Psicrystal with VoP? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Psicrystal with VoP? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
malivain
04-22-07, 07:52 PM Can a psicrystal get vow of poverty?
Tempest Stormwind
04-22-07, 08:01 PM In theory, yes.

However, in practice, Exalted feats have a severe RP requirement. A psicrystal, as a fragment of the owner's personality, will likely not qualify if the owner doesn't also qualify for Exalted feats. Furthermore, since the psicrystal and the owner are, in many ways, the same creature, I doubt any psicrystal with VoP could have it justified if the owner didn't also have the VoP.

All of that said, there are SO many issues with that feat that I really, really wouldn't recommend using it (or the entire Book of Exalted Cheese, for that matter). This is on top of the earlier analysis, by the way.
malivain
04-22-07, 08:03 PM Ah alright, just curious. I figured because a psicrystal never gets any gear and doesn't split gold/gear with the party it would be sweet if I used Form of Doom and stuff like that with the little guy.

-Malivain
Tempest Stormwind
04-22-07, 08:07 PM Ah alright, just curious. I figured because a psicrystal never gets any gear and doesn't split gold/gear with the party it would be sweet if I used Form of Doom and stuff like that with the little guy.

-Malivain

You can already do that without the VoP. If you like this idea, do a quick board search for "The Big Guy Is With Me". Or just pop on over to the OTHER active psicrystal-feat thread (where this REALLY should have gone) and look at the recent posts; it was a work of Scion of Coldshard and is linked there.
malivain
04-22-07, 08:15 PM Ah sorry, I didn't see the other forum. Just logged on and posted. :P Won't be so hasty next time.

-Malivain
Tempest Stormwind
04-22-07, 09:30 PM Ah sorry, I didn't see the other forum. Just logged on and posted. :P Won't be so hasty next time.

-MalivainAh, good, you do remember! (http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/posting.php)

Hope that this thread's proven helpful nonetheless.
MerlintheTuna
04-23-07, 03:43 PM A psicrystal, as a fragment of the owner's personality, will likely not qualify if the owner doesn't also qualify for Exalted feats.I'm not so sure on that. The psicrystal is a fragment of the owner's personality; it could very well be the most altruistic, virtuous fragment of the owner's personality, amounting to the D&D equivalent of the shoulder-angel. By separating itself from the rest of the "taint" in the character's mind, the psicrystal ends up free from unnecessary temptations. Taken from that angle, it might actually make more sense for a psicrystal to be exalted than a human. Doesn't make it any less cheesy, but it does make a fair amount of fluff-sense.
PhaedrusXY
04-23-07, 05:47 PM I can just imagine it with the whiny "Nobleman" NPC voice in Baldur's Gate that says "Don't touch me!". :D
AntiDjinn
04-23-07, 06:30 PM Per the creature entry for Psicrstal: "Alignment: As master." So the master must be some variant of Good or the psicrystal won't qualify. Just because the master is exalted does not mean the crystal is likewise (and vice-versa). The exalted status requires a Good alingment, but is not itself an alignment. The status normally has to be bestowed by a celestial or other agent of the upper planes. So for your crystal to be exalted it has to be Good enough to win the praise of angels. Just wait until your start to suffer alignment drift and one day your pet rock anounces that it can no longer keep company with you.
awaken_D_M_golem
04-23-07, 06:54 PM Given a psicrystal's personality, it should have no problem with a Vow of Anything.
Vow of Poverty meet no hands or pockets.
It's single minded focus, especially at higher levels, would keep it from being interested in breaking a Vow of Chastity.
(cough)
AntiDjinn
04-23-07, 07:00 PM Still needs the exalted status before it qualifies to take exalted feats.

Given that it doesn't have any worldly possessions to renounce, most DMs would probably nerf it.

