Drow misconception? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Drow misconception? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
MelancholyWindmill
04-11-07, 08:42 PM Okay me and my friend were playing a game of D&D with him as the Dm and me and a few heroes as the unlikely raggamuffin party of heroes. so I decide to make a drow druid (simply because I had never seen one before and thought it would be an interesting idea since we weren't going to play that particular game for any long period of time) now my friend the DM starts pulling out some stuff about drow being these very insectoid creatures that resembled any one of a myriad of bugs. More like half breed insects and some sort of elvish creature and had completely separated the Drow from Dark elves. (what i mean is there were mantis based drow ant based drow spider based dorw etc etc etc) I had no idea where he was getting any of his information, and not one to immediately refuse his claims thinking i may just be wrong (my idea being that drow was just another name for dark elves in relatively any setting) so tonight (this being a week afterward and consulting other friends) I decided to check the internet if I could find out exactly where he had seen this (him saying he had never seen drow as a name for dark elves and had always seen drow as those crazy bug things) after doing a google search and checking the first three pages of searching different things for half an hour I came up with nothing and hoped that asking here I may learn if his are legitimate claims or just stuff he made up and convinced himself were true.

so anyone who ha sany information that could help me figure this out i would much appreciate it
Frylord
04-11-07, 08:48 PM Bwuh? Drow as insects? Never heard of the idea...

The only insect race in D&D I've heard of is the Thri-Kreen (not spelled right, I know)

Buuuut... I don't know a lot about D&D, so can't help you there.
Richmud
04-11-07, 08:55 PM I've never heard the term drow used to describe anything other then dark elves

For what its worth standard dark elves are connected with spiders and there is a creature called a drider (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/drider.htm) that is like a centaur but drow and spider instead of human and horse
MelancholyWindmill
04-11-07, 08:57 PM no he knows the difference between these "drow" and a drider, I even asked him if he had meant a drider he is convinced that drow are most often refered to as a separate thing entirely.

I mean I am reletively knew to D&D if I say so myself but I know enough of the varios races to figure ther ewas soemthign wrong with what he was saying
MikeN
04-11-07, 08:58 PM His campaign, his rules. By "traditional" D&D, he's wrong...they're simply funny-colored elves with some angst whose main goddess likes spiders for some reason and who have some minor benefits covered by an LA high enough to ALMOST make sure most fanboys won't play them :P
Infinitum
04-11-07, 11:53 PM Drow = Dark Elves

Dark Elves = Drow

The elven goddess Araunshee plotted against the creator of the elves Corellon Larethian, eventually being expelled from the elven pantheon and stripped of her divinity. She became the demoness Lolth and re-ascended to god(dess)hood, then set about making her mark in the underdark. She swayed elves from the surface to follow her, to take her as their new faith. Those elves that did follow her were cursed by Corellon and his peers, their ancestors becoming what you see as today in cities such as Menzoberranzan and Ched Nasad (when it existed). These "dark elves" became known as the Drow, and they eventually awoke a major force in the Underdark, following their dark queen.

Thus, they are not, in any form at all now or in the past, insect in any form.
Shatteredtower
04-12-07, 03:46 AM Sounds like someone might have combined drow with insectare from 2nd Edition's Spelljammer.
D-Dus
04-12-07, 03:50 AM I'm surprised that nobody mentioned this, but:
there's a picture of a drow in the DMG..... :eek:
Just show him that and he'll have a hard time denying that drow are really just dark elves :P
Alac Luin
04-12-07, 01:39 PM Or tell him to look at the MM
From the SRD (elf entry)
"Drow
Also known as dark elves, drow are a depraved and evil subterranean offshoot."
YellowKnight
04-12-07, 02:15 PM You're forgetting that this guy has the ability to modify how things are in his game. He could very well be making his own version of the "drow", expanding the race as a whole into two different types. If he wants to do this, it's fair game. He doesn't have to use them as written if he doesn't want to.

