Suggestion for Elf PsyWar [Archive] - Wizards Community

Suggestion for Elf PsyWar [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
jbsaff
09-20-07, 04:05 PM I'm going to be playing in a new game next week with some very new players. The DM is hoping for an all psionic party if the group is okay with it. Current party is as follows:

Dreamscarred Wilder (from Untapped Potential)
Xeph Soulknife (Cleaving Blade Variant from UTP)
Dreamscarred Society Mind. (Me. For those unfamiliar with the class, it is a psionic support character. Used to help friends and hinder foes. I'm planning on going into Thrallherd later.)

We have a fourth player, but she's unsure of what she wants to play. She's a big LotR fan, and likes elves. She also thinks she will want to play a martial class. I'm trying to help the DM out (his first time behind the screen) by tracking down a set of "good" options for everyone, just in case we get asked "What do you think I should pick?".

To that end, what kind of focus would best fit for making an effective elf PsyWar? Sword and Board? Two-handed weapon? Other? Can we use Force Screen instead of a shield, or does such a tactic spend too much for too little at early levels (starting level 2)? Assuming a 16 WIS, she'd have 4 pp and could use the Screen once per encounter on an average day. This precludes any other use of powers, however, which is why I'm hesitant to suggest it to a new player.

I'm not really in need of a build so much as I'm requesting a direction to look in. I've not played a PsyWar or a traditional martial class, so I'm not as familiar with the relative benefits of feat selections, for example. I've read through the PsyWar Build guide, but what I saw seemed directed for a human.

Available resources: Core/SRD, anything Dreamscarred Press
We are sticking to SRD-listed rules so that everyone who needs to look at rules can do so easily. For example, no Illithids and we use the SRD Slayer requirements.

Other important facts:
32 point buy.
Starting at level 2. Campaign may run up to level 12-15, depending on time and interest.
We are aware that we do not have a trap-finding skill-monkey. The DM is planning for this, and I am already planning my second character/first thrall to correct this issue. There is an outside chance that the elf character could become a rogue or psychic rogue, but it's a long shot.

The min/max side of me isn't thrilled with the Elf race for the PsyWar, since I feel like it's not using the DEX bonus for much in a melee character. However, it sounds like the player is going to want to mix in up CQB style. I'm happy to hear suggested alternatives for race, but ultimately the player in question will make up her mind.

Finally, thanks!
PhaedrusXY
09-20-07, 04:26 PM You could suggest that she use a Wild Elf (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/elf.htm#wildElf) instead.
Fafnir
09-20-07, 06:29 PM Or, suggest the Marksman instead. Otherwise, I wouldn't use Force Screen at low levels, but beside that, with a PsyWarrior pretty much anything is good.
Lycanthromancer
09-20-07, 08:07 PM I always thought that a marksman using Zen Archery would be a kick-arse build.
jbsaff
09-20-07, 08:49 PM No doubt. Now if I can just convince the player in question, it would be great.

Thanks for the idea PhaedrusXY, I'll be looking into those options.
Nom
09-20-07, 09:01 PM Many PsyWar abilities work just fine for an archer. Some don't, but you should be able to find 10-15 that will. Plus you can use your many feats either on the traditional Point Blank Shot - Precise Shot - Rapid Shot / Multishot chain or on the psionic archery feats (or both).
The_Shaman
09-20-07, 09:18 PM CPsi has one useful 2nd level power that lets you fire in melee at no penalty, but I suppose you could just ask the DM to houserule a psionic version of the Arrow Mind spell from CAdv.
Sagetim
09-20-07, 09:30 PM I'm going to be playing in a new game next week with some very new players. The DM is hoping for an all psionic party if the group is okay with it. Current party is as follows:

Dreamscarred Wilder (from Untapped Potential)
Xeph Soulknife (Cleaving Blade Variant from UTP)
Dreamscarred Society Mind. (Me. For those unfamiliar with the class, it is a psionic support character. Used to help friends and hinder foes. I'm planning on going into Thrallherd later.)

