Psionic Runestaffs [Archive] - Wizards Community

Psionic Runestaffs [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Sarlax
05-30-07, 12:21 PM For those who don't know, Runestaffs are magic items appearing in the Magic Item Compendium. They permit casters access to spells they don't know or don't have prepared, casting them as if they did know them as their own spells and using their own spell slots 3 times per day. The spells in a runestaff are thematically linked, so you have a Runestaff of Charming, which gives access to Charm Person and Charm Monster.

How about psionic equivalents?

I'm really wondering about potential abuses I'm not seeing. Here's how the proposed Psicircuit (psionic circuit + psicrown) would work: It provides a number of related powers which a user can manifest with his own power points, but he can only access each power from that crown only 3 times per day. Are there any hidden problems here I'm not yet seeing?

An example might be the Psicircuit of Investigation. It gives access to the powers Aura Sight, Object Reading, and Sensitivity to Psychic Impressions. A manifester, spending his own points, can use each power as if it were on his powers known list three times per day.
Evil DM Mk3
05-30-07, 12:41 PM I can see no problems but I would ask if it was needed at all. Psionics will only stay interesting as long as it is somthing other than spell points for spells. Having/not having certain types of items would help that I think.
Tempest Stormwind
05-30-07, 01:13 PM There's already a similar item in Untapped Potential - the mindstone.
Sarlax
05-30-07, 03:34 PM There's already a similar item in Untapped Potential - the mindstone.
What is Untapped Potential?
Tempest Stormwind
05-30-07, 03:55 PM What is Untapped Potential?

See the FAQ at the top of the forum.
Sarlax
05-30-07, 03:58 PM See the FAQ at the top of the forum.
"A third party product" works just fine and is a less roundabout way of hyping your own book.
Rageheart
05-30-07, 05:13 PM "A third party product" works just fine and is a less roundabout way of hyping your own book.

Ah... but if he had said that there would have had to be a followup dialog explaining it further.

"Where is the book I gave you?"
"East"
<moves east> "Am I close?"
"No."

(Honestly, is it Tempest's fault that the item asked about is already covered in a source he helped write?
...If so I'd hate to see the kinda crap you would dish Bruce Cordell if he ever showed up in here.)
Amaril
05-31-07, 10:30 AM I can see no problems but I would ask if it was needed at all. Psionics will only stay interesting as long as it is somthing other than spell points for spells. Having/not having certain types of items would help that I think.

You mean like dorjes (wands), powerstones (scrolls), and psicrowns (staffs)?
Sarlax
05-31-07, 10:55 AM Honestly, is it Tempest's fault that the item asked about is already covered in a source he helped write?
Nope, but it's silly to send me chasing through links just to see a product page for some book he wrote, all of which doesn't get to answering at all the question I asked: Are there hidden problems of balance that come from introducing such an item?
munin
05-31-07, 01:01 PM ...Here's how the proposed Psicircuit (psionic circuit + psicrown) would work: It provides a number of related powers which a user can manifest with his own power points, but he can only access each power from that crown only 3 times per day. Are there any hidden problems here I'm not yet seeing?...

It shouldn't be problematic as long as you remember that casters can only use the spells in a runestaff (http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ps/20070216a) which are on their own spell list, and that a "psicircuit" should have a similar restriction.

A manifester's power points are more flexible than spell slots (a manifester gives up some undifferentiated power points, while a caster has to choose which prepared spell to give up), but it's probably not worth increasing the psicircuit's market price, since the manifester's flexibility with power points is already part of their nature.
forsaken1111
05-31-07, 01:08 PM Yeah, so long as it doesn't allow a psion to use powers which are specific to a discipline or another class (psywar, ardent) then it should be fine.

I think this might be less useful for erudites, since any discipline-specific power would be prohibited unless they'd already learned it and added it to their power list... at which point they really wouldn't need the psionic runestaff thing anyway.

Even more restrictive would be ardents, who could only use a psionic runestaff with a power which is in one of their chosen mantles.
Sarlax
05-31-07, 03:37 PM I think this might be less useful for erudites, since any discipline-specific power would be prohibited unless they'd already learned it and added it to their power list... at which point they really wouldn't need the psionic runestaff thing anyway.
I believe it'd actually be best for erudites since they can make a psicircuit for any power and thereby bypass their powers per day limit.
angellis_ater
05-31-07, 05:01 PM Nope, but it's silly to send me chasing through links just to see a product page for some book he wrote, all of which doesn't get to answering at all the question I asked: Are there hidden problems of balance that come from introducing such an item?