If you are looking merely from a game balance perspective then no problems; if the DM is using rules from the BoED then he has already decided that balance is not a concern.
SlanderPanic
04-23-07, 07:03 PM Everyone seems to be missing the point. The Vow feats bestow powerful benefits on the condition that the character remains an absolute paragon of goodness and that said character gives up something very significant for the rest of his existence.

A psicrystal normally owns no possessions, so a Vow of Poverty would be meaningless. He doesn't need or want sex (and couldn't have it if he did), so why would the gods reward him for swearing a Vow of Chastity?
Yadot
04-23-07, 09:40 PM Everyone seems to be missing the point. The Vow feats bestow powerful benefits on the condition that the character remains an absolute paragon of goodness and that said character gives up something very significant for the rest of his existence.

A psicrystal normally owns no possessions, so a Vow of Poverty would be meaningless. He doesn't need or want sex (and couldn't have it if he did), so why would the gods reward him for swearing a Vow of Chastity?
For keeping his thoughts chaste.:P
Fromost the Grimm
04-23-07, 09:47 PM For anyone actually, honestly, seriously contemplating their PsiCrystal taking VoP . . .

. . . I'd rule that to do so, it must fore-go all it's worldly possessions.

Namely, it's Psion companion.

If it is willing to do this . . . then sure, it can have VoP.

:blink:
Mindolin
04-27-07, 11:23 AM For anyone actually, honestly, seriously contemplating their PsiCrystal taking VoP . . .

. . . I'd rule that to do so, it must fore-go all it's worldly possessions.

Namely, it's Psion companion.

:blink:

Ah, but the psion is not a worldly possession, it is a sentient creature, thus why a wizard can still have a familiar.
Scion of Coldshard
04-27-07, 11:57 AM A psicrystal normally owns no possessions, so a Vow of Poverty would be meaningless.

It is a sentient, corporeal creature. Why cant it own possessions again?

I know that I have given my psicrystals in the past stuff. A belt and a 'skin of the...' work pretty nicely on it actually. Giving it a couple ioun stones was pretty fun too ;)
Lycanthromancer
04-27-07, 01:05 PM <Snip>A psicrystal normally owns no possessions, so a Vow of Poverty would be meaningless. He doesn't need or want sex (and couldn't have it if he did)</Snip>Erm...Doesn't that...erm...depend on the psicrystal's shape...?

...
Mindolin
04-27-07, 05:01 PM Not really, magic items resize so it can mold itself to fit the psicrystal.
sooperspook
04-28-07, 03:19 AM This:
Erm...Doesn't that...erm...depend on the psicrystal's shape...?

...

And this:

Not really, magic items resize so it can mold itself to fit the psicrystal.

Make me go ..:eek:
SlanderPanic
04-28-07, 12:02 PM Erm...Doesn't that...erm...depend on the psicrystal's shape...?

You joke, but I've seen selenite "massage wands" in various sizes sold at rock-and-gem shows. A year ago, when my then-girlfriend and I were in a New Orleans rock shop, she bought several small crystal phalli.

It is a sentient, corporeal creature. Why cant it own possessions again?

I didn't say "can't." I said "usually doesn't." Being a construct, the psicrystal probably doesn't care much about possessions, but given that its mind is a fragment of a humanoid personality, I can certainly see one having traces of avarice. This wouldn't hold a candle, however, to a full person's materialistic needs and desires.
Scion of Coldshard
04-28-07, 12:18 PM I didn't say "can't." I said "usually doesn't."

I understand the difference in phrasing but 'usually doesnt' just means to me that you dont see fit to outfit them ;)

Plus it means that by taking the vow they do give up something. They might get more back than they give up depending but that doesnt bother me any.

Normally a psicrystal can have possessions and use magical items. Sometimes this even means that a psicrystal could use a magical item to help the party out in some way.

A psicrystal with the vow would give up all of that though. So they are giving up something. The ability to have items which might help them more directly (many of the bonuses from vop kindof suck anyway) and the ability to occasionally use items to help out other people.

