Shaper or Telepath Elocator? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Shaper or Telepath Elocator? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
StruckingFuggle
09-14-07, 03:01 AM Yeah, it's kind of a silly newb question, but I'm building my first Psionic character, and I want to do either a Telepath or a Shaper->Constructor, but at the same time, I really, really want a level of Elocator so I can play with Scorn Earth.

Is there a way to pull this off without somehow seriously gimping my character, since I need three feats that aren't of any use to a Shaper - Dodge, Mobility, and Spring Attack? :/

(well, just Mobility and SA, but as far as I can tell, there's no way to get Mobility without Dodge, even if the Elocator doesn't list it as a requirement)

I'm thinking the least crazy way is a human with a level of psywar. Preserving a feat at the cost of a psion manifester level? ... maybe? x.x Or a human with two flaws, so I have the three feats and some relevant ones, too?

But I'd like to figure a way without flaws out, first.

Help?
Nibbler
09-14-07, 09:07 AM If you really want the flavor of the elocator:
Rogue (UA feat variant) 2/Telepath 6/Elocator 7 with Practiced Manifester makes a phenomenal infiltrator. You can get anywhere and bend the minds of the weak to accomplish your mission.

If you just want to hang out on the ceiling during fights and pop out constructs:
Shaper 9/Elocator 1/Slayer 10 or
Shaper 19/Elocator 1

Also: http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=624041
carnivore
09-14-07, 09:11 AM you can qualify for PrC ...with Items...there is this:

Armor of Mobility (Draconminicon,16.) 16000gp ... gives you the Mobility feat

but if you lose the Armor...you lose the feat and Class Abilities of Elocator....

but the problem with Elocator.....Spring Attack has a BAB +4 Requirement.... which you cant get until 8th lvl as a Psion..but you still have to wait until 9th when you get another feat.

if you want ... you could do this:

Psion 6/ Fighter 1/ Elocator 7/ xxxxx 6

or this:

Human or Kalashtar or Elan
Ranger 1/ Psion 4/ Fighter 1/ Elocator 7/ Slayer 7

:D
carnivore
09-14-07, 09:15 AM If you really want the flavor of the elocator:
Rogue (UA feat variant) 2/Telepath 6/Elocator 7 with Practiced Manifester makes a phenomenal infiltrator. You can get anywhere and bend the minds of the weak to accomplish your mission.:

this kicks butt .... i love it :) ...but the 2nd level of Rogue must be @ 8th lvl:

Rogue 1/ Psion 6/ Rogue 2nd lvl ..... thus can take the Feat with his bonus feats(BAB+4 now, to qualify for Spring Attack)

:D
carnivore
09-14-07, 12:19 PM Another alternative could be:

Psion 8/ Slayer 6/ Elocator 6

required Feats:
Track
Dodge
Mobility
Spring Attack

open feats:
2 Bonus from Psion
1 bonus if Human
3 from character levels
more than enough feats to be effective.... :cool:

BAB +14
17th lvl Manifester
9th lvl powers

lots of skills and 2 nice abilities:
Cerebral Blind (Su): After reaching 6th level, a slayer is protected from all devices, powers, and spells that reveal location. This ability protects against information gathering by clairsentience powers or effects that reveal location.
The ability even foils bend reality, limited wish, miracle, reality revision, and wish when they are used to gain information about the slayer’s location (however, metafaculty can pierce this protective barrier). In the case of remote viewing or scrying that scans an area a slayer is in, the effect works, but the slayer simply isn’t detected. Remote viewing or scrying attempts that are targeted specifically at a slayer do not work. This ability is active as long as the slayer is psionically focused.

and

Transporter (Ex): At 6th level, an elocater learns both psionic teleport and psionic plane shift. These powers are in addition to any powers the elocater normally learns by advancing a level.
The elocater treats these powers as if they were 3rd-level powers on her class list. This means, among other things, that manifesting these powers costs 5 power points. (If the character does not have a high enough manifester level to manifest 3rd-level powers the character cannot manifest these powers until she has attained the required manifester level.)

in addition to all the handy Elocator Abilities... ;) ... this works as a Shaper or Telepath equally well

:D
Nibbler
09-14-07, 12:57 PM If you'd only be taking Slayer to level 6, you might as well go for Sanctified Mind instead. Same BAB and ML progression but another good save and a great list of class features. And let's face it, Iron Will is more useful prereq than Track.
carnivore
09-14-07, 04:04 PM If you'd only be taking Slayer to level 6, you might as well go for Sanctified Mind instead. Same BAB and ML progression but another good save and a great list of class features. And let's face it, Iron Will is more useful prereq than Track.

