested encounters this invalidates several balancing assumptions. It powers up anything with per/day expendable resources (notably spellcasters), since they don't need to worry about conserving power. Further, you might want to use CR rather than LA (or an average of the two) for monster creatures, since LA weights heavily against abilities that are relatively weak in a single encounter but powerful when useable over and over again.
RLRapp
05-10-07, 04:31 AM Fun trick with Hustle power if in contact with enemy, Take full attack, activate hustle, take move away from opponent. Also remember, a trolls regen is no help if his Con is reduced to 0 (prevenom wpn, truevenom wpn).
Rageheart
05-10-07, 01:28 PM Fun trick with Hustle power if in contact with enemy, Take full attack, activate hustle (Provoking AoO), take move away from opponent.

Emphasis mine.
InkBlot
05-10-07, 02:34 PM He would provoke for moving out of the enemy's threatened area, but not for manifesting hustle. Swift action powers never provoke (XPH, p59, "Manifesting a power with a manifesting time of 1 swift action does not provoke attacks of opportunity").
Rageheart
05-10-07, 02:46 PM REALLY?! (looks it up) ...that is very cool!

My mistake, nothing to see here... Move along. :D
CrimsonDeath
05-10-07, 04:15 PM Fun trick with Hustle power if in contact with enemy, Take full attack, activate hustle, take move away from opponent. Also remember, a trolls regen is no help if his Con is reduced to 0 (prevenom wpn, truevenom wpn).
The troll's Fort save might be a problem... Not to mention that you have a lot of Con to go through.
WyvernSlayer
05-31-07, 07:15 AM Without any magic items at all you could easily grab a 40 AC using a few powers and 4 feats, at 10th level PW.

Take Exotic Armor Proficiency: Dwarven Battleplate. Use the Variant to lose Tower Shields for Extreme Shields.
Take Heavy Armor Optimization Line. Bonus to armor and increase in Max Dex iirc, don't have my books on me.
Take Shield Specialization. +1 shields.

You get 10+3 Dex+11 Armor+4Shield= 28 AC

Thicken Skin for 10 PP = +4 Natural armor.
Defensive Precognition for 10 PP= +4 Insight to AC and saves.
Mental Barrier (stretch 8P)= +4 Deflection

This doesn't count any:
Mithril for armor for better Dex.
Magic Armor Bonuses
Magic Shield Bonuses
Dodge Bonuses, etc etc.

You have 25k Gold to spend, enjoy!
The_Ditto
05-31-07, 08:11 AM Fun trick with Hustle power if in contact with enemy, Take full attack, activate hustle, take move away from opponent. Also remember, a trolls regen is no help if his Con is reduced to 0 (prevenom wpn, truevenom wpn).

You'd have an easier time bringing the troll down using Ego Whip, then with poison ... ;)
Moosh Nailo
05-31-07, 09:04 PM There is a feat in CPsi, Focused Shield, that increases your shield's AC bonus by one.
starfire311
05-31-07, 10:35 PM Take Heavy Armor Optimization Line. Bonus to armor and increase in Max Dex

Heavy armor optimization does not increase max dex, niether do any feats that have heavy armor optimization as a prereq. AFAIK.

Feats to look at would be shield ward + deflective armor, allow you to add shield and armor bonus to touch AC.
Tyroki
06-01-07, 12:36 AM What about inertial armor? Or doesn't that stack with physical armor?
Vharuck
06-01-07, 12:52 AM What about inertial armor? Or doesn't that stack with physical armor?

Same named bonuses, in this case "armor," do not stack unless otherwise noted (basically just dodge stacks).
Tyroki
06-01-07, 12:53 AM So you can't use Leather Armor and the power Inertial Armor together to get more AC? O.o Meaning to use Inertial Armor, you can't wear any armor at all?!
InkBlot
06-01-07, 04:14 AM You can still wear armor and use inertial armor. It just doesn't give you any extra protection. All the places on your body that leather armor covers are already covered by inertial armor, and then some.
Tyroki
06-01-07, 07:11 PM I see. So if you're wearing basic Leather Armor that grants 2 AC, and you use Inertial Armor (None-augmented) which gives +4, then you're only getting a 2 bonus from Inertial Armor, giving you only 4 armor all up?
Vharuck
06-01-07, 07:22 PM I see. So if you're wearing basic Leather Armor that grants 2 AC, and you use Inertial Armor (None-augmented) which gives +4, then you're only getting a 2 bonus from Inertial Armor, giving you only 4 armor all up?