We have a fourth player, but she's unsure of what she wants to play. She's a big LotR fan, and likes elves. She also thinks she will want to play a martial class. I'm trying to help the DM out (his first time behind the screen) by tracking down a set of "good" options for everyone, just in case we get asked "What do you think I should pick?".

To that end, what kind of focus would best fit for making an effective elf PsyWar? Sword and Board? Two-handed weapon? Other? Can we use Force Screen instead of a shield, or does such a tactic spend too much for too little at early levels (starting level 2)? Assuming a 16 WIS, she'd have 4 pp and could use the Screen once per encounter on an average day. This precludes any other use of powers, however, which is why I'm hesitant to suggest it to a new player.

I'm not really in need of a build so much as I'm requesting a direction to look in. I've not played a PsyWar or a traditional martial class, so I'm not as familiar with the relative benefits of feat selections, for example. I've read through the PsyWar Build guide, but what I saw seemed directed for a human.

Available resources: Core/SRD, anything Dreamscarred Press
We are sticking to SRD-listed rules so that everyone who needs to look at rules can do so easily. For example, no Illithids and we use the SRD Slayer requirements.

Other important facts:
32 point buy.
Starting at level 2. Campaign may run up to level 12-15, depending on time and interest.
We are aware that we do not have a trap-finding skill-monkey. The DM is planning for this, and I am already planning my second character/first thrall to correct this issue. There is an outside chance that the elf character could become a rogue or psychic rogue, but it's a long shot.

The min/max side of me isn't thrilled with the Elf race for the PsyWar, since I feel like it's not using the DEX bonus for much in a melee character. However, it sounds like the player is going to want to mix in up CQB style. I'm happy to hear suggested alternatives for race, but ultimately the player in question will make up her mind.

Finally, thanks!

well my first response is to say 'go soulknife/soulbow and blow stuff up with mind bullets'.

however you want something for psychic warrior. So, with that in mind I'll suggest this: have her use either sword and board or dual rapier/scimitar. Weapon finess is her friend, and ranged weapons are as well. Use the bonus feats for things like psionic weapon, psionic shot, speed of thought, up the walls. Pretty much make use of the feats that give bonuses while focused, or use the focus without burning pp. I'd also suggest getting into the pyrokineticist prestige class. it's a non manifester class that lets you burn things with FIRE. hell, at first level of the prc you get to have a flaming whip. Then if your character pisses her off you can have burning ass scars for ******* her off. Hand aflame is also helpful for the 'super pimp slap' and weapon aflame just makes things that much better....especially when you have a +1 flaming whatever. 3d6 bonus fire damage. Who needs str bonus?
The_Shaman
09-21-07, 06:32 AM BTW, if elven subraces are allowed, wood elves and wild elves are the best races. I'm actually a fan of wood elves, partly because of their applicable favored class (ranger, good for archers), and partly because the +2 str -2 int isn't a bad thing in many cases, including psy-warriors.

For equipment, I think that with the right powers you won't need to go melee. I suppose that as a LotR fan she would like to make an archer? On the other hand, RotW had some weapons morphing between bows and swords, and one of them - greatsword/comp. longbow - looked like a good weapon if the player wants to be able to get "down and dirty." At first, a buckler gives you a useful +1 to AC and can be used perfectly well with a bow: as you're not using that hand to hold a weapon, just to draw arrows and pull the string, afaik you don't lose your shield bonus/get a penalty to attack. In addition, she might want to prepare a one-handed weapon for emergencies, and a dagger - just in case, a dagger is always useful. I must disagree with Sagetim: weapon finesse probably won't be necessary, at least unless there's a +2 or higher difference between dex and str modifiers.
jbsaff
09-21-07, 10:18 AM I'm sorry, I seem to have miscommunicated. I do in fact want to explore melee possibilities. I feel confident that if the player does want to play something ranged, we will be able to put that together without difficulty. I feel less experienced with melee options, especially with the sheer variety of options that a PsyWar can conceivably use.

To that end, the Wood Elves suggestion and the idea of focusing on feats that benefit while focused were very helpful.

