Psickic [Archive] - Wizards Community - Pages Merged by Solauren

Psickic [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Hellsbells
10-20-07, 10:42 PM I was wondering if it would be possible to take all of the core base classes (or atleast most of them) and make them psionics. Could it be done, Would you want to? Well I dont know since I dont have the psionics books but I leave the challenge to you.
Lokiyn
10-20-07, 11:14 PM No need
Psionics can cover all the main adventuring rolesWell, exept for healing, it can cover that role, but only with great difficulty and much ineffeciency. Psionic information can be found in the System Reference Document, d20srd.org for an easier hyperlinked version.
CrimsonDeath
10-21-07, 12:13 AM It's basically been done (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/magic/spellPoints.htm).
JulesCARV
10-21-07, 12:23 AM I don't really think it makes sense to turn non-magical classes into psionic ones. For example, a rogue fits in a non-magical world, a traditional D&D magical world, and a psionic world with equal ease, unless by "psionic world" you mean a world where everyone is is psionic and uses psionic powers. I think that the barbarian, fighter, monk, and rogue all fit into a psionic campaign as much as a traditional D&D magical one -- i.e., as non-magical, non-psionic characters.

If you replace magical classes with psionics straight "out of the book," a few things might be missing. One is that no evil clerics will be around to create HORDES OF SHAMBLING ZOMBIES, as they would in a traditional D&D world. Undead might still exist, but they'd be their own destructive force, not at the beck and call of unholy types. Undead aren't impressed by an Nerull-worshipping ardent or psion, so everyone will hate undead, and there will be no "utility undead" helping living bad guys.

The other thing missing will be illusions. Illusions are basically the sole purview of arcane magic -- divine magic can barely do them, and psionics can't do them at all, although sometimes it can do rather pale imitations through telepathy. No mirror image, no invisibility, etc.

So necromancy and illusions are out. Beyond that, though, psionics can do what it needs to, although sometimes it seems frustratingly inefficient compared to arcane/divine magic. (Why must my nomad -- a mobility specialist -- wait until level 7 to fly, while unspecialized sorcerers and wizards could do it at level 5 or 6? Why must my egoist go through such convoluted steps to heal, metamorphosing into an inanimate object before manifesting empathic transfer to avoid catching the disease I'm healing, while clerics can cast a simple remove disease? Why must greater metamorphosis have an experience cost for a shapechanging specialist while shapechange, available to all sorcerers, wizards, druids, and some clerics, requires only a one-time expenditure on a focus?) Still, while there may be times when it's less efficient, it still can do what it needs to -- except create HORDES OF SHAMBLING ZOMBIES, that is.
Bacris
10-21-07, 01:18 AM Let's see:

Sneak - psychic rogue from the mind's eye
Healer - ardent from Complete Psionic
Utility - society mind (available here on the boards or free from Dreamscarred Press), shaper
Tank - psychic warrior or ardent
Blaster - psion or wilder
Ranged - psychic warrior or marksman from Untapped Potential
Melee - psychic warrior or soulknife (recommend BlaineTog's fix)
Battlefield Control - psychic warrior
Debuff - psion, to an extent
Travel - nomad
Face - telepath or society mind, or even thoughtsinger

There's no reason to have a "psionic" barbarian, there's already a "magic-free" ranger variant, the ardent can fill most of the roles of the cleric...

Most of the roles, to an extent, have already been done in a psionic format :)
Jaxgaret
10-21-07, 01:25 AM Fighter --> Psychic Warrior (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/classes/psychicWarrior.htm)
Wizard --> Psion (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/classes/psion.htm)
Sorcerer --> Wilder (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/classes/wilder.htm)
Rogue/Bard --> Lurk (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/cwc/20061003)
Paladin/Marshal (Warlord) --> Divine Mind
Cleric --> Ardent
Monk --> Soulknife (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/classes/soulknife.htm)

Close enough.
InkBlot
10-21-07, 01:25 AM Bard - Thoughtsinger
Cleric/Druid - Ardent
Sorcerer - Wilder
Wizard - Psion/Erudite

For the Paladin and Ranger, use the various non-casting variants. If the player wants powers then s/he can multiclass into Warmind or Psychic Warrior or something.

