Post/Author/DateTime	Post
nighttree 09-17-07, 10:28 PM	Hellbred have the (Ex) ability Evil Exception, which allows them to cast evil spells, use evil items etc...etc..without penalty regardless of their alignment. So the question is this...... Can a hellbred who is NOT evil, still qualify for feats, and PrC that require evil alignment ?
IdleAltruism 09-17-07, 10:32 PM	The ability doesn't grant them this, so I would have to say no. It doesn't speculate that there could be more exceptions, its pretty clear on what it does and doesn't do. Getting into an evil PrC would probably lead such a character to become evil anyways.
nighttree 09-17-07, 11:01 PM	The reason I ask (bear with me, it may make a difference in opinion), Is that I have been working on a build. This person is Hellbred (duh), and feels "used" by the gods. In his previouse life he was a cleric of an evil god (and was somewhat shocked to find out that instead of being slated for "royal treatment" due to his years of exceptional service to this god, was instead going to suffer an eternity of torment). Just prior to his death, he did a number of exceptional deeds (due to events in the world everyone was "cut off" from all the gods, and had to make the best of a bad situation), and as a result his souls disposition is in question. Now he finds himself a Hellbred (Warlock), and I have been toying with the Idea of the "Unholy Scion" template (hence the question regarding templates, although the template say's "evil" alignment....could events change his alignment ???) or once the template is in place is alignment "fixed". I also would like him to go into Ur Priest (followed by Eldritch Disciple) but it requires evil alignment (although it makes no mention of loosing class abilities if you don't maintane evil alignment) and a feat (Spell focus "Evil") that also requires an evil alignment. So if he starts out evil, and keeps that alignment until he gains Ur Priest, could his alignment shift to more of a Neutral alignment, without loss of template, or Ur Priest abilities ??? EDIT: After reading the alignments in detail, this character is most likely Neutral Evil anyway, it's just that his concern is avoiding having his soul return to his former master. I guess I should be asking can an evil character do "Good", completely for selfish reasons (grin)
IdleAltruism 09-17-07, 11:12 PM	Really you would be completely stretching what the hellbred is supposed to be. He shouldn't have any knowledge of his prior life. Generally when you don't meet the prerequisites of a PrC class you loose all the abilities it granted you(complete warrior pg 16, it specifically states alignment can do this). The Unholyscion is an inherited template. If you read the fluff you're born with it. Since hellbred aren't born it would be very difficult to acquire this template.....
Duelpersonality 09-18-07, 10:35 AM	Also, the unholy scion template is pretty specific that it's an evil outsider taking control of a baby still on the womb or a mutated half-fiend that looks exactly like the humanoid race of the other parent. The way you're describing the actions of the character, he's already going back anyway. Hellbred who are using the Evil Exception heavily ability are already walking a pretty fine line when it comes to their ultimate fate. Now, if you're dead set on the unholy scion part, you might try working with your DM to change the abilities and power level (as the level adjust is pretty harsh) to use as a kind of escapee from the torment of the afterlife. This would require a lot of work to tweak the template, but it could be used for this and possibly create a much more interesting conundrum than a hellbred. How do you deal with the fact that you had to destroy a child's life to get your second chance? The restart in levels could be explained as the baby's brain not being able to contain your former life's memories in full, but you still remember enough to know what happened. Just random thoughts, though I think I have a good idea for the Good Guy in my evil campaign now...
nighttree 09-18-07, 11:05 AM	Now, if you're dead set on the unholy scion part, you might try working with your DM to change the abilities and power level (as the level adjust is pretty harsh) to use as a kind of escapee from the torment of the afterlife. This would require a lot of work to tweak the template, but it could be used for this and possibly create a much more interesting conundrum than a hellbred. That was kind of the idea, as you put it, he is an "escapee" (or more to the point, he's being given another chance due to his actions just prior to death) to avoid the grasp of his former god. His god, actually granted him the abilities gained by the "Unholy Scion" template in hopes of corrupting/tainting him enough to insure the return of his property (in this case, a soul). The character does not have ALL of his past life memories, although he knows all the "basic" stuff an adult would (the specifics of his former life are missing) other than that he served this God, and nightmare flashes of the Abyss where his soul was headed. The rest of the party is 8th level, and the idea was that this character would "appear" to be about 6 years old, and traveling with his mother (he is actually about 6 months old, and aging at an apperant rate of about one year per month till he hit's adulthood). So he would start with the "Unholy Scion" template, and three class levels. I actually thought it fit with both Hellbred, and Unholy Scion (at least the theme did) pretty well :(
Duelpersonality 09-18-07, 01:46 PM	Don't let the rules get in the way of a good story. If your DM is willing to work with you on the unholy scion, go for it. I would leave hellbred out if you are going for a literal rebirth (though you might be able to work on the Evil Exception ability to include it with the modified unholy scion idea).