Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Solstysse 05-08-07, 12:01 PM	I'm still hammering Psicrystal issues with my dm/boyfriend. So here are my issues and my points. Advice is MUCH appreciated as nothing is really said either way on what happens when a psicrystal is destroyed in the errata yet. Q: If a psicrystal is destroyed, is the psion able to create another crystal? I would say yes. First, very few things completely nullify a feat, since psicrystal affinity is a feat as is craft construct or craft psionic construct which allow you to recraft a construct if you choose I think reforming a crystal that is in essence a fragment of yourself would be completely do-able. Also, the feat is very specific, you can't create anything but a psicrystal so the limitations of that are more stringent than just craft construct. Having to take the feat again to get another crystal seems extremely harsh, although I would say that creating a crystal of another "personality" might require the feat to be taken again. As far as power balance goes, I think the psicrystals aren't overpowered, they mix animal companions with familiars so in keeping with the mixture I would say having 24 hours of uninterupted meditation plus xp loss would be equal to a successful fort save (100xp per level in psion) would be balanced. This seems fair to me, especially since this wasn't a free abilty like it is in druids or even a low cost (100 gold) ability as in socerers/wizards. Animal companions don't give buffs like familiar because they're free and easily recreated and familiars don't do have the capacity to tank like animal companions but do give nice buffs so they cost xp and more time to get back. Psicrystals are the best of both worlds but require a feat to obtain. The feat shouldn't just disappear when the crystal is broken and there is nothing ruling that a contruct cannot be remade although it cannot be "brought back to life" because constructs are not alive in the first place. I related it to him like this, I have a weapon proffieceny in trident, if my trident broke I wouldn't have to retake the feat to learn another trident, I always have the ability to weild it. I have to acquire another trident which might mean questing, crafting or stealing but there is balance in it. What do you guys think?
Psionx 05-08-07, 12:11 PM	I'm an RAW person, of course because there aren't any I'll just say what makes sense to me. I'd say you have to spend 1 pp to create a piece of crystal (crystal shard power with less ability). Now imbuing it with a portion of your personality requires 7 power points (a more limited form of modify memory). It must be the same personality as before however. And there you go, 8 pp total to create another one (the reason for the costs is because not all psions have access to those powers, but these are lesser versions and thus at the same cost they are justified). That is how I'd rule it, 8 pp to create a new one (if you are level one, you will probably have to wait until you are level 2 to get it back).
Phalo 05-08-07, 12:17 PM	I would probably rule you had to make the fort save as if a familiar died and corresponding xp penalty and have to wait to create a new one This reasoning is mostly because you had a portion of you personality destroyed along with the corresponding trauma.
Solstysse 05-08-07, 12:23 PM	I would probably rule you had to make the fort save as if a familiar died and corresponding xp penalty and have to wait to create a new one This reasoning is mostly because you had a portion of you personality destroyed along with the corresponding trauma. The books says " Because it is an extension of its creator's personality, a character's psicrystal is in some ways a part of him." and refers to it as "..a fragment of a psionic characters personality..." so you don't lose that whole portion of yourself, it's a tiny fragment of that part of your personality that is impressed upon the stone. The wait time wouldn't be great at all if you lost a tiny fragment of part of your personality.
Solstysse 05-08-07, 12:28 PM	I'm an RAW person, of course because there aren't any I'll just say what makes sense to me. I'd say you have to spend 1 pp to create a piece of crystal (crystal shard power with less ability). Now imbuing it with a portion of your personality requires 7 power points (a more limited form of modify memory). It must be the same personality as before however. And there you go, 8 pp total to create another one (the reason for the costs is because not all psions have access to those powers, but these are lesser versions and thus at the same cost they are justified). That is how I'd rule it, 8 pp to create a new one (if you are level one, you will probably have to wait until you are level 2 to get it back). That is a fair idea, I'm not sure my dm would bite though. Me manifesting powers I don't have would throw him off I'm sure, but it sounds completely resonable to me. Especially since I already have the feat. I would say that losing a feat is bad but losing a psicrystal with improved psicrystal x3 is worse and obscene. If the construct was just gone, nullifying the feat altogether all the stacking feats would be gone also. As far as a I know nothing like that exists in d&d (i may be wrong though) and I haven't come across anything that removes a feat altogether like apopsi removes powers for psions.
