Psychic Werewolves? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Psychic Werewolves? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Rungok
02-17-08, 04:58 AM I have a psion in my campaign that got mauled by a werewolf in the adventure im running. Unfortunately im not sure what would exactly happen to him.

He failed his fortitude save and should technically contract lycanthropy but theres a few questions about it.

Firstly, He's an elan. I believe that while they are aberrations they still can contract diseases, so im pretty sure he can get it. Is that possible?

Secondly, as a psion/wizard (going for cerebremancer in a few levels) does he still have any of his abilities/memories/knowledge when he's a werewolf? or does he become a generally sucky werewolf that had a bunch of useless levels that gave him crap HP and skills that he cant use.

Thirdly, what happens when one is afflicted? Is there obvious traits of being infected, or is it subtle? I mean do they instantly explode into a full werewolf or do they kinda become it later? When being changed what kind of mental changes occur? Greater senses? change in thinking? Hunger?

If anyone could hep me out and offer up some wolfy insight i'd appreciate it.

Oh yeah, how would this affect character development XP and level-wise? Do i have to add a level adjustment or something?
BowenSilverclaw1986
02-17-08, 06:07 AM Only humanoids and giants can contract lycanthropy. Since this guy's an aberration, it won't affect him

~Bowen
kelvinaw273
02-17-08, 06:16 AM Dubious question. I would guess his Elan resiliance should throw off the lycanthropy. If he did get lycanthropy, then as an involuntary lycanthrope he will be normal unless he transforms, and then he loses his sentience and is a ravening beast. I guess some psychometabolism powers might enable him to resist the change or else keep his mind ...
Fireclave
02-17-08, 06:35 AM Bowen has it right. Elans are immune to contacting lycanthropy. But if you still want the rest of your quesitons answered, the lycanthrope monster entry (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/lycanthrope.htm) will answer all of your questions in depth.
Lycanthromancer
02-17-08, 12:23 PM An elan CAN be a lycanthrope, if he became elan after he contracted it, since he would have the 'human' subtype.

Which would be interesting, at the very least.
Bauglir
02-17-08, 01:25 PM Wouldn't he lose the template when becoming an elan? I thought it wiped everything and started you off as a 1st level character with standard elan traits.
Lycanthromancer
02-17-08, 01:32 PM DM's call, I'd guess.

After all, if the character had lost a limb, it wouldn't (necessarily) regenerate, would it?
M-bark
02-17-08, 01:33 PM An elan CAN be a lycanthrope, if he became elan after he contracted it, since he would have the 'human' subtype.

Which would be interesting, at the very least.

Humans are Elans? What? How's that possible?
teshen
02-17-08, 01:45 PM Humans are Elans? What? How's that possible?Elans are made by a psionic ritual. So if anyone is accepted by the elans that perform the ritual, the ritual is performed and he loses everything he ever was and becomes a level 1 elan.

A level 1 human commoner is accepted? Level 1 elan.
An 12 level orc warblade is accepted? Level 1 elan.
A 21 level elven archmage? Level 1 elan.
A changeling egoist 11 is accepted? Level 1 elan.
A divine minion kobold is accepted? He eats the council and steals all the power without the ritual.

Savy?
Lycanthromancer
02-17-08, 02:07 PM Except that orcs and elves can't become elans. Humans only. And a human with lycanthropy is still human (essentially).

Half-orcs, half-elves, tieflings, and aasimars still have the human subtype, meaning they still qualify for things that require being human (so they could qualify for being elan). What this does to them, however, we don't exactly know.

Becoming elan may or may not cure the lycanthropy, but it wouldn't necessarily make an elan immune to the effects of its own strain. In fact, the strain itself could mutate into something more...interesting.

However, becoming elan DOES make you aberration, which means that you can't contract lycanthropy AFTER becoming elan. Doesn't mean it can't keep the one you already had.
Bauglir
02-17-08, 03:19 PM This is true. Actually... methinks the mutation thing has given me an idea for a plot. I'll have to use this.
CrimsonDeath
02-17-08, 03:26 PM DM's call, I'd guess.

After all, if the character had lost a limb, it wouldn't (necessarily) regenerate, would it?