For the Monk, the abilities based on spells would work exactly the same. They'd simply be based on powers instead. Not a real difference.

Replace Use Magic Device, Spellcraft, and Knowledge (Arcana) with Use Psionic Device, Psicraft, and Knowledge (Psionics) respectively. Knowledge (Religion) can either be rolled into other knowledge skills or left alone. Not a big difference.

Transparency covers the rest.

Healing will be difficult, but not impossible, before 5th level.

Any magic item can be made as a psionic item by using roughly equivalent powers. So sayeth ye Magic Item Compendium.

If you're using other alternative magic systems and classes (Pact Magic, Incarnum, the Sublime Way, Factotums, etc.), then this will be a lot easier. That's essentially how I ran my last game, and everything went fine. With Healing Belts, nobody missed the Cleric. An evil Ardent created a horde of shambling skeletal tulpas, and the Factotum in the party almost tried to turn them (he succeeded on his psicraft check to realize what they really were).

edit: If you want to make a world where every creature has a palpable psionic potential, then use the feat Hidden Talent from the XPH. It's in the section about designing psionic campaigns, since it's intended only for high-psionics games. Hidden Talent can only be taken at 1st level, and grants 2 power points and use of a single first level power.
Hellsbells
10-21-07, 12:13 PM I don't really think it makes sense to turn non-magical classes into psionic ones. For example, a rogue fits in a non-magical world, a traditional D&D magical world, and a psionic world with equal ease, unless by "psionic world" you mean a world where everyone is is psionic and uses psionic powers. I think that the barbarian, fighter, monk, and rogue all fit into a psionic campaign as much as a traditional D&D magical one -- i.e., as non-magical, non-psionic characters.

Sorry for confusion, I meant spellcasting ones. Or otherwise non sword-swinger classes.

And to the people who have been saying normal psionics already covers it that isnt the point. The point is to make a Psionic druid, a druid who uses her instincts to generate psionic power and defends the wilds with it, Or a cleric, whos god grants psionics instead of spells and prays/sermons for the power of ones mind, etc. Its about theme and desine not mechanics and party role.
Hellsbells
10-21-07, 12:17 PM If you replace magical classes with psionics straight "out of the book," a few things might be missing. One is that no evil clerics will be around to create HORDES OF SHAMBLING ZOMBIES, as they would in a traditional D&D world. Undead might still exist, but they'd be their own destructive force, not at the beck and call of unholy types. Undead aren't impressed by an Nerull-worshipping ardent or psion, so everyone will hate undead, and there will be no "utility undead" helping living bad guys.

The other thing missing will be illusions. Illusions are basically the sole purview of arcane magic -- divine magic can barely do them, and psionics can't do them at all, although sometimes it can do rather pale imitations through telepathy. No mirror image, no invisibility, etc.

So necromancy and illusions are out. Beyond that, though, psionics can do what it needs to, although sometimes it seems frustratingly inefficient compared to arcane/divine magic. (Why must my nomad -- a mobility specialist -- wait until level 7 to fly, while unspecialized sorcerers and wizards could do it at level 5 or 6? Why must my egoist go through such convoluted steps to heal, metamorphosing into an inanimate object before manifesting empathic transfer to avoid catching the disease I'm healing, while clerics can cast a simple remove disease? Why must greater metamorphosis have an experience cost for a shapechanging specialist while shapechange, available to all sorcerers, wizards, druids, and some clerics, requires only a one-time expenditure on a focus?) Still, while there may be times when it's less efficient, it still can do what it needs to -- except create HORDES OF SHAMBLING ZOMBIES, that is.

I may be to inexperienced to coment but make your own psionics to do these things. Make a HORDES OF SHAMBLING ZOMBIES! psionic power, make totally new powers or convert spells to powers. I dont know if that is possible since I know next to nothing about psionics but thats my opinion.
Bacris
10-21-07, 01:11 PM Its about theme and desine not mechanics and party role.