It looks like he's actually a little confused about them as is, but he can change how they are if he so chooses.
Alac Luin
04-12-07, 02:22 PM You're forgetting that this guy has the ability to modify how things are in his game. He could very well be making his own version of the "drow", expanding the race as a whole into two different types. If he wants to do this, it's fair game. He doesn't have to use them as written if he doesn't want to.

It looks like he's actually a little confused about them as is, but he can change how they are if he so chooses.

No no, we can allow the DM to do what he wishes in his game but
"(him saying he had never seen drow as a name for dark elves and had always seen drow as those crazy bug things) "

The DM should be informed that the two terms are typically interchangeable. (well, not in dragonlance :) )

The DM should be better at explaining that in his world, Drow are a different creature to new players to his game that might want to play a "dark elf" charicter.
HermitIX
04-12-07, 02:23 PM Drow are not bugs.

I would point out that in the Dragon Lance world they do not have Drow, but they do have Dark Elves. Dark Elves are evil elves that have been kicked out of the good elf land. They look normal though.
YellowKnight
04-12-07, 04:43 PM No no, we can allow the DM to do what he wishes in his game but
"(him saying he had never seen drow as a name for dark elves and had always seen drow as those crazy bug things) "

The DM should be informed that the two terms are typically interchangeable. (well, not in dragonlance :) )

The DM should be better at explaining that in his world, Drow are a different creature to new players to his game that might want to play a "dark elf" charicter.

That's why I said he looks a little confused.
Treymordin
04-12-07, 10:06 PM Drow = Dark Elves

Dark Elves = Drow

The elven goddess Araunshee plotted against the creator of the elves Corellon Larethian, eventually being expelled from the elven pantheon and stripped of her divinity. She became the demoness Lolth and re-ascended to god(dess)hood, then set about making her mark in the underdark. She swayed elves from the surface to follow her, to take her as their new faith. Those elves that did follow her were cursed by Corellon and his peers, their ancestors becoming what you see as today in cities such as Menzoberranzan and Ched Nasad (when it existed). These "dark elves" became known as the Drow, and they eventually awoke a major force in the Underdark, following their dark queen.

Thus, they are not, in any form at all now or in the past, insect in any form.

That is only in the Forgotten Realms.
Treymordin
04-12-07, 10:07 PM Drow are not bugs.

I would point out that in the Dragon Lance world they do not have Drow, but they do have Dark Elves. Dark Elves are evil elves that have been kicked out of the good elf land. They look normal though.

Very true!!

Oh and drow are not just dark they aer black, almost purple.
D-Dus
04-13-07, 03:22 AM Or tell him to look at the MM

D'oh! That's what I meant. There's a picture in the MM.... :embarrass
The_Shaman
04-13-07, 08:00 AM There was a kind of template in Underdark that turned any creature into a spiderlike abomination... Perhaps he wanted to spice things a little by including it or the spider-touched? Otherwise, drow are about as insectile as any other elf is - not at all. Besides, I think that it was mentioned in a few novels that drow don't find driders especially attractive, too.
MelancholyWindmill
04-13-07, 03:59 PM well thanks everyone you all have confirmed what i thought, the thing thats different about him creating a new setting is that he claims to have seen exactly 3 books (i am unsure if he means novels or modules) where it states his versian of drow. I have looked into it on the internet and have not come with anything (as before) so does anyone know if there are any books that might lead him to this conclusion
Aetheryn
04-13-07, 04:19 PM I'm so confused all of a sudden. :P
The_Shaman
04-13-07, 04:34 PM Insectile drow that are not driders, nor Lloth-touched, not arachnoid? (the one from Underdark)? I can't say I think of one that can possible be canon, unless he means the aranea. However, their alternate form is usually that of a normal elf (or human).
AnonymousInternets
04-13-07, 08:27 PM While you and the DM were talking, did either try opening the Drow page in the MM? It really does look like a purple elf with silver hair. Nothing insectoid about it at all.
CaptKillern
04-13-07, 08:54 PM I have seen some stuff in Eberron where Drow where insect armor. Forgot what it was called. Spider chitin? But even in the pictures its clearly a darkskinned elf in armor.
Richmud
04-13-07, 09:02 PM I have seen some stuff in Eberron where Drow where insect armor. Forgot what it was called. Spider chitin? But even in the pictures its clearly a darkskinned elf in armor.