Thanks!
Fafnir
09-21-07, 10:43 AM I personally dislike Wood Elves, as I always found more skillpoints more valuable than extra melee damage/accuracy (which can easily replaced by buffs). Still, your mileage may vary.
Orenmir
09-21-07, 10:55 AM I wouldn't use Force Screen at low levels,

Just curious... Why not? +4 to AC that will stack with anything (if you're not already using a shield). Costs only a point. Lasts 10 rounds at first level. Seems good to me.
Fafnir
09-21-07, 12:33 PM Just curious... Why not? +4 to AC that will stack with anything (if you're not already using a shield). Costs only a point. Lasts 10 rounds at first level. Seems good to me.

You have too few pp in the first levels to use them on something that will last only one fight and require either to manage a prebuffing or to waste the first round for it. Later, an Extended, augmented Force Screen is great, but not now.
Orenmir
09-21-07, 01:41 PM You have too few pp in the first levels to use them on something that will last only one fight and require either to manage a prebuffing or to waste the first round for it.

You just described most first level powers. So, what powers would you suggest are worth it?
Fafnir
09-21-07, 02:19 PM You just described most first level powers. So, what powers would you suggest are worth it?

True, but this one can be replaced through equipment; this is why I usually prefer Vigor and a shield. I usually pick up Force Screen later, around 3°-4°.
The_Shaman
09-21-07, 02:25 PM What weapon would she prefer, btw? I think it's more a matter of taste. If she wants a longsword, a normal shield can work okay, if she prefers a spear or halberd, shield may just be worth it. Doesn't the party have a scout to warn them about probable fights?
jbsaff
09-21-07, 06:19 PM On the scout: Not as such. We will have at least one psicrystal (probably 2) which will be used to some degree. The experienced people in the game (the DM and I) are aware of our deficiency and will be attempting to avoid/rectify it.
Sagetim
09-21-07, 07:51 PM On the scout: Not as such. We will have at least one psicrystal (probably 2) which will be used to some degree. The experienced people in the game (the DM and I) are aware of our deficiency and will be attempting to avoid/rectify it.

your going to send a psycrystal to scout? o.o

your bloody insane. Unless the DM is nice and will let you replace it if it gets broken...well, you lose that thing, it's gone. And seriously...unless your trudging around crystal caverns, it's going to stick out pretty badly. 'hey bob, did you see that thing?' 'what thing?' 'that big spidery thing..' 'spider?! kill it!'
jbsaff
09-21-07, 09:09 PM We are using DSP material, including the amendment to Psicrystal Affinity, so yes, we could replace them. When I said "scouting" I meant "looking around the corner real quiet like". They are good for it, but it's what we have right now. I don't think they will be walking on the ground either. That will help a bit.
Sagetim
09-21-07, 09:14 PM We are using DSP material, including the amendment to Psicrystal Affinity, so yes, we could replace them. When I said "scouting" I meant "looking around the corner real quiet like". They are good for it, but it's what we have right now. I don't think they will be walking on the ground either. That will help a bit.

oh? didn't know there was material to cover that. That's a relief. You could always tie it to the end of a stick and use it to peek around corners like that.
'hey bob, did you see that shiney thing?' 'yeah, lets go get it before cap'n sam makes us share it with the others.' 'loooooot!'
jbsaff
09-21-07, 10:43 PM 'hey bob, did you see that shiney thing?' 'yeah, lets go get it before cap'n sam makes us share it with the others.' 'loooooot!'

Hilarious!
The Italian
09-22-07, 12:16 AM Have your DM basicly make her Elf a Psionic elf( aka a Xeph). The Xeph speed burst 3 times a day is really impressive, especially while focused with Speed of thought and a PW ability to Hustle( base speed 30+ insight 10+ xeph burst for up to 30 competence bonus to speed gives you a move of 80 by 9th, without the extra move action from Hustle, basicly giving her a 240 range). I truly suggest reading Wyvern SLayers PW Build, alot of great ideas to base the character on. The only thing you would need is to adjust some of the feats at 1st level. If she likes the LoTR elf, she may want to TWF tree, and PW gives plenty of feats to choose from, and combine with Strength of My Enemy and Psionic Lions Charge, she could easily shred a stronger opponent at the same time cranking up her strength.

