Davians (bat winged humanoids) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Davians (bat winged humanoids) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Crebain
10-12-07, 10:23 PM Phisical desription: Davians look just like humans but have large bat-like wings. They have hollow bones that are twice as hard as a humans. They also have a one way breathing system (meaning they breathe in and out at the same time using a special organ). This system is designed for breathing in high altitudes ,which is a vestigial ability, considering they can only fly 5ft high. Davians have no stomach which decreases their weight significantly. Instead the use their intestines to digest their food. They eat smaller portions of food at a time but more times daily.
Crebain
10-12-07, 10:33 PM Speed-30ft, Fly-20ft 5ft high +3 dexterity when flying

Special Qualities- blindsense 20ft, low-light vision

Abilities- Dex-1 Int+1

Feat- Alertness, blindfight

Skills- +2 on spot and listen checks in the dark

Languages- Speaks Davian

Alignment- always chaotic
Darth Sephiroth
10-13-07, 10:14 AM Uneven Ability scores shouldn't be used, secondly this is in the LA +1 or +2 range with everything
Crebain
10-13-07, 10:28 AM I'm sorry but i've only been DM'ing for a year. What does LA mean.:confused:
Arscura
10-13-07, 11:26 AM I'm sorry but i've only been DM'ing for a year. What does LA mean.:confused:

Level Adjustment, which means you shouln't play this race as a level 1 character or 2, depending on the number.
Indeed uneven score abilities shouldn't be used. I did that in the beginning of my career as race maker as well, but it isn't advised.
DonThelonious
10-13-07, 11:31 AM LA is for level adjustment. It is explained more clearly in the back of the Monster Manual.

Basically its a set number you would add when calculating levels, so a LA +1 race with 3 levels in rogue would be Effective Character Level (ECL) 4. You treat the character as if it was level 4 for experience based benefits such as ability score increases and feats, otherwise they are a level 3 character in all other respects.
--
As for the race you have posted, why are they only allowed to fly 5 ft. off the ground? You might as well make the wings vestigial and give bonuses to jump and balance checks.
Crebain
10-13-07, 11:55 AM Okay I will make them +1 LA. The reason they can only fly 5ft is so that characters can still hit them with their melee weapons. But I guess since most character carry at least one ranged weapon I will increase the max fly height to 30ft.
1 ton ghost
10-13-07, 01:24 PM bat people ("desmodu", MonManII) already exist, just not in the capacity to which you have illustrated here.

i think what you're gunning for is an anthropomorphic type which is totally relevant, but in need of a little tweaking. you might want to consider something to mimic echolocation or a vampire bat's sanguine tendencies, Blood Drain (Ex) and the like.
Crebain
10-13-07, 03:08 PM First of all, I don't know what anthropomorphic means. Secondly It's a chaotic bat-like humanoid not an evil vampire.
1 ton ghost
10-13-07, 03:33 PM First of all, I don't know what anthropomorphic means. Secondly It's a chaotic bat-like humanoid not an evil vampire.

relax, damn...
you posted for critique, that's what's going on here. no one took a pot shot at your write up.
-if you don't know what anthropomorphic means, look it up, you can obviously use a computer.
-blood drain isn't inherantly evil btw. vamp bats are faily low Int animals and alot of them have a dietary requirement, not a need to inflict dmg via blood loss. you've got your parties mixed.
Crebain
10-13-07, 03:52 PM I wasn't meaning to be mean I just didn't know what anthropomorphic meant and wanted to show a difference beetween davians and vampires.
Xiuhcoatl
10-13-07, 06:51 PM I wasn't meaning to be mean I just didn't know what anthropomorphic meant and wanted to show a difference beetween davians and vampires.

Do you have the internet? Look up both on Wikipedia. It's easy to do.