i would love to do that... but Sacntified Mind also requires:

Proficency with All Martial Weapons :yuck: ..... Slayer is much easier to get into

:D
PhaedrusXY
09-14-07, 04:33 PM You might consider using Ardent as a base. It can handle the manifester loss alot more easily due to how it interacts with Practiced Manifester.
Fraglan
09-14-07, 08:42 PM i would love to do that... but Sacntified Mind also requires:

Proficency with All Martial Weapons :yuck: ..... Slayer is much easier to get into

:D

So take Slayer1/SM5. Isn't SM a 5 level PrC anyway?
CrimsonDeath
09-14-07, 08:57 PM So take Slayer1/SM5. Isn't SM a 5 level PrC anyway?
It's a six-level PrC, but both Slayer and Sanctified Mind give up a manifester level at level 1. You'd be better off with Slayer 6 (losing only one ML) or Fighter 1/Sanctified Mind 5 (getting a bonus feat, rather than taking Track to qualify for Slayer and Iron Will to qualify for Sanctified Mind).

However, {psionic class} X/Slayer Y/Sanctified Mind Z (for X + Y + Z = 20 and X < 9) is a build that gets tossed around every once in a while. It's become less popular now that Psion 6/Anarchic Initiate 4/Slayer 10 is available, though.
Nibbler
09-14-07, 09:52 PM Sacntified Mind also requires:Proficency with All Martial Weapons

Elocator grants proficiency with all martial weapons
carnivore
09-15-07, 08:40 AM Elocator grants proficiency with all martial weapons

true... but the problem is how to get it with the fewest levels and lost Manifester levels:

Psion 8/ Slayer 6/ Elocator 6

requires 4 feats:
Track
Dodge
Mobility
Spring Attack

but gives:
17th lvl Manifester
BAB +14

it is difficult to do it without losing a ML:

Psion 6/ Anarchic Initiate 3/ Elocator 6/ Sanctified Mind 5

would be one way i can think of.... it gives:

BAB+14
17th lvl ML
feats:
Overchannel
Dodge
Mobility
Spring Attack
Iron Will

i think the first way is easier .... i do like Sanctified Mind .... but for a Stealthy Character.... Slayer is Better(and easier to get into)

:D
StruckingFuggle
09-15-07, 02:21 PM Ardent's from CompPsi, right? And I don't have CompPsi. :( Just the XPH.

Also, while the Elocater / Slayer suggestions seem like fun on there own, I was just planning on grabbing the first level of Elocator for myself. :) The rest starts losing MLs, and all I really want out of Elocator is Scorn Earth.
Sagetim
09-15-07, 03:11 PM Ardent's from CompPsi, right? And I don't have CompPsi. :( Just the XPH.

Also, while the Elocater / Slayer suggestions seem like fun on there own, I was just planning on grabbing the first level of Elocator for myself. :) The rest starts losing MLs, and all I really want out of Elocator is Scorn Earth.

If you can get your dm to allow you to, go Ardent 9/elocator 1/ constructor 10.
the only missing ml's will be from constructor. And more importantly you'll be able to get spring attack at level 6 due to ardent BAB.
The_Shaman
09-15-07, 04:59 PM BTW, isn't Nomad the best fundament for Elocator? The power list seems to synergize well imo.
CrimsonDeath
09-15-07, 05:24 PM BTW, isn't Nomad the best fundament for Elocator? The power list seems to synergize well imo.
Actually, it's for that exact reason I believe Nomad is (mechanically) the worst flavor of Psion to use for getting into Elocator (just as Telepath is the worst way into Thrallherd). Elocator not only grants Psionic Teleport (a Nomad-only power) but grants it at a lower power level than normal. If you go in as a Nomad, all this does is stretch your PP if you happen to to use Teleport a lot. If you go in as another flavor of Psion (or with another psionic class entirely), it also increases your versatility.
StruckingFuggle
09-15-07, 09:27 PM BTW, isn't Nomad the best fundament for Elocator? The power list seems to synergize well imo.

I'm not interested in synergy or the like, or even in elocator levels 2-10.

I just want my Shaper->Constructor to be able to walk on walls. :)
Kaleran1277
09-15-07, 09:34 PM StruckingFuggle, I have read your post, am have a question;
"Do you want the Scorn earth power to fly all the time?"

If the answer is yes: May I humbly suggest that you go for Shaper-or Telepath, and take the expanded knowledge feat to get 'fly, psionic' as a power.You can qualify for it as low as 9th level. No PrC needed. No wasted manifester levels, just ectoplasmic nasty-while flying! If 'fly, psionic' does not last long enough for you, then I suggest the metapsionic feat: extended power.