Actually, the Inertial Armor, being the higher bonus of that type, is the only source of your armor bonus. All 4 of the bonus points are from the inertial armor; should the power not work (most likely its duration expires), the leather armor will now be the only armor bonus and then counts.
Fafnir
06-01-07, 07:44 PM I see. So if you're wearing basic Leather Armor that grants 2 AC, and you use Inertial Armor (None-augmented) which gives +4, then you're only getting a 2 bonus from Inertial Armor, giving you only 4 armor all up?

You get the greater of the two, i.e. +4 from Inertial Armor.

Now if it was a Full Plate (AC+8) and Inertial Armor (AC+4), you'd get +8... except against incorporeal attacks, which ignore physical armor but not [Force] effects. You'd get +4 (from IA) against those.
primemover003
06-01-07, 07:52 PM There is a feat in CPsi, Focused Shield, that increases your shield's AC bonus by one.
If you're gonna blow a feat for +1 Shield bonus get Shield Specialization from PHBII. Then take Shield Ward and add your Shield bonus to your Touch AC and Trip/Bullrush checks (to resist).

Or take Parrying Shield from LoM for one feat to get the Shield bonus to touch attacks only.
Lycanthromancer
06-02-07, 01:22 PM Wearing armor can still be a good idea, even against corporeal foes.