Tempest Stormwind 05-08-07, 12:53 PM	This is answered in the FAQ on the top of the forum. Q: What happens when my psicrystal dies? A: The official response from Customer Service is "You can get another one." That is all that is written on the subject, as it wasn't addressed in Complete Psionics. Come up with a suitable houserule -- personally, I've tried a few different ones, but from now on will be using the simplest, inspired by the Tome of Magic: It reforms on its own after 24 hours. I must stress, though, this is a house rule -- no official method of getting a psicrystal back exists (though it's clear you do get another one), and no penalty exists when it dies (beyond not having your crystal around). A simple variant is given in Untapped Potential, written for conservative DMs who think it should be closer to a familiar (100xp after 24 hours has passed to create a new one out of astral matter or rebuild the old one from a fragment of it; the feat covers knowledge of how to do this). Given how that book also contains further options for psicrystals (expanded feats to get more use out of them and a PrC based around your psicrystal), it was kind of required anyway.
InkBlot 05-08-07, 01:00 PM	As far as a I know nothing like that exists in d&d (i may be wrong though) and I haven't come across anything that removes a feat altogether like apopsi removes powers for psions. If you take an exalted feat, and then do something to lose your exalted status, your exalted feats get taken away by the gods and can never be gotten back. But that's the BoED for you. I agree that it would be completely balls to not let you make another psicrystal. The houserule I use is that the manifester takes a penalty to the skill, check, or save that her destroyed psicrystal used to give her a bonus to. The penalty goes away after 2d6 days. At that time the manifester can spend 8 hours in meditation to create another psicrystal either from raw ectoplasm or from a gem of the right size. Either way, the results are the same. The manifester gets a new psicrystal with the same personality as the old one (but not the same memories). I would say having 24 hours of uninterupted meditation plus xp loss would be equal to a successful fort save (100xp per level in psion) would be balanced. Keep in mind that wilders, psychic warriors, lurks, psychic rogues, warminds, fists of Zuoken, ardents, and divine minds can all also take Psicrystal Affinity and get a psicrystal. Psicrystals improve by your levels in all psionic classes, so a multiclassed lurk 4/soulknife 4/fighter 2 counts 8 levels towards her pet rock.
Solstysse 05-08-07, 01:02 PM	This is answered in the FAQ on the top of the forum. A simple variant is given in Untapped Potential, written for conservative DMs who think it should be closer to a familiar (100xp after 24 hours has passed to create a new one out of astral matter or rebuild the old one from a fragment of it; the feat covers knowledge of how to do this). Given how that book also contains further options for psicrystals (expanded feats to get more use out of them and a PrC based around your psicrystal), it was kind of required anyway. I did read your FAQ's but my dm requires me to find official ruling on something or enough evidence to sway him one way or another. (Arguing with your mate about d&d may be silly but two gamers in close quarters, especially two dms...it can get a little hairy lol) If you can let me know what you meant by "customer service" that would help alot. Or if you actually write for the game, that would be fine also. He's kind of wanting something in the official errata.
InkBlot 05-08-07, 01:36 PM	Costumer Service refers to Wizards Of The Coast's customer service call center. They're unreliable, sometimes even self-contradictory, but they are kind-of-sort-of-mostly official. Tempest writes for Dreamscarred Press, not Wizards Of The Coast. Besides customer service's vague answer of "you can get another psicrystal if your old one dies," WotC has never published any information on what happens after your piscrystal dies (in 3.5 edition).
Solstysse 05-08-07, 02:02 PM	Costumer Service refers to Wizards Of The Coast's customer service call center. They're unreliable, sometimes even self-contradictory, but they are kind-of-sort-of-mostly official. Tempest writes for Dreamscarred Press, not Wizards Of The Coast. Besides customer service's vague answer of "you can get another psicrystal if your old one dies," WotC has never published any information on what happens after your piscrystal dies (in 3.5 edition). I think the point I brought up earlier in another response to a post about having taken improved psicrystal x3 and losing 4 feats finally swayed the dm. Thanks everyone, the suggestions are amazing! Now I have to battle it out as to how I actually get the crystal back but I have an interesting hybrid race (kalashtar/maenad) so being sparkly skinned due to crystals leaves many story related options. Don't worry though, the kalashtar/maenad mix was battled out in much the same way, *wipes sweat from her brow*
Tempest Stormwind 05-08-07, 02:05 PM	Customer Service: 50% accurate, 100% legal. (Actual quote from a Magic card named "The Ultimate Nightmare of Wizards of the Coast (R) Customer Service", by the way.) You ask them questions on the game. If it's core, they'll contradict themselves and often contradict the rules themselves. If it's an expansion ruleset, it's worse, since it almost never actually bothers to provide an answer. For instance, "What happens when my psicrystal dies?" is consistently answered with "You can get another one". That is ALL they will say on the matter. I may not be a WotC employee (although people have tried to get me to become one (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=736200)), but I'm very well versed in the rules, particularly the psionics rules (I was the primary author, developer, and editor (rules and language) on Untapped Potential, for instance, which this board has pretty much universally embraced, although I am no doubt biased in saying so). There are several others with as much expertise in the system as I have -- InkBlot here is one of them -- and you will find we all say the same general thing about psicrystal death. That thing is: "There's nothing official on it except 'you can get another one'; come up with a houserule for getting another one." Similarly, since there is no rule about XP loss or a penalty if the crystal dies (beyond not having it around and thus having at least one, possibly two or more feats rendered worthless, which is pretty damn severe if you ask me), either go RAW and ignore such penalties, or come up with a houserule that works in your game. This isn't Oberoni, by the way - we are admitting that there is a problem in the rules, and in fact we've asked many times over that it be fixed, but Wizards doesn't provide that fix. It's one of the many reasons people who support psionics tend to be bitter about most of WotC. On an unrelated note, I note your DM is comfortable with houserules. Although the Eberron Campaign Setting implies it, Races of Eberron flat-out says that there is no such thing as a half-kalashtar. (Assuming a maenad and a kalashtar mated, if the child was the same gender as the kalashtar parent, it would inherit the spiritual bond from that parent and be a kalashtar, otherwise it would be born a maenad.)
