Ebberon dwarves [Archive] - Wizards Community

Ebberon dwarves [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Angus Cotton
02-04-08, 03:18 PM I did not know where to post this, but I decided it is more a race question than a feat question. Before I get into my problem, I want to preface this by saying I run a level 20ish, non-Ebberon game. It is a world I made up completely separate from Ebberon. My buddy (we will call him "DM2")who plays in my game, also DMs. His group is level 8ish, and his world is also unrelated to Ebberon. We alternate DMing, and when we decide to make a house rule decision, we consult each other, and try to keep the same rules between both groups. Bear all this in mind. Now the issue.

I have a player in my group who plays a dwarf fighter. He wants to take as his feat choice for 20th level, "Mror's Stalwart" from Races of Ebberon. Also, Dwarven Waraxe is not on the list of weapons that that feat improves; so, since he (and me and the other DM for that matter) don't see why it was excluded from the list of cultural dwarven weapons, he wants us to house rule it that it should be on the list. Note also, that he has taken all the Specialization feats and Focus feats for Dwarven Waraxe. He has already asked this of me a few times, and I have already told him "no", but I decided to take a more open mind about it last game, and to mull it over.

Here are my problems with this:
1) He wants to customize an existing feat to fit his need by rewriting it.
2) It is an Eberon feat, and althouogh the Mror dwarves of Eberon are similiar in DNA, they are totally different culturally and technologically.
3) It was written with the Eberon ruleset in mind, so their might be balance issues we are not aware of (no Action Points in our games for example).
4) Allowing him to do it anyway, would set a precident where we are modifying feats for other players.

Here is what DM2 has a problem with:
1) the ability to get all those weapon feats attached to other weapons, by simply just having proficiency in them, well, in his opinion, he feels the feat itself is to powerful.

I do not feel it is to powerful myself, simply because it will only equate to +1 damage to his waraxe. The other stuff is immaterial, I think, as I don't think he is going to use a warhammer, when he has a waraxe available. Anyway, all this brings me to my questions:

1) What are your opinions?
2) What is it about Mror dwarves that cause dwarven waraxe to be left off the Mror Stalwart list? an oversight? or do they really not use dwarven waraxes that much?
ProjectA
02-04-08, 10:47 PM 1) I just opened the book to check and dwarven waraxe is included.
2) Eberron dwarves aren't that different. They're still proud warriors, craftsmen, and merchants who defend their people and treasures fiercely.
3) Not having action points should make that part of the feat moot since he won't be able to use it anyway right?
4) You'd set a precedent for letting somebody have a feat that amounted to +1 damage which isn't a huge deal, really.
Neutronium_Dragon
02-05-08, 04:00 AM The feat fits perfectly well into any standard dwarf culture - that's the reason for the Mror requirement (so that the dwarf taking it has a dwarven-culture background).

As for balance issues? Honestly, it's not that great a feat in any circumstance, and as a choice at level 20 it might be nice for the theme but from a mechanical perspective it's really weak; if it creates any balance problems they'll be on the side of 'seriously underpowered'.
serow_#R
02-05-08, 04:26 AM This feat makes a dwarven fighter fight better with a few more weapons at level 20?

Sounds rather underpowered... especially since it probably won't be able to work with Weapon Supremacy.
Edymnion
02-06-08, 12:52 PM Check PHBII for the weapon focus/specialization/etc line thats there. Type Mastery that applies to all weapons of the same damage type. Sure, hefty prereqs, but there is little reason a fighter married to his weapon wouldn't have picked those prereqs up anyway.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Angus Cotton 02-04-08, 03:18 PM	I did not know where to post this, but I decided it is more a race question than a feat question. Before I get into my problem, I want to preface this by saying I run a level 20ish, non-Ebberon game. It is a world I made up completely separate from Ebberon. My buddy (we will call him "DM2")who plays in my game, also DMs. His group is level 8ish, and his world is also unrelated to Ebberon. We alternate DMing, and when we decide to make a house rule decision, we consult each other, and try to keep the same rules between both groups. Bear all this in mind. Now the issue. I have a player in my group who plays a dwarf fighter. He wants to take as his feat choice for 20th level, "Mror's Stalwart" from Races of Ebberon. Also, Dwarven Waraxe is not on the list of weapons that that feat improves; so, since he (and me and the other DM for that matter) don't see why it was excluded from the list of cultural dwarven weapons, he wants us to house rule it that it should be on the list. Note also, that he has taken all the Specialization feats and Focus feats for Dwarven Waraxe. He has already asked this of me a few times, and I have already told him "no", but I decided to take a more open mind about it last game, and to mull it over. Here are my problems with this: 1) He wants to customize an existing feat to fit his need by rewriting it. 2) It is an Eberon feat, and althouogh the Mror dwarves of Eberon are similiar in DNA, they are totally different culturally and technologically. 3) It was written with the Eberon ruleset in mind, so their might be balance issues we are not aware of (no Action Points in our games for example). 4) Allowing him to do it anyway, would set a precident where we are modifying feats for other players. Here is what DM2 has a problem with: 1) the ability to get all those weapon feats attached to other weapons, by simply just having proficiency in them, well, in his opinion, he feels the feat itself is to powerful. I do not feel it is to powerful myself, simply because it will only equate to +1 damage to his waraxe. The other stuff is immaterial, I think, as I don't think he is going to use a warhammer, when he has a waraxe available. Anyway, all this brings me to my questions: 1) What are your opinions? 2) What is it about Mror dwarves that cause dwarven waraxe to be left off the Mror Stalwart list? an oversight? or do they really not use dwarven waraxes that much?
ProjectA 02-04-08, 10:47 PM	1) I just opened the book to check and dwarven waraxe is included. 2) Eberron dwarves aren't that different. They're still proud warriors, craftsmen, and merchants who defend their people and treasures fiercely. 3) Not having action points should make that part of the feat moot since he won't be able to use it anyway right? 4) You'd set a precedent for letting somebody have a feat that amounted to +1 damage which isn't a huge deal, really.
Neutronium_Dragon 02-05-08, 04:00 AM	The feat fits perfectly well into any standard dwarf culture - that's the reason for the Mror requirement (so that the dwarf taking it has a dwarven-culture background). As for balance issues? Honestly, it's not that great a feat in any circumstance, and as a choice at level 20 it might be nice for the theme but from a mechanical perspective it's really weak; if it creates any balance problems they'll be on the side of 'seriously underpowered'.
serow_#R 02-05-08, 04:26 AM	This feat makes a dwarven fighter fight better with a few more weapons at level 20? Sounds rather underpowered... especially since it probably won't be able to work with Weapon Supremacy.
Edymnion 02-06-08, 12:52 PM	Check PHBII for the weapon focus/specialization/etc line thats there. Type Mastery that applies to all weapons of the same damage type. Sure, hefty prereqs, but there is little reason a fighter married to his weapon wouldn't have picked those prereqs up anyway.