Decide for yourself - Untapped Potential is OGL:

Mindstones
A mindstone is in many ways the fusion of a power stone, an ioun stone, and a cognizance crystal. It stores a particular power, which a psionic manifester may later call upon as if he knew the power.
Physical Description: A mindstone is indistinguishable physically from an impression crystal, except that traditionally it is made of opaque stones such as opal, turquoise, and obsidian, and typically no smaller stones are included. These stones do not shed light except when used. It has the same physical statistics as a cognizance crystal.
Activation: The user must merely hold or have a mindstone on his person for a period of at least 10 minutes (which is long enough to attune
the user to the crystal). After he has attuned to the crystal, the user who holds a mindstone in his hand may cause it to orbit his head as if it were an ioun stone. He may manifest the power stored within any orbiting mindstone as if he knew the power, provided the power is on his class list and he is capable of manifesting powers of that level. Unlike most psionic items, the
manifester uses his own power points, manifester level, and key ability score when manifesting from a mindstone. Using a power from a mindstone is limited, however – a manifester uses his own manifester level or the power point limit of the stone, whichever is lower, to determine how many power points he can spend on the power.
A mindstone can hold any power with a power point cost equal to or lower than its power point limit, which is set during creation. For instance, a mindstone with a limit of 7 power points could hold the knowledge of any power of 4th level or lower, but the greatest number of power points that even the most powerful of manifesters could spend manifesting the power from it would be 7.
Storing a power within a blank mindstone requires a manifester to “lock” one of his powers known as unavailable for 24 hours, during which time he cannot manifest it (he is treated as not knowing that power for this duration). During those 24 hours, the blank mindstone must orbit his head continuously, drawing upon his sequestered psionic energy. At the end of this time, the power returns to his mind, and the mindstone is successfully attuned and is ready for use. If the manifester wishes, he may interrupt the attunement process by snatching the orbiting stone prematurely, which instantly
restores his ability to manifest the power in question (although any time spent orbiting is wasted; the stone must be attuned anew).
Flushing a mindstone takes 10 minutes of continuous meditation. At the end of this time, the mindstone returns to its blank state, and another power can be stored within. An attuned wielder knows if a crystal contains a power, although he must address the mindstone (as if it were a power stone) before he can attempt to identify an unknown power within using Psicraft.
Construction: The market price for a blank mindstone depends on its power point limit, which is always an odd number and is never higher than 17. The formula is identical to that of a cognizance crystal: determine the highest-level power that could be manifest by spending a number of points equal to its limit, square this number, and multiply by 1,000 gp. For mindstones with powers stored within, the price fluctuates wildly and must be individually negotiated (if such an item is even available).

Faint to strong psychokinesis; ML equal to power point limit, Craft Cognizance Crystal; Price: see above Weight 1 lb.