Let the One PW Slay them ALL.:P

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
jbsaff 09-20-07, 04:05 PM	I'm going to be playing in a new game next week with some very new players. The DM is hoping for an all psionic party if the group is okay with it. Current party is as follows: Dreamscarred Wilder (from Untapped Potential) Xeph Soulknife (Cleaving Blade Variant from UTP) Dreamscarred Society Mind. (Me. For those unfamiliar with the class, it is a psionic support character. Used to help friends and hinder foes. I'm planning on going into Thrallherd later.) We have a fourth player, but she's unsure of what she wants to play. She's a big LotR fan, and likes elves. She also thinks she will want to play a martial class. I'm trying to help the DM out (his first time behind the screen) by tracking down a set of "good" options for everyone, just in case we get asked "What do you think I should pick?". To that end, what kind of focus would best fit for making an effective elf PsyWar? Sword and Board? Two-handed weapon? Other? Can we use Force Screen instead of a shield, or does such a tactic spend too much for too little at early levels (starting level 2)? Assuming a 16 WIS, she'd have 4 pp and could use the Screen once per encounter on an average day. This precludes any other use of powers, however, which is why I'm hesitant to suggest it to a new player. I'm not really in need of a build so much as I'm requesting a direction to look in. I've not played a PsyWar or a traditional martial class, so I'm not as familiar with the relative benefits of feat selections, for example. I've read through the PsyWar Build guide, but what I saw seemed directed for a human. Available resources: Core/SRD, anything Dreamscarred Press We are sticking to SRD-listed rules so that everyone who needs to look at rules can do so easily. For example, no Illithids and we use the SRD Slayer requirements. Other important facts: 32 point buy. Starting at level 2. Campaign may run up to level 12-15, depending on time and interest. We are aware that we do not have a trap-finding skill-monkey. The DM is planning for this, and I am already planning my second character/first thrall to correct this issue. There is an outside chance that the elf character could become a rogue or psychic rogue, but it's a long shot. The min/max side of me isn't thrilled with the Elf race for the PsyWar, since I feel like it's not using the DEX bonus for much in a melee character. However, it sounds like the player is going to want to mix in up CQB style. I'm happy to hear suggested alternatives for race, but ultimately the player in question will make up her mind. Finally, thanks!
PhaedrusXY 09-20-07, 04:26 PM	You could suggest that she use a Wild Elf (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/elf.htm#wildElf) instead.
Fafnir 09-20-07, 06:29 PM	Or, suggest the Marksman instead. Otherwise, I wouldn't use Force Screen at low levels, but beside that, with a PsyWarrior pretty much anything is good.
Lycanthromancer 09-20-07, 08:07 PM	I always thought that a marksman using Zen Archery would be a kick-arse build.
jbsaff 09-20-07, 08:49 PM	No doubt. Now if I can just convince the player in question, it would be great. Thanks for the idea PhaedrusXY, I'll be looking into those options.
Nom 09-20-07, 09:01 PM	Many PsyWar abilities work just fine for an archer. Some don't, but you should be able to find 10-15 that will. Plus you can use your many feats either on the traditional Point Blank Shot - Precise Shot - Rapid Shot / Multishot chain or on the psionic archery feats (or both).
The_Shaman 09-20-07, 09:18 PM	CPsi has one useful 2nd level power that lets you fire in melee at no penalty, but I suppose you could just ask the DM to houserule a psionic version of the Arrow Mind spell from CAdv.
Sagetim 09-20-07, 09:30 PM	I'm going to be playing in a new game next week with some very new players. The DM is hoping for an all psionic party if the group is okay with it. Current party is as follows: Dreamscarred Wilder (from Untapped Potential) Xeph Soulknife (Cleaving Blade Variant from UTP) Dreamscarred Society Mind. (Me. For those unfamiliar with the class, it is a psionic support character. Used to help friends and hinder foes. I'm planning on going into Thrallherd later.) We have a fourth player, but she's unsure of what she wants to play. She's a big LotR fan, and likes elves. She also thinks she will want to play a martial class. I'm trying to help the DM out (his first time behind the screen) by tracking down a set of "good" options for