Anthropomorphism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthropomorphism) is easy to find, and Vampire Bats (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vampire_bat) are real creatures.
Hellsbells
10-13-07, 07:45 PM Heehee... Wait for further updates
Crebain
10-13-07, 08:15 PM I didn't know what anthropomorphic meant now I do. Yes, I did look it up on wikipedia and ,no, davians are not anthropomorphic.

P.S. laugh at me and I will destroy you http://smilies.vidahost.com/contrib/sarge/BoomSmilie_anim.gif
Xiuhcoatl
10-13-07, 08:59 PM If they aren't anthropomorphic, then what can they be? Please provide a detailed description.

Here's some more feedback for you.

Speed-30ft, Fly-20ft 5ft high +3 dexterity when flying

Eh? What? Why do they get an odd bonus for being higher in the air? This mechanic simply doesn't exist. Either give them a simple dodge bonus or do away with it completely.

Special Qualities- blindsense 20ft, low-light vision

Being batfolk, can a Silence spell cancel out their blindsense?

Abilities- Dex-1 Int+1

No go. Stat bonuses must be even. Make them +2 or +0.

Feat- Alertness, blindfight

Are these bonus feats?

Skills- +2 on spot and listen checks in the dark

This is OK. ... but why would listen be affected by light or the lack thereof? Sound travels the same in light or darkness.

Languages- Speaks Davian

You mean "Languages: Common, Davian" right?

Alignment- always chaotic

Alignment restrictions don't usually exist for PC races.

As well, this is at least LA +1 ... no getting around that.
Hellsbells
10-13-07, 09:05 PM WERE DID YOU GET THAT SMILEY! THAT IS SO AWESOME!
Crebain
10-13-07, 09:27 PM Size - medium

Speed - 30ft Fly - 20ft, 20ft high +2 dodge bonus when flying because of increased manuverability

Special Qualities - blindsense 20ft

Abilities - Dex -2, Int +2

Bonus Feats - Alertness, Blindfight

Skills - +2 on spot checks in dark

Languages - common, davian

Alignment any

p.s. I got the smily here http://www.mysmilies.com/smileys/Genres/Violent
Xiuhcoatl
10-13-07, 09:45 PM what is the maneuverability of its flight?

and what's the flavor text?
Crebain
10-13-07, 10:20 PM They have increased manuverability in the air as opposed to being on the ground where their bulky wings create extra weight and can sometimes knock a davian off balance.
Xiuhcoatl
10-13-07, 11:17 PM What is the flavor text for the race?

What is the maneuverability of their flight?
Crebain
10-13-07, 11:51 PM what do you mean....AND WHY MUST YOU ASK SO MANY QUESTIONS!!! :rant:
Fireclave
10-14-07, 12:05 AM what do you mean....AND WHY MUST YOU ASK SO MANY QUESTIONS!!! :rant:
People are asking you questions because that what you implicitly asked for by requesting critiques. And flight maneuverability is a rating of how well a creature can fly. Most creatures have a flight maneuverability of average or lower. Good and perfect maneuverability is usually the purview of magic or supernatural flight. You can read up more on flight in your DMG or in the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/movement.htm#movingInThreeDimensions).
Crebain
10-14-07, 12:34 AM Fine if you must know thier flight manuverability is average.
Xiuhcoatl
10-14-07, 08:02 AM Fine if you must know thier flight manuverability is average.

So why do they get a dodge bonus in flight while other, faster, higher-dex, higher-manuverability races?

As I have asked before: what is the flavor behind this race? You know, the fluff instead of the crunch?
DonThelonious
10-14-07, 08:37 AM Crebain: Chill out dude. You have brought this on the boards and said:
"Hey, look what I made!!!!!!"

:ahem: And people are looking.:ahem:

:rant: We are not criticizing you or your race. We are all here to help you balance it and cover all your bases when PCs get their hands on it. You stated above that that you are inexperienced and in need of advice, so stop acting like a damn NOOB, please.:rant:

As for your race, I really like the concept, but the fluff is a bit *meh*. My advice is to lose the limit on flight elevation, PCs are not going to go with that, in fact they will most likely be put off by this type of limitation. It flies, plain and simple.