Ryuu_Tenshi 05-08-07, 02:26 PM	(although people have tried to get me to become one (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=736200)), (It's time for Ryuu's daily derailment of a topic Tempest has posted in. The last post in that thread gave me an image of Tempest cutting down a kaiju in plate mail with a holy symbol. and its animal companion. with a uranium katana. ow. that was my brain. also I probably just killed grammar.) Ok on topic. I think if you just present the argument of having the rules work like a wizard's familiar, AND point out that at the VERY LEAST, WotC says that you CAN get it back even if they don't specify how, he SHOULD listen. Then again, I don't know him and he could be unreasonable... but the best you can hope for is to present a reasonable, well-balanced argument and see what happens.
Solstysse 05-08-07, 03:02 PM	Customer Service: 50% accurate, 100% legal. (Actual quote from a Magic card named "The Ultimate Nightmare of Wizards of the Coast (R) Customer Service", by the way.) You ask them questions on the game. If it's core, they'll contradict themselves and often contradict the rules themselves. If it's an expansion ruleset, it's worse, since it almost never actually bothers to provide an answer. For instance, "What happens when my psicrystal dies?" is consistently answered with "You can get another one". That is ALL they will say on the matter. I may not be a WotC employee (although people have tried to get me to become one (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=736200)), but I'm very well versed in the rules, particularly the psionics rules (I was the primary author, developer, and editor (rules and language) on Untapped Potential, for instance, which this board has pretty much universally embraced, although I am no doubt biased in saying so). There are several others with as much expertise in the system as I have -- InkBlot here is one of them -- and you will find we all say the same general thing about psicrystal death. That thing is: "There's nothing official on it except 'you can get another one'; come up with a houserule for getting another one." Similarly, since there is no rule about XP loss or a penalty if the crystal dies (beyond not having it around and thus having at least one, possibly two or more feats rendered worthless, which is pretty damn severe if you ask me), either go RAW and ignore such penalties, or come up with a houserule that works in your game. This isn't Oberoni, by the way - we are admitting that there is a problem in the rules, and in fact we've asked many times over that it be fixed, but Wizards doesn't provide that fix. It's one of the many reasons people who support psionics tend to be bitter about most of WotC. On an unrelated note, I note your DM is comfortable with houserules. Although the Eberron Campaign Setting implies it, Races of Eberron flat-out says that there is no such thing as a half-kalashtar. (Assuming a maenad and a kalashtar mated, if the child was the same gender as the kalashtar parent, it would inherit the spiritual bond from that parent and be a kalashtar, otherwise it would be born a maenad.) I love the mtg quote, at least WotC has a sense of humour about everything eh? He came home for lunch and we hammered it all out, he's just going to treat it like a animal companion in the way I regain it. Which is alot less harsh than I thought it was going to end up being. He's normally a pretty hardass dm when it comes to d&d. I'm newish player to d&d but like a lawyer thrives on law text I'm giddy over my new reading material. I'm used to exalted aka land of anything is possible so d&d's rules, or lack thereof, sometimes trip me up. He was happy to oblige when I asked for a half kalashtar/maenad character due to my backstory skills. I explain away why she exists, how she exists, why she inherited one trait over another and why the kalashtar would "tamper" with another like that, taking that risk is kind of an un-kalashtar thing to do anyway. But we made the class appropriately powered and she's a fun character to play. You guys have been really great with all of this, I'm already annoying the poo out of the boyfreind with all of this so I'm well on my way to having my heavy warhorse killed in game. *laughs*