Would the cullers choose a candidate with only one arm?
Lycanthromancer
02-17-08, 03:29 PM I never said the 'limb' had to be an arm. Or a leg. :P

I guess it would depend on just how closely they 'evaluate' their subject. :D
InkBlot
02-17-08, 04:11 PM Many people speculate that the ritual of becoming an elan involves creating a new body from scratch, and then transfering the applicant's psyche into it. In that case, a lost limb would be restored unless there was good reason not to (e.g., if the applicant planned to continue her old life and wouldn't be able to explain the sudden reappearance of the left hand she lost when her cousin's wedding party was attacked by giants several years ago).

And it may be splitting the hair a bit too fine, but I don't think that half-humans can become elans. A half-elf isn't human, they just have human blood. The cullers are looking for humans specifically.
The_Mess
02-17-08, 04:41 PM The details of the ritual are non-existent. All that's established, really, is human-only, has to convince a committee (which is biased towards red hair) (no, really), and you become an aberration.

However, if you want to go the werewolf route anyway, without instantly upping the character several levels (which is what happens if you just apply the werewolf template), you might like to look into the old Savage Progressions (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/arch/sp) article series. They covered adding templates to characters in mid game without giving someone a huge power jump. Here are the relevant entries:

General rules for template classes (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20030824a)
Werewolf (and ghost) template class (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20040117a)
Rungok
02-17-08, 05:50 PM But this doesnt really go over the process of becoming a were-wolf. I mean is it instant? or is it over the course of the next month? Is there a means of detecting an infected? is there a cure that can be used before they fully make the change?

(Edit) Ooops! I found it at the bottom of the link provided. Sorry!
Lycanthromancer
02-17-08, 06:06 PM I don't like the way D&D does lycanthropy. A player shouldn't get punished by having an enforced alignment change for trying for damage-control (by trying to control himself while shifted). It's stupid, and punishes a player for attempting to control his own actions.

Plus, being a werewolf is just cool, and becoming an NPC because of a dumb game-rule just...isn't.

Hmm. Maybe I should come up with a racial base-class that emulates becoming a lycanthrope (and retaining efficacy throughout a 20-level class progression). I've worked on one for undead, suitable for PCs, that can emulate virtually every undead creature in the game, so I don't see why I couldn't do one for lycanthropes, too (since I love them so). Psionic lycanthropes would be awesome, especially once I make lycanthropy transmittable to ANY critter.

The main problem is that I'm getting jaded with creating D&D stuff; there's not much point, since 4e is about to make it all obsolete. *Sigh*
Sidhe_Blooded
02-17-08, 06:42 PM sorry to hijack the thread, but could you post a link to that undead class?
Lycanthromancer
02-17-08, 07:02 PM It isn't finished, and I don't like to present things like this that aren't done (although my powers revision isn't finished, it's huge enough that I needed help to finish it, as well as editing, proofreading, and potentially playtesting, so I let that one slide). I can post it, if you want it, however.

Just so you know, though, it's not done.
Sidhe_Blooded
02-17-08, 07:18 PM if you don't feel like it's ready then don't worry about it. I'll be looking forward to when it is ready though, undead are a lot of fun.

we now return you to your regularly scheduled thread.
X0_Lt_0X
02-17-08, 08:33 PM Elans are made by a psionic ritual. So if anyone is accepted by the elans that perform the ritual, the ritual is performed and he loses everything he ever was and becomes a level 1 elan.

A level 1 human commoner is accepted? Level 1 elan.
An 12 level orc warblade is accepted? Level 1 elan.
A 21 level elven archmage? Level 1 elan.
A changeling egoist 11 is accepted? Level 1 elan.
A divine minion kobold is accepted? He eats the council and steals all the power without the ritual.

Savy?

where exactly does it say that?
The_Mess
02-17-08, 11:34 PM It doesn't. The XPH is clear, only humans become Elan. They lose their accumulated experience and become a first level character. Even this is vague. First level what? Why that?

The best interpretation is that the subjected human goes back to "zeroeth" level and has to train to become a 1st level whatever (as any other race, they all have starting ages).

It's clearly not intended for this to happen to PCs. No details are provided for converting your current human character into an Elan. That's just not what they had in mind. Shame, really.