If the answer is no: Then the feat practiced manifester in conjunction with Psywarrior(2) may be the least painful answer.

Thank you.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
StruckingFuggle 09-14-07, 03:01 AM	Yeah, it's kind of a silly newb question, but I'm building my first Psionic character, and I want to do either a Telepath or a Shaper->Constructor, but at the same time, I really, really want a level of Elocator so I can play with Scorn Earth. Is there a way to pull this off without somehow seriously gimping my character, since I need three feats that aren't of any use to a Shaper - Dodge, Mobility, and Spring Attack? :/ (well, just Mobility and SA, but as far as I can tell, there's no way to get Mobility without Dodge, even if the Elocator doesn't list it as a requirement) I'm thinking the least crazy way is a human with a level of psywar. Preserving a feat at the cost of a psion manifester level? ... maybe? x.x Or a human with two flaws, so I have the three feats and some relevant ones, too? But I'd like to figure a way without flaws out, first. Help?
Nibbler 09-14-07, 09:07 AM	If you really want the flavor of the elocator: Rogue (UA feat variant) 2/Telepath 6/Elocator 7 with Practiced Manifester makes a phenomenal infiltrator. You can get anywhere and bend the minds of the weak to accomplish your mission. If you just want to hang out on the ceiling during fights and pop out constructs: Shaper 9/Elocator 1/Slayer 10 or Shaper 19/Elocator 1 Also: http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=624041
carnivore 09-14-07, 09:11 AM	you can qualify for PrC ...with Items...there is this: Armor of Mobility (Draconminicon,16.) 16000gp ... gives you the Mobility feat but if you lose the Armor...you lose the feat and Class Abilities of Elocator.... but the problem with Elocator.....Spring Attack has a BAB +4 Requirement.... which you cant get until 8th lvl as a Psion..but you still have to wait until 9th when you get another feat. if you want ... you could do this: Psion 6/ Fighter 1/ Elocator 7/ xxxxx 6 or this: Human or Kalashtar or Elan Ranger 1/ Psion 4/ Fighter 1/ Elocator 7/ Slayer 7 :D
carnivore 09-14-07, 09:15 AM	If you really want the flavor of the elocator: Rogue (UA feat variant) 2/Telepath 6/Elocator 7 with Practiced Manifester makes a phenomenal infiltrator. You can get anywhere and bend the minds of the weak to accomplish your mission.: this kicks butt .... i love it :) ...but the 2nd level of Rogue must be @ 8th lvl: Rogue 1/ Psion 6/ Rogue 2nd lvl ..... thus can take the Feat with his bonus feats(BAB+4 now, to qualify for Spring Attack) :D
carnivore 09-14-07, 12:19 PM	Another alternative could be: Psion 8/ Slayer 6/ Elocator 6 required Feats: Track Dodge Mobility Spring Attack open feats: 2 Bonus from Psion 1 bonus if Human 3 from character levels more than enough feats to be effective.... :cool: BAB +14 17th lvl Manifester 9th lvl powers lots of skills and 2 nice abilities: Cerebral Blind (Su): After reaching 6th level, a slayer is protected from all devices, powers, and spells that reveal location. This ability protects against information gathering by clairsentience powers or effects that reveal location. The ability even foils bend reality, limited wish, miracle, reality revision, and wish when they are used to gain information about the slayer’s location (however, metafaculty can pierce this protective barrier). In the case of remote viewing or scrying that scans an area a slayer is in, the effect works, but the slayer simply isn’t detected. Remote viewing or scrying attempts that are targeted specifically at a slayer do not work. This ability is active as long as the slayer is psionically focused. and Transporter (Ex): At 6th level, an elocater learns both psionic teleport and psionic plane shift. These powers are in addition to any powers the elocater normally learns by advancing a level. The elocater treats these powers as if they were 3rd-level powers on her class list. This means, among other things, that manifesting these powers costs 5 power points. (If the character does not have a high enough manifester level to manifest 3rd-level powers the character cannot manifest these powers until she has attained the required manifester level.) in addition to all the handy Elocator Abilities... ;) ... this works as a Shaper or Telepath equally well :D
Nibbler 09-14-07, 12:57 PM	If you'd only be taking Slayer to level 6, you might as well go for Sanctified Mind instead. Same BAB and ML progression but another good save and a great list of class features. And let's face it, Iron Will is more useful prereq than Track.
