Bard Race [Archive] - Wizards Community - Pages Merged by Solauren

Bard Race [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
PalyLeto
08-14-07, 02:12 AM Looking for Bard Race.
Max LA+4, although LA would probably not be good.
Something humanoid, but whatever is good.
Something that looks cool playing a violin.
give me a link please if there has been a thread already on this.

Thanks.
bobothechimp
08-14-07, 02:42 AM Human.
PalyLeto
08-14-07, 03:40 AM Human.

........

no, that's a good reply, just everyone says human.
It's like always the first post.
celestialkin
08-14-07, 07:34 AM You could do a Tibbit Bard (from the Dragon Compendium (http://paizo.com/dragon/products/books/v5748btpy7dxa)). Just take the Natural Speak feat from Masters of the Wild (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/dndacc/881640000), and you have a singing cat performing on the street for cash (or a warm bowl of milk). :D
Lawlicron
08-14-07, 11:32 AM ........

no, that's a good reply, just everyone says human.
It's like always the first post.

Its just its actually the best race for bard that doesn't have an LA. Bards are feat starved sometimes and the extra skill never hurts.

You could always play a Half-Sea elf. They are like normal half-elves except they get a swim speed. You can take a feat at 1st level that lets them breath water and increases their swim speed.
PalyLeto
08-14-07, 04:13 PM You could do a Tibbit Bard (from the Dragon Compendium (http://paizo.com/dragon/products/books/v5748btpy7dxa)). Just take the Natural Speak feat from Masters of the Wild (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/dndacc/881640000), and you have a singing cat performing on the street for cash (or a warm bowl of milk). :D

Oh my God, that is so cute.
PurinaDragonChow
08-14-07, 04:22 PM Star Elf gets +2 to Cha, -2 to Con. LA +0.
DrRufio
08-14-07, 04:35 PM I know it isn't waht you want to hear, but human really is the best, maybe gnome if you don't plan on doing anything in melee.
The_Shaman
08-14-07, 07:33 PM Spellscale from Races of the Dragon also works, iirc - +2 cha, -2 con. You could patch either the spellscale or the star elf with Dragonborn of Bahamut if you prefer having lower dexterity over lower constitution (hint: armored caster + mithral heavy armor). Halflings, particularly strongheart halflings (FRCS/RoF/PGtF) and gnomes (illusions, mostly) can also be considered.

If LA is accepted, I can also suggest you take a look at that:

- half-fey (Fiend Folio). The downside is, you are fragile and your spells are kinda behind. The upside is... this is probably the most powerful LA +2 I've seen. Boosts to most stats - except str and con, actually, DR, flight, immunity to most X Person spells, a bagful of spell-likes (charm person at will???) and more. If you start at ECL 5+, it will be viable. If you can buy off LA, it gets amazing. Oh, and as a template, it stacks with your core abilities. Half-fey human? Sure. Half-fey halfling? Why not. Half-fey dwarf? It could happen.
MaximumHavoc
08-14-07, 07:46 PM Feytouched
Ability Score Adjustments: +2 Dexterity, -2 Constitution, +2 Charisma.
Favored Class: Bard or rogue.
Level Adjustment: +0

My personal favorite.
queenfange
08-14-07, 07:52 PM I'd say human or gnome. I have a homebrew race I like to use for bards (it's their favored class and they get +2 Cha), but they also get a penalty against charm and sleep spells as well as -2 Int.
The_Shaman
08-14-07, 08:03 PM Feytouched
Ability Score Adjustments: +2 Dexterity, -2 Constitution, +2 Charisma.
Favored Class: Bard or rogue.
Level Adjustment: +0

My personal favorite.

Are you sure? I could have sworn they were LA+1, at least the Fiend Folio version was.
AZNsupermarket
08-14-07, 08:10 PM I like elves because of the longbow proficiency (most of the time, it's best to fight using ranged combat if you're a bard)
celestialkin
08-14-07, 08:19 PM Oh my God, that is so cute.

I know. I am thinking of writing up this character just for fun. :)

Feytouched
Ability Score Adjustments: +2 Dexterity, -2 Constitution, +2 Charisma.
Favored Class: Bard or rogue.
Level Adjustment: +0

My personal favorite.