I think drow have a scorpion thing instead of a spider thing going in Eberron
Kouk
04-14-07, 06:29 AM That is only in the Forgotten Realms.

Lolth is in core now, the story is pretty much the same I think.
Ghenesh
04-14-07, 07:38 PM Totally offtopic question, what's the offspring between an Elf and a Drow?
Bladerock
04-14-07, 08:22 PM Half-elf with darkvison instead of low-light vision?

That is what half-drow-half-human where tha last time i checked... But i am not sure about what would happen if it where half-drow-half-elf.
Eatable_Dice
04-14-07, 11:14 PM Totally offtopic question, what's the offspring between an Elf and a Drow?

Half a pint of Guiness + Half a pint of Budweiser.
Wharin
04-15-07, 01:29 AM Totally offtopic question, what's the offspring between an Elf and a Drow?

If you use FR rules, its going to be one or the other. And this is true for all elves: see, wood, bronze, moon, drow etc. There are no hybrid full elves (if that makes any sense to you). Now I have heard some people say that Drow + (non drow) elf always equals Drow, but I have yet to read that for myself in a 3rd edition source book.

I believe there was even a story published in Dragon a few years back where some Moon elf schmuck was all emo because his Sun elf daughter could never use his Moonblade, lest she die, because, despite the fact that her parantage is one half moon elf, she is, for all intents and purposes, still a "full blooded" Sun Elf.

I am unsure what the Greyhawk/Standard rules are, but I would hope that they are the same, less there be even more subraces out there. Of course, that would help explain there are already so many subraces: they are all just crossbreeds, which were bred like dogs for new types.
Wolf72
04-15-07, 11:47 AM well thanks everyone you all have confirmed what i thought, the thing thats different about him creating a new setting is that he claims to have seen exactly 3 books (i am unsure if he means novels or modules) where it states his versian of drow. I have looked into it on the internet and have not come with anything (as before) so does anyone know if there are any books that might lead him to this conclusion

not one thing, at this point ask him to provide evidence ... He is confused and seems to refuse to admit it (err stubborn, even). I've done that before and it's really hard to give up that type of idea sometimes.
docballen
04-15-07, 12:26 PM My first experience with the world of "elves" came with an AD&D book called "Elves" (published by Role Aids...) where it details a variety of elf-races. There is a whole segment on "dark elves"-- or as they are called now, Drow. it includes a pretty detailed physical description... which is confirmed by MM 3.5.

You may not be able to help your delusional friend. Just see if he will let you play the character you choose but call it a "dark elf" or maybe a "black elf" and use the correct stats.

Please be aware that this should give you warning sirens about this guy's DM style. Be ready for more crazy "house rules."
SSj3goblin
04-15-07, 02:10 PM I have to agree. It's probably one of these DM's (some players are like this too) who get everything wrong and seem to play an entire different game than D&D (like my DM who said Djinn's wanted to destroy the world because they were CHAOTIC (and good :rolleyes:, wich it seems he did not get )).

My advice, run away.
Prak, the Mad
04-16-07, 04:16 PM Otherwise, drow are about as insectile as any other elf is - not at all.
except of course for Mialee, the mutant cricket, :)

my advice, point out that in standard D&D Drow are just evil elves that live underground, show him the MM, then ask if he's changing that for his game.