carnivore 09-14-07, 04:04 PM	If you'd only be taking Slayer to level 6, you might as well go for Sanctified Mind instead. Same BAB and ML progression but another good save and a great list of class features. And let's face it, Iron Will is more useful prereq than Track. i would love to do that... but Sacntified Mind also requires: Proficency with All Martial Weapons :yuck: ..... Slayer is much easier to get into :D
PhaedrusXY 09-14-07, 04:33 PM	You might consider using Ardent as a base. It can handle the manifester loss alot more easily due to how it interacts with Practiced Manifester.
Fraglan 09-14-07, 08:42 PM	i would love to do that... but Sacntified Mind also requires: Proficency with All Martial Weapons :yuck: ..... Slayer is much easier to get into :D So take Slayer1/SM5. Isn't SM a 5 level PrC anyway?
CrimsonDeath 09-14-07, 08:57 PM	So take Slayer1/SM5. Isn't SM a 5 level PrC anyway? It's a six-level PrC, but both Slayer and Sanctified Mind give up a manifester level at level 1. You'd be better off with Slayer 6 (losing only one ML) or Fighter 1/Sanctified Mind 5 (getting a bonus feat, rather than taking Track to qualify for Slayer and Iron Will to qualify for Sanctified Mind). However, {psionic class} X/Slayer Y/Sanctified Mind Z (for X + Y + Z = 20 and X < 9) is a build that gets tossed around every once in a while. It's become less popular now that Psion 6/Anarchic Initiate 4/Slayer 10 is available, though.
Nibbler 09-14-07, 09:52 PM	Sacntified Mind also requires:Proficency with All Martial Weapons Elocator grants proficiency with all martial weapons
carnivore 09-15-07, 08:40 AM	Elocator grants proficiency with all martial weapons true... but the problem is how to get it with the fewest levels and lost Manifester levels: Psion 8/ Slayer 6/ Elocator 6 requires 4 feats: Track Dodge Mobility Spring Attack but gives: 17th lvl Manifester BAB +14 it is difficult to do it without losing a ML: Psion 6/ Anarchic Initiate 3/ Elocator 6/ Sanctified Mind 5 would be one way i can think of.... it gives: BAB+14 17th lvl ML feats: Overchannel Dodge Mobility Spring Attack Iron Will i think the first way is easier .... i do like Sanctified Mind .... but for a Stealthy Character.... Slayer is Better(and easier to get into) :D
StruckingFuggle 09-15-07, 02:21 PM	Ardent's from CompPsi, right? And I don't have CompPsi. :( Just the XPH. Also, while the Elocater / Slayer suggestions seem like fun on there own, I was just planning on grabbing the first level of Elocator for myself. :) The rest starts losing MLs, and all I really want out of Elocator is Scorn Earth.
Sagetim 09-15-07, 03:11 PM	Ardent's from CompPsi, right? And I don't have CompPsi. :( Just the XPH. Also, while the Elocater / Slayer suggestions seem like fun on there own, I was just planning on grabbing the first level of Elocator for myself. :) The rest starts losing MLs, and all I really want out of Elocator is Scorn Earth. If you can get your dm to allow you to, go Ardent 9/elocator 1/ constructor 10. the only missing ml's will be from constructor. And more importantly you'll be able to get spring attack at level 6 due to ardent BAB.
The_Shaman 09-15-07, 04:59 PM	BTW, isn't Nomad the best fundament for Elocator? The power list seems to synergize well imo.
CrimsonDeath 09-15-07, 05:24 PM	BTW, isn't Nomad the best fundament for Elocator? The power list seems to synergize well imo. Actually, it's for that exact reason I believe Nomad is (mechanically) the worst flavor of Psion to use for getting into Elocator (just as Telepath is the worst way into Thrallherd). Elocator not only grants Psionic Teleport (a Nomad-only power) but grants it at a lower power level than normal. If you go in as a Nomad, all this does is stretch your PP if you happen to to use Teleport a lot. If you go in as another flavor of Psion (or with another psionic class entirely), it also increases your versatility.
StruckingFuggle 09-15-07, 09:27 PM	BTW, isn't Nomad the best fundament for Elocator? The power list seems to synergize well imo. I'm not interested in synergy or the like, or even in elocator levels 2-10. I just want my Shaper->Constructor to be able to walk on walls. :)
Kaleran1277 09-15-07, 09:34 PM	StruckingFuggle, I have read your post, am have a question; "Do you want the Scorn earth power to fly all the time?" If the answer is yes: May I humbly suggest that you go for Shaper-or Telepath, and take the expanded knowledge feat to get 'fly, psionic' as a power.You can qualify for it as low as 9th level. No PrC needed. No wasted manifester levels, just ectoplasmic nasty-while flying! If 'fly, psionic' does not last long enough for you, then I suggest the metapsionic feat: extended power. If the answer is no: Then the feat practiced manifester in conjunction with Psywarrior(2) may be the least painful answer. Thank you.