I just looked this template up in Fiend Folio, and it seems odd that there is no penalty for this. Not only do you get a free +2 bonus to your stats (the -2 con balances one of them out), but you get two favored classes, and a +2 to Hide and Move Silently. Was there any errata for this?

I just find it odd that this is a Rogue's/Bard's dream come true, yet it has no LA or drawbacks. I don't see why anyone would play a Bard or Rogue without this template.
baby_kamikaize_kobold
08-14-07, 08:38 PM maybe catfolk only +1 LA
Aleolus
08-14-07, 11:55 PM Dude, everyone makes fun of me, because this is my favorite race out of the base ones in the PHB, but I say Half-elves are great, especially for Bard. Then of course, there's always Gnomes, who get bonuses to illusion magic they cast.
AZNsupermarket
08-14-07, 11:58 PM Dude, everyone makes fun of me, because this is my favorite race out of the base ones in the PHB, but I say Half-elves are great, especially for Bard.

Half-elves make decent bards only if you're taking the races of the destiny racial substitution levels.

EDIT: races of destiny, not races of the wild
Aleolus
08-15-07, 12:22 AM Half-elves make decent bards only if you're taking the races of the wild racial substitution levels.

*buzzer sounds* Sorry, Half-elves are in Races of Destiny, not Wild. Elves are in Wild, Half-elves in Destiny.
AZNsupermarket
08-15-07, 12:50 AM *buzzer sounds* Sorry, Half-elves are in Races of Destiny, not Wild. Elves are in Wild, Half-elves in Destiny.

right
Lawlicron
08-15-07, 01:19 AM If your going to do half-elf then do half-aquatic elf. They are half elves with swim speeds. They win. And they can take the substitution levels.
The_Shaman
08-15-07, 06:28 AM I know. I am thinking of writing up this character just for fun. :)

I just looked this template up in Fiend Folio, and it seems odd that there is no penalty for this. Not only do you get a free +2 bonus to your stats (the -2 con balances one of them out), but you get two favored classes, and a +2 to Hide and Move Silently. Was there any errata for this?

I just find it odd that this is a Rogue's/Bard's dream come true, yet it has no LA or drawbacks. I don't see why anyone would play a Bard or Rogue without this template.

Guys, it is a LA +1 race. I don't have FF with me so I can't say if they made a typo by not listing it, but only a race with LA could need its own racial class (http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20040213a), for crying out loud.
Orchomenos
08-15-07, 10:39 AM A Grig (http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/35/sovelior_sage/monstersS.html#grig)? +3 LA, -6 STR, +8 DEX, +2 CON, +2 WIS, +4 CHA, Tiny size, proficient in Longbow.
And when they play Fiddle, any nonsprite within 30' is affected by irresistible dance. Unlike the Pixie, there's no LA adjustment for this ability. And it doesn't mention what he has to play, only that he is playing. We can abuse it by telling any time he uses his Bardic Music ability, Irresistible Dance automatically apply...
Lawlicron
08-15-07, 11:33 AM Doesn't a Grig have racial hit die? Don't they also have a progression in Savage Species? That ability seems game breaking.
MaximumHavoc
08-15-07, 11:38 AM It appears I was mistaken about Feytouched having no level adjustment. A little reserch on the WoTC pages turned up the following:

WEBPAGE: Transition Classes
Feytouched creatures bear the fingerprint of the weird and pay for it with a +1 level adjustment.

WEBPAGE: Level-Adjusted Races
The Feytouched

WEBPAGE: Excerpts - Fiend Folio
Feytouched
Medium-Size Fey
Hit Dice: 1d6-1 (2 hp)
Initiative: +5
Speed: 30 ft.
AC: 13 (+1 Dex, +2 leather), touch 11, flat-footed 12
Base Attack/Grapple: +0/+0
Attack: Dagger +0 melee, or shortbow +1 ranged
Full Attack: Dagger +0 melee, or shortbow +1 ranged
Damage: Dagger 1d4, or shortbow 1d6
Face/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks:Charm person
Special Qualities: Immunity to mind-affecting effects, low-light vision
Saves: Fort -1, Ref +3, Will +2
Abilities: Str 10, Dex 13, Con 9, Int 10, Wis 10, Cha 13
Skills: Bluff +5, Handle Animal +2, Hide +7, Knowledge (any one) +2, Move Silently +7, Sense Motive +4, Spot +3, Survival +4
Feats: Improved Initiative
Climate/Terrain: Any land and underground
Organization: Solitary or team (2-4)
Challenge Rating: 1/2
Treasure: Standard
Alignment: Usually chaotic (any)
Advancement: By character class
Level Adjustment: +1

