Saw an earlier thread [Archive] - Wizards Community

Saw an earlier thread [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Zylo_Drizzt
04-19-07, 09:10 PM The thread was talking earlier about warforged having Psionic substitution levels. I was wondering if anyone has come up with any?

here is the first completed one ( I think. there might be changes later. )

Warforged Psychic Warrior Substitution Levels:

HD: D10

Code:
Table: Warforged Psychic Warrior Substitution Levels
Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special
1 0 +2 +0 +0 Bonus Psionic feat Bonus Warforged feat
4 3 +4 +1 +1 Power Psionic Repair Damage
5 3 +5 +1 +1 Bonus feat Efficient MindBonus warforged feat (Ex): A warforged psychic warrior gains a bonus warforged feat for which he meets the prerequisites.

One with Body: A warforged psychic warrior has learned to rely on himself to heal, since they do not heal naturally and normal healing spells don't work as well for them as they do for others. Beginning at 4th level, a warforged psychic warrior may add psionic repair damage to his 2nd level powers known instead of his normal 2nd level power.

Efficient Mind (Ex): To regain power points, a warforged must spend hours of a time doing almost nothing. What else is there to do but contemplate the mysteries of his powers, and to come to understand said powers better? From this understanding, a warforged psychic warrior learns how to use them more efficiently. Beginning at 5th level, a warforged psychic warrior can expend his psionic focus to reduce the cost of all powers he manifests in that round by 2 power points. This allows the warforged to spend more points on augmenting powers as well, should he wish to do so.
Abilities in red removed
Kiklio
04-19-07, 10:14 PM I'm not completely sure of my Eberron knowledge, but you may be thinking of the Psiforged, a warforged with the Psiforged Body feat. The feat appears in Magic of Eberron. If there are warforged artificer substitution levels, they should work equally well with the psionic artificer class. I hope this helps.
InkBlot
04-20-07, 02:27 AM No, he's talking about somebody's idea for a psicrystal docent. Instead of an independant mobile psicrystal, a warforged could get a psicrystal that just sits in the docent slot on his chest.

Whoever thought it up never fleshed out the idea, and never gave a good reason why it should be a substitution level even though psicrystals aren't a class feature.

It was a recent thread, so it should only be a couple pages back.
Zylo_Drizzt
04-20-07, 10:37 AM Yes but I think the warforged should have some psionic substitution levels any ways. I just don't know where to start.
Batshido
04-20-07, 10:40 AM Yes but I think the warforged should have some psionic substitution levels any ways. I just don't know where to start.

Well this is certainly the forum to spitball in.

Throw out your reasoning and I'm sure we can figure something out. ;)
Zylo_Drizzt
04-20-07, 11:08 AM The warforged or psiforged seem like are or at least would be exellent Shapers, Egoist, and Psychic warriors. I mean you see all the new races in eberron have at least one psionic substitution level (I don't have the book so I might be wrong about the shifter) except the warforged.
Batshido
04-20-07, 12:21 PM The warforged or psiforged seem like are or at least would be exellent Shapers, Egoist, and Psychic warriors. I mean you see all the new races in eberron have at least one psionic substitution level (I don't have the book so I might be wrong about the shifter) except the warforged.

Here's an idea:

Psi-Forged Psychic Warrior:
Sub-level 1: Bonus Warforged Feat. Replaces Bonus Psy-Warrior Feat
Sub-level 4: Psionic Repair Damage power learned. Replaces Psy-Warrior power learned.
Sub-level 8: DR 2/- while Focused. Replaces Bonus Psy-Warrior Feat.

Fluff: Psi-Forged Sub-levels represent the Psi-Forged becoming more in tune with his own form and learning to use his abilities to fortify himself.

The level 8 power may be a little over the top, what do you think?

Edit: Maybe a d10 hit die wouldn't be out of the question.
Zylo_Drizzt
04-20-07, 12:31 PM I like it but it seems to me it needs something...
FreAkOuTRG
04-21-07, 03:05 PM I tried to do this, despite having no psionic books or eberron books. I was pretty sure their was already a psionic body feat, but since I couldn't find it I made it myself. Here's my take:

Warforged Psychic Warrior Substitution Levels:

HD: D10
Table: Warforged Psychic Warrior Substitution Levels
Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special
1 0 +2 +0 +0 Bonus Psionic feat Bonus Warforged feat
2 1 +3 +0 +0 Power One with Body
5 3 +5 +1 +1 Bonus feat Efficient Mind

Bonus warforged feat (Ex): A warforged psychic warrior gains a bonus warforged feat for which he meets the prerequisites.