I could definately see a psicrystal getting jealous of those larger people around it with things like hands and bodies though. Materialistic desires indeed ;)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
malivain 04-22-07, 07:52 PM	Can a psicrystal get vow of poverty?
Tempest Stormwind 04-22-07, 08:01 PM	In theory, yes. However, in practice, Exalted feats have a severe RP requirement. A psicrystal, as a fragment of the owner's personality, will likely not qualify if the owner doesn't also qualify for Exalted feats. Furthermore, since the psicrystal and the owner are, in many ways, the same creature, I doubt any psicrystal with VoP could have it justified if the owner didn't also have the VoP. All of that said, there are SO many issues with that feat that I really, really wouldn't recommend using it (or the entire Book of Exalted Cheese, for that matter). This is on top of the earlier analysis, by the way.
malivain 04-22-07, 08:03 PM	Ah alright, just curious. I figured because a psicrystal never gets any gear and doesn't split gold/gear with the party it would be sweet if I used Form of Doom and stuff like that with the little guy. -Malivain
Tempest Stormwind 04-22-07, 08:07 PM	Ah alright, just curious. I figured because a psicrystal never gets any gear and doesn't split gold/gear with the party it would be sweet if I used Form of Doom and stuff like that with the little guy. -Malivain You can already do that without the VoP. If you like this idea, do a quick board search for "The Big Guy Is With Me". Or just pop on over to the OTHER active psicrystal-feat thread (where this REALLY should have gone) and look at the recent posts; it was a work of Scion of Coldshard and is linked there.
malivain 04-22-07, 08:15 PM	Ah sorry, I didn't see the other forum. Just logged on and posted. :P Won't be so hasty next time. -Malivain
Tempest Stormwind 04-22-07, 09:30 PM	Ah sorry, I didn't see the other forum. Just logged on and posted. :P Won't be so hasty next time. -MalivainAh, good, you do remember! (http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/posting.php) Hope that this thread's proven helpful nonetheless.
MerlintheTuna 04-23-07, 03:43 PM	A psicrystal, as a fragment of the owner's personality, will likely not qualify if the owner doesn't also qualify for Exalted feats.I'm not so sure on that. The psicrystal is a fragment of the owner's personality; it could very well be the most altruistic, virtuous fragment of the owner's personality, amounting to the D&D equivalent of the shoulder-angel. By separating itself from the rest of the "taint" in the character's mind, the psicrystal ends up free from unnecessary temptations. Taken from that angle, it might actually make more sense for a psicrystal to be exalted than a human. Doesn't make it any less cheesy, but it does make a fair amount of fluff-sense.
PhaedrusXY 04-23-07, 05:47 PM	I can just imagine it with the whiny "Nobleman" NPC voice in Baldur's Gate that says "Don't touch me!". :D
AntiDjinn 04-23-07, 06:30 PM	Per the creature entry for Psicrstal: "Alignment: As master." So the master must be some variant of Good or the psicrystal won't qualify. Just because the master is exalted does not mean the crystal is likewise (and vice-versa). The exalted status requires a Good alingment, but is not itself an alignment. The status normally has to be bestowed by a celestial or other agent of the upper planes. So for your crystal to be exalted it has to be Good enough to win the praise of angels. Just wait until your start to suffer alignment drift and one day your pet rock anounces that it can no longer keep company with you.
awaken_D_M_golem 04-23-07, 06:54 PM	Given a psicrystal's personality, it should have no problem with a Vow of Anything. Vow of Poverty meet no hands or pockets. It's single minded focus, especially at higher levels, would keep it from being interested in breaking a Vow of Chastity. (cough)
AntiDjinn 04-23-07, 07:00 PM	Still needs the exalted status before it qualifies to take exalted feats. Given that it doesn't have any worldly possessions to renounce, most DMs would probably nerf it. If you are looking merely from a game balance perspective then no problems; if the DM is using rules from the BoED then he has already decided that balance is not a concern.