What I find curious is that a creature with a +1 level adjustment would have a CR of 1/2:

WEBPAGE: Monster Index
Name Book Page Type CR
Feytouched FF 71 Fey 1/2
The_Shaman
08-15-07, 02:20 PM Doesn't a Grig have racial hit die? Don't they also have a progression in Savage Species? That ability seems game breaking.

No, they are a 1 HD fey, which means their first class HD replaces their racial one. An interesting class for a bard, but the LA +3 is a bit hard. As for gamebreaking... It's the DM that allows you to get a grig fiddle. Plus, a DC 12 ability is not always gamebreaking... Unlike the spell the ability allows a save.
Starfols
08-21-07, 10:14 PM I'd actually suggest satyr. It's got bonuses to every stat except strength, DR, pipes thing, among other things.
Manyfist
08-21-07, 11:17 PM Lesser Aasimar gets +2 Wis and +2 Cha for LA:+0.
Thief_of_Hope
08-22-07, 12:37 AM You might try one of my personal favorite races from the boards for a bard or sorcerer:

http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=749491
asurademon
08-22-07, 12:55 AM Lesser Aasimar gets +2 Wis and +2 Cha for LA:+0.

I second this, though I still think lesser aasimar are overpowered. The imbalanced ability scores along with other things debatedly make them slightly weak for a +1LA, but way to good for no LA. If I were a DM I'd give them some sort of penalty. Anyhow they'd definitely make awesome bards. I really like aasimar.
mrpopstar
08-22-07, 01:52 PM In which book can I find Lesser Aasimar?
Orchomenos
08-22-07, 01:52 PM I'd actually suggest satyr. It's got bonuses to every stat except strength, DR, pipes thing, among other things.

Yeah, but they have 5 HD, +2 LA, for a total of +7 ECL. Compare this to even a 7th level pure bard, you're not going too far.
JarionSilverblades
08-22-07, 04:59 PM I had a DM let me use a Tiefling, but we changed it slightly. The origin was the tiefling's fiend ancestor was a succubus, so it had +2 Dex, -2 Int, +2 cha, instead of +2 Dex, +2 Int, -2 Cha.
Hebitsuikaza
08-22-07, 06:07 PM ........

no, that's a good reply, just everyone says human.
It's like always the first post.

You have a problem with human? Seriously?...
Okay, fine then! Awakened Ferret!!
They ought to have a high dexterity and charisma. Just watch out for that willpower save to stop yourself from stealing everything shiny.

Why does everything have to be a friggin' min/max competition?
Yes there is going to be a specially-designed Elf race who is the ultimate race at being bards or you can take a 'race' that should be so absolutely rare they it should really be one specific character in the setting rather than a race at all...

HOWEVER, you can't really RP those things because they are so flat, bland and empty that it isn't worth choosing.

The best race for Bard is the one that you would find most fun and interesting to be a member of that race that walks around singing. I don't care if the race has a -4 Charisma and -2 Dexterity. If you can imagine a member of that race being a storyteller and singer and you'd be inspired to really get into playing the character.

Because sitting around trying to squeeze every last point out of a faceless, nameless, bland, streamlined construct and then rolling a bunch of dice to try to 'win' will get really boring really fast.
If that's all you want to do then I would suggest you stop playing D&D and start playing D&D minatures or Magic the Gathering where you actually at least have something tangible to work your muchkiny-spirit into and the line between YOU winning or losing is so much more clear than simply playing one random party member in a group.
Manyfist
08-22-07, 07:48 PM In which book can I find Lesser Aasimar?

Player's guide to Faerun
imakuni67
08-23-07, 01:16 PM I second this, though I still think lesser aasimar are overpowered. The imbalanced ability scores along with other things debatedly make them slightly weak for a +1LA, but way to good for no LA. If I were a DM I'd give them some sort of penalty. Anyhow they'd definitely make awesome bards. I really like aasimar.