We're not that giddy for money at Dreamscarred Press. :-)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Sarlax 05-30-07, 12:21 PM	For those who don't know, Runestaffs are magic items appearing in the Magic Item Compendium. They permit casters access to spells they don't know or don't have prepared, casting them as if they did know them as their own spells and using their own spell slots 3 times per day. The spells in a runestaff are thematically linked, so you have a Runestaff of Charming, which gives access to Charm Person and Charm Monster. How about psionic equivalents? I'm really wondering about potential abuses I'm not seeing. Here's how the proposed Psicircuit (psionic circuit + psicrown) would work: It provides a number of related powers which a user can manifest with his own power points, but he can only access each power from that crown only 3 times per day. Are there any hidden problems here I'm not yet seeing? An example might be the Psicircuit of Investigation. It gives access to the powers Aura Sight, Object Reading, and Sensitivity to Psychic Impressions. A manifester, spending his own points, can use each power as if it were on his powers known list three times per day.
Evil DM Mk3 05-30-07, 12:41 PM	I can see no problems but I would ask if it was needed at all. Psionics will only stay interesting as long as it is somthing other than spell points for spells. Having/not having certain types of items would help that I think.
Tempest Stormwind 05-30-07, 01:13 PM	There's already a similar item in Untapped Potential - the mindstone.
Sarlax 05-30-07, 03:34 PM	There's already a similar item in Untapped Potential - the mindstone. What is Untapped Potential?
Tempest Stormwind 05-30-07, 03:55 PM	What is Untapped Potential? See the FAQ at the top of the forum.
Sarlax 05-30-07, 03:58 PM	See the FAQ at the top of the forum. "A third party product" works just fine and is a less roundabout way of hyping your own book.
Rageheart 05-30-07, 05:13 PM	"A third party product" works just fine and is a less roundabout way of hyping your own book. Ah... but if he had said that there would have had to be a followup dialog explaining it further. "Where is the book I gave you?" "East" <moves east> "Am I close?" "No." (Honestly, is it Tempest's fault that the item asked about is already covered in a source he helped write? ...If so I'd hate to see the kinda crap you would dish Bruce Cordell if he ever showed up in here.)
Amaril 05-31-07, 10:30 AM	I can see no problems but I would ask if it was needed at all. Psionics will only stay interesting as long as it is somthing other than spell points for spells. Having/not having certain types of items would help that I think. You mean like dorjes (wands), powerstones (scrolls), and psicrowns (staffs)?
Sarlax 05-31-07, 10:55 AM	Honestly, is it Tempest's fault that the item asked about is already covered in a source he helped write? Nope, but it's silly to send me chasing through links just to see a product page for some book he wrote, all of which doesn't get to answering at all the question I asked: Are there hidden problems of balance that come from introducing such an item?
munin 05-31-07, 01:01 PM	...Here's how the proposed Psicircuit (psionic circuit + psicrown) would work: It provides a number of related powers which a user can manifest with his own power points, but he can only access each power from that crown only 3 times per day. Are there any hidden problems here I'm not yet seeing?... It shouldn't be problematic as long as you remember that casters can only use the spells in a runestaff (http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ps/20070216a) which are on their own spell list, and that a "psicircuit" should have a similar restriction. A manifester's power points are more flexible than spell slots (a manifester gives up some undifferentiated power points, while a caster has to choose which prepared spell to give up), but it's probably not worth increasing the psicircuit's market price, since the manifester's flexibility with power points is already part of their nature.
forsaken1111 05-31-07, 01:08 PM	Yeah, so long as it doesn't allow a psion to use powers which are specific to a discipline or another class (psywar, ardent) then it should be fine. I think this might be less useful for erudites, since any discipline-specific power would be prohibited unless they'd already learned it and added it to their power list... at which point they really wouldn't need the psionic runestaff thing anyway. Even more restrictive would be ardents, who could only use a psionic runestaff with a power which is in one of their chosen mantles.
Sarlax 05-31-07, 03:37 PM	I think this might be less useful for erudites, since any discipline-specific power would be prohibited unless they'd already learned it and added it to their power list... at which point they really wouldn't need the psionic runestaff thing anyway. I believe it'd actually be best for erudites since they can make a psicircuit for any power and thereby bypass their powers per day limit.
angellis_ater 05-31-07, 05:01 PM	Nope, but it's silly to send me chasing through links just to see a product page for some book he wrote, all of which doesn't get to answering at all the question I asked: Are there hidden problems of balance that come from introducing such an item? Decide for yourself - Untapped Potential is OGL: Mindstones A mindstone is in many ways the fusion of a power stone, an ioun stone, and a cognizance crystal. It stores a particular power, which a psionic manifester may later call upon as if he knew the power. Physical Description: A mindstone is indistinguishable physically from an impression crystal, except that traditionally it is made of opaque stones such as opal, turquoise, and obsidian, and typically no smaller stones are included. These stones do not shed light except when used. It has the same physical statistics as a cognizance crystal. Activation: The user must merely hold or have a mindstone on his person for a period of at least 10 minutes (which is long enough to attune the user to the crystal). After he has attuned to the crystal, the user who holds a mindstone in his hand may cause it to orbit his head as if it were an ioun stone. He may manifest the power stored within any orbiting mindstone as if he knew the power, provided the power is on his class list and he is capable of manifesting powers of that level. Unlike most psionic items, the manifester uses his own power points, manifester level, and key ability score when manifesting from a mindstone. Using a power from a mindstone is limited, however – a manifester uses his own manifester level or the power point limit of the stone, whichever is lower, to determine how many power points he can spend on the power. A mindstone can hold any power with a power point cost equal to or lower than its power point limit, which is set during creation. For instance, a mindstone with a limit of 7 power points could hold the knowledge of any power of 4th level or lower, but the greatest number of power points that even the most powerful of manifesters could spend manifesting the power from it would be 7. Storing a power within a blank mindstone requires a manifester to “lock” one of his powers known as unavailable for 24 hours, during which time he cannot manifest it (he is treated as not knowing that power for this duration). During those 24 hours, the blank mindstone must orbit his head continuously, drawing upon his sequestered psionic energy. At the end of this time, the power returns to his mind, and the mindstone is successfully attuned and is ready for use. If the manifester wishes, he may interrupt the attunement process by snatching the orbiting stone prematurely, which instantly restores his ability to manifest the power in question (although any time spent orbiting is wasted; the stone must be attuned anew). Flushing a mindstone takes 10 minutes of continuous meditation. At the end of this time, the mindstone returns to its blank state, and another power can be stored within. An attuned wielder knows if a crystal contains a power, although he must address the mindstone (as if it were a power stone) before he can attempt to identify an unknown power within using Psicraft. Construction: The market price for a blank mindstone depends on its power point limit, which is always an odd number and is never higher than 17. The formula is identical to that of a cognizance crystal: determine the highest-level power that could be manifest by spending a number of points equal to its limit, square this number, and multiply by 1,000 gp. For mindstones with powers stored within, the price fluctuates wildly and must be individually negotiated (if such an item is even available). Faint to strong psychokinesis; ML equal to power point limit, Craft Cognizance Crystal; Price: see above Weight 1 lb. We're not that giddy for money at Dreamscarred Press. :-)