Another thing that doesn't make sense: You retain your memories and appearance of your old life... but not your knowledges? Not even Knowledge (local)? Weird.
StruckingFuggle
02-18-08, 01:19 AM I don't like the way D&D does lycanthropy. A player shouldn't get punished by having an enforced alignment change for trying for damage-control (by trying to control himself while shifted). It's stupid, and punishes a player for attempting to control his own actions.

Plus, being a werewolf is just cool, and becoming an NPC because of a dumb game-rule just...isn't.

Hmm. Maybe I should come up with a racial base-class that emulates becoming a lycanthrope (and retaining efficacy throughout a 20-level class progression). I've worked on one for undead, suitable for PCs, that can emulate virtually every undead creature in the game, so I don't see why I couldn't do one for lycanthropes, too (since I love them so). Psionic lycanthropes would be awesome, especially once I make lycanthropy transmittable to ANY critter.

The main problem is that I'm getting jaded with creating D&D stuff; there's not much point, since 4e is about to make it all obsolete. *Sigh*

Nooooooo no no no.

I'm going to be doing 3.5 for a long time, probably; though I may take some things from 4e, I dunno ... but that is awesome! And I would use it!

*encourage!*
Rungok
02-18-08, 04:02 AM Inkblot said:
Many people speculate that the ritual of becoming an elan involves creating a new body from scratch, and then transfering the applicant's psyche into it. In that case, a lost limb would be restored unless there was good reason not to.

