Goliaths [Archive] - Wizards Community - Pages Merged by Solauren

Goliaths [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Ninja_Ferret
10-12-07, 03:44 PM Ok so I'm thinking of playing a Goliath. They are monsterous humanoid. So does that mean they also get darkvision? but was never added into their abilities in RoS?

What about a Goliath with the monkey grip feat. Would that mean they can wield a huge weapon for a -2?

What about an enlarged goliath? Would they be able to use a gargantuan weapon if they had monkey grip?
Teydyn
10-12-07, 05:49 PM Ok so I'm thinking of playing a Goliath. They are monsterous humanoid. So does that mean they also get darkvision? but was never added into their abilities in RoS?

What about a Goliath with the monkey grip feat. Would that mean they can wield a huge weapon for a -2?

What about an enlarged goliath? Would they be able to use a gargantuan weapon if they had monkey grip?

1) No IIRC
2) No, same wording on powerful build & monkey grip, does not stack
3) No (but enlarged he could wield a Huge weapon) (remember, enlarge person has humanoid as target)
war_thog
10-12-07, 11:42 PM Yes they do get darkvision.
Its an error that it isnt written in the RoS. Its fixed in errata or FaQ somewhere.
All Monstrous Humanoids get Darkvision.
runestar
10-13-07, 02:11 AM Ok so I'm thinking of playing a Goliath. They are monsterous humanoid. So does that mean they also get darkvision? but was never added into their abilities in RoS?

Yes. All monstrous humanoids, by definition, automatically get darkvision unless it is explicitly stated that they do not.

What about a Goliath with the monkey grip feat. Would that mean they can wield a huge weapon for a -2?

No. Monkey grip does not stack with powerful build as they are each based off your base size. Each allows you to wield a large weapon. Having both still only allows you to wield a large weapon.

What about an enlarged goliath? Would they be able to use a gargantuan weapon if they had monkey grip?

Only huge. Say a goliath becomes large via mountain rage. His powerful build ability will then allow him to wield huge weapons (but he better have such a backup, since his normally large weapon does not resize).

Note that monkey grip is still useless in this scenario, since its benefit is effectively superseded by powerful build.
Ninja_Ferret
10-13-07, 01:30 PM Whoot .thanks guys. Even my group didnt know so i went a game without it. But its all good it was mostly daytime and they had glowsticks.

But yeah after reading both monkey grip and their abilities it doesnt stack. But sure soon enough when i get money ill pay a mage to cast enlarge person and permencey on me. Then get a MW huge Quarterstaff. hehe. I love the spell shillelagh. Though once i get to around level 10 i might not use it as much.
Teydyn
10-13-07, 02:09 PM ill pay a mage to cast enlarge person and permencey on me.
Wont work.

You are monstrous humanoid, not humanoid.
Enlarge Person (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/enlargePerson.htm) targets 1 humanoid creature, not 1 creature
Yadot
10-13-07, 02:35 PM You can get an object of Psionic Expansion (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/expansion.htm) though.
Garonak
10-13-07, 03:23 PM Only huge. Say a goliath becomes large via mountain rage. His powerful build ability will then allow him to wield huge weapons (but he better have such a backup, since his normally large weapon does not resize).

Note that monkey grip is still useless in this scenario, since its benefit is effectively superseded by powerful build.

Not quite. Mountain rage doesn't stack with Powerful build. When you use Mountain Rage you lose Powerful Build and just become large. Which means that Monkey Grip can in that scenario be useful.
Ninja_Ferret
10-13-07, 03:31 PM Could i get a permency on the psionic Expansion?
runestar
10-13-07, 10:51 PM Not quite. Mountain rage doesn't stack with Powerful build. When you use Mountain Rage you lose Powerful Build and just become large. Which means that Monkey Grip can in that scenario be useful.

