Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Anearysm 01-31-08, 10:53 PM	Just wondering if anyone could help me make this little race of mine not unbalanced. Bit of background: they look very similar to werewolves (takes an ability check to tell the difference in some cases). they're just as intelligent as humans. the foerei (same word in plural and singular) have incredibly keen senses and incredible reflexes. they're taught at an early age how to hunt, track, use a bow, etc. they try to avoid contact with human settlements for risk of being mistaken for a werewolf and killed, but they maintain good relations with other races, elves and gnomes in particular. Stats: -I'm thinking +2 wisdom and/or +2 dex. I'm wondering if i should slap a -2 charisma for their appearance. -medium size -Proficiency with bows -+2 skill bonuses to listen, spot, search, and survival. -Wondering if they should have the "scent" ability, or at least a watered down version of it (15' instead of 30 feet maybe?) -Think i should give them the track feat, or at the very least a bonus to track checks (you can do <DC10 track checks w/o the feat i think) -low-light vision -Languages: sylvan+common. Bonus: Elven + gnome. -Favored class: ranger -I should probably add a +1 LA depending on the abilities Any suggestions?
VorpalBunny 01-31-08, 11:43 PM	Looks good, might be a bit underpowered for a +1 LA. Look at the Whisper Gnome for something (roughly) as powerful as your creation, but has no LA. Sent is reasonable, and to flesh them out as a +1, you might be able to give them a bite and/or claws (No more than D8+str). Quick question ('cause I might want to play this race some time) are these things based on WoW Worgen? VB
zeratulcraft 02-01-08, 12:10 AM	Never give a negative to charisma based purely on appearance, what does how you look have to do with your proficiency in sorcerous magic? If the entire race is ugly, either grant a negative to social skills that has some basis on your looks against creatures other than themselves. Or simply add it in as fluff that they suffer stigma because of their appearance. IMO really, but it just makes sense...
Captain_Kobold 02-01-08, 12:24 AM	From the looks, flavor and mechanics of the race, it seems almost identical to the Lupins. They were in a Dragon Magazine and (IIRC) in the Dragon Compendium. Charisma is less to do with looks than with force of personality. You can have an ugly race with no charisma penalty. They could have a Charisma penalty, but it would more likely be due to them being used to sublimating their will to that of the Pack. Also, Charisma penalties are not a good way of balancing a race. You could give them a penalty to interactions with humans and communities with experience with lycanthropes, but that seems unnecesary. What is the speed of the race? Whisper Gnomes are really not a good race to use as a balancing comparison. They are widely regarded as heavily broken for their LA. Using the PHB core races is usually the best bet. At the moment, the only thing giving your creature +1 LA is the potentially unbalanced Ability scores. Fix that and you should be fine. (Or just use the Lupins as written.)
ArochanoX 02-01-08, 01:55 AM	they're just as intelligent as humans. the foerei (same word in plural and singular) have incredibly keen senses and incredible reflexes. they're taught at an early age how to hunt, track, use a bow, etc. Stats: -I'm thinking +2 wisdom and/or +2 dex. I'm wondering if i should slap a -2 charisma for their appearance. -medium size -Proficiency with bows -+2 skill bonuses to listen, spot, search, and survival. -Wondering if they should have the "scent" ability, or at least a watered down version of it (15' instead of 30 feet maybe?) -Think i should give them the track feat, or at the very least a bonus to track checks (you can do <DC10 track checks w/o the feat i think) -low-light vision -Languages: sylvan+common. Bonus: Elven + gnome. -Favored class: ranger -I should probably add a +1 LA depending on the abilities If you want them to be LA +1 I suggest following: Foerei Medium Monstrous Humanoid Base land speed: 40ft +4 Dex, +2 Wis +4 racial bonus on listen and spot checks +2 racial bonus on balance and survival checks Scent. Foerei have keen noses.. (Whatever that literally means :D) and thus have scent. Note that creatures with scent can track as if they had the track feat. Low-Light Vision Racial Weapon Proficiensy: Foerei are proficient with short and longbows along with composite versions of them. Automatic Languages: Common and Sylvan Bonus Languages: Elven, Gnome, Goblin maybe Level Adjustment: +1 If you want them to be LA +0, change type from monstrous humanoid to humanoid, reduce movement to 30ft, replace the ability modifiers with following: +2 Dex, -2 Str or Con, Reduce listen and spot bonuses to +2 and get rid of the balance bonus, remove scent, but give them track as a bonus feat. Then allow them to get racial feat that grants scent. LA +0 version: Foerei Medium Humanoid Base land speed: 30ft +2 Dex, -2 Str or Con +2 racial bonus on listen and spot checks +2 racial bonus on survival checks Track Foerei have keen noses.. (Whatever that literally means :D) and gain track as a bonus feat. Low-Light Vision Racial Weapon Proficiensy: Foerei are proficient with short and longbows along with composite versions of them. Automatic Languages: Common Bonus Languages: Elven, Gnome, Goblin, Sylvan Level Adjustment: +0
Anearysm 02-01-08, 10:49 AM	Quick question ('cause I might want to play this race some time) are these things based on WoW Worgen? What's a Worgen? Never give a negative to charisma based purely on appearance, what does how you look have to do with your proficiency in sorcerous magic? Charisma is less to do with looks than with force of personality. You can have an ugly race with no charisma penalty. Thanks, I was wondering about that. Maybe i should smack on a conditional diplomacy penalty on them instead, or something to that effect. Foerei Medium Monstrous Humanoid Base land speed: 40ft +4 Dex, +2 Wis +4 racial bonus on listen and spot checks +2 racial bonus on balance and survival checks Scent. Foerei have keen noses.. (Whatever that literally means ) and thus have scent. Note that creatures with scent can track as if they had the track feat. Low-Light Vision Racial Weapon Proficienscy: Foerei are proficient with short and longbows along with composite versions of them. Automatic Languages: Common and Sylvan Bonus Languages: Elven, Gnome, Goblin maybe Level Adjustment: +1 40ft speed and +4 on dex and Listen/spot sounds like a bit much, but that looks like a pretty good thing to work off of. thanks.