I disagree. If Elans were literally remade from scratch then had a psyche transferred, Then the prerequisites they have been applying of Red hair and pale skin would be completely unnecessary. Since they could just make the people that are more qualified into the aesthetics they require.
kelvinaw273
02-18-08, 08:40 AM That also does not fit for the Eberron Elans, which are made by binding a criminal Quori spirit into the body of a human. The Quori is quiescent (it cannot do anything) but the human becomes an Elan. Presumably the 'requirement' for red hair and pale skin is not present for these Elans, as the Inspired and Kalashtar probably don't much care about the appearance. I imagine the Kalashtar would only use volunteers to bind quori spirits into, but the Inspired probably don't much care which could make for some interesting character creations ...
Ecalsneerg
02-18-08, 12:39 PM To answer the OP's question (and try to unravel what the question turned in to), elans cannot become lycanthropes, they are aberrations and hence immune. What happens if a lycanthrope becomes an elan isn't quite the same thing.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Rungok 02-17-08, 04:58 AM	I have a psion in my campaign that got mauled by a werewolf in the adventure im running. Unfortunately im not sure what would exactly happen to him. He failed his fortitude save and should technically contract lycanthropy but theres a few questions about it. Firstly, He's an elan. I believe that while they are aberrations they still can contract diseases, so im pretty sure he can get it. Is that possible? Secondly, as a psion/wizard (going for cerebremancer in a few levels) does he still have any of his abilities/memories/knowledge when he's a werewolf? or does he become a generally sucky werewolf that had a bunch of useless levels that gave him crap HP and skills that he cant use. Thirdly, what happens when one is afflicted? Is there obvious traits of being infected, or is it subtle? I mean do they instantly explode into a full werewolf or do they kinda become it later? When being changed what kind of mental changes occur? Greater senses? change in thinking? Hunger? If anyone could hep me out and offer up some wolfy insight i'd appreciate it. Oh yeah, how would this affect character development XP and level-wise? Do i have to add a level adjustment or something?
BowenSilverclaw1986 02-17-08, 06:07 AM	Only humanoids and giants can contract lycanthropy. Since this guy's an aberration, it won't affect him ~Bowen
kelvinaw273 02-17-08, 06:16 AM	Dubious question. I would guess his Elan resiliance should throw off the lycanthropy. If he did get lycanthropy, then as an involuntary lycanthrope he will be normal unless he transforms, and then he loses his sentience and is a ravening beast. I guess some psychometabolism powers might enable him to resist the change or else keep his mind ...
Fireclave 02-17-08, 06:35 AM	Bowen has it right. Elans are immune to contacting lycanthropy. But if you still want the rest of your quesitons answered, the lycanthrope monster entry (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/lycanthrope.htm) will answer all of your questions in depth.
Lycanthromancer 02-17-08, 12:23 PM	An elan CAN be a lycanthrope, if he became elan after he contracted it, since he would have the 'human' subtype. Which would be interesting, at the very least.
Bauglir 02-17-08, 01:25 PM	Wouldn't he lose the template when becoming an elan? I thought it wiped everything and started you off as a 1st level character with standard elan traits.
Lycanthromancer 02-17-08, 01:32 PM	DM's call, I'd guess. After all, if the character had lost a limb, it wouldn't (necessarily) regenerate, would it?
M-bark 02-17-08, 01:33 PM	An elan CAN be a lycanthrope, if he became elan after he contracted it, since he would have the 'human' subtype. Which would be interesting, at the very least. Humans are Elans? What? How's that possible?
teshen 02-17-08, 01:45 PM	Humans are Elans? What? How's that possible?Elans are made by a psionic ritual. So if anyone is accepted by the elans that perform the ritual, the ritual is performed and he loses everything he ever was and becomes a level 1 elan. A level 1 human commoner is accepted? Level 1 elan. An 12 level orc warblade is accepted? Level 1 elan. A 21 level elven archmage? Level 1 elan. A changeling egoist 11 is accepted? Level 1 elan. A divine minion kobold is accepted? He eats the council and steals all the power without the ritual. Savy?
Lycanthromancer 02-17-08, 02:07 PM	Except that orcs and elves can't become elans. Humans only. And a human with lycanthropy is still human (essentially). Half-orcs, half-elves, tieflings, and aasimars still have the human subtype, meaning they still qualify for things that require being human (so they could qualify for being elan). What this does to them, however, we don't exactly know. Becoming elan may or may not cure the lycanthropy, but it wouldn't necessarily make an elan immune to the effects of its own strain. In fact, the strain itself could mutate into something more...interesting. However, becoming elan DOES make you aberration, which means that you can't contract lycanthropy AFTER becoming elan. Doesn't mean it can't keep the one you already had.
Bauglir 02-17-08, 03:19 PM	This is true. Actually... methinks the mutation thing has given me an idea for a plot. I'll have to use this.
CrimsonDeath 02-17-08, 03:26 PM	DM's call, I'd guess. After all, if the character had lost a limb, it wouldn't (necessarily) regenerate, would it? Would the cullers choose a candidate with only one arm?
Lycanthromancer 02-17-08, 03:29 PM	I never said the 'limb' had to be an arm. Or a leg. :P I guess it would depend on just how closely they 'evaluate' their subject. :D
InkBlot 02-17-08, 04:11 PM	Many people speculate that the ritual of becoming an elan involves creating a new body from scratch, and then transfering the applicant's psyche into it. In that case, a lost limb would be restored unless there was good reason not to (e.g., if the applicant planned to continue her old life and wouldn't be able to explain the sudden reappearance of the left hand she lost when her cousin's wedding party was attacked by giants several years ago). And it may be splitting the hair a bit too fine, but I don't think that half-humans can become elans. A half-elf isn't human, they just have human blood. The cullers are looking for humans specifically.