Speaking of planetouched, we've always thrown out the -2 charmisa for Tieflings because aasimar and tieflings should be equal...and the charmisa penalty doesn't make sense really. Maybe a circumstance penalty here and there for the horns and the like but that's just because of peoples misconceptions about tieflings. A good tiefling bard could be an interesting character to play!
asurademon
08-23-07, 01:32 PM Speaking of planetouched, we've always thrown out the -2 charmisa for Tieflings because aasimar and tieflings should be equal...and the charmisa penalty doesn't make sense really. Maybe a circumstance penalty here and there for the horns and the like but that's just because of peoples misconceptions about tieflings. A good tiefling bard could be an interesting character to play!

I agree, and I might also get rid of the -2 to charisma if I ever get a chance to run a game (the group I was gaming with split up, and I haven't been able to find anyone else), I've certainly thought about it. It makes sense to an extent that people would mistrust a tiefling, but none the less, it's not like there aren't other creatures which humans, and the other core races mistrust, but they still have extremely an high charisma despite it. Also some fiends have truly extraordinarily good charisma, and I like the idea that a tiefling could even inherit some of that. I would probably have it so that each tiefling has a particular type of fiend's traits which are predominant, and that would determine what traits the tiefling gets, I'd do the same for aasimar.
Aleolus
08-23-07, 02:01 PM What I do, when someone says they want to play a Aasimar or Teifling, I try to find out what, if any, plane they want their bloodline from, and come up with a race based off that. For instance, I came up with the Bengalii as a Planetouched from the Beastlands, descended from the Guardinals, which you can find here (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=880235)
mkill
08-23-07, 02:20 PM Speaking of planetouched, we've always thrown out the -2 charmisa for Tieflings because aasimar and tieflings should be equal...and the charmisa penalty doesn't make sense really. Maybe a circumstance penalty here and there for the horns and the like but that's just because of peoples misconceptions about tieflings. A good tiefling bard could be an interesting character to play!

And actually there was a Tiefling bard in Baldur's Gate 2, in case anyone remembers.
CaoSlayer
08-23-07, 05:52 PM Hael Dalis.

ummm, any race is feasible for an efective bard...

Wants something different?

Be an half-orc with about 12 charisma after mods and be a Bard 2/ combat class 3 / warchanter 10 for a magic less, uncharismatic bard