One with Body: A warforged psychic warrior has learned to rely on himself to heal, since they do not heal naturally and normal healing spells don't work as well for them as they do for others. Beginning at 2nd level, a psychic warrior with a wisdom score of 12 or higher can expend power points and a standard action to heal an amount of damage equal to the power points spent times the psychic warriors wisdom modifier. A warforged psychic warrior does not gain a power at 2nd level.

Efficient Mind (Ex): To regain power points, a warforged must spend hours of a time doing almost nothing. What else is there to do but contemplate the mysteries of his powers, and to come to understand said powers better? From this understanding, a warforged psychic warrior learns how to use them more efficiently. Beginning at 5th level, a warforged psychic warrior powers cost 2 PP less than those of normal psychic warriors, though this can not lower the cost of a power to below 1 PP. This has no effect on how a psychic warrior augments his powers, beyond allowing him to augment them further before reaching his limit of his character level.

Abilities in red removed[/B]
Zylo_Drizzt
04-21-07, 03:15 PM I like the HD going up. I like the mid and last substitution by Freakoutrg but I think the first goes to batshido.

Oh by the way Freakoutrg the psiforged body has the ability to store pp.

For the cost of pp which one is better for the mid level substitution between these 2?
FreAkOuTRG
04-21-07, 03:31 PM I like the HD going up. I like the mid and last substitution by Freakoutrg but I think the first goes to batshido.
Thanks.Oh by the way Freakoutrg the psiforged body has the ability to store pp. Ah, I thought there was one.For the cost of pp which one is better for the mid level substitution between these 2?Que?

I've changed my post somewhat.
calronmoonflower
04-21-07, 04:08 PM One with Body: A warforged psychic warrior has learned to rely on himself to heal, since they do not heal naturally and normal healing spells don't work as well for them as they do for others. Beginning at 2nd level, a psychic warrior with a wisdom score of 12 or higher can expend power points and a standard action to heal an amount of damage equal to the power points spent times the psychic warriors wisdom modifier. A warforged psychic warrior does not gain a power at 2nd level.

The Body Adjustment power will actually work far better than this. Because psionics has no sub-schools, and their for no healing sub-school, warforged gain the full benefit from psionic healing.
FreAkOuTRG
04-22-07, 07:52 PM The Body Adjustment power will actually work far better than this. Because psionics has no sub-schools, and their for no healing sub-school, warforged gain the full benefit from psionic healing.

Far better?
Average healing (Body Adjustment)

Lvl 2: None
Lvl 4: 1d12 (6)
Lvl 5: 3d12 (6.5x3=19)
Lvl 10: 5d12 (6.5x5=32)
Lvl 20: 9d12 (6.5x9=58)

Average healing (One with Body, assuming +2 Wisdom)

Lvl 2: 2x2 (4)
Lvl 4: 4x2 (8)
Lvl 5: 7x2 (14)
Lvl 10: 12x2 (24)
Lvl 20: 22x2 (44)

Still a bit behind, but not that far, and it's available earlier. Plus, a periapt of wisdom boosts it past easily. Of course, with a feat, Body adjustment can be maximized or empowered.

Oh, and by the way, Body Adjustment is a Psychometabolism [healing] power. Psionics do have subschools. Check here (http://www.d20srd.org/indexes/psionicPowersOverview.htm). It's a simple thing to house rule that psychometabolism [healing] spells are cut in half as well. Especially with magic transperency.

Nonetheless, do you have any ideas to improve it, or will you simply criticize me?

Possible idea: It costs no power points (and thus does not benifit from Efficient Mind), but you have to expend your psionic focus.
Batshido
04-22-07, 08:13 PM Possible idea: It costs no power points (and thus does not benifit from Efficient Mind), but you have to expend your psionic focus.
This would be all kinds of broken. It's basically like saying "as long as you can gain a psionic focus, you can always have full health."

I could see limiting it to once per day for every 4 levels, or something like that.

Oh, and by the way, Body Adjustment is a Psychometabolism [healing] power. Psionics do have subschools. Check here. It's a simple thing to house rule that psychometabolism [healing] spells are cut in half as well. Especially with magic transperency.
This is exactly why I suggested Psionic Repair Damage. The Warforged has no issues with that.

I like the idea behind the 5th replacement level you put up, but it's not terribly balanced. Over the course of the day, it's going to end up letting him manifest between 50% and 100% more powers. It also effectively drops 2nd level powers to cost as much as 1st level powers, so it takes a lot of the decision making out of the class.