SlanderPanic 04-23-07, 07:03 PM	Everyone seems to be missing the point. The Vow feats bestow powerful benefits on the condition that the character remains an absolute paragon of goodness and that said character gives up something very significant for the rest of his existence. A psicrystal normally owns no possessions, so a Vow of Poverty would be meaningless. He doesn't need or want sex (and couldn't have it if he did), so why would the gods reward him for swearing a Vow of Chastity?
Yadot 04-23-07, 09:40 PM	Everyone seems to be missing the point. The Vow feats bestow powerful benefits on the condition that the character remains an absolute paragon of goodness and that said character gives up something very significant for the rest of his existence. A psicrystal normally owns no possessions, so a Vow of Poverty would be meaningless. He doesn't need or want sex (and couldn't have it if he did), so why would the gods reward him for swearing a Vow of Chastity? For keeping his thoughts chaste.:P
Fromost the Grimm 04-23-07, 09:47 PM	For anyone actually, honestly, seriously contemplating their PsiCrystal taking VoP . . . . . . I'd rule that to do so, it must fore-go all it's worldly possessions. Namely, it's Psion companion. If it is willing to do this . . . then sure, it can have VoP. :blink:
Mindolin 04-27-07, 11:23 AM	For anyone actually, honestly, seriously contemplating their PsiCrystal taking VoP . . . . . . I'd rule that to do so, it must fore-go all it's worldly possessions. Namely, it's Psion companion. :blink: Ah, but the psion is not a worldly possession, it is a sentient creature, thus why a wizard can still have a familiar.
Scion of Coldshard 04-27-07, 11:57 AM	A psicrystal normally owns no possessions, so a Vow of Poverty would be meaningless. It is a sentient, corporeal creature. Why cant it own possessions again? I know that I have given my psicrystals in the past stuff. A belt and a 'skin of the...' work pretty nicely on it actually. Giving it a couple ioun stones was pretty fun too ;)
Lycanthromancer 04-27-07, 01:05 PM	<Snip>A psicrystal normally owns no possessions, so a Vow of Poverty would be meaningless. He doesn't need or want sex (and couldn't have it if he did)</Snip>Erm...Doesn't that...erm...depend on the psicrystal's shape...? ...
Mindolin 04-27-07, 05:01 PM	Not really, magic items resize so it can mold itself to fit the psicrystal.
sooperspook 04-28-07, 03:19 AM	This: Erm...Doesn't that...erm...depend on the psicrystal's shape...? ... And this: Not really, magic items resize so it can mold itself to fit the psicrystal. Make me go ..:eek:
SlanderPanic 04-28-07, 12:02 PM	Erm...Doesn't that...erm...depend on the psicrystal's shape...? You joke, but I've seen selenite "massage wands" in various sizes sold at rock-and-gem shows. A year ago, when my then-girlfriend and I were in a New Orleans rock shop, she bought several small crystal phalli. It is a sentient, corporeal creature. Why cant it own possessions again? I didn't say "can't." I said "usually doesn't." Being a construct, the psicrystal probably doesn't care much about possessions, but given that its mind is a fragment of a humanoid personality, I can certainly see one having traces of avarice. This wouldn't hold a candle, however, to a full person's materialistic needs and desires.
Scion of Coldshard 04-28-07, 12:18 PM	I didn't say "can't." I said "usually doesn't." I understand the difference in phrasing but 'usually doesnt' just means to me that you dont see fit to outfit them ;) Plus it means that by taking the vow they do give up something. They might get more back than they give up depending but that doesnt bother me any. Normally a psicrystal can have possessions and use magical items. Sometimes this even means that a psicrystal could use a magical item to help the party out in some way. A psicrystal with the vow would give up all of that though. So they are giving up something. The ability to have items which might help them more directly (many of the bonuses from vop kindof suck anyway) and the ability to occasionally use items to help out other people. I could definately see a psicrystal getting jealous of those larger people around it with things like hands and bodies though. Materialistic desires indeed ;)