Legdiwena 02-01-08, 11:18 AM	When you say they look like werewolves, do you mean a werewolf's hybrid form, a hiruste human, his animal form, or something completely different.
VorpalBunny 02-01-08, 03:57 PM	http://www.wowwiki.com/Worgen That is a worgen. VB
Anearysm 02-01-08, 06:01 PM	When you say they look like werewolves, do you mean a werewolf's hybrid form, a hiruste human, his animal form, or something completely different. I'd compare them to a mix between the hybrid form and a human. The biggest differences between a foerei and hybrid form are that foerei are built like humans (They aren't bulky monsters), and the foerei have humanlike facial features.
Anearysm 02-01-08, 06:53 PM	I decided to look in the monster manual and compare it with other +1 LA creatures (because building a 0 LA Foerei with constitution or strength penalties seems contrary to the race's flavor to me.) This is what i have down so far: Medium Humanoid Base land speed: 35 ft. +2 Dex, +2 Wis +2 racial bonus on listen, search, and spot checks. +2 racial bonus on Survival checks. +1 racial bonus to Knowledge(nature), Craft(bows), and Profession(hunting) Can use Knowledge(nature) as though trained Lesser Scent:The Foerei can sniff out a creature op to 20ft away. can use this ability to pinpoint an unseen creature's location 5ft away. with a DC20 Wisdom check. allows track checks up to DC20 without the feat, and gives a +1 bonus on track checks (seems like a good compromise imo) Low-Light Vision Racial Weapon Proficiency: Long and Short bows, composite and not Automatic Languages: Common, Sylvan Bonus Languages: Elven, Gnome, Halfling Level Adjustment: +1 Favored class: Ranger Any further suggestions?
ArochanoX 02-02-08, 02:16 PM	Medium Humanoid Base land speed: 35 ft. +2 Dex, +2 Wis +2 racial bonus on listen, search, and spot checks. +2 racial bonus on Survival checks. +1 racial bonus to Knowledge(nature), Craft(bows), and Profession(hunting) Can use Knowledge(nature) as though trained Lesser Scent:The Foerei can sniff out a creature op to 20ft away. can use this ability to pinpoint an unseen creature's location 5ft away. with a DC20 Wisdom check. allows track checks up to DC20 without the feat, and gives a +1 bonus on track checks (seems like a good compromise imo) Low-Light Vision Racial Weapon Proficiency: Long and Short bows, composite and not Automatic Languages: Common, Sylvan Bonus Languages: Elven, Gnome, Halfling Level Adjustment: +1 Favored class: Ranger Basically this looks ok, maybe a bit underpowered. Though few point-outs: 35ft speed is difficult. When wearing medium or heavy armor, what is the speed? Or when whearing mountain plate? What if some spell effect halves the movement speed? I think you should stick to either 40ft or 30ft. And that lesser scent also makes things difficult. I suggest giving them entire scent, it's not that much powerful. 40ft speed and +4 on dex and Listen/spot sounds like a bit much, but that looks like a pretty good thing to work off of. thanks. You should check catfolk from races of the wild. I based my suggestion on that. Even though their pictures are different, their stats fit both.
Anearysm 02-03-08, 07:13 PM	Alright then, I took a look at both catfolk and lupins. (cripes, those lupins ARE similar!) Catfolk look a touch unbalanced, I'm still reluctant to give a net +6 bonus to the attributes for +1 LA. Anywho, this is what I've come up with: Medium Humanoid Base land speed: 40 ft. +2 Dex, +2 Wis +2 racial bonus on listen, search, and spot checks (keen senses) +2 racial bonus on survival, and move silently checks +1 racial bonus to Knowledge(nature), Craft(bows), and Profession(hunting) Can use Knowledge(nature) as though trained Scent +1 morale bonus to attack and damage against lycanthropes Low-Light Vision +1 natural armor bonus Racial Weapon Proficiency: All bow weapons. Automatic Languages: Common, Sylvan Bonus Languages: Elven, Gnome, Halfling Level Adjustment: +1 Favored class: Ranger