Then you're not talking about "psionic" versions of the classes, because psionic versions of those classes would use different mechanics. What you're talking about is simply reflavoring, not changes to the actual classes.

If you want a psionic version of the cleric, you have the ardent. If you want a "psionic" cleric, where it's still the cleric, just called psionic, just use the cleric and say "he's psionic" since you don't want to worry about mechanics. :P
InkBlot
10-21-07, 01:46 PM Hellsbells, do you own a copy of the Expanded Psionics Handbook yet? If not, just put this project on hold until you do. The SRD isn't enough for a project like this.

If you do have the XPH, then you need to decide what it is exactly that you like about psionics? Is it the mechanics? What parts of the mechanics? The powers? The power points? What? Why? Is it the flavor? What part of the flavor? The focus on mind and spirit? The independent nature of a psychic? The crystals? What is it? Why?

Then you need to ask yourself all those same questions about Clerics and Druids. You should end up with two big lists: everything you like about psionics, and everything you like about divine magic. After you get those lists, we can start to help you create new material by combining them.
Hellsbells
10-21-07, 02:44 PM Then you're not talking about "psionic" versions of the classes, because psionic versions of those classes would use different mechanics. What you're talking about is simply reflavoring, not changes to the actual classes.

If you want a psionic version of the cleric, you have the ardent. If you want a "psionic" cleric, where it's still the cleric, just called psionic, just use the cleric and say "he's psionic" since you don't want to worry about mechanics. :P

Ok I need to clarify again. I want to change the mechanics, but the reason I want to do it is for the theme.
Jaxgaret
10-22-07, 10:13 PM Ok I need to clarify again. I want to change the mechanics, but the reason I want to do it is for the theme.

What?
CrimsonDeath
10-23-07, 04:03 AM Ok I need to clarify again. I want to change the mechanics, but the reason I want to do it is for the theme.

And this (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/magic/spellPoints.htm) doesn't do it for you?