Half a pint of Guiness + Half a pint of Budweiser. so a horrid abomination whose parents should be slain, gotcha.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
MelancholyWindmill 04-11-07, 08:42 PM	Okay me and my friend were playing a game of D&D with him as the Dm and me and a few heroes as the unlikely raggamuffin party of heroes. so I decide to make a drow druid (simply because I had never seen one before and thought it would be an interesting idea since we weren't going to play that particular game for any long period of time) now my friend the DM starts pulling out some stuff about drow being these very insectoid creatures that resembled any one of a myriad of bugs. More like half breed insects and some sort of elvish creature and had completely separated the Drow from Dark elves. (what i mean is there were mantis based drow ant based drow spider based dorw etc etc etc) I had no idea where he was getting any of his information, and not one to immediately refuse his claims thinking i may just be wrong (my idea being that drow was just another name for dark elves in relatively any setting) so tonight (this being a week afterward and consulting other friends) I decided to check the internet if I could find out exactly where he had seen this (him saying he had never seen drow as a name for dark elves and had always seen drow as those crazy bug things) after doing a google search and checking the first three pages of searching different things for half an hour I came up with nothing and hoped that asking here I may learn if his are legitimate claims or just stuff he made up and convinced himself were true. so anyone who ha sany information that could help me figure this out i would much appreciate it
Frylord 04-11-07, 08:48 PM	Bwuh? Drow as insects? Never heard of the idea... The only insect race in D&D I've heard of is the Thri-Kreen (not spelled right, I know) Buuuut... I don't know a lot about D&D, so can't help you there.
Richmud 04-11-07, 08:55 PM	I've never heard the term drow used to describe anything other then dark elves For what its worth standard dark elves are connected with spiders and there is a creature called a drider (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/drider.htm) that is like a centaur but drow and spider instead of human and horse
MelancholyWindmill 04-11-07, 08:57 PM	no he knows the difference between these "drow" and a drider, I even asked him if he had meant a drider he is convinced that drow are most often refered to as a separate thing entirely. I mean I am reletively knew to D&D if I say so myself but I know enough of the varios races to figure ther ewas soemthign wrong with what he was saying
MikeN 04-11-07, 08:58 PM	His campaign, his rules. By "traditional" D&D, he's wrong...they're simply funny-colored elves with some angst whose main goddess likes spiders for some reason and who have some minor benefits covered by an LA high enough to ALMOST make sure most fanboys won't play them :P
Infinitum 04-11-07, 11:53 PM	Drow = Dark Elves Dark Elves = Drow The elven goddess Araunshee plotted against the creator of the elves Corellon Larethian, eventually being expelled from the elven pantheon and stripped of her divinity. She became the demoness Lolth and re-ascended to god(dess)hood, then set about making her mark in the underdark. She swayed elves from the surface to follow her, to take her as their new faith. Those elves that did follow her were cursed by Corellon and his peers, their ancestors becoming what you see as today in cities such as Menzoberranzan and Ched Nasad (when it existed). These "dark elves" became known as the Drow, and they eventually awoke a major force in the Underdark, following their dark queen. Thus, they are not, in any form at all now or in the past, insect in any form.
Shatteredtower 04-12-07, 03:46 AM	Sounds like someone might have combined drow with insectare from 2nd Edition's Spelljammer.
D-Dus 04-12-07, 03:50 AM	I'm surprised that nobody mentioned this, but: there's a picture of a drow in the DMG..... :eek: Just show him that and he'll have a hard time denying that drow are really just dark elves :P
Alac Luin 04-12-07, 01:39 PM	Or tell him to look at the MM From the SRD (elf entry) "Drow Also known as dark elves, drow are a depraved and evil subterranean offshoot."