What if we allow it, but he has to expend his focus to do it? So he could manifest Psionic Lion's Charge for 1 pp, but he has to loose his focus in order to make up the difference. If we do this, it'll basically be like giving him an extra 2 power points a combat (because realistically refocusing in combat is problematic at best) at the cost of not being able to use Psionic Weapon or Invest Armor that combat. It'd be an ability that offered another level of depth to the character without flat-out ramping up his power level.
calronmoonflower
04-22-07, 08:39 PM Still a bit behind, but not that far, and it's available earlier. Plus, a periapt of wisdom boosts it past easily. Of course, with a feat, Body adjustment can be maximized or empowered.

Oh, and by the way, Body Adjustment is a Psychometabolism [healing] power. Psionics do have subschools. Check here (http://www.d20srd.org/indexes/psionicPowersOverview.htm). It's a simple thing to house rule that psychometabolism [healing] spells are cut in half as well. Especially with magic transperency.

Nonetheless, do you have any ideas to improve it, or will you simply criticize me?

Possible idea: It costs no power points (and thus does not benifit from Efficient Mind), but you have to expend your psionic focus.

Sorry I'm half-blind sometimes. I didn't see the times Wis mod part.

Also why nerf the psionic healing of warforged?
Batshido
04-22-07, 08:44 PM Sorry I'm half-blind sometimes. I didn't see the times Wis mod part.

Also why nerf the psionic healing of warforged?

All effects from the sub-school of "Healing" are nerfed when used on a Warforged. The alternate abilities we're putting out there are attempts to get around that.
FreAkOuTRG
04-22-07, 09:16 PM This would be all kinds of broken. It's basically like saying "as long as you can gain a psionic focus, you can always have full health."

I could see limiting it to once per day for every 4 levels, or something like that.Sorry, didn't make myself clear. Think Lay on Hands (paladin)This is exactly why I suggested Psionic Repair Damage. The Warforged has no issues with that.Where is this power?I like the idea behind the 5th replacement level you put up, but it's not terribly balanced. Over the course of the day, it's going to end up letting him manifest between 50% and 100% more powers. It also effectively drops 2nd level powers to cost as much as 1st level powers, so it takes a lot of the decision making out of the class.

What if we allow it, but he has to expend his focus to do it? So he could manifest Psionic Lion's Charge for 1 pp, but he has to loose his focus in order to make up the difference. If we do this, it'll basically be like giving him an extra 2 power points a combat (because realistically refocusing in combat is problematic at best) at the cost of not being able to use Psionic Weapon or Invest Armor that combat. It'd be an ability that offered another level of depth to the character without flat-out ramping up his power level.It's a standard action to expend focus right? If so, I'm not sure I like this. Will think on ways to fix it.Sorry I'm half-blind sometimes. I didn't see the times Wis mod part.

Also why nerf the psionic healing of warforged?Meant that the DM could house rule it.All effects from the sub-school of "Healing" are nerfed when used on a Warforged. The alternate abilities we're putting out there are attempts to get around that.Technically, I believe it's just Conjuration [healing] spells; technically. I would say it's best to have it cut in half anyway.
calronmoonflower
04-22-07, 09:19 PM All effects from the sub-school of "Healing" are nerfed when used on a Warforged. The alternate abilities we're putting out there are attempts to get around that.

But psionics has no subschool, so they do an end run around the healing warforged limitations.

From the Main FAQ i hightlighted the key parts of the quote.
Healing spells and spell-like effects don’t work in the
Mournland (EBERRON Campaign Setting, page 188). What
about magic items that create such effects, such as a potion
of cure light wounds? What about the paladin’s lay on
hands or the monk’s wholeness of body? What about
psionic powers that heal damage?
No magic item effect that duplicates a spell from the
healing subschool functions within the Mournland. A wand of
cure light wounds, a scroll of cure serious wounds, and a potion
of cure moderate wounds are all equally useless inside that
land’s borders.
Extraordinary and supernatural abilities that heal hit point
damage function normally, making the paladin an extremely
valuable member of a Mournland-bound adventuring party.
Spells that heal damage but which aren’t from the healing
subschool (such as goodberry) work normally. Since psionic
powers don’t have the healing subschool (and in fact don’t
have subschools at all), they would also function normally.
Furthermore, while you are within an extradimensional
space (such as that created by rope trick or Mordenkainen’s
magnificent mansion), you can ignore this restriction entirely.
FreAkOuTRG
04-22-07, 09:24 PM But psionics has no subschool, so they do an end run around the healing warforged limitations.