As for the maneuverability, this is a medium race right? Small and smaller races would have an average maneuverability (if they have a VERY high Dex. So you might want to drop it by one category.

Why do they have Blindsense 20ft. and Blind Fighting as a bonus feat? My advice is to go with either one or the other, not both. Having both makes no sense.

As far as the +2 Dodge Bonus to AC while flying is concerned, drop it. Give them something like the Dodge Feat while airborne. And if yuo really wanted them to basically be humans with batwings, then you should ditch the ability score adjustment. Also lose the human extra feat and bonus skill points, since those have been replaced with wings.
----
Please do not be offended by the above. I am simply telling you like it is, in terms anyone will understand. No hard feelings.
EvilVegan
10-14-07, 09:14 AM Crebrain, Please don't take the questions and suggestions personally, we're really here to help.

Here's an editted and standardized version of the info you've given us.

Racial Traits
Ability Modifiers: +2 Int, -2 Dex
Size: Medium
Speed: 30 feet. Fly 20 (average).
Senses: Blindsense 20 feet.
Bonus Feats: Alertness, Blindfight
Skill Bonus: +2 on spot checks in the dark.
Airborn Grace: +2 dodge bonus to AC while flying.
Level Adjustment: +1

It's a little powerful for +1 LA. If you had a restriction on the flight, such as "can't use hands or arms while flying" then that would be a balancing factor. Also, requiring exotic armor would help a little.

Here's what I would do without any real information about why these abilities are the way they are (which is why Xiuhcoatl keeps asking for flavor text):

Racial Traits
Ability Modifiers: +2 Int. Davians are smart.
Size: Medium.
Type: Monstrous Humanoid.
Speed: 20 feet. Fly 20 (average). While flying a Davian cannot wield weapons or cast spells requiring somatic components.
Senses: Blindsense 20 feet.
Bonus Feats: Alertness
Skill Bonus: +2 on spot checks in the dark.
Airborn Grace: +2 dodge bonus to AC while flying.
Exotic Form: Armor designed for a davian costs twice as much as that for a normal creature. They cannot wear bracers or gloves designed for humanoids.
Level Adjustment: +1

Ok, I put a type in there (they aren't really humanoids).
I reduced their base land speed to show that these guys really are clumsy on land.
Added the exotic armor and flying restrictions. The exotic armor is assuming that they have batwings where there arms normally are, but if that's not the case remove the bracer/glove restriction.
Took out blindfight because they have blindsense already and it was just a little too much.

And by the way, Anthropomorphic is a template from Savage Species that lets you make any animal into a humanoid creature. Depending on your description of the creature they're already anthropomorphic.

We need more flavor, such as where they come from (formerly some sort of extra planar creature from limbo that set up a home on the prime, cursed breed of humans, descendants of werebats, product of magical experiments) and what their society is like.

From your description, they look like humans with large, bat-like wings. Okay, do they have these coming out from where their arms are? Out of their back like an angel/demon? Coming out of the side of their head? Their legs?

Are they furry? Are they Bat-like, or do they just have bat-wings? If they aren't bat-like, why do they have so many bat-like features (blindsense, spot bonus in the dark)?

Why are they smarter than a human? Do they have larger brains, or societies founded on learning?

These aren't questions I'm asking to be mean, these are questions that help us understand what you want to accomplish with the race and help you do that.

Look at a PHB race. They've got more than just a physical description and stat-block.