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Hellsbells 10-20-07, 10:42 PM	I was wondering if it would be possible to take all of the core base classes (or atleast most of them) and make them psionics. Could it be done, Would you want to? Well I dont know since I dont have the psionics books but I leave the challenge to you.
Lokiyn 10-20-07, 11:14 PM	No need Psionics can cover all the main adventuring rolesWell, exept for healing, it can cover that role, but only with great difficulty and much ineffeciency. Psionic information can be found in the System Reference Document, d20srd.org for an easier hyperlinked version.
CrimsonDeath 10-21-07, 12:13 AM	It's basically been done (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/magic/spellPoints.htm).
JulesCARV 10-21-07, 12:23 AM	I don't really think it makes sense to turn non-magical classes into psionic ones. For example, a rogue fits in a non-magical world, a traditional D&D magical world, and a psionic world with equal ease, unless by "psionic world" you mean a world where everyone is is psionic and uses psionic powers. I think that the barbarian, fighter, monk, and rogue all fit into a psionic campaign as much as a traditional D&D magical one -- i.e., as non-magical, non-psionic characters. If you replace magical classes with psionics straight "out of the book," a few things might be missing. One is that no evil clerics will be around to create HORDES OF SHAMBLING ZOMBIES, as they would in a traditional D&D world. Undead might still exist, but they'd be their own destructive force, not at the beck and call of unholy types. Undead aren't impressed by an Nerull-worshipping ardent or psion, so everyone will hate undead, and there will be no "utility undead" helping living bad guys. The other thing missing will be illusions. Illusions are basically the sole purview of arcane magic -- divine magic can barely do them, and psionics can't do them at all, although sometimes it can do rather pale imitations through telepathy. No mirror image, no invisibility, etc. So necromancy and illusions are out. Beyond that, though, psionics can do what it needs to, although sometimes it seems frustratingly inefficient compared to arcane/divine magic. (Why must my nomad -- a mobility specialist -- wait until level 7 to fly, while unspecialized sorcerers and wizards could do it at level 5 or 6? Why must my egoist go through such convoluted steps to heal, metamorphosing into an inanimate object before manifesting empathic transfer to avoid catching the disease I'm healing, while clerics can cast a simple remove disease? Why must greater metamorphosis have an experience cost for a shapechanging specialist while shapechange, available to all sorcerers, wizards, druids, and some clerics, requires only a one-time expenditure on a focus?) Still, while there may be times when it's less efficient, it still can do what it needs to -- except create HORDES OF SHAMBLING ZOMBIES, that is.
Bacris 10-21-07, 01:18 AM	Let's see: Sneak - psychic rogue from the mind's eye Healer - ardent from Complete Psionic Utility - society mind (available here on the boards or free from Dreamscarred Press), shaper Tank - psychic warrior or ardent Blaster - psion or wilder Ranged - psychic warrior or marksman from Untapped Potential Melee - psychic warrior or soulknife (recommend BlaineTog's fix) Battlefield Control - psychic warrior Debuff - psion, to an extent Travel - nomad Face - telepath or society mind, or even thoughtsinger There's no reason to have a "psionic" barbarian, there's already a "magic-free" ranger variant, the ardent can fill most of the roles of the cleric... Most of the roles, to an extent, have already been done in a psionic format :)
Jaxgaret 10-21-07, 01:25 AM	Fighter --> Psychic Warrior (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/classes/psychicWarrior.htm) Wizard --> Psion (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/classes/psion.htm) Sorcerer --> Wilder (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/classes/wilder.htm) Rogue/Bard --> Lurk (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/cwc/20061003) Paladin/Marshal (Warlord) --> Divine Mind Cleric --> Ardent Monk --> Soulknife (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/classes/soulknife.htm) Close enough.
InkBlot 10-21-07, 01:25 AM	Bard - Thoughtsinger Cleric/Druid - Ardent Sorcerer - Wilder Wizard - Psion/Erudite For the Paladin and Ranger, use the various non-casting variants. If the player wants powers then s/he can multiclass into Warmind or Psychic Warrior or something. For the Monk, the abilities based on spells would work exactly the same. They'd simply be based on powers instead. Not a real difference. Replace Use Magic Device, Spellcraft, and Knowledge (Arcana) with Use Psionic Device, Psicraft, and Knowledge (Psionics) respectively. Knowledge (Religion) can either be rolled into other knowledge skills or left alone. Not a big difference. Transparency covers the rest. Healing will be difficult, but not impossible, before 5th level. Any magic item can be made as a psionic item by using roughly equivalent powers. So sayeth ye Magic Item Compendium. If you're using other alternative magic systems and classes (Pact Magic, Incarnum, the Sublime Way, Factotums, etc.), then this will be a lot easier. That's essentially how I ran my last game, and everything went fine. With Healing Belts, nobody missed the Cleric. An evil Ardent created a horde of shambling skeletal tulpas, and the Factotum in the party almost tried to turn them (he succeeded on his psicraft check to realize what they really were). edit: If you want to make a world where every creature has a palpable psionic potential, then use the feat Hidden Talent from the XPH. It's in the section about designing psionic campaigns, since it's intended only for high-psionics games. Hidden Talent can only be taken at 1st level, and grants 2 power points and use of a single first level power.