The_Mess 02-17-08, 04:41 PM	The details of the ritual are non-existent. All that's established, really, is human-only, has to convince a committee (which is biased towards red hair) (no, really), and you become an aberration. However, if you want to go the werewolf route anyway, without instantly upping the character several levels (which is what happens if you just apply the werewolf template), you might like to look into the old Savage Progressions (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/arch/sp) article series. They covered adding templates to characters in mid game without giving someone a huge power jump. Here are the relevant entries: General rules for template classes (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20030824a) Werewolf (and ghost) template class (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20040117a)
Rungok 02-17-08, 05:50 PM	But this doesnt really go over the process of becoming a were-wolf. I mean is it instant? or is it over the course of the next month? Is there a means of detecting an infected? is there a cure that can be used before they fully make the change? (Edit) Ooops! I found it at the bottom of the link provided. Sorry!
Lycanthromancer 02-17-08, 06:06 PM	I don't like the way D&D does lycanthropy. A player shouldn't get punished by having an enforced alignment change for trying for damage-control (by trying to control himself while shifted). It's stupid, and punishes a player for attempting to control his own actions. Plus, being a werewolf is just cool, and becoming an NPC because of a dumb game-rule just...isn't. Hmm. Maybe I should come up with a racial base-class that emulates becoming a lycanthrope (and retaining efficacy throughout a 20-level class progression). I've worked on one for undead, suitable for PCs, that can emulate virtually every undead creature in the game, so I don't see why I couldn't do one for lycanthropes, too (since I love them so). Psionic lycanthropes would be awesome, especially once I make lycanthropy transmittable to ANY critter. The main problem is that I'm getting jaded with creating D&D stuff; there's not much point, since 4e is about to make it all obsolete. Sigh
Sidhe_Blooded 02-17-08, 06:42 PM	sorry to hijack the thread, but could you post a link to that undead class?
Lycanthromancer 02-17-08, 07:02 PM	It isn't finished, and I don't like to present things like this that aren't done (although my powers revision isn't finished, it's huge enough that I needed help to finish it, as well as editing, proofreading, and potentially playtesting, so I let that one slide). I can post it, if you want it, however. Just so you know, though, it's not done.
Sidhe_Blooded 02-17-08, 07:18 PM	if you don't feel like it's ready then don't worry about it. I'll be looking forward to when it is ready though, undead are a lot of fun. we now return you to your regularly scheduled thread.
X0_Lt_0X 02-17-08, 08:33 PM	Elans are made by a psionic ritual. So if anyone is accepted by the elans that perform the ritual, the ritual is performed and he loses everything he ever was and becomes a level 1 elan. A level 1 human commoner is accepted? Level 1 elan. An 12 level orc warblade is accepted? Level 1 elan. A 21 level elven archmage? Level 1 elan. A changeling egoist 11 is accepted? Level 1 elan. A divine minion kobold is accepted? He eats the council and steals all the power without the ritual. Savy? where exactly does it say that?
The_Mess 02-17-08, 11:34 PM	It doesn't. The XPH is clear, only humans become Elan. They lose their accumulated experience and become a first level character. Even this is vague. First level what? Why that? The best interpretation is that the subjected human goes back to "zeroeth" level and has to train to become a 1st level whatever (as any other race, they all have starting ages). It's clearly not intended for this to happen to PCs. No details are provided for converting your current human character into an Elan. That's just not what they had in mind. Shame, really. Another thing that doesn't make sense: You retain your memories and appearance of your old life... but not your knowledges? Not even Knowledge (local)? Weird.
StruckingFuggle 02-18-08, 01:19 AM	I don't like the way D&D does lycanthropy. A player shouldn't get punished by having an enforced alignment change for trying for damage-control (by trying to control himself while shifted). It's stupid, and punishes a player for attempting to control his own actions. Plus, being a werewolf is just cool, and becoming an NPC because of a dumb game-rule just...isn't. Hmm. Maybe I should come up with a racial base-class that emulates becoming a lycanthrope (and retaining efficacy throughout a 20-level class progression). I've worked on one for undead, suitable for PCs, that can emulate virtually every undead creature in the game, so I don't see why I couldn't do one for lycanthropes, too (since I love them so). Psionic lycanthropes would be awesome, especially once I make lycanthropy transmittable to ANY critter. The main problem is that I'm getting jaded with creating D&D stuff; there's not much point, since 4e is about to make it all obsolete. Sigh Nooooooo no no no. I'm going to be doing 3.5 for a long time, probably; though I may take some things from 4e, I dunno ... but that is awesome! And I would use it! encourage!
Rungok 02-18-08, 04:02 AM	Inkblot said: Many people speculate that the ritual of becoming an elan involves creating a new body from scratch, and then transfering the applicant's psyche into it. In that case, a lost limb would be restored unless there was good reason not to. I disagree. If Elans were literally remade from scratch then had a psyche transferred, Then the prerequisites they have been applying of Red hair and pale skin would be completely unnecessary. Since they could just make the people that are more qualified into the aesthetics they require.
kelvinaw273 02-18-08, 08:40 AM	That also does not fit for the Eberron Elans, which are made by binding a criminal Quori spirit into the body of a human. The Quori is quiescent (it cannot do anything) but the human becomes an Elan. Presumably the 'requirement' for red hair and pale skin is not present for these Elans, as the Inspired and Kalashtar probably don't much care about the appearance. I imagine the Kalashtar would only use volunteers to bind quori spirits into, but the Inspired probably don't much care which could make for some interesting character creations ...
Ecalsneerg 02-18-08, 12:39 PM	To answer the OP's question (and try to unravel what the question turned in to), elans cannot become lycanthropes, they are aberrations and hence immune. What happens if a lycanthrope becomes an elan isn't quite the same thing.