Quick Pyrokenetisist questions [Archive] - Wizards Community

Quick Pyrokenetisist questions [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Archangel_Arcanis
05-08-07, 10:07 AM 1) has it been errataed that you gain prof with your fire lash if you don't have prof with whip?
2)what do you think the best entry for it is, using it primarily for ranged combat?
3)any feats or anything to help once i hit a creature with fire immunity or high resistance?

my thoughts so far are to go wilder5/pyro x and use my wilder levels to generate offence when creature is resistant to fire. but they don't have whip prof and are lacking in skills to round out my abilities.

I also chose wilder since i will be one of very few in the setting with psi powers. I would like to avoid melee since we already have 3 melee guys and a wizard that is trying to do it all by them self. DM typically throws only 1 fight a day unless in dungeon so i figured psi would be best fit for this style game.
Tempest Stormwind
05-08-07, 10:15 AM 1) has it been errataed that you gain prof with your fire lash if you don't have prof with whip?
2)what do you think the best entry for it is, using it primarily for ranged combat?
3)any feats or anything to help once i hit a creature with fire immunity or high resistance?

my thoughts so far are to go wilder5/pyro x and use my wilder levels to generate offence when creature is resistant to fire. but they don't have whip prof and are lacking in skills to round out my abilities.

I also chose wilder since i will be one of very few in the setting with psi powers. I would like to avoid melee since we already have 3 melee guys and a wizard that is trying to do it all by them self. DM typically throws only 1 fight a day unless in dungeon so i figured psi would be best fit for this style game.
1) You don't wield it as a whip, you use ranged touch attacks with it that happen to benefit from advanced training as a whip. Like you don't need bow proficiency to fire an Acid Arrow or lance proficiency to use a Thunderlance.
2) Nothing really; it's not all that hot of a class. Unless you use the Hyperconscious version, in which case any potent warrior class works. DO NOT go in as a manifester; it doesn't advance manifesting meaning you'll be a weak manifester with a weak PrC.
3) The only one I can think of... is for mages only. Big surprise there.

If you're using psi because you can go nova, then why go pyro, since the pyro is the warlock of psionics (nearly all of his abilities are unlimited-use)?
Vharuck
05-08-07, 10:20 AM 3)any feats or anything to help once i hit a creature with fire immunity or high resistance?

Might I suggest the Run feat? :P
InkBlot
05-08-07, 01:24 PM 2)what do you think the best entry for it is, using it primarily for ranged combat?

Rogue, with two levels of Psychic Warrior. You said you wanted to round out your skills, and with 3 tanks and a wizard there's a gaping role that needs to be filled in your party. Rogue will give you the skills you need, and sneak attack, trapfinding, and evasion. Two levels of Psywar gives you the psionics you need to get into the class, and enough feats to grab Pointblank Shot, Precise Shot, Psionic Shot, and Psicrystal Affinity.

Psicrystal Affinity gives you Alertness, Skill Focus, and a great little scout who has all the skills you do but a much higher dex and size bonus to hide. If you take Psicrystal Containment later, it can give you an extra use of Psionic Shot. Keep in mind that all psionic class levels count towards your psicrystal's abilities, including Psywar and Pyro.
CrimsonDeath
05-08-07, 06:37 PM Keep in mind that all psionic class levels count towards your psicrystal's abilities, including Psywar and Pyro.
As per the feat description, which, as the primary source, supercedes anything mentioned in the class features of a prestiege class.

(Just pointing that out before anyone asks the question.)
Ithamar
05-09-07, 04:16 PM Hope its OK if I hijack the thread with a quick Pyro question: Since the lash is basically a fire whip, does that mean you do not threaten any of the squares you can reach?

I think you probably do not threaten, but I just wanted confirmation. Thanks.
Lycanthromancer
05-11-07, 02:18 PM Unless you threaten with ranged attacks, no, likely not.
Archangel_Arcanis
05-11-07, 04:23 PM thanks for the replies i decided to just go with a shaper after reading carnivore's psion guide. I wanted to go with pyro as an archer type and never be without a weapon. I know the class is weak but the dm can't ever handle it when i play my characters all out anyway. If i don't hold back the dm gets mad because i can out think them and destroy their plot or 'superdupergotakillyou' bad guy with ease because the dm doesn't understand how to build or defend against anything other than hulk smash types.