Hellsbells 10-21-07, 12:13 PM	I don't really think it makes sense to turn non-magical classes into psionic ones. For example, a rogue fits in a non-magical world, a traditional D&D magical world, and a psionic world with equal ease, unless by "psionic world" you mean a world where everyone is is psionic and uses psionic powers. I think that the barbarian, fighter, monk, and rogue all fit into a psionic campaign as much as a traditional D&D magical one -- i.e., as non-magical, non-psionic characters. Sorry for confusion, I meant spellcasting ones. Or otherwise non sword-swinger classes. And to the people who have been saying normal psionics already covers it that isnt the point. The point is to make a Psionic druid, a druid who uses her instincts to generate psionic power and defends the wilds with it, Or a cleric, whos god grants psionics instead of spells and prays/sermons for the power of ones mind, etc. Its about theme and desine not mechanics and party role.
Hellsbells 10-21-07, 12:17 PM	If you replace magical classes with psionics straight "out of the book," a few things might be missing. One is that no evil clerics will be around to create HORDES OF SHAMBLING ZOMBIES, as they would in a traditional D&D world. Undead might still exist, but they'd be their own destructive force, not at the beck and call of unholy types. Undead aren't impressed by an Nerull-worshipping ardent or psion, so everyone will hate undead, and there will be no "utility undead" helping living bad guys. The other thing missing will be illusions. Illusions are basically the sole purview of arcane magic -- divine magic can barely do them, and psionics can't do them at all, although sometimes it can do rather pale imitations through telepathy. No mirror image, no invisibility, etc. So necromancy and illusions are out. Beyond that, though, psionics can do what it needs to, although sometimes it seems frustratingly inefficient compared to arcane/divine magic. (Why must my nomad -- a mobility specialist -- wait until level 7 to fly, while unspecialized sorcerers and wizards could do it at level 5 or 6? Why must my egoist go through such convoluted steps to heal, metamorphosing into an inanimate object before manifesting empathic transfer to avoid catching the disease I'm healing, while clerics can cast a simple remove disease? Why must greater metamorphosis have an experience cost for a shapechanging specialist while shapechange, available to all sorcerers, wizards, druids, and some clerics, requires only a one-time expenditure on a focus?) Still, while there may be times when it's less efficient, it still can do what it needs to -- except create HORDES OF SHAMBLING ZOMBIES, that is. I may be to inexperienced to coment but make your own psionics to do these things. Make a HORDES OF SHAMBLING ZOMBIES! psionic power, make totally new powers or convert spells to powers. I dont know if that is possible since I know next to nothing about psionics but thats my opinion.
Bacris 10-21-07, 01:11 PM	Its about theme and desine not mechanics and party role. Then you're not talking about "psionic" versions of the classes, because psionic versions of those classes would use different mechanics. What you're talking about is simply reflavoring, not changes to the actual classes. If you want a psionic version of the cleric, you have the ardent. If you want a "psionic" cleric, where it's still the cleric, just called psionic, just use the cleric and say "he's psionic" since you don't want to worry about mechanics. :P
InkBlot 10-21-07, 01:46 PM	Hellsbells, do you own a copy of the Expanded Psionics Handbook yet? If not, just put this project on hold until you do. The SRD isn't enough for a project like this. If you do have the XPH, then you need to decide what it is exactly that you like about psionics? Is it the mechanics? What parts of the mechanics? The powers? The power points? What? Why? Is it the flavor? What part of the flavor? The focus on mind and spirit? The independent nature of a psychic? The crystals? What is it? Why? Then you need to ask yourself all those same questions about Clerics and Druids. You should end up with two big lists: everything you like about psionics, and everything you like about divine magic. After you get those lists, we can start to help you create new material by combining them.
Hellsbells 10-21-07, 02:44 PM	Then you're not talking about "psionic" versions of the classes, because psionic versions of those classes would use different mechanics. What you're talking about is simply reflavoring, not changes to the actual classes. If you want a psionic version of the cleric, you have the ardent. If you want a "psionic" cleric, where it's still the cleric, just called psionic, just use the cleric and say "he's psionic" since you don't want to worry about mechanics. :P Ok I need to clarify again. I want to change the mechanics, but the reason I want to do it is for the theme.
Jaxgaret 10-22-07, 10:13 PM	Ok I need to clarify again. I want to change the mechanics, but the reason I want to do it is for the theme. What?
CrimsonDeath 10-23-07, 04:03 AM	Ok I need to clarify again. I want to change the mechanics, but the reason I want to do it is for the theme. And this (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/magic/spellPoints.htm) doesn't do it for you?