From the Main FAQ i hightlighted the key parts of the quote.

I would say it would work in mournland as well, but not because there are no subschools - if you check the link I posted you'll see that they actually do have subschools. I see mournland as blocking divine power, not psionic.
Batshido
04-22-07, 09:29 PM Sorry, didn't make myself clear. Think Lay on Hands (paladin)
That seems a little more reasonable.
Where is this power?
XPH page 127, or here (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/psionicRepairDamage.htm).
It's a standard action to expend focus right? If so, I'm not sure I like this. Will think on ways to fix it.
Expending your focus takes no actual time at all. The ability you use it for takes a certain amount of time. Think Metapsionic feats or something like Psionic Weapon. It doesn't take you 2 standard actions (and therefor more than a turn) to manifest a Meta'ed power or make one Psionic Weapon enhanced attack. That's because expending your focus is basically a free action, even though it's not called that.
But psionics has no subschool, so they do an end run around the healing warforged limitations.
Ah, true. My mistake.
FreAkOuTRG
04-22-07, 09:36 PM That seems a little more reasonable.

XPH page 127, or here (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/psionicRepairDamage.htm). Now that I've seen it, it does seem better.
Expending your focus takes no actual time at all. The ability you use it for takes a certain amount of time. Think Metapsionic feats or something like Psionic Weapon. It doesn't take you 2 standard actions (and therefor more than a turn) to manifest a Meta'ed power or make one Psionic Weapon enhanced attack. That's because expending your focus is basically a free action, even though it's not called that.Ah, okAh, true. My mistake.Despite what the FAQ said, I maintain that I believe that it does have subschools. Of course, I still say they can get around it, but that's beside the point.
FreAkOuTRG
04-22-07, 09:42 PM How about this?

Warforged Psychic Warrior Substitution Levels:

HD: D10
Table: Warforged Psychic Warrior Substitution Levels
Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special
1 0 +2 +0 +0 Bonus Psionic feat Bonus Warforged feat
4 3 +4 +1 +1 Power Psionic Repair Damage
5 3 +5 +1 +1 Bonus feat Efficient Mind

Bonus warforged feat (Ex): A warforged psychic warrior gains a bonus warforged feat for which he meets the prerequisites.

Psionic Repair Damage: A warforged psychic warrior has learned to rely on himself to heal, since they do not heal naturally and normal healing spells don't work as well for them as they do for others. Beginning at 4th level, a warforged psychic warrior may add psionic repair damage to his 2nd level powers known instead of his normal 2nd level power.

Efficient Mind (Ex): To regain power points, a warforged must spend hours of a time doing almost nothing. What else is there to do but contemplate the mysteries of his powers, and to come to understand said powers better? From this understanding, a warforged psychic warrior learns how to use them more efficiently. Beginning at 5th level, a warforged psychic warrior can expend his psionic focus to reduce the cost of all powers he manifests in that round by 2 power points. This allows the warforged to spend more points on augmenting powers as well, should he wish to do so.
Abilities in red removed
Zylo_Drizzt
04-23-07, 10:49 AM very nice FreAkOuTRG. I think we should all work on the shaper or egoist now.

Warforged Psychic Warrior Substitution Levels:

HD: D10

Code:
Table: Warforged Psychic Warrior Substitution Levels
Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special
1 0 +2 +0 +0 Bonus Psionic feat Bonus Warforged feat
4 3 +4 +1 +1 Power Psionic Repair Damage
5 3 +5 +1 +1 Bonus feat Efficient MindBonus warforged feat (Ex): A warforged psychic warrior gains a bonus warforged feat for which he meets the prerequisites.

One with Body: A warforged psychic warrior has learned to rely on himself to heal, since they do not heal naturally and normal healing spells don't work as well for them as they do for others. Beginning at 4th level, a warforged psychic warrior may add psionic repair damage to his 2nd level powers known instead of his normal 2nd level power.

Efficient Mind (Ex): To regain power points, a warforged must spend hours of a time doing almost nothing. What else is there to do but contemplate the mysteries of his powers, and to come to understand said powers better? From this understanding, a warforged psychic warrior learns how to use them more efficiently. Beginning at 5th level, a warforged psychic warrior can expend his psionic focus to reduce the cost of all powers he manifests in that round by 2 power points. This allows the warforged to spend more points on augmenting powers as well, should he wish to do so.
Abilities in red removed

I will post this at the top.

if you guys make changes please let me know. same goes for any other psionic substitution levels you come up with that we all agree is balanced.