Get a +1 suit of leather armor, enhanced with all sorts of nifty special abilities, then manifest inertial armor. You'll have a decent AC, AND you'll get lots of special abilities. If you get dispelled, you get zapped with a null psionics field, or your duration expires unexpectedly, then you'll still have a higher AC than if you were naked (though there is something to be said for being naked - it just doesn't have much to do with your AC; touch attacks are another matter altogether).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Flash10 05-04-07, 02:17 PM	So my old DND group got together to do a DND Draft last weekend. (Yes, football, beer and DND do go well together!) ;-) The basic gist was Good (mostly humans) vs. Evil (undead, Trolls and whatnot) at Lvl 10 characters. Basically, one big fight club! Half of the characters were pregenerated to speed up time. With each player allowed to customize Feats, Gear, Spells and 25,000 g.p. worth of magical stuff. Needless to say the Good guys got trounced! Mostly by the Troll Barbarian with (smartly!) protection from fire!!! I ended playing a Human Fighter 5/Psi War 5 with a Greater Psionic Weapon Holy Greatsword (that's 8d6+ to our evil adversaries once a round). Unfortunately, still not enough. Anyways, looking back on the fight, we had horrible ACs. So this got me to thinking about a straight up (level 10) Psi Warrior and how much AC I could pack into this tank. So I'm looking for some ideas. Magical Armor and Shield definitely come to mind. Thought about Dodge and Psionic Dodge (not sure if it's worth two feats for a +2 AC). Precog Defensive seems a must choice for a +4 AC for 10 PP. As well as Greater Condealing Amorpha in actual combat. Any ideas would be greatly appreciated. I know I don't know all the bonus stacking rules, so I'm looking for some help to make a character with the only idea behind him is high AC/not getting hit in melee combat.
InkBlot 05-04-07, 02:31 PM	Stacking is easy. Numerical bonuses that have a name -- e.g. "+1 insight bonus to AC" -- don't stack with other bonuses that have the same name. The only exception is dodge bonuses. Dodge bonuses always stack, unless they are from the same source (see below). Multiple numerical bonuses from the same source do not stack. E.g., if you manifest an unaugmented defensive precognition twice you will only get a +1 insight bonus to AC -- not a +2. Numerical bonuses which are not named always stack, unless they are from the same source (see above). For example, the freedom mantle in CPsi gives you a +10 bonus to speed, and the feat Speed Of Thought gives you a +10 insight bonus to speed. Because the freedom mantle's bonus is unnamed, it stacks with Speed Of Thought. If your base speed was 30, your new speed is 50. On tanking: A good way not to get hit is to have reach, and the feat Stand Still. The power extend reach from CPsi, and the power expansion from the Expanded Psionics Handbook, are both very good for increasing reach. They also stack (so if you use expansion to become large, and then manifest extend reach, you will have 15 feet of reach). Be sure to read the errata for the expansion power, if you haven't already. Damage reduction is a very good thing to have while tanking. The 1st level power biofeedback can give you a good amount of DR/-. Strength of my enemy is one of the best powers a psychic warrior can have. Every strike makes it harder for the enemy to hit you, and lets you hit the enemy harder.
Nephlite 05-04-07, 03:03 PM	So my old DND group got together to do a DND Draft last weekend. (Yes, football, beer and DND do go well together!) ;-) The basic gist was Good (mostly humans) vs. Evil (undead, Trolls and whatnot) at Lvl 10 characters. Basically, one big fight club! Half of the characters were pregenerated to speed up time. With each player allowed to customize Feats, Gear, Spells and 25,000 g.p. worth of magical stuff. Needless to say the Good guys got trounced! Mostly by the Troll Barbarian with (smartly!) protection from fire!!! I ended playing a Human Fighter 5/Psi War 5 with a Greater Psionic Weapon Holy Greatsword (that's 8d6+ to our evil adversaries once a round). Unfortunately, still not enough. Anyways, looking back on the fight, we had horrible ACs. So this got me to thinking about a straight up (level 10) Psi Warrior and how much AC I could pack into this tank. So I'm looking for some ideas. Magical Armor and Shield definitely come to mind. Thought about Dodge and Psionic Dodge (not sure if it's worth two feats for a +2 AC). Precog Defensive seems a must choice for a +4 AC for 10 PP. As well as Greater Condealing