YellowKnight 04-12-07, 02:15 PM	You're forgetting that this guy has the ability to modify how things are in his game. He could very well be making his own version of the "drow", expanding the race as a whole into two different types. If he wants to do this, it's fair game. He doesn't have to use them as written if he doesn't want to. It looks like he's actually a little confused about them as is, but he can change how they are if he so chooses.
Alac Luin 04-12-07, 02:22 PM	You're forgetting that this guy has the ability to modify how things are in his game. He could very well be making his own version of the "drow", expanding the race as a whole into two different types. If he wants to do this, it's fair game. He doesn't have to use them as written if he doesn't want to. It looks like he's actually a little confused about them as is, but he can change how they are if he so chooses. No no, we can allow the DM to do what he wishes in his game but "(him saying he had never seen drow as a name for dark elves and had always seen drow as those crazy bug things) " The DM should be informed that the two terms are typically interchangeable. (well, not in dragonlance :) ) The DM should be better at explaining that in his world, Drow are a different creature to new players to his game that might want to play a "dark elf" charicter.
HermitIX 04-12-07, 02:23 PM	Drow are not bugs. I would point out that in the Dragon Lance world they do not have Drow, but they do have Dark Elves. Dark Elves are evil elves that have been kicked out of the good elf land. They look normal though.
YellowKnight 04-12-07, 04:43 PM	No no, we can allow the DM to do what he wishes in his game but "(him saying he had never seen drow as a name for dark elves and had always seen drow as those crazy bug things) " The DM should be informed that the two terms are typically interchangeable. (well, not in dragonlance :) ) The DM should be better at explaining that in his world, Drow are a different creature to new players to his game that might want to play a "dark elf" charicter. That's why I said he looks a little confused.
Treymordin 04-12-07, 10:06 PM	Drow = Dark Elves Dark Elves = Drow The elven goddess Araunshee plotted against the creator of the elves Corellon Larethian, eventually being expelled from the elven pantheon and stripped of her divinity. She became the demoness Lolth and re-ascended to god(dess)hood, then set about making her mark in the underdark. She swayed elves from the surface to follow her, to take her as their new faith. Those elves that did follow her were cursed by Corellon and his peers, their ancestors becoming what you see as today in cities such as Menzoberranzan and Ched Nasad (when it existed). These "dark elves" became known as the Drow, and they eventually awoke a major force in the Underdark, following their dark queen. Thus, they are not, in any form at all now or in the past, insect in any form. That is only in the Forgotten Realms.
Treymordin 04-12-07, 10:07 PM	Drow are not bugs. I would point out that in the Dragon Lance world they do not have Drow, but they do have Dark Elves. Dark Elves are evil elves that have been kicked out of the good elf land. They look normal though. Very true!! Oh and drow are not just dark they aer black, almost purple.
D-Dus 04-13-07, 03:22 AM	Or tell him to look at the MM D'oh! That's what I meant. There's a picture in the MM.... :embarrass
The_Shaman 04-13-07, 08:00 AM	There was a kind of template in Underdark that turned any creature into a spiderlike abomination... Perhaps he wanted to spice things a little by including it or the spider-touched? Otherwise, drow are about as insectile as any other elf is - not at all. Besides, I think that it was mentioned in a few novels that drow don't find driders especially attractive, too.
MelancholyWindmill 04-13-07, 03:59 PM	well thanks everyone you all have confirmed what i thought, the thing thats different about him creating a new setting is that he claims to have seen exactly 3 books (i am unsure if he means novels or modules) where it states his versian of drow. I have looked into it on the internet and have not come with anything (as before) so does anyone know if there are any books that might lead him to this conclusion
Aetheryn 04-13-07, 04:19 PM	I'm so confused all of a sudden. :P
The_Shaman 04-13-07, 04:34 PM	Insectile drow that are not driders, nor Lloth-touched, not arachnoid? (the one from Underdark)? I can't say I think of one that can possible be canon, unless he means the aranea. However, their alternate form is usually that of a normal elf (or human).