Has anyone come up with any other psionic substitution levels or replacement for psionic classes? If so please post that here.
FreAkOuTRG
04-23-07, 03:27 PM Zylo, try hitting the "Quote" button at the bottom of my last post and then put that in the first post.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Zylo_Drizzt 04-19-07, 09:10 PM	The thread was talking earlier about warforged having Psionic substitution levels. I was wondering if anyone has come up with any? here is the first completed one ( I think. there might be changes later. ) Warforged Psychic Warrior Substitution Levels: HD: D10 Code: Table: Warforged Psychic Warrior Substitution Levels Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special 1 0 +2 +0 +0 Bonus Psionic feat Bonus Warforged feat 4 3 +4 +1 +1 Power Psionic Repair Damage 5 3 +5 +1 +1 Bonus feat Efficient MindBonus warforged feat (Ex): A warforged psychic warrior gains a bonus warforged feat for which he meets the prerequisites. One with Body: A warforged psychic warrior has learned to rely on himself to heal, since they do not heal naturally and normal healing spells don't work as well for them as they do for others. Beginning at 4th level, a warforged psychic warrior may add psionic repair damage to his 2nd level powers known instead of his normal 2nd level power. Efficient Mind (Ex): To regain power points, a warforged must spend hours of a time doing almost nothing. What else is there to do but contemplate the mysteries of his powers, and to come to understand said powers better? From this understanding, a warforged psychic warrior learns how to use them more efficiently. Beginning at 5th level, a warforged psychic warrior can expend his psionic focus to reduce the cost of all powers he manifests in that round by 2 power points. This allows the warforged to spend more points on augmenting powers as well, should he wish to do so. Abilities in red removed
Kiklio 04-19-07, 10:14 PM	I'm not completely sure of my Eberron knowledge, but you may be thinking of the Psiforged, a warforged with the Psiforged Body feat. The feat appears in Magic of Eberron. If there are warforged artificer substitution levels, they should work equally well with the psionic artificer class. I hope this helps.
InkBlot 04-20-07, 02:27 AM	No, he's talking about somebody's idea for a psicrystal docent. Instead of an independant mobile psicrystal, a warforged could get a psicrystal that just sits in the docent slot on his chest. Whoever thought it up never fleshed out the idea, and never gave a good reason why it should be a substitution level even though psicrystals aren't a class feature. It was a recent thread, so it should only be a couple pages back.
Zylo_Drizzt 04-20-07, 10:37 AM	Yes but I think the warforged should have some psionic substitution levels any ways. I just don't know where to start.
Batshido 04-20-07, 10:40 AM	Yes but I think the warforged should have some psionic substitution levels any ways. I just don't know where to start. Well this is certainly the forum to spitball in. Throw out your reasoning and I'm sure we can figure something out. ;)
Zylo_Drizzt 04-20-07, 11:08 AM	The warforged or psiforged seem like are or at least would be exellent Shapers, Egoist, and Psychic warriors. I mean you see all the new races in eberron have at least one psionic substitution level (I don't have the book so I might be wrong about the shifter) except the warforged.
Batshido 04-20-07, 12:21 PM	The warforged or psiforged seem like are or at least would be exellent Shapers, Egoist, and Psychic warriors. I mean you see all the new races in eberron have at least one psionic substitution level (I don't have the book so I might be wrong about the shifter) except the warforged. Here's an idea: Psi-Forged Psychic Warrior: Sub-level 1: Bonus Warforged Feat. Replaces Bonus Psy-Warrior Feat Sub-level 4: Psionic Repair Damage power learned. Replaces Psy-Warrior power learned. Sub-level 8: DR 2/- while Focused. Replaces Bonus Psy-Warrior Feat. Fluff: Psi-Forged Sub-levels represent the Psi-Forged becoming more in tune with his own form and learning to use his abilities to fortify himself. The level 8 power may be a little over the top, what do you think? Edit: Maybe a d10 hit die wouldn't be out of the question.
Zylo_Drizzt 04-20-07, 12:31 PM	I like it but it seems to me it needs something...