Amorpha in actual combat. Any ideas would be greatly appreciated. I know I don't know all the bonus stacking rules, so I'm looking for some help to make a character with the only idea behind him is high AC/not getting hit in melee combat. Well: 25 k? That is 1/2 the normal starting gold of a 10th level character: No wonder you guys lost. The game assumes for CR's sake that you have sxtahdard gear. You should lower the challenges if less gear or game thinks you want a TPK. So you guys did fine for how poor you guys were. A Great rule of thumb to judge what is best AC you'll need for tyour level is 15 + level*1.5. In your case 15 +15=30 AC is the most you'll need or you'll be hit more often than not. Are you able to craft these yourself (saves a huge amount of money but might lose a level in exchange because of Exp costs). i'll assume you bought not crafted these: If you have Mithral Full plate (assuming decent dex) that costs 10k. If you have low Dex than skip that and go +2 full plate for 5, 800 gp giving 10AC +1 dex bonus: total=11 possible. Than assumming 2 handed sword: +1 animated Heavy shield for +3 AC for about 9000. So far we reached: +14. AC great for level 7 or 8, but low for 10. So we could get a +2 Amulet of natural armor: +2 AC for 8 k. Giving us +16 AC. AC 26 so good for level 8 or 9 but not good for level 10. Spent so far: 9+ 5.8 + 8=22.8 K. We have only 2.2 K left. However, you can always use Precog Defense in battle for +4 AC: upping you to 30AC. However, PP useage should be rationed if more than 1 fight/day (and usually there is). Plus we need a +1 weapon too :D. So yeah, we can do it but hard.
Flash10 05-05-07, 07:22 PM	Wow! Awesome ideas. Never even considered the Stand Still and Reach options. Definitely worth investing into! Also hadn't thought of the Mithral Full Plate +1 either. And yes, Dex is 16, so it works out perfectly! Also going for a heavy sheild +3. So my next question is, would Precog Defense and Mental Barrier stack with the above items? [Do precog def and mental barrier stack even (I'm guessing yes, because one is a deflection bonus while the other is an insight bonus right)?]
Bacris 05-05-07, 07:58 PM	So my next question is, would Precog Defense and Mental Barrier stack with the above items? [Do precog def and mental barrier stack even (I'm guessing yes, because one is a deflection bonus while the other is an insight bonus right)?] Yes and yes. So far, you have armor, shield, natural, and dex to AC. Insight and Deflection would stack.
Nom 05-07-07, 09:32 AM	Miscellaneous dumb question: How does one squeeze a troll (6 HD, +5 LA) barbarian (at least 1 HD) into a level 10 cap? It's a minimum ECL 12.
starfire311 05-07-07, 09:39 AM	Miscellaneous dumb question: How does one squeeze a troll (6 HD, +5 LA) barbarian (at least 1 HD) into a level 10 cap? It's a minimum ECL 12. I figured they were not using LA, and it was probably a 4th level barbarian troll, and thus really a 15th level character, no wonder he kicked butt.
RobbyPants 05-07-07, 02:10 PM	I ended playing a Human Fighter 5/Psi War 5 with a Greater Psionic Weapon Holy Greatsword (that's 8d6+ to our evil adversaries once a round). Unfortunately, still not enough. Why fighter 5? That's about the deadest (I made a new word! :P) of the dead levels. Don't 6th level psycic warriors qualify for Weapon Specialization (or was that just 3.0)? If so, there's little reason to take more than two levels of fighter.
CrimsonDeath 05-07-07, 06:34 PM	Unlike ToB classes, 3.5 PsyWars do not get Weapon Specialization, although I am in at least one game that allows them to qualify for it at level 8.
primemover003 05-07-07, 10:29 PM	Currently my Human PsyWar 11 can get a 42 AC with a little planning. Before Buffing AC 34, t 20, ff 24 +8 Armor (Celestial Chainmail) +5 Dex 20 (18 + Gloves +2) +5 Shield (Dragonhide Buckler +3 & Shield Specialization) +5 Dodge (Combat Expertise) +1 Natural (amulet +1) Buffing 4 rounds +4 Insight (Precog, Defense for 10pp) +1 Haste (Boots of Speed) +2 Deflection (Potion Shield of Faith +2) +1 Dex (Cat's Grace) total AC 42, t 28, ff 27 and 50% miss chance Greater Concealing Amorpha And I don't even have Dodge or Psionic Dodge!!!
Vharuck 05-07-07, 10:58 PM	Though they have medium BAB progression, it's best to stick with PsyWar the whole time (unless you go into a good PrC). You'll more than make up for it with better tactical options and the ability to buff your abilities to equal that fighter's BAB (you get less attacks on a full attack, but your standard attacks should hit harder and they happen more often).