Good catch there...:embarrass
Ninja_Ferret
10-13-07, 10:53 PM Is mountain range a feat or a spell? And is it also from RoS?
Templario
10-13-07, 11:04 PM Mountain rage is a Racial Substitution Level for Goliath Barbarians, still in RoS
AtsuiShoto
10-14-07, 11:45 AM ...it's also a good way to make a Goliath Barbarian into a powerhouse of unbridled destructive power. As a DM, your best bet after allowing such a thing is to throw away most of the standard low-level stuff you would usually run (like ogres and swarms of orcs) to instead use anything that gets its strength from its range. Anything CR-appropriate within 10 feet of a Mountain-raging Goliath Barbarian will likely die before it gets a chance to show off any of its "cool" abilities. Rough terrain is VERY good, to break up charges.

You see, Goliaths are already pretty darn powerful for +1 LA creatures, the barbarian class plays to the Goliath's strengths nicely, and Mountain Rage just makes the barbarian even better for very little lost. It's not broken unless you ignore it, but then it really will seem broken.
Ninja_Ferret
10-14-07, 11:53 AM Yeah im playing a Druid/Ranger/beastmaster goliath. :D
Garonak
10-14-07, 12:50 PM Rough terrain is VERY good, to break up charges.

Difficult terrain won't help much... A nice Goliath build is Barbarian Leap Attacker, as Goliath don't need a running jump,
they tend to make difficult terrain obsolete, they can charge jump over it. Give them the Lion Totem from Complete Champion and a pair of Boots of Striding and Springing they'll be pretty difficult to play with. Goliath BBN 6 with goliath greathammer: str 21 (27 when mountain raging): Jump: 9 + 5 (8) + 4 (speed) +5 (boots) = 23 (26) in jump, that's a jump of 20-25 feet by rolling a 1 on a d20, 40-45 ft with a 20. Finishing the charge jump with a full attack and a Power Attack penalty of 5, which will result in +20 dmg for a total of 3d6+32 plus magic and other feats, with a total of -4 to hit (+2 charge, -1 size, -5 PA), +10/+5 (+6BA, +8str, +2charge, -1 size, -5PA)(or +3 if you're dm doesn't allow the charge bonus to apply to more than one attack) to hit plus magic and feats.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Ninja_Ferret 10-12-07, 03:44 PM	Ok so I'm thinking of playing a Goliath. They are monsterous humanoid. So does that mean they also get darkvision? but was never added into their abilities in RoS? What about a Goliath with the monkey grip feat. Would that mean they can wield a huge weapon for a -2? What about an enlarged goliath? Would they be able to use a gargantuan weapon if they had monkey grip?
Teydyn 10-12-07, 05:49 PM	Ok so I'm thinking of playing a Goliath. They are monsterous humanoid. So does that mean they also get darkvision? but was never added into their abilities in RoS? What about a Goliath with the monkey grip feat. Would that mean they can wield a huge weapon for a -2? What about an enlarged goliath? Would they be able to use a gargantuan weapon if they had monkey grip? 1) No IIRC 2) No, same wording on powerful build & monkey grip, does not stack 3) No (but enlarged he could wield a Huge weapon) (remember, enlarge person has humanoid as target)
war_thog 10-12-07, 11:42 PM	Yes they do get darkvision. Its an error that it isnt written in the RoS. Its fixed in errata or FaQ somewhere. All Monstrous Humanoids get Darkvision.
runestar 10-13-07, 02:11 AM	Ok so I'm thinking of playing a Goliath. They are monsterous humanoid. So does that mean they also get darkvision? but was never added into their abilities in RoS? Yes. All monstrous humanoids, by definition, automatically get darkvision unless it is explicitly stated that they do not. What about a Goliath with the monkey grip feat. Would that mean they can wield a huge weapon for a -2? No. Monkey grip does not stack with powerful build as they are each based off your base size. Each allows you to wield a large weapon. Having both still only allows you to wield a large weapon. What about an enlarged goliath? Would they be able to use a gargantuan weapon if they had monkey grip? Only huge. Say a goliath becomes large via mountain rage. His powerful build ability will then allow him to wield huge weapons (but he better have such a backup, since his normally large weapon does not resize). Note that monkey grip is still useless in this scenario, since its benefit is effectively superseded by powerful build.