FreAkOuTRG 04-21-07, 03:05 PM	I tried to do this, despite having no psionic books or eberron books. I was pretty sure their was already a psionic body feat, but since I couldn't find it I made it myself. Here's my take: Warforged Psychic Warrior Substitution Levels: HD: D10 Table: Warforged Psychic Warrior Substitution Levels Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special 1 0 +2 +0 +0 Bonus Psionic feat Bonus Warforged feat 2 1 +3 +0 +0 Power One with Body 5 3 +5 +1 +1 Bonus feat Efficient Mind Bonus warforged feat (Ex): A warforged psychic warrior gains a bonus warforged feat for which he meets the prerequisites. One with Body: A warforged psychic warrior has learned to rely on himself to heal, since they do not heal naturally and normal healing spells don't work as well for them as they do for others. Beginning at 2nd level, a psychic warrior with a wisdom score of 12 or higher can expend power points and a standard action to heal an amount of damage equal to the power points spent times the psychic warriors wisdom modifier. A warforged psychic warrior does not gain a power at 2nd level. Efficient Mind (Ex): To regain power points, a warforged must spend hours of a time doing almost nothing. What else is there to do but contemplate the mysteries of his powers, and to come to understand said powers better? From this understanding, a warforged psychic warrior learns how to use them more efficiently. Beginning at 5th level, a warforged psychic warrior powers cost 2 PP less than those of normal psychic warriors, though this can not lower the cost of a power to below 1 PP. This has no effect on how a psychic warrior augments his powers, beyond allowing him to augment them further before reaching his limit of his character level. Abilities in red removed[/B]
Zylo_Drizzt 04-21-07, 03:15 PM	I like the HD going up. I like the mid and last substitution by Freakoutrg but I think the first goes to batshido. Oh by the way Freakoutrg the psiforged body has the ability to store pp. For the cost of pp which one is better for the mid level substitution between these 2?
FreAkOuTRG 04-21-07, 03:31 PM	I like the HD going up. I like the mid and last substitution by Freakoutrg but I think the first goes to batshido. Thanks.Oh by the way Freakoutrg the psiforged body has the ability to store pp. Ah, I thought there was one.For the cost of pp which one is better for the mid level substitution between these 2?Que? I've changed my post somewhat.
calronmoonflower 04-21-07, 04:08 PM	One with Body: A warforged psychic warrior has learned to rely on himself to heal, since they do not heal naturally and normal healing spells don't work as well for them as they do for others. Beginning at 2nd level, a psychic warrior with a wisdom score of 12 or higher can expend power points and a standard action to heal an amount of damage equal to the power points spent times the psychic warriors wisdom modifier. A warforged psychic warrior does not gain a power at 2nd level. The Body Adjustment power will actually work far better than this. Because psionics has no sub-schools, and their for no healing sub-school, warforged gain the full benefit from psionic healing.
FreAkOuTRG 04-22-07, 07:52 PM	The Body Adjustment power will actually work far better than this. Because psionics has no sub-schools, and their for no healing sub-school, warforged gain the full benefit from psionic healing. Far better? Average healing (Body Adjustment) Lvl 2: None Lvl 4: 1d12 (6) Lvl 5: 3d12 (6.5x3=19) Lvl 10: 5d12 (6.5x5=32) Lvl 20: 9d12 (6.5x9=58) Average healing (One with Body, assuming +2 Wisdom) Lvl 2: 2x2 (4) Lvl 4: 4x2 (8) Lvl 5: 7x2 (14) Lvl 10: 12x2 (24) Lvl 20: 22x2 (44) Still a bit behind, but not that far, and it's available earlier. Plus, a periapt of wisdom boosts it past easily. Of course, with a feat, Body adjustment can be maximized or empowered. Oh, and by the way, Body Adjustment is a Psychometabolism [healing] power. Psionics do have subschools. Check here (http://www.d20srd.org/indexes/psionicPowersOverview.htm). It's a simple thing to house rule that psychometabolism [healing] spells are cut in half as well. Especially with magic transperency. Nonetheless, do you have any ideas to improve it, or will you simply criticize me? Possible idea: It costs no power points (and thus does not benifit from Efficient Mind), but you have to expend your psionic focus.
Batshido 04-22-07, 08:13 PM	Possible idea: It costs no power points (and thus does not benifit from Efficient Mind), but you have to expend your psionic focus. This would be all kinds of broken. It's basically like saying "as long as you can gain a psionic focus, you can always have full health." I could see limiting it to once per day for every 4 levels, or something like that. Oh, and by the way, Body Adjustment is a Psychometabolism [healing] power. Psionics do have subschools. Check here. It's a simple thing to house rule that psychometabolism [healing] spells are cut in half as well. Especially with magic transperency. This is exactly why I suggested Psionic Repair Damage. The Warforged has no issues with that. I like the idea behind the 5th replacement level you put up, but it's not terribly balanced. Over the course of the day, it's going to end up letting him manifest between 50% and 100% more powers. It also effectively drops 2nd level powers to cost as much as 1st level powers, so it takes a lot of the decision making out of the class. What if we allow it, but he has to expend his focus to do it? So he could manifest Psionic Lion's Charge for 1 pp, but he has to loose his focus in order to make up the difference. If we do this, it'll basically be like giving him an extra 2 power points a combat (because realistically refocusing in combat is problematic at best) at the cost of not being able to use Psionic Weapon or Invest Armor that combat. It'd be an ability that offered another level of depth to the character without flat-out ramping up his power level.