Overview: Davians are blah blah blah
Physiology: Davians are X tall, they have Y skin, males are bigger/smaller than females, they sleep hanging upside down, blah blah
Personality: Davians are calculating and blah blah blah
Alignments: Davians prefer freedom and self-reliance, they are stifled by rules and restrictions. blahblahblah
Lands: Davians live in mountain fortresses that incorporate natural caves or in dense dark jungles. (blahblahblah)
Religion: Davians worship Dave, lord of the bat-folk. blahblab
Language: Davians speak in a high pitched squeeky voice

These are all meant in jest, but the information is useful to us and to your players as well. It will let people know what these guys are other than a physical description.
Crebain
10-14-07, 01:05 PM Overview: Davians are anthropomorphic monstrous humanoids that look like humans but have large bat-wings coming out of their back
Physiology: Male davians are 5'6 to 6 foot tall and weigh from 100 to 130 pounds. Females are 4'7 to 5'5 foot tall and weigh 90 to 120 pounds. They have varied skin color. They have powerful eyes and ears.
Personality: Davians are always calm yet calculating. They are almost never frightened but alway a little bit nervous. They make certain that this nervousness never shows. The davians are just as active in the day as most races but are more active at night.
Alignments: Always Chaotic. Davians value their freedom highly but will comform to resonable laws if forced to.
Lands The davians come from dark dense jungles, but many live in the lands of other races.
Religion Most davians worship Corlon, the god of the night.
Language: Davians speak common and Davian which is a pattern of clicks and chirps which davians can use to communicate with each other diminutive animals

as for the stats they are:

Racial Traits
Ability Modifiers: +2 Int, -2 Dex
Size: Medium
Speed: 30 feet. Fly 20 (average).
Bonus Feats: Blindfight
Skill Bonuses: +2 on listen checks and +2 on spot checks in dark
Airborn Grace: +4 dodge bonus to AC while flying.
Level Adjustment: +1
Xiuhcoatl
10-14-07, 08:25 PM See, there you go -- that's much better. Now we have a basic idea of the race, and the stats are coherent. Good job. :)
DonThelonious
10-14-07, 08:32 PM Overview: Davians are anthropomorphic monstrous humanoids that look like humans but have large bat-wings coming out of their back
Physiology: Male davians are 5'6 to 6 foot tall and weigh from 100 to 130 pounds. Females are 4'7 to 5'5 foot tall and weigh 90 to 120 pounds. They have varied skin color. They have powerful eyes and ears.
Personality: Davians are always calm yet calculating. They are almost never frightened but alway a little bit nervous. They make certain that this nervousness never shows. The davians are just as active in the day as most races but are more active at night.
Alignments: Always Chaotic. Davians value their freedom highly but will comform to resonable laws if forced to.
Lands The davians come from dark dense jungles, but many live in the lands of other races.
Religion Most davians worship Corlon, the god of the night.
Language: Davians speak common and Davian which is a pattern of clicks and chirps which davians can use to communicate with each other diminutive animals

as for the stats they are:

Racial Traits
Ability Modifiers: +2 Int, -2 Dex
Size: Medium
Speed: 30 feet. Fly 20 (average).
Bonus Feats: Blindfight
Skill Bonuses: +2 on listen checks and +2 on spot checks in dark
Airborn Grace: +4 dodge bonus to AC while flying.
Level Adjustment: +1

Its shaping up to be quite a cool race. I still don't understand why they get a penalty to Dex? Also you might want to just drop the part I marked in red, it makes it less confusing.

:thumbsup: Good work so far.
Crebain
10-14-07, 09:39 PM the wing's bulkiness makes it harder to keep balance while dodging melee attacks and makes them larger targets for ranged attacks.
DonThelonious
10-15-07, 06:04 AM That makes sense. You might want to explain it with all the fluff, and if you have explained it I advise making it clearer so that, once again, there will be less confusion.

Someone earlier asked how they sleep. I think this is an imprtant question, because if I was going to run one of these as a character and they slept upside down, I would be getting me an immovable rod and flying REAL high.

Heck, now that I think about it if I could fly I would get two of them and string up a hammock at say 12,000 ft. Higher than a casually flying dragon or other hunting flying animal, or any hunting beast for that matter. Low enough so that I would not die from lack of oxygen. Still need some way to stay warm...