AnonymousInternets 04-13-07, 08:27 PM	While you and the DM were talking, did either try opening the Drow page in the MM? It really does look like a purple elf with silver hair. Nothing insectoid about it at all.
CaptKillern 04-13-07, 08:54 PM	I have seen some stuff in Eberron where Drow where insect armor. Forgot what it was called. Spider chitin? But even in the pictures its clearly a darkskinned elf in armor.
Richmud 04-13-07, 09:02 PM	I have seen some stuff in Eberron where Drow where insect armor. Forgot what it was called. Spider chitin? But even in the pictures its clearly a darkskinned elf in armor. I think drow have a scorpion thing instead of a spider thing going in Eberron
Kouk 04-14-07, 06:29 AM	That is only in the Forgotten Realms. Lolth is in core now, the story is pretty much the same I think.
Ghenesh 04-14-07, 07:38 PM	Totally offtopic question, what's the offspring between an Elf and a Drow?
Bladerock 04-14-07, 08:22 PM	Half-elf with darkvison instead of low-light vision? That is what half-drow-half-human where tha last time i checked... But i am not sure about what would happen if it where half-drow-half-elf.
Eatable_Dice 04-14-07, 11:14 PM	Totally offtopic question, what's the offspring between an Elf and a Drow? Half a pint of Guiness + Half a pint of Budweiser.
Wharin 04-15-07, 01:29 AM	Totally offtopic question, what's the offspring between an Elf and a Drow? If you use FR rules, its going to be one or the other. And this is true for all elves: see, wood, bronze, moon, drow etc. There are no hybrid full elves (if that makes any sense to you). Now I have heard some people say that Drow + (non drow) elf always equals Drow, but I have yet to read that for myself in a 3rd edition source book. I believe there was even a story published in Dragon a few years back where some Moon elf schmuck was all emo because his Sun elf daughter could never use his Moonblade, lest she die, because, despite the fact that her parantage is one half moon elf, she is, for all intents and purposes, still a "full blooded" Sun Elf. I am unsure what the Greyhawk/Standard rules are, but I would hope that they are the same, less there be even more subraces out there. Of course, that would help explain there are already so many subraces: they are all just crossbreeds, which were bred like dogs for new types.
Wolf72 04-15-07, 11:47 AM	well thanks everyone you all have confirmed what i thought, the thing thats different about him creating a new setting is that he claims to have seen exactly 3 books (i am unsure if he means novels or modules) where it states his versian of drow. I have looked into it on the internet and have not come with anything (as before) so does anyone know if there are any books that might lead him to this conclusion not one thing, at this point ask him to provide evidence ... He is confused and seems to refuse to admit it (err stubborn, even). I've done that before and it's really hard to give up that type of idea sometimes.
docballen 04-15-07, 12:26 PM	My first experience with the world of "elves" came with an AD&D book called "Elves" (published by Role Aids...) where it details a variety of elf-races. There is a whole segment on "dark elves"-- or as they are called now, Drow. it includes a pretty detailed physical description... which is confirmed by MM 3.5. You may not be able to help your delusional friend. Just see if he will let you play the character you choose but call it a "dark elf" or maybe a "black elf" and use the correct stats. Please be aware that this should give you warning sirens about this guy's DM style. Be ready for more crazy "house rules."
SSj3goblin 04-15-07, 02:10 PM	I have to agree. It's probably one of these DM's (some players are like this too) who get everything wrong and seem to play an entire different game than D&D (like my DM who said Djinn's wanted to destroy the world because they were CHAOTIC (and good :rolleyes:, wich it seems he did not get )). My advice, run away.
Prak, the Mad 04-16-07, 04:16 PM	Otherwise, drow are about as insectile as any other elf is - not at all. except of course for Mialee, the mutant cricket, :) my advice, point out that in standard D&D Drow are just evil elves that live underground, show him the MM, then ask if he's changing that for his game. Half a pint of Guiness + Half a pint of Budweiser. so a horrid abomination whose parents should be slain, gotcha.