Lycanthromancer 05-08-07, 09:31 PM	Metamorphosis, definitely. And if you can Metamorphosis your psicrystal as well, all the better. EVERYBODY GO HYDRA! WOO! That's a helluvalotuvattacks, there.
Flash10 05-09-07, 11:32 AM	Miscellaneous dumb question: How does one squeeze a troll (6 HD, +5 LA) barbarian (at least 1 HD) into a level 10 cap? It's a minimum ECL 12. We had an extra player on our team (odd number of guys), so I think the DM let it slide.
Flash10 05-09-07, 11:41 AM	Though they have medium BAB progression, it's best to stick with PsyWar the whole time (unless you go into a good PrC). You'll more than make up for it with better tactical options and the ability to buff your abilities to equal that fighter's BAB (you get less attacks on a full attack, but your standard attacks should hit harder and they happen more often). I came to the same conclusion after this whole encounter. So I was compairing a straight lvl 10 Fighter to a 10 Psi Warrior.... why would anyone want to play a plain fighter? If the two went toe to toe, wouldn't a Psi Warrior always win? His buffs are awesome. Sure he has a d8 for HP, but that doesn't seem a big difference if ya ask me. BAB is a little better with a fighter, but with buffs, PsiWar is better. Just wondering....
Nephlite 05-09-07, 11:51 AM	I came to the same conclusion after this whole encounter. So I was compairing a straight lvl 10 Fighter to a 10 Psi Warrior.... why would anyone want to play a plain fighter? If the two went toe to toe, wouldn't a Psi Warrior always win? His buffs are awesome. Sure he has a d8 for HP, but that doesn't seem a big difference if ya ask me. BAB is a little better with a fighter, but with buffs, PsiWar is better. Just wondering.... Fighters require expert planning (more so than wizards when preparing spells/day). They are not beginner classes: which is funny because they are the Core warrior PC class. Fighter has more tricks than the Psi-Warr and the Psi-warr can run out of PP in 4 encounters/day. The Fighter could in theory still be stronger (except that some powers have long durations).
PhaedrusXY 05-09-07, 12:00 PM	So I was compairing a straight lvl 10 Fighter to a 10 Psi Warrior.... why would anyone want to play a plain fighter?If you actually have the recommended 4 encounters per day, the psiwarrior will either be hurting badly for (or out of) power points by the end, or he'll have to be very conservative with them. That makes them about equal, as far as combat ability, on average. Of course, the psiwarrior has alot more options, and can burn all his power points on a single encounter to be signifigantly better than the fighter, if he needs to. So yeah, overall I think they are better than fighters. But fighters are arguably the weakest class in the core rules at all but the lowest levels of the game.
Nom 05-09-07, 08:43 PM	We had an extra player on our team (odd number of guys), so I think the DM let it slide.Don't forget the D&D rule of thumb that 2 levels approximately equals 2 characters. Thus, if this guy was Barb 1 (ECL 12) then he's about equal to 2 PCs. If he was Barb 5 or 6 then he theoretically is equal to your entire party. Note that if all you are fighting is fully-rested encounters this invalidates several balancing assumptions. It powers up anything with per/day expendable resources (notably spellcasters), since they don't need to worry about conserving power. Further, you might want to use CR rather than LA (or an average of the two) for monster creatures, since LA weights heavily against abilities that are relatively weak in a single encounter but powerful when useable over and over again.
RLRapp 05-10-07, 04:31 AM	Fun trick with Hustle power if in contact with enemy, Take full attack, activate hustle, take move away from opponent. Also remember, a trolls regen is no help if his Con is reduced to 0 (prevenom wpn, truevenom wpn).
Rageheart 05-10-07, 01:28 PM	Fun trick with Hustle power if in contact with enemy, Take full attack, activate hustle (Provoking AoO), take move away from opponent. Emphasis mine.
InkBlot 05-10-07, 02:34 PM	He would provoke for moving out of the enemy's threatened area, but not for manifesting hustle. Swift action powers never provoke (XPH, p59, "Manifesting a power with a manifesting time of 1 swift action does not provoke attacks of opportunity").
Rageheart 05-10-07, 02:46 PM	REALLY?! (looks it up) ...that is very cool! My mistake, nothing to see here... Move along. :D
CrimsonDeath 05-10-07, 04:15 PM	Fun trick with Hustle power if in contact with enemy, Take full attack, activate hustle, take move away from opponent. Also remember, a trolls regen is no help if his Con is reduced to 0 (prevenom wpn, truevenom wpn). The troll's Fort save might be a problem... Not to mention that you have a lot of Con to go through.