Oh... Oops, sorry about that. I was just going on a tangent :blush:...

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Crebain 10-12-07, 10:23 PM	Phisical desription: Davians look just like humans but have large bat-like wings. They have hollow bones that are twice as hard as a humans. They also have a one way breathing system (meaning they breathe in and out at the same time using a special organ). This system is designed for breathing in high altitudes ,which is a vestigial ability, considering they can only fly 5ft high. Davians have no stomach which decreases their weight significantly. Instead the use their intestines to digest their food. They eat smaller portions of food at a time but more times daily.
Crebain 10-12-07, 10:33 PM	Speed-30ft, Fly-20ft 5ft high +3 dexterity when flying Special Qualities- blindsense 20ft, low-light vision Abilities- Dex-1 Int+1 Feat- Alertness, blindfight Skills- +2 on spot and listen checks in the dark Languages- Speaks Davian Alignment- always chaotic
Darth Sephiroth 10-13-07, 10:14 AM	Uneven Ability scores shouldn't be used, secondly this is in the LA +1 or +2 range with everything
Crebain 10-13-07, 10:28 AM	I'm sorry but i've only been DM'ing for a year. What does LA mean.:confused:
Arscura 10-13-07, 11:26 AM	I'm sorry but i've only been DM'ing for a year. What does LA mean.:confused: Level Adjustment, which means you shouln't play this race as a level 1 character or 2, depending on the number. Indeed uneven score abilities shouldn't be used. I did that in the beginning of my career as race maker as well, but it isn't advised.
DonThelonious 10-13-07, 11:31 AM	LA is for level adjustment. It is explained more clearly in the back of the Monster Manual. Basically its a set number you would add when calculating levels, so a LA +1 race with 3 levels in rogue would be Effective Character Level (ECL) 4. You treat the character as if it was level 4 for experience based benefits such as ability score increases and feats, otherwise they are a level 3 character in all other respects. -- As for the race you have posted, why are they only allowed to fly 5 ft. off the ground? You might as well make the wings vestigial and give bonuses to jump and balance checks.
Crebain 10-13-07, 11:55 AM	Okay I will make them +1 LA. The reason they can only fly 5ft is so that characters can still hit them with their melee weapons. But I guess since most character carry at least one ranged weapon I will increase the max fly height to 30ft.
1 ton ghost 10-13-07, 01:24 PM	bat people ("desmodu", MonManII) already exist, just not in the capacity to which you have illustrated here. i think what you're gunning for is an anthropomorphic type which is totally relevant, but in need of a little tweaking. you might want to consider something to mimic echolocation or a vampire bat's sanguine tendencies, Blood Drain (Ex) and the like.
Crebain 10-13-07, 03:08 PM	First of all, I don't know what anthropomorphic means. Secondly It's a chaotic bat-like humanoid not an evil vampire.
1 ton ghost 10-13-07, 03:33 PM	First of all, I don't know what anthropomorphic means. Secondly It's a chaotic bat-like humanoid not an evil vampire. relax, damn... you posted for critique, that's what's going on here. no one took a pot shot at your write up. -if you don't know what anthropomorphic means, look it up, you can obviously use a computer. -blood drain isn't inherantly evil btw. vamp bats are faily low Int animals and alot of them have a dietary requirement, not a need to inflict dmg via blood loss. you've got your parties mixed.
Crebain 10-13-07, 03:52 PM	I wasn't meaning to be mean I just didn't know what anthropomorphic meant and wanted to show a difference beetween davians and vampires.
Xiuhcoatl 10-13-07, 06:51 PM	I wasn't meaning to be mean I just didn't know what anthropomorphic meant and wanted to show a difference beetween davians and vampires. Do you have the internet? Look up both on Wikipedia. It's easy to do. Anthropomorphism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthropomorphism) is easy to find, and Vampire Bats (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vampire_bat) are real creatures.