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
PalyLeto 08-14-07, 02:12 AM	Looking for Bard Race. Max LA+4, although LA would probably not be good. Something humanoid, but whatever is good. Something that looks cool playing a violin. give me a link please if there has been a thread already on this. Thanks.
bobothechimp 08-14-07, 02:42 AM	Human.
PalyLeto 08-14-07, 03:40 AM	Human. ........ no, that's a good reply, just everyone says human. It's like always the first post.
celestialkin 08-14-07, 07:34 AM	You could do a Tibbit Bard (from the Dragon Compendium (http://paizo.com/dragon/products/books/v5748btpy7dxa)). Just take the Natural Speak feat from Masters of the Wild (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/dndacc/881640000), and you have a singing cat performing on the street for cash (or a warm bowl of milk). :D
Lawlicron 08-14-07, 11:32 AM	........ no, that's a good reply, just everyone says human. It's like always the first post. Its just its actually the best race for bard that doesn't have an LA. Bards are feat starved sometimes and the extra skill never hurts. You could always play a Half-Sea elf. They are like normal half-elves except they get a swim speed. You can take a feat at 1st level that lets them breath water and increases their swim speed.
PalyLeto 08-14-07, 04:13 PM	You could do a Tibbit Bard (from the Dragon Compendium (http://paizo.com/dragon/products/books/v5748btpy7dxa)). Just take the Natural Speak feat from Masters of the Wild (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/dndacc/881640000), and you have a singing cat performing on the street for cash (or a warm bowl of milk). :D Oh my God, that is so cute.
PurinaDragonChow 08-14-07, 04:22 PM	Star Elf gets +2 to Cha, -2 to Con. LA +0.
DrRufio 08-14-07, 04:35 PM	I know it isn't waht you want to hear, but human really is the best, maybe gnome if you don't plan on doing anything in melee.
The_Shaman 08-14-07, 07:33 PM	Spellscale from Races of the Dragon also works, iirc - +2 cha, -2 con. You could patch either the spellscale or the star elf with Dragonborn of Bahamut if you prefer having lower dexterity over lower constitution (hint: armored caster + mithral heavy armor). Halflings, particularly strongheart halflings (FRCS/RoF/PGtF) and gnomes (illusions, mostly) can also be considered. If LA is accepted, I can also suggest you take a look at that: - half-fey (Fiend Folio). The downside is, you are fragile and your spells are kinda behind. The upside is... this is probably the most powerful LA +2 I've seen. Boosts to most stats - except str and con, actually, DR, flight, immunity to most X Person spells, a bagful of spell-likes (charm person at will???) and more. If you start at ECL 5+, it will be viable. If you can buy off LA, it gets amazing. Oh, and as a template, it stacks with your core abilities. Half-fey human? Sure. Half-fey halfling? Why not. Half-fey dwarf? It could happen.
MaximumHavoc 08-14-07, 07:46 PM	Feytouched Ability Score Adjustments: +2 Dexterity, -2 Constitution, +2 Charisma. Favored Class: Bard or rogue. Level Adjustment: +0 My personal favorite.
queenfange 08-14-07, 07:52 PM	I'd say human or gnome. I have a homebrew race I like to use for bards (it's their favored class and they get +2 Cha), but they also get a penalty against charm and sleep spells as well as -2 Int.
The_Shaman 08-14-07, 08:03 PM	Feytouched Ability Score Adjustments: +2 Dexterity, -2 Constitution, +2 Charisma. Favored Class: Bard or rogue. Level Adjustment: +0 My personal favorite. Are you sure? I could have sworn they were LA+1, at least the Fiend Folio version was.
AZNsupermarket 08-14-07, 08:10 PM	I like elves because of the longbow proficiency (most of the time, it's best to fight using ranged combat if you're a bard)
celestialkin 08-14-07, 08:19 PM	Oh my God, that is so cute. I know. I am thinking of writing up this character just for fun. :) Feytouched Ability Score Adjustments: +2 Dexterity, -2 Constitution, +2 Charisma. Favored Class: Bard or rogue. Level Adjustment: +0 My personal favorite. I just looked this template up in Fiend Folio, and it seems odd that there is no penalty for this. Not only do you get a free +2 bonus to your stats (the -2 con balances one of them out), but you get two favored classes, and a +2 to Hide and Move Silently. Was there any errata for this? I just find it odd that this is a Rogue's/Bard's dream come true, yet it has no LA or drawbacks. I don't see why anyone would play a Bard or Rogue without this template.
baby_kamikaize_kobold 08-14-07, 08:38 PM	maybe catfolk only +1 LA
Aleolus 08-14-07, 11:55 PM	Dude, everyone makes fun of me, because this is my favorite race out of the base ones in the PHB, but I say Half-elves are great, especially for Bard. Then of course, there's always Gnomes, who get bonuses to illusion magic they cast.
AZNsupermarket 08-14-07, 11:58 PM	Dude, everyone makes fun of me, because this is my favorite race out of the base ones in the PHB, but I say Half-elves are great, especially for Bard. Half-elves make decent bards only if you're taking the races of the destiny racial substitution levels. EDIT: races of destiny, not races of the wild