calronmoonflower 04-22-07, 08:39 PM	Still a bit behind, but not that far, and it's available earlier. Plus, a periapt of wisdom boosts it past easily. Of course, with a feat, Body adjustment can be maximized or empowered. Oh, and by the way, Body Adjustment is a Psychometabolism [healing] power. Psionics do have subschools. Check here (http://www.d20srd.org/indexes/psionicPowersOverview.htm). It's a simple thing to house rule that psychometabolism [healing] spells are cut in half as well. Especially with magic transperency. Nonetheless, do you have any ideas to improve it, or will you simply criticize me? Possible idea: It costs no power points (and thus does not benifit from Efficient Mind), but you have to expend your psionic focus. Sorry I'm half-blind sometimes. I didn't see the times Wis mod part. Also why nerf the psionic healing of warforged?
Batshido 04-22-07, 08:44 PM	Sorry I'm half-blind sometimes. I didn't see the times Wis mod part. Also why nerf the psionic healing of warforged? All effects from the sub-school of "Healing" are nerfed when used on a Warforged. The alternate abilities we're putting out there are attempts to get around that.
FreAkOuTRG 04-22-07, 09:16 PM	This would be all kinds of broken. It's basically like saying "as long as you can gain a psionic focus, you can always have full health." I could see limiting it to once per day for every 4 levels, or something like that.Sorry, didn't make myself clear. Think Lay on Hands (paladin)This is exactly why I suggested Psionic Repair Damage. The Warforged has no issues with that.Where is this power?I like the idea behind the 5th replacement level you put up, but it's not terribly balanced. Over the course of the day, it's going to end up letting him manifest between 50% and 100% more powers. It also effectively drops 2nd level powers to cost as much as 1st level powers, so it takes a lot of the decision making out of the class. What if we allow it, but he has to expend his focus to do it? So he could manifest Psionic Lion's Charge for 1 pp, but he has to loose his focus in order to make up the difference. If we do this, it'll basically be like giving him an extra 2 power points a combat (because realistically refocusing in combat is problematic at best) at the cost of not being able to use Psionic Weapon or Invest Armor that combat. It'd be an ability that offered another level of depth to the character without flat-out ramping up his power level.It's a standard action to expend focus right? If so, I'm not sure I like this. Will think on ways to fix it.Sorry I'm half-blind sometimes. I didn't see the times Wis mod part. Also why nerf the psionic healing of warforged?Meant that the DM could house rule it.All effects from the sub-school of "Healing" are nerfed when used on a Warforged. The alternate abilities we're putting out there are attempts to get around that.Technically, I believe it's just Conjuration [healing] spells; technically. I would say it's best to have it cut in half anyway.
calronmoonflower 04-22-07, 09:19 PM	All effects from the sub-school of "Healing" are nerfed when used on a Warforged. The alternate abilities we're putting out there are attempts to get around that. But psionics has no subschool, so they do an end run around the healing warforged limitations. From the Main FAQ i hightlighted the key parts of the quote. Healing spells and spell-like effects don’t work in the Mournland (EBERRON Campaign Setting, page 188). What about magic items that create such effects, such as a potion of cure light wounds? What about the paladin’s lay on hands or the monk’s wholeness of body? What about psionic powers that heal damage? No magic item effect that duplicates a spell from the healing subschool functions within the Mournland. A wand of cure light wounds, a scroll of cure serious wounds, and a potion of cure moderate wounds are all equally useless inside that land’s borders. Extraordinary and supernatural abilities that heal hit point damage function normally, making the paladin an extremely valuable member of a Mournland-bound adventuring party. Spells that heal damage but which aren’t from the healing subschool (such as goodberry) work normally. Since psionic powers don’t have the healing subschool (and in fact don’t have subschools at all), they would also function normally. Furthermore, while you are within an extradimensional space (such as that created by rope trick or Mordenkainen’s magnificent mansion), you can ignore this restriction entirely.
FreAkOuTRG 04-22-07, 09:24 PM	But psionics has no subschool, so they do an end run around the healing warforged limitations. From the Main FAQ i hightlighted the key parts of the quote. I would say it would work in mournland as well, but not because there are no subschools - if you check the link I posted you'll see that they actually do have subschools. I see mournland as blocking divine power, not psionic.