Hellsbells 10-13-07, 07:45 PM	Heehee... Wait for further updates
Crebain 10-13-07, 08:15 PM	I didn't know what anthropomorphic meant now I do. Yes, I did look it up on wikipedia and ,no, davians are not anthropomorphic. P.S. laugh at me and I will destroy you http://smilies.vidahost.com/contrib/sarge/BoomSmilie_anim.gif
Xiuhcoatl 10-13-07, 08:59 PM	If they aren't anthropomorphic, then what can they be? Please provide a detailed description. Here's some more feedback for you. Speed-30ft, Fly-20ft 5ft high +3 dexterity when flying Eh? What? Why do they get an odd bonus for being higher in the air? This mechanic simply doesn't exist. Either give them a simple dodge bonus or do away with it completely. Special Qualities- blindsense 20ft, low-light vision Being batfolk, can a Silence spell cancel out their blindsense? Abilities- Dex-1 Int+1 No go. Stat bonuses must be even. Make them +2 or +0. Feat- Alertness, blindfight Are these bonus feats? Skills- +2 on spot and listen checks in the dark This is OK. ... but why would listen be affected by light or the lack thereof? Sound travels the same in light or darkness. Languages- Speaks Davian You mean "Languages: Common, Davian" right? Alignment- always chaotic Alignment restrictions don't usually exist for PC races. As well, this is at least LA +1 ... no getting around that.
Hellsbells 10-13-07, 09:05 PM	WERE DID YOU GET THAT SMILEY! THAT IS SO AWESOME!
Crebain 10-13-07, 09:27 PM	Size - medium Speed - 30ft Fly - 20ft, 20ft high +2 dodge bonus when flying because of increased manuverability Special Qualities - blindsense 20ft Abilities - Dex -2, Int +2 Bonus Feats - Alertness, Blindfight Skills - +2 on spot checks in dark Languages - common, davian Alignment any p.s. I got the smily here http://www.mysmilies.com/smileys/Genres/Violent
Xiuhcoatl 10-13-07, 09:45 PM	what is the maneuverability of its flight? and what's the flavor text?
Crebain 10-13-07, 10:20 PM	They have increased manuverability in the air as opposed to being on the ground where their bulky wings create extra weight and can sometimes knock a davian off balance.
Xiuhcoatl 10-13-07, 11:17 PM	What is the flavor text for the race? What is the maneuverability of their flight?
Crebain 10-13-07, 11:51 PM	what do you mean....AND WHY MUST YOU ASK SO MANY QUESTIONS!!! :rant:
Fireclave 10-14-07, 12:05 AM	what do you mean....AND WHY MUST YOU ASK SO MANY QUESTIONS!!! :rant: People are asking you questions because that what you implicitly asked for by requesting critiques. And flight maneuverability is a rating of how well a creature can fly. Most creatures have a flight maneuverability of average or lower. Good and perfect maneuverability is usually the purview of magic or supernatural flight. You can read up more on flight in your DMG or in the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/movement.htm#movingInThreeDimensions).
Crebain 10-14-07, 12:34 AM	Fine if you must know thier flight manuverability is average.
Xiuhcoatl 10-14-07, 08:02 AM	Fine if you must know thier flight manuverability is average. So why do they get a dodge bonus in flight while other, faster, higher-dex, higher-manuverability races? As I have asked before: what is the flavor behind this race? You know, the fluff instead of the crunch?
DonThelonious 10-14-07, 08:37 AM	Crebain: Chill out dude. You have brought this on the boards and said: "Hey, look what I made!!!!!!" :ahem: And people are looking.:ahem: :rant: We are not criticizing you or your race. We are all here to help you balance it and cover all your bases when PCs get their hands on it. You stated above that that you are inexperienced and in need of advice, so stop acting like a damn NOOB, please.:rant: As for your race, I really like the concept, but the fluff is a bit meh. My advice is to lose the limit on flight elevation, PCs are not going to go with that, in fact they will most likely be put off by this type of limitation. It flies, plain and simple. As for the maneuverability, this is a medium race right? Small and smaller races would have an average maneuverability (if they have a VERY high Dex. So you might want to drop it by one category. Why