Aleolus 08-15-07, 12:22 AM	Half-elves make decent bards only if you're taking the races of the wild racial substitution levels. buzzer sounds Sorry, Half-elves are in Races of Destiny, not Wild. Elves are in Wild, Half-elves in Destiny.
AZNsupermarket 08-15-07, 12:50 AM	buzzer sounds Sorry, Half-elves are in Races of Destiny, not Wild. Elves are in Wild, Half-elves in Destiny. right
Lawlicron 08-15-07, 01:19 AM	If your going to do half-elf then do half-aquatic elf. They are half elves with swim speeds. They win. And they can take the substitution levels.
The_Shaman 08-15-07, 06:28 AM	I know. I am thinking of writing up this character just for fun. :) I just looked this template up in Fiend Folio, and it seems odd that there is no penalty for this. Not only do you get a free +2 bonus to your stats (the -2 con balances one of them out), but you get two favored classes, and a +2 to Hide and Move Silently. Was there any errata for this? I just find it odd that this is a Rogue's/Bard's dream come true, yet it has no LA or drawbacks. I don't see why anyone would play a Bard or Rogue without this template. Guys, it is a LA +1 race. I don't have FF with me so I can't say if they made a typo by not listing it, but only a race with LA could need its own racial class (http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20040213a), for crying out loud.
Orchomenos 08-15-07, 10:39 AM	A Grig (http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/35/sovelior_sage/monstersS.html#grig)? +3 LA, -6 STR, +8 DEX, +2 CON, +2 WIS, +4 CHA, Tiny size, proficient in Longbow. And when they play Fiddle, any nonsprite within 30' is affected by irresistible dance. Unlike the Pixie, there's no LA adjustment for this ability. And it doesn't mention what he has to play, only that he is playing. We can abuse it by telling any time he uses his Bardic Music ability, Irresistible Dance automatically apply...
Lawlicron 08-15-07, 11:33 AM	Doesn't a Grig have racial hit die? Don't they also have a progression in Savage Species? That ability seems game breaking.
MaximumHavoc 08-15-07, 11:38 AM	It appears I was mistaken about Feytouched having no level adjustment. A little reserch on the WoTC pages turned up the following: WEBPAGE: Transition Classes Feytouched creatures bear the fingerprint of the weird and pay for it with a +1 level adjustment. WEBPAGE: Level-Adjusted Races The Feytouched WEBPAGE: Excerpts - Fiend Folio Feytouched Medium-Size Fey Hit Dice: 1d6-1 (2 hp) Initiative: +5 Speed: 30 ft. AC: 13 (+1 Dex, +2 leather), touch 11, flat-footed 12 Base Attack/Grapple: +0/+0 Attack: Dagger +0 melee, or shortbow +1 ranged Full Attack: Dagger +0 melee, or shortbow +1 ranged Damage: Dagger 1d4, or shortbow 1d6 Face/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft. Special Attacks:Charm person Special Qualities: Immunity to mind-affecting effects, low-light vision Saves: Fort -1, Ref +3, Will +2 Abilities: Str 10, Dex 13, Con 9, Int 10, Wis 10, Cha 13 Skills: Bluff +5, Handle Animal +2, Hide +7, Knowledge (any one) +2, Move Silently +7, Sense Motive +4, Spot +3, Survival +4 Feats: Improved Initiative Climate/Terrain: Any land and underground Organization: Solitary or team (2-4) Challenge Rating: 1/2 Treasure: Standard Alignment: Usually chaotic (any) Advancement: By character class Level Adjustment: +1 What I find curious is that a creature with a +1 level adjustment would have a CR of 1/2: WEBPAGE: Monster Index Name Book Page Type CR Feytouched FF 71 Fey 1/2
The_Shaman 08-15-07, 02:20 PM	Doesn't a Grig have racial hit die? Don't they also have a progression in Savage Species? That ability seems game breaking. No, they are a 1 HD fey, which means their first class HD replaces their racial one. An interesting class for a bard, but the LA +3 is a bit hard. As for gamebreaking... It's the DM that allows you to get a grig fiddle. Plus, a DC 12 ability is not always gamebreaking... Unlike the spell the ability allows a save.
Starfols 08-21-07, 10:14 PM	I'd actually suggest satyr. It's got bonuses to every stat except strength, DR, pipes thing, among other things.
Manyfist 08-21-07, 11:17 PM	Lesser Aasimar gets +2 Wis and +2 Cha for LA:+0.
Thief_of_Hope 08-22-07, 12:37 AM	You might try one of my personal favorite races from the boards for a bard or sorcerer: http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=749491
asurademon 08-22-07, 12:55 AM	Lesser Aasimar gets +2 Wis and +2 Cha for LA:+0. I second this, though I still think lesser aasimar are overpowered. The imbalanced ability scores along with other things debatedly make them slightly weak for a +1LA, but way to good for no LA. If I were a DM I'd give them some sort of penalty. Anyhow they'd definitely make awesome bards. I really like aasimar.
mrpopstar 08-22-07, 01:52 PM	In which book can I find Lesser Aasimar?
Orchomenos 08-22-07, 01:52 PM	I'd actually suggest satyr. It's got bonuses to every stat except strength, DR, pipes thing, among other things. Yeah, but they have 5 HD, +2 LA, for a total of +7 ECL. Compare this to even a 7th level pure bard, you're not going too far.