WyvernSlayer 05-31-07, 07:15 AM	Without any magic items at all you could easily grab a 40 AC using a few powers and 4 feats, at 10th level PW. Take Exotic Armor Proficiency: Dwarven Battleplate. Use the Variant to lose Tower Shields for Extreme Shields. Take Heavy Armor Optimization Line. Bonus to armor and increase in Max Dex iirc, don't have my books on me. Take Shield Specialization. +1 shields. You get 10+3 Dex+11 Armor+4Shield= 28 AC Thicken Skin for 10 PP = +4 Natural armor. Defensive Precognition for 10 PP= +4 Insight to AC and saves. Mental Barrier (stretch 8P)= +4 Deflection This doesn't count any: Mithril for armor for better Dex. Magic Armor Bonuses Magic Shield Bonuses Dodge Bonuses, etc etc. You have 25k Gold to spend, enjoy!
The_Ditto 05-31-07, 08:11 AM	Fun trick with Hustle power if in contact with enemy, Take full attack, activate hustle, take move away from opponent. Also remember, a trolls regen is no help if his Con is reduced to 0 (prevenom wpn, truevenom wpn). You'd have an easier time bringing the troll down using Ego Whip, then with poison ... ;)
Moosh Nailo 05-31-07, 09:04 PM	There is a feat in CPsi, Focused Shield, that increases your shield's AC bonus by one.
starfire311 05-31-07, 10:35 PM	Take Heavy Armor Optimization Line. Bonus to armor and increase in Max Dex Heavy armor optimization does not increase max dex, niether do any feats that have heavy armor optimization as a prereq. AFAIK. Feats to look at would be shield ward + deflective armor, allow you to add shield and armor bonus to touch AC.
Tyroki 06-01-07, 12:36 AM	What about inertial armor? Or doesn't that stack with physical armor?
Vharuck 06-01-07, 12:52 AM	What about inertial armor? Or doesn't that stack with physical armor? Same named bonuses, in this case "armor," do not stack unless otherwise noted (basically just dodge stacks).
Tyroki 06-01-07, 12:53 AM	So you can't use Leather Armor and the power Inertial Armor together to get more AC? O.o Meaning to use Inertial Armor, you can't wear any armor at all?!
InkBlot 06-01-07, 04:14 AM	You can still wear armor and use inertial armor. It just doesn't give you any extra protection. All the places on your body that leather armor covers are already covered by inertial armor, and then some.
Tyroki 06-01-07, 07:11 PM	I see. So if you're wearing basic Leather Armor that grants 2 AC, and you use Inertial Armor (None-augmented) which gives +4, then you're only getting a 2 bonus from Inertial Armor, giving you only 4 armor all up?
Vharuck 06-01-07, 07:22 PM	I see. So if you're wearing basic Leather Armor that grants 2 AC, and you use Inertial Armor (None-augmented) which gives +4, then you're only getting a 2 bonus from Inertial Armor, giving you only 4 armor all up? Actually, the Inertial Armor, being the higher bonus of that type, is the only source of your armor bonus. All 4 of the bonus points are from the inertial armor; should the power not work (most likely its duration expires), the leather armor will now be the only armor bonus and then counts.
Fafnir 06-01-07, 07:44 PM	I see. So if you're wearing basic Leather Armor that grants 2 AC, and you use Inertial Armor (None-augmented) which gives +4, then you're only getting a 2 bonus from Inertial Armor, giving you only 4 armor all up? You get the greater of the two, i.e. +4 from Inertial Armor. Now if it was a Full Plate (AC+8) and Inertial Armor (AC+4), you'd get +8... except against incorporeal attacks, which ignore physical armor but not [Force] effects. You'd get +4 (from IA) against those.
primemover003 06-01-07, 07:52 PM	There is a feat in CPsi, Focused Shield, that increases your shield's AC bonus by one. If you're gonna blow a feat for +1 Shield bonus get Shield Specialization from PHBII. Then take Shield Ward and add your Shield bonus to your Touch AC and Trip/Bullrush checks (to resist). Or take Parrying Shield from LoM for one feat to get the Shield bonus to touch attacks only.
Lycanthromancer 06-02-07, 01:22 PM	Wearing armor can still be a good idea, even against corporeal foes. Get a +1 suit of leather armor, enhanced with all sorts of nifty special abilities, then manifest inertial armor. You'll have a decent AC, AND you'll get lots of special abilities. If you get dispelled, you get zapped with a null psionics field, or your duration expires unexpectedly, then you'll still have a higher AC than if you were naked (though there is something to be said for being naked - it just doesn't have much to do with your AC; touch attacks are another matter altogether).