everyone, just in case we get asked "What do you think I should pick?". To that end, what kind of focus would best fit for making an effective elf PsyWar? Sword and Board? Two-handed weapon? Other? Can we use Force Screen instead of a shield, or does such a tactic spend too much for too little at early levels (starting level 2)? Assuming a 16 WIS, she'd have 4 pp and could use the Screen once per encounter on an average day. This precludes any other use of powers, however, which is why I'm hesitant to suggest it to a new player. I'm not really in need of a build so much as I'm requesting a direction to look in. I've not played a PsyWar or a traditional martial class, so I'm not as familiar with the relative benefits of feat selections, for example. I've read through the PsyWar Build guide, but what I saw seemed directed for a human. Available resources: Core/SRD, anything Dreamscarred Press We are sticking to SRD-listed rules so that everyone who needs to look at rules can do so easily. For example, no Illithids and we use the SRD Slayer requirements. Other important facts: 32 point buy. Starting at level 2. Campaign may run up to level 12-15, depending on time and interest. We are aware that we do not have a trap-finding skill-monkey. The DM is planning for this, and I am already planning my second character/first thrall to correct this issue. There is an outside chance that the elf character could become a rogue or psychic rogue, but it's a long shot. The min/max side of me isn't thrilled with the Elf race for the PsyWar, since I feel like it's not using the DEX bonus for much in a melee character. However, it sounds like the player is going to want to mix in up CQB style. I'm happy to hear suggested alternatives for race, but ultimately the player in question will make up her mind. Finally, thanks! well my first response is to say 'go soulknife/soulbow and blow stuff up with mind bullets'. however you want something for psychic warrior. So, with that in mind I'll suggest this: have her use either sword and board or dual rapier/scimitar. Weapon finess is her friend, and ranged weapons are as well. Use the bonus feats for things like psionic weapon, psionic shot, speed of thought, up the walls. Pretty much make use of the feats that give bonuses while focused, or use the focus without burning pp. I'd also suggest getting into the pyrokineticist prestige class. it's a non manifester class that lets you burn things with FIRE. hell, at first level of the prc you get to have a flaming whip. Then if your character pisses her off you can have burning ass scars for ******* her off. Hand aflame is also helpful for the 'super pimp slap' and weapon aflame just makes things that much better....especially when you have a +1 flaming whatever. 3d6 bonus fire damage. Who needs str bonus?
The_Shaman 09-21-07, 06:32 AM	BTW, if elven subraces are allowed, wood elves and wild elves are the best races. I'm actually a fan of wood elves, partly because of their applicable favored class (ranger, good for archers), and partly because the +2 str -2 int isn't a bad thing in many cases, including psy-warriors. For equipment, I think that with the right powers you won't need to go melee. I suppose that as a LotR fan she would like to make an archer? On the other hand, RotW had some weapons morphing between bows and swords, and one of them - greatsword/comp. longbow - looked like a good weapon if the player wants to be able to get "down and dirty." At first, a buckler gives you a useful +1 to AC and can be used perfectly well with a bow: as you're not using that hand to hold a weapon, just to draw arrows and pull the string, afaik you don't lose your shield bonus/get a penalty to attack. In addition, she might want to prepare a one-handed weapon for emergencies, and a dagger - just in case, a dagger is always useful. I must disagree with Sagetim: weapon finesse probably won't be necessary, at least unless there's a +2 or higher difference between dex and str modifiers.
jbsaff 09-21-07, 10:18 AM	I'm sorry, I seem to have miscommunicated. I do in fact want to explore melee possibilities. I feel confident that if the player does want to play something ranged, we will be able to put that together without difficulty. I feel less experienced with melee options, especially with the sheer variety of options that a PsyWar can conceivably use. To that end, the Wood Elves suggestion and the idea of focusing on feats that benefit while focused were very helpful. Thanks!