I think i just need to start playing stupid characters that way they don't think of all the things i do.
Lycanthromancer
05-13-07, 05:33 PM Meh. Go shaper, and summon, summon, summon. Oh, and use Minor Creation to make lots of poison to coat your constructs with.

Seriously, take a CLOSE look at Minor Creation. You can do a LOT with it. Also, Time Hop things like chain-links in chandeliers, and so on. Fun, fun.

(Just four little words here: "three-point-five Constructor." Look it up on Mind's Eye.)
JiCi
05-15-07, 07:55 AM 2) Nothing really; it's not all that hot of a class. Unless you use the Hyperconscious version, in which case any potent warrior class works. DO NOT go in as a manifester; it doesn't advance manifesting meaning you'll be a weak manifester with a weak PrC.Emphasis mine.

Where did you see that version Tempest ?
Archangel_Arcanis
05-15-07, 11:18 AM thanks for the advice Lycanthromancer. I wasn't planning on using Astral Construct that much since i'm not normally a summoner but with that class i will be.
CrimsonDeath
05-15-07, 04:30 PM Emphasis mine.

Where did you see that version Tempest ?

In the book, Hyperconscious.
Tempest Stormwind
05-15-07, 05:32 PM Emphasis mine.

Where did you see that version Tempest ?

At the back, in a sidebar with the Blade Manifester and variant Metamind. It's identical in all ways except with a full base attack bonus.
Lycanthromancer
05-15-07, 09:38 PM If you encounter something with an uber Armor Class, and you go Constructor, make sure you create one massive Astral Constructs, then four little ones, then have the little ones Aid Another (as well as flank). Each one will add +2 to the massive one's attack roll, with an additional +2 for flanking (if you can manage it), which adds up rather quickly. Also use your constructs as clones of yourself. If you make a high enough Craft or Disguise check, you can make your ACs look exactly like you, and your foes won't know who is who.
Zyrusticae
05-15-07, 10:37 PM At the back, in a sidebar with the Blade Manifester and variant Metamind. It's identical in all ways except with a full base attack bonus.

And a d10 HD instead of a d8.

...Just to make that clear.
AntiDjinn
05-15-07, 11:25 PM 3)any feats or anything to help once i hit a creature with fire immunity or high resistance?

Let the rest of your party handle it? Ask the spellthief to get in there and steal the target's energy resistance? Maybe just realize that you shoud have seen this moment coming (how long did you figure you would go before crossing lashes with another pyro?) and planned for it.

Depending on the route you took to enter the PrC, you have a fair to middling BAB. You should have (one would hope) at least one weapon at hand that does not deal fire damage. If you took a manifesting class for most of your base levels then hopefully you loaded up on powers that complement your PrC abilities; maybe you took a power or two that can do non-energy damage.
saidin0111
05-15-07, 11:29 PM If you encounter something with an uber Armor Class, and you go Constructor, make sure you create one massive Astral Constructs, then four little ones, then have the little ones Aid Another (as well as flank). Each one will add +2 to the massive one's attack roll, with an additional +2 for flanking (if you can manage it), which adds up rather quickly. Also use your constructs as clones of yourself. If you make a high enough Craft or Disguise check, you can make your ACs look exactly like you, and your foes won't know who is who.

Although, if you are using CPsi, the Astral Construct power has been nerfed to only one at a time, or two at once if you are a 5th level Ectopic Adept. That's right, a mediocre summoning power needed to be nerfed. Why, I'm not exactly sure, but I don't doubt it has something to do with the "Psionics is Inherently Broken" crowd whining. They seem to fail to realize that a first level power cannot be directly compared to a first level spell. An augmented power should be a little better than an auto-scaled spell. Astral Construct is being restricted on number of manifestations, while you can summon a horde of monsters with the various summon monster spells. I could see, maybe, if they restricted it to one Astral Construct of each number of HD at one time, but that still makes it nerfed compared to the Summon Monster spells. I think they decided that some of the Ectopic Forms would be too powerful to have hordes of them manifested, in which case they should have limited AC to one Ectopic Form AC at a time and not just a blanket one AC at a time.
Lycanthromancer
05-16-07, 02:29 PM Which is a laugh, considering how much they suck at higher levels.