Ninja_Ferret 10-13-07, 01:30 PM	Whoot .thanks guys. Even my group didnt know so i went a game without it. But its all good it was mostly daytime and they had glowsticks. But yeah after reading both monkey grip and their abilities it doesnt stack. But sure soon enough when i get money ill pay a mage to cast enlarge person and permencey on me. Then get a MW huge Quarterstaff. hehe. I love the spell shillelagh. Though once i get to around level 10 i might not use it as much.
Teydyn 10-13-07, 02:09 PM	ill pay a mage to cast enlarge person and permencey on me. Wont work. You are monstrous humanoid, not humanoid. Enlarge Person (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/enlargePerson.htm) targets 1 humanoid creature, not 1 creature
Yadot 10-13-07, 02:35 PM	You can get an object of Psionic Expansion (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/expansion.htm) though.
Garonak 10-13-07, 03:23 PM	Only huge. Say a goliath becomes large via mountain rage. His powerful build ability will then allow him to wield huge weapons (but he better have such a backup, since his normally large weapon does not resize). Note that monkey grip is still useless in this scenario, since its benefit is effectively superseded by powerful build. Not quite. Mountain rage doesn't stack with Powerful build. When you use Mountain Rage you lose Powerful Build and just become large. Which means that Monkey Grip can in that scenario be useful.
Ninja_Ferret 10-13-07, 03:31 PM	Could i get a permency on the psionic Expansion?
runestar 10-13-07, 10:51 PM	Not quite. Mountain rage doesn't stack with Powerful build. When you use Mountain Rage you lose Powerful Build and just become large. Which means that Monkey Grip can in that scenario be useful. Good catch there...:embarrass
Ninja_Ferret 10-13-07, 10:53 PM	Is mountain range a feat or a spell? And is it also from RoS?
Templario 10-13-07, 11:04 PM	Mountain rage is a Racial Substitution Level for Goliath Barbarians, still in RoS
AtsuiShoto 10-14-07, 11:45 AM	...it's also a good way to make a Goliath Barbarian into a powerhouse of unbridled destructive power. As a DM, your best bet after allowing such a thing is to throw away most of the standard low-level stuff you would usually run (like ogres and swarms of orcs) to instead use anything that gets its strength from its range. Anything CR-appropriate within 10 feet of a Mountain-raging Goliath Barbarian will likely die before it gets a chance to show off any of its "cool" abilities. Rough terrain is VERY good, to break up charges. You see, Goliaths are already pretty darn powerful for +1 LA creatures, the barbarian class plays to the Goliath's strengths nicely, and Mountain Rage just makes the barbarian even better for very little lost. It's not broken unless you ignore it, but then it really will seem broken.
Ninja_Ferret 10-14-07, 11:53 AM	Yeah im playing a Druid/Ranger/beastmaster goliath. :D
Garonak 10-14-07, 12:50 PM	Rough terrain is VERY good, to break up charges. Difficult terrain won't help much... A nice Goliath build is Barbarian Leap Attacker, as Goliath don't need a running jump, they tend to make difficult terrain obsolete, they can charge jump over it. Give them the Lion Totem from Complete Champion and a pair of Boots of Striding and Springing they'll be pretty difficult to play with. Goliath BBN 6 with goliath greathammer: str 21 (27 when mountain raging): Jump: 9 + 5 (8) + 4 (speed) +5 (boots) = 23 (26) in jump, that's a jump of 20-25 feet by rolling a 1 on a d20, 40-45 ft with a 20. Finishing the charge jump with a full attack and a Power Attack penalty of 5, which will result in +20 dmg for a total of 3d6+32 plus magic and other feats, with a total of -4 to hit (+2 charge, -1 size, -5 PA), +10/+5 (+6BA, +8str, +2charge, -1 size, -5PA)(or +3 if you're dm doesn't allow the charge bonus to apply to more than one attack) to hit plus magic and feats.