Fafnir 09-21-07, 10:43 AM	I personally dislike Wood Elves, as I always found more skillpoints more valuable than extra melee damage/accuracy (which can easily replaced by buffs). Still, your mileage may vary.
Orenmir 09-21-07, 10:55 AM	I wouldn't use Force Screen at low levels, Just curious... Why not? +4 to AC that will stack with anything (if you're not already using a shield). Costs only a point. Lasts 10 rounds at first level. Seems good to me.
Fafnir 09-21-07, 12:33 PM	Just curious... Why not? +4 to AC that will stack with anything (if you're not already using a shield). Costs only a point. Lasts 10 rounds at first level. Seems good to me. You have too few pp in the first levels to use them on something that will last only one fight and require either to manage a prebuffing or to waste the first round for it. Later, an Extended, augmented Force Screen is great, but not now.
Orenmir 09-21-07, 01:41 PM	You have too few pp in the first levels to use them on something that will last only one fight and require either to manage a prebuffing or to waste the first round for it. You just described most first level powers. So, what powers would you suggest are worth it?
Fafnir 09-21-07, 02:19 PM	You just described most first level powers. So, what powers would you suggest are worth it? True, but this one can be replaced through equipment; this is why I usually prefer Vigor and a shield. I usually pick up Force Screen later, around 3°-4°.
The_Shaman 09-21-07, 02:25 PM	What weapon would she prefer, btw? I think it's more a matter of taste. If she wants a longsword, a normal shield can work okay, if she prefers a spear or halberd, shield may just be worth it. Doesn't the party have a scout to warn them about probable fights?
jbsaff 09-21-07, 06:19 PM	On the scout: Not as such. We will have at least one psicrystal (probably 2) which will be used to some degree. The experienced people in the game (the DM and I) are aware of our deficiency and will be attempting to avoid/rectify it.
Sagetim 09-21-07, 07:51 PM	On the scout: Not as such. We will have at least one psicrystal (probably 2) which will be used to some degree. The experienced people in the game (the DM and I) are aware of our deficiency and will be attempting to avoid/rectify it. your going to send a psycrystal to scout? o.o your bloody insane. Unless the DM is nice and will let you replace it if it gets broken...well, you lose that thing, it's gone. And seriously...unless your trudging around crystal caverns, it's going to stick out pretty badly. 'hey bob, did you see that thing?' 'what thing?' 'that big spidery thing..' 'spider?! kill it!'
jbsaff 09-21-07, 09:09 PM	We are using DSP material, including the amendment to Psicrystal Affinity, so yes, we could replace them. When I said "scouting" I meant "looking around the corner real quiet like". They are good for it, but it's what we have right now. I don't think they will be walking on the ground either. That will help a bit.
Sagetim 09-21-07, 09:14 PM	We are using DSP material, including the amendment to Psicrystal Affinity, so yes, we could replace them. When I said "scouting" I meant "looking around the corner real quiet like". They are good for it, but it's what we have right now. I don't think they will be walking on the ground either. That will help a bit. oh? didn't know there was material to cover that. That's a relief. You could always tie it to the end of a stick and use it to peek around corners like that. 'hey bob, did you see that shiney thing?' 'yeah, lets go get it before cap'n sam makes us share it with the others.' 'loooooot!'
jbsaff 09-21-07, 10:43 PM	'hey bob, did you see that shiney thing?' 'yeah, lets go get it before cap'n sam makes us share it with the others.' 'loooooot!' Hilarious!
The Italian 09-22-07, 12:16 AM	Have your DM basicly make her Elf a Psionic elf( aka a Xeph). The Xeph speed burst 3 times a day is really impressive, especially while focused with Speed of thought and a PW ability to Hustle( base speed 30+ insight 10+ xeph burst for up to 30 competence bonus to speed gives you a move of 80 by 9th, without the extra move action from Hustle, basicly giving her a 240 range). I truly suggest reading Wyvern SLayers PW Build, alot of great ideas to base the character on. The only thing you would need is to adjust some of the feats at 1st level. If she likes the LoTR elf, she may want to TWF tree, and PW gives plenty of feats to choose from, and combine with Strength of My Enemy and Psionic Lions Charge, she could easily shred a stronger opponent at the same time cranking up her strength. Let the One PW Slay them ALL.:P