I just choose to believe that most of CPsi doesn't exist.

I reject your reality and substitute my own.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Archangel_Arcanis 05-08-07, 10:07 AM	1) has it been errataed that you gain prof with your fire lash if you don't have prof with whip? 2)what do you think the best entry for it is, using it primarily for ranged combat? 3)any feats or anything to help once i hit a creature with fire immunity or high resistance? my thoughts so far are to go wilder5/pyro x and use my wilder levels to generate offence when creature is resistant to fire. but they don't have whip prof and are lacking in skills to round out my abilities. I also chose wilder since i will be one of very few in the setting with psi powers. I would like to avoid melee since we already have 3 melee guys and a wizard that is trying to do it all by them self. DM typically throws only 1 fight a day unless in dungeon so i figured psi would be best fit for this style game.
Tempest Stormwind 05-08-07, 10:15 AM	1) has it been errataed that you gain prof with your fire lash if you don't have prof with whip? 2)what do you think the best entry for it is, using it primarily for ranged combat? 3)any feats or anything to help once i hit a creature with fire immunity or high resistance? my thoughts so far are to go wilder5/pyro x and use my wilder levels to generate offence when creature is resistant to fire. but they don't have whip prof and are lacking in skills to round out my abilities. I also chose wilder since i will be one of very few in the setting with psi powers. I would like to avoid melee since we already have 3 melee guys and a wizard that is trying to do it all by them self. DM typically throws only 1 fight a day unless in dungeon so i figured psi would be best fit for this style game. 1) You don't wield it as a whip, you use ranged touch attacks with it that happen to benefit from advanced training as a whip. Like you don't need bow proficiency to fire an Acid Arrow or lance proficiency to use a Thunderlance. 2) Nothing really; it's not all that hot of a class. Unless you use the Hyperconscious version, in which case any potent warrior class works. DO NOT go in as a manifester; it doesn't advance manifesting meaning you'll be a weak manifester with a weak PrC. 3) The only one I can think of... is for mages only. Big surprise there. If you're using psi because you can go nova, then why go pyro, since the pyro is the warlock of psionics (nearly all of his abilities are unlimited-use)?
Vharuck 05-08-07, 10:20 AM	3)any feats or anything to help once i hit a creature with fire immunity or high resistance? Might I suggest the Run feat? :P
InkBlot 05-08-07, 01:24 PM	2)what do you think the best entry for it is, using it primarily for ranged combat? Rogue, with two levels of Psychic Warrior. You said you wanted to round out your skills, and with 3 tanks and a wizard there's a gaping role that needs to be filled in your party. Rogue will give you the skills you need, and sneak attack, trapfinding, and evasion. Two levels of Psywar gives you the psionics you need to get into the class, and enough feats to grab Pointblank Shot, Precise Shot, Psionic Shot, and Psicrystal Affinity. Psicrystal Affinity gives you Alertness, Skill Focus, and a great little scout who has all the skills you do but a much higher dex and size bonus to hide. If you take Psicrystal Containment later, it can give you an extra use of Psionic Shot. Keep in mind that all psionic class levels count towards your psicrystal's abilities, including Psywar and Pyro.
CrimsonDeath 05-08-07, 06:37 PM	Keep in mind that all psionic class levels count towards your psicrystal's abilities, including Psywar and Pyro. As per the feat description, which, as the primary source, supercedes anything mentioned in the class features of a prestiege class. (Just pointing that out before anyone asks the question.)
Ithamar 05-09-07, 04:16 PM	Hope its OK if I hijack the thread with a quick Pyro question: Since the lash is basically a fire whip, does that mean you do not threaten any of the squares you can reach? I think you probably do not threaten, but I just wanted confirmation. Thanks.
Lycanthromancer 05-11-07, 02:18 PM	Unless you threaten with ranged attacks, no, likely not.
Archangel_Arcanis 05-11-07, 04:23 PM	thanks for the replies i decided to just go with a shaper after reading carnivore's psion guide. I wanted to go with pyro as an archer type and never be without a weapon. I know the class is weak but the dm can't ever handle it when i play my characters all out anyway. If i don't hold back the dm gets mad because i can out think them and destroy their plot or 'superdupergotakillyou' bad guy with ease because the dm doesn't understand how to build or defend against anything other than hulk smash types. I think i just need to start playing stupid characters that way they don't think of all the things i do.