JarionSilverblades 08-22-07, 04:59 PM	I had a DM let me use a Tiefling, but we changed it slightly. The origin was the tiefling's fiend ancestor was a succubus, so it had +2 Dex, -2 Int, +2 cha, instead of +2 Dex, +2 Int, -2 Cha.
Hebitsuikaza 08-22-07, 06:07 PM	........ no, that's a good reply, just everyone says human. It's like always the first post. You have a problem with human? Seriously?... Okay, fine then! Awakened Ferret!! They ought to have a high dexterity and charisma. Just watch out for that willpower save to stop yourself from stealing everything shiny. Why does everything have to be a friggin' min/max competition? Yes there is going to be a specially-designed Elf race who is the ultimate race at being bards or you can take a 'race' that should be so absolutely rare they it should really be one specific character in the setting rather than a race at all... HOWEVER, you can't really RP those things because they are so flat, bland and empty that it isn't worth choosing. The best race for Bard is the one that you would find most fun and interesting to be a member of that race that walks around singing. I don't care if the race has a -4 Charisma and -2 Dexterity. If you can imagine a member of that race being a storyteller and singer and you'd be inspired to really get into playing the character. Because sitting around trying to squeeze every last point out of a faceless, nameless, bland, streamlined construct and then rolling a bunch of dice to try to 'win' will get really boring really fast. If that's all you want to do then I would suggest you stop playing D&D and start playing D&D minatures or Magic the Gathering where you actually at least have something tangible to work your muchkiny-spirit into and the line between YOU winning or losing is so much more clear than simply playing one random party member in a group.
Manyfist 08-22-07, 07:48 PM	In which book can I find Lesser Aasimar? Player's guide to Faerun
imakuni67 08-23-07, 01:16 PM	I second this, though I still think lesser aasimar are overpowered. The imbalanced ability scores along with other things debatedly make them slightly weak for a +1LA, but way to good for no LA. If I were a DM I'd give them some sort of penalty. Anyhow they'd definitely make awesome bards. I really like aasimar. Speaking of planetouched, we've always thrown out the -2 charmisa for Tieflings because aasimar and tieflings should be equal...and the charmisa penalty doesn't make sense really. Maybe a circumstance penalty here and there for the horns and the like but that's just because of peoples misconceptions about tieflings. A good tiefling bard could be an interesting character to play!
asurademon 08-23-07, 01:32 PM	Speaking of planetouched, we've always thrown out the -2 charmisa for Tieflings because aasimar and tieflings should be equal...and the charmisa penalty doesn't make sense really. Maybe a circumstance penalty here and there for the horns and the like but that's just because of peoples misconceptions about tieflings. A good tiefling bard could be an interesting character to play! I agree, and I might also get rid of the -2 to charisma if I ever get a chance to run a game (the group I was gaming with split up, and I haven't been able to find anyone else), I've certainly thought about it. It makes sense to an extent that people would mistrust a tiefling, but none the less, it's not like there aren't other creatures which humans, and the other core races mistrust, but they still have extremely an high charisma despite it. Also some fiends have truly extraordinarily good charisma, and I like the idea that a tiefling could even inherit some of that. I would probably have it so that each tiefling has a particular type of fiend's traits which are predominant, and that would determine what traits the tiefling gets, I'd do the same for aasimar.
Aleolus 08-23-07, 02:01 PM	What I do, when someone says they want to play a Aasimar or Teifling, I try to find out what, if any, plane they want their bloodline from, and come up with a race based off that. For instance, I came up with the Bengalii as a Planetouched from the Beastlands, descended from the Guardinals, which you can find here (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=880235)
mkill 08-23-07, 02:20 PM	Speaking of planetouched, we've always thrown out the -2 charmisa for Tieflings because aasimar and tieflings should be equal...and the charmisa penalty doesn't make sense really. Maybe a circumstance penalty here and there for the horns and the like but that's just because of peoples misconceptions about tieflings. A good tiefling bard could be an interesting character to play! And actually there was a Tiefling bard in Baldur's Gate 2, in case anyone remembers.
CaoSlayer 08-23-07, 05:52 PM	Hael Dalis. ummm, any race is feasible for an efective bard... Wants something different? Be an half-orc with about 12 charisma after mods and be a Bard 2/ combat class 3 / warchanter 10 for a magic less, uncharismatic bard