Batshido 04-22-07, 09:29 PM	Sorry, didn't make myself clear. Think Lay on Hands (paladin) That seems a little more reasonable. Where is this power? XPH page 127, or here (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/psionicRepairDamage.htm). It's a standard action to expend focus right? If so, I'm not sure I like this. Will think on ways to fix it. Expending your focus takes no actual time at all. The ability you use it for takes a certain amount of time. Think Metapsionic feats or something like Psionic Weapon. It doesn't take you 2 standard actions (and therefor more than a turn) to manifest a Meta'ed power or make one Psionic Weapon enhanced attack. That's because expending your focus is basically a free action, even though it's not called that. But psionics has no subschool, so they do an end run around the healing warforged limitations. Ah, true. My mistake.
FreAkOuTRG 04-22-07, 09:36 PM	That seems a little more reasonable. XPH page 127, or here (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/psionicRepairDamage.htm). Now that I've seen it, it does seem better. Expending your focus takes no actual time at all. The ability you use it for takes a certain amount of time. Think Metapsionic feats or something like Psionic Weapon. It doesn't take you 2 standard actions (and therefor more than a turn) to manifest a Meta'ed power or make one Psionic Weapon enhanced attack. That's because expending your focus is basically a free action, even though it's not called that.Ah, okAh, true. My mistake.Despite what the FAQ said, I maintain that I believe that it does have subschools. Of course, I still say they can get around it, but that's beside the point.
FreAkOuTRG 04-22-07, 09:42 PM	How about this? Warforged Psychic Warrior Substitution Levels: HD: D10 Table: Warforged Psychic Warrior Substitution Levels Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special 1 0 +2 +0 +0 Bonus Psionic feat Bonus Warforged feat 4 3 +4 +1 +1 Power Psionic Repair Damage 5 3 +5 +1 +1 Bonus feat Efficient Mind Bonus warforged feat (Ex): A warforged psychic warrior gains a bonus warforged feat for which he meets the prerequisites. Psionic Repair Damage: A warforged psychic warrior has learned to rely on himself to heal, since they do not heal naturally and normal healing spells don't work as well for them as they do for others. Beginning at 4th level, a warforged psychic warrior may add psionic repair damage to his 2nd level powers known instead of his normal 2nd level power. Efficient Mind (Ex): To regain power points, a warforged must spend hours of a time doing almost nothing. What else is there to do but contemplate the mysteries of his powers, and to come to understand said powers better? From this understanding, a warforged psychic warrior learns how to use them more efficiently. Beginning at 5th level, a warforged psychic warrior can expend his psionic focus to reduce the cost of all powers he manifests in that round by 2 power points. This allows the warforged to spend more points on augmenting powers as well, should he wish to do so. Abilities in red removed
Zylo_Drizzt 04-23-07, 10:49 AM	very nice FreAkOuTRG. I think we should all work on the shaper or egoist now. Warforged Psychic Warrior Substitution Levels: HD: D10 Code: Table: Warforged Psychic Warrior Substitution Levels Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special 1 0 +2 +0 +0 Bonus Psionic feat Bonus Warforged feat 4 3 +4 +1 +1 Power Psionic Repair Damage 5 3 +5 +1 +1 Bonus feat Efficient MindBonus warforged feat (Ex): A warforged psychic warrior gains a bonus warforged feat for which he meets the prerequisites. One with Body: A warforged psychic warrior has learned to rely on himself to heal, since they do not heal naturally and normal healing spells don't work as well for them as they do for others. Beginning at 4th level, a warforged psychic warrior may add psionic repair damage to his 2nd level powers known instead of his normal 2nd level power. Efficient Mind (Ex): To regain power points, a warforged must spend hours of a time doing almost nothing. What else is there to do but contemplate the mysteries of his powers, and to come to understand said powers better? From this understanding, a warforged psychic warrior learns how to use them more efficiently. Beginning at 5th level, a warforged psychic warrior can expend his psionic focus to reduce the cost of all powers he manifests in that round by 2 power points. This allows the warforged to spend more points on augmenting powers as well, should he wish to do so. Abilities in red removed I will post this at the top. if you guys make changes please let me know. same goes for any other psionic substitution levels you come up with that we all agree is balanced. Has anyone come up with any other psionic substitution levels or replacement for psionic classes? If so please post that here.
FreAkOuTRG 04-23-07, 03:27 PM	Zylo, try hitting the "Quote" button at the bottom of my last post and then put that in the first post.