do they have Blindsense 20ft. and Blind Fighting as a bonus feat? My advice is to go with either one or the other, not both. Having both makes no sense. As far as the +2 Dodge Bonus to AC while flying is concerned, drop it. Give them something like the Dodge Feat while airborne. And if yuo really wanted them to basically be humans with batwings, then you should ditch the ability score adjustment. Also lose the human extra feat and bonus skill points, since those have been replaced with wings. ---- Please do not be offended by the above. I am simply telling you like it is, in terms anyone will understand. No hard feelings.
EvilVegan 10-14-07, 09:14 AM	Crebrain, Please don't take the questions and suggestions personally, we're really here to help. Here's an editted and standardized version of the info you've given us. Racial Traits Ability Modifiers: +2 Int, -2 Dex Size: Medium Speed: 30 feet. Fly 20 (average). Senses: Blindsense 20 feet. Bonus Feats: Alertness, Blindfight Skill Bonus: +2 on spot checks in the dark. Airborn Grace: +2 dodge bonus to AC while flying. Level Adjustment: +1 It's a little powerful for +1 LA. If you had a restriction on the flight, such as "can't use hands or arms while flying" then that would be a balancing factor. Also, requiring exotic armor would help a little. Here's what I would do without any real information about why these abilities are the way they are (which is why Xiuhcoatl keeps asking for flavor text): Racial Traits Ability Modifiers: +2 Int. Davians are smart. Size: Medium. Type: Monstrous Humanoid. Speed: 20 feet. Fly 20 (average). While flying a Davian cannot wield weapons or cast spells requiring somatic components. Senses: Blindsense 20 feet. Bonus Feats: Alertness Skill Bonus: +2 on spot checks in the dark. Airborn Grace: +2 dodge bonus to AC while flying. Exotic Form: Armor designed for a davian costs twice as much as that for a normal creature. They cannot wear bracers or gloves designed for humanoids. Level Adjustment: +1 Ok, I put a type in there (they aren't really humanoids). I reduced their base land speed to show that these guys really are clumsy on land. Added the exotic armor and flying restrictions. The exotic armor is assuming that they have batwings where there arms normally are, but if that's not the case remove the bracer/glove restriction. Took out blindfight because they have blindsense already and it was just a little too much. And by the way, Anthropomorphic is a template from Savage Species that lets you make any animal into a humanoid creature. Depending on your description of the creature they're already anthropomorphic. We need more flavor, such as where they come from (formerly some sort of extra planar creature from limbo that set up a home on the prime, cursed breed of humans, descendants of werebats, product of magical experiments) and what their society is like. From your description, they look like humans with large, bat-like wings. Okay, do they have these coming out from where their arms are? Out of their back like an angel/demon? Coming out of the side of their head? Their legs? Are they furry? Are they Bat-like, or do they just have bat-wings? If they aren't bat-like, why do they have so many bat-like features (blindsense, spot bonus in the dark)? Why are they smarter than a human? Do they have larger brains, or societies founded on learning? These aren't questions I'm asking to be mean, these are questions that help us understand what you want to accomplish with the race and help you do that. Look at a PHB race. They've got more than just a physical description and stat-block. Overview: Davians are blah blah blah Physiology: Davians are X tall, they have Y skin, males are bigger/smaller than females, they sleep hanging upside down, blah blah Personality: Davians are calculating and blah blah blah Alignments: Davians prefer freedom and self-reliance, they are stifled by rules and restrictions. blahblahblah Lands: Davians live in mountain fortresses that incorporate natural caves or in dense dark jungles. (blahblahblah) Religion: Davians worship Dave, lord of the bat-folk. blahblab Language: Davians speak in a high pitched squeeky voice These are all meant in jest, but the information is useful to us and to your players as well. It will let people know what these guys are other than a physical description.