Lycanthromancer 05-13-07, 05:33 PM	Meh. Go shaper, and summon, summon, summon. Oh, and use Minor Creation to make lots of poison to coat your constructs with. Seriously, take a CLOSE look at Minor Creation. You can do a LOT with it. Also, Time Hop things like chain-links in chandeliers, and so on. Fun, fun. (Just four little words here: "three-point-five Constructor." Look it up on Mind's Eye.)
JiCi 05-15-07, 07:55 AM	2) Nothing really; it's not all that hot of a class. Unless you use the Hyperconscious version, in which case any potent warrior class works. DO NOT go in as a manifester; it doesn't advance manifesting meaning you'll be a weak manifester with a weak PrC.Emphasis mine. Where did you see that version Tempest ?
Archangel_Arcanis 05-15-07, 11:18 AM	thanks for the advice Lycanthromancer. I wasn't planning on using Astral Construct that much since i'm not normally a summoner but with that class i will be.
CrimsonDeath 05-15-07, 04:30 PM	Emphasis mine. Where did you see that version Tempest ? In the book, Hyperconscious.
Tempest Stormwind 05-15-07, 05:32 PM	Emphasis mine. Where did you see that version Tempest ? At the back, in a sidebar with the Blade Manifester and variant Metamind. It's identical in all ways except with a full base attack bonus.
Lycanthromancer 05-15-07, 09:38 PM	If you encounter something with an uber Armor Class, and you go Constructor, make sure you create one massive Astral Constructs, then four little ones, then have the little ones Aid Another (as well as flank). Each one will add +2 to the massive one's attack roll, with an additional +2 for flanking (if you can manage it), which adds up rather quickly. Also use your constructs as clones of yourself. If you make a high enough Craft or Disguise check, you can make your ACs look exactly like you, and your foes won't know who is who.
Zyrusticae 05-15-07, 10:37 PM	At the back, in a sidebar with the Blade Manifester and variant Metamind. It's identical in all ways except with a full base attack bonus. And a d10 HD instead of a d8. ...Just to make that clear.
AntiDjinn 05-15-07, 11:25 PM	3)any feats or anything to help once i hit a creature with fire immunity or high resistance? Let the rest of your party handle it? Ask the spellthief to get in there and steal the target's energy resistance? Maybe just realize that you shoud have seen this moment coming (how long did you figure you would go before crossing lashes with another pyro?) and planned for it. Depending on the route you took to enter the PrC, you have a fair to middling BAB. You should have (one would hope) at least one weapon at hand that does not deal fire damage. If you took a manifesting class for most of your base levels then hopefully you loaded up on powers that complement your PrC abilities; maybe you took a power or two that can do non-energy damage.
saidin0111 05-15-07, 11:29 PM	If you encounter something with an uber Armor Class, and you go Constructor, make sure you create one massive Astral Constructs, then four little ones, then have the little ones Aid Another (as well as flank). Each one will add +2 to the massive one's attack roll, with an additional +2 for flanking (if you can manage it), which adds up rather quickly. Also use your constructs as clones of yourself. If you make a high enough Craft or Disguise check, you can make your ACs look exactly like you, and your foes won't know who is who. Although, if you are using CPsi, the Astral Construct power has been nerfed to only one at a time, or two at once if you are a 5th level Ectopic Adept. That's right, a mediocre summoning power needed to be nerfed. Why, I'm not exactly sure, but I don't doubt it has something to do with the "Psionics is Inherently Broken" crowd whining. They seem to fail to realize that a first level power cannot be directly compared to a first level spell. An augmented power should be a little better than an auto-scaled spell. Astral Construct is being restricted on number of manifestations, while you can summon a horde of monsters with the various summon monster spells. I could see, maybe, if they restricted it to one Astral Construct of each number of HD at one time, but that still makes it nerfed compared to the Summon Monster spells. I think they decided that some of the Ectopic Forms would be too powerful to have hordes of them manifested, in which case they should have limited AC to one Ectopic Form AC at a time and not just a blanket one AC at a time.
Lycanthromancer 05-16-07, 02:29 PM	Which is a laugh, considering how much they suck at higher levels. I just choose to believe that most of CPsi doesn't exist. I reject your reality and substitute my own.