Crebain 10-14-07, 01:05 PM	Overview: Davians are anthropomorphic monstrous humanoids that look like humans but have large bat-wings coming out of their back Physiology: Male davians are 5'6 to 6 foot tall and weigh from 100 to 130 pounds. Females are 4'7 to 5'5 foot tall and weigh 90 to 120 pounds. They have varied skin color. They have powerful eyes and ears. Personality: Davians are always calm yet calculating. They are almost never frightened but alway a little bit nervous. They make certain that this nervousness never shows. The davians are just as active in the day as most races but are more active at night. Alignments: Always Chaotic. Davians value their freedom highly but will comform to resonable laws if forced to. Lands The davians come from dark dense jungles, but many live in the lands of other races. Religion Most davians worship Corlon, the god of the night. Language: Davians speak common and Davian which is a pattern of clicks and chirps which davians can use to communicate with each other diminutive animals as for the stats they are: Racial Traits Ability Modifiers: +2 Int, -2 Dex Size: Medium Speed: 30 feet. Fly 20 (average). Bonus Feats: Blindfight Skill Bonuses: +2 on listen checks and +2 on spot checks in dark Airborn Grace: +4 dodge bonus to AC while flying. Level Adjustment: +1
Xiuhcoatl 10-14-07, 08:25 PM	See, there you go -- that's much better. Now we have a basic idea of the race, and the stats are coherent. Good job. :)
DonThelonious 10-14-07, 08:32 PM	Overview: Davians are anthropomorphic monstrous humanoids that look like humans but have large bat-wings coming out of their back Physiology: Male davians are 5'6 to 6 foot tall and weigh from 100 to 130 pounds. Females are 4'7 to 5'5 foot tall and weigh 90 to 120 pounds. They have varied skin color. They have powerful eyes and ears. Personality: Davians are always calm yet calculating. They are almost never frightened but alway a little bit nervous. They make certain that this nervousness never shows. The davians are just as active in the day as most races but are more active at night. Alignments: Always Chaotic. Davians value their freedom highly but will comform to resonable laws if forced to. Lands The davians come from dark dense jungles, but many live in the lands of other races. Religion Most davians worship Corlon, the god of the night. Language: Davians speak common and Davian which is a pattern of clicks and chirps which davians can use to communicate with each other diminutive animals as for the stats they are: Racial Traits Ability Modifiers: +2 Int, -2 Dex Size: Medium Speed: 30 feet. Fly 20 (average). Bonus Feats: Blindfight Skill Bonuses: +2 on listen checks and +2 on spot checks in dark Airborn Grace: +4 dodge bonus to AC while flying. Level Adjustment: +1 Its shaping up to be quite a cool race. I still don't understand why they get a penalty to Dex? Also you might want to just drop the part I marked in red, it makes it less confusing. :thumbsup: Good work so far.
Crebain 10-14-07, 09:39 PM	the wing's bulkiness makes it harder to keep balance while dodging melee attacks and makes them larger targets for ranged attacks.
DonThelonious 10-15-07, 06:04 AM	That makes sense. You might want to explain it with all the fluff, and if you have explained it I advise making it clearer so that, once again, there will be less confusion. Someone earlier asked how they sleep. I think this is an imprtant question, because if I was going to run one of these as a character and they slept upside down, I would be getting me an immovable rod and flying REAL high. Heck, now that I think about it if I could fly I would get two of them and string up a hammock at say 12,000 ft. Higher than a casually flying dragon or other hunting flying animal, or any hunting beast for that matter. Low enough so that I would not die from lack of oxygen. Still need some way to stay warm... Oh... Oops, sorry about that. I was just going on a tangent :blush:...