Help with a new race/monster (PEACH) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Help with a new race/monster (PEACH) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Jprostovich
12-04-07, 01:56 PM I am creating a campaign setting I hope will be rich in detail and background.
Of extreme importance to the campaign is the existence of a first race I call True Fay (or just fay)
The Fay were the first race on the world I call Qualmara. They were created by the goddess of the world (also named Qualmara) and as such were appointed as guardians and keepers of the natural order. They appear not unlike elves but are taller and far less flighty. In fact, the vast majority of the Fay are Lawful Good. This conflicts with the usual assumption that nature is chaotic and in stead assumes that nature is follows a strict order. Everything has its place in the ecosystem and each serves its purpose. The central conflict of this campaign setting is the fight between the Lawful and the Chaotic. The Fay are the guardians of nature and thus Lawful.
As beings highly in-tune with the natural world I want the fay to have abilities to control plants, trees and stone. Finally, the race of Fay is immortal. They are immune to disease and natural death. They can, however be slain. The fay players will encounter are all ancient (they have been alive for thousands of years) however no more Fay can be born into this world due to a tragedy in the setting's history. The Fay (and there are few) alive in present day are very scarce.
All that being said, I am stuck when it comes to designing them statistically. Due to their age I imagine they would have more than 1 hit die, yet individually they are not overtly powerful as they must gain levels like any other humanoid.

That being said, here is what I have so far. Please let me know what the CR should be, and Level Adjustment (players will not be able to make True Fay Characters at first but perhaps as things evolve...)

Name: True Fay
Type: Fey
Speed: 40
Size: Medium
Subtype: Lawful
HD: 4d6 (16hp)

STR: 8
Dex: 19
CON: 10
Int: 22
WIS: 18
CHA: 18

Skills as Druid

special abilities:
Speak with animals (continual effect)
Long Life: The Fay's long lives grant them the ability to take 20 on any knowledge History Check

Nature Command: Once per day per 4HD a fay can use one of the following abilities at caster level 8

Animate Trees (sp) A can animate trees within 180 feet at will, controlling up to two trees at a time (as Treant ability)
Animate plants (sp) same as the spell
Animate Stone (sp) as Animate Object Spell but only effects stone. Multiple fay can combine their efforts to animate larger stones. Each additional fay contributing to the task adds +2 to the effective caster level.

Additional Traits:
base attack =1/2 HD
Good Reflex and Will saves
Skill points 6+int/HD (x4@first level)
Low light vision
Fay eat, sleep and breathe
Damage reduction 10/cold iron
Immunity to disease
A slain fay cannot be resurrected by spells that restore souls to their bodies. It takes a different magical effect, such as limited wish, wish miracle or true resurrection to restore it to life.
Fay do not die from age or natural causes

Stats as Character Str -2, Dex +2, Int +4, Wis +2
Favored class: Druid

Any help with balancing this creation out is most appreciated as are your Your thoughts and comments
Thanks!
Jorda_The_Knight
12-04-07, 06:37 PM Okay, let's get crackin!
I like the idea for a race, I'm big into the fey (or fay, whatever you like) and plant creatures in general. I'm also interested in creating new races and so on so I've got a bit of experience there to draw on. I'll break it down into bullet head points to make it easier to read. This is all just advice mind you, take from it what you will and know that I don't mean to insult or offend you in anyway.

*Long Life: This ability while seemingly harmless break a lot of rules. I'd suggest something more tame along the lines of a +4 to all Knowledge (History) checks and the ability to make Knowledge (History) checks without first having any ranks in it. This allows all fay to have a better than average understanding and knowledge of history without making them all instant historians.

*Animate Plants/Trees: With a caster level of 8 and a spell level of 7 it doesn't seem feasible to me that they should have such a strong ability. While I understand why they would it's hard to balance something like this, though you have done a good job capping it with HD. I suppose the only real suggestion I have is to give them one or the other; either animate trees or animate plants. Since both abilities are similar they sort of overlap, and a fay able to use both in a single encounter can really tip the scales. Personally I would go with a straight Animate Plants ability, since the spell works on trees as well as any other plant.

*DR 10/cold iron: Ouch, now this one would be a real deal breaker for me as a DM. Damage reduction plays a huge part in early combat and even in higher level encounters it can be problematic. More than a few dual wielding rogues and fighters have met their ends due to something as simple as DR 10/cold iron. The other issue here is that cold iron weapons are not common, and in the world you described with so few of the fay left alive why would people be carrying them around anyways? Perhaps breaking it down to DR 5/cold iron will help keeps things more balanced and still give them that edge they should have in combat.

*Ability Modifiers: These are almost perfect, but I would adjust the Int bonus down to a +2 to match the others. I know they've been around for a long, long time, but elves have long lifespans to and they don't get a bonus to Int. This way you've got all +2 bonuses, which looks more even handed.

*Level Adjustment: As you have them right now I would settle for an LA of +4 and may let a +3 slide. With the above adjustments I think a +2 level adjustment would be fair.

Hope this helped! :D
Jprostovich
12-04-07, 07:16 PM Thanks so much for the advice. I am uncomfortable with the level of power available with the Animate Plants/Trees/Stone stuff as well. I also considered removing the ability altogether instead allowing only the wizards and druids the ability just as a spell.
My thoughts are as follows: While adjusting the Ability adjustments like you suggested as well as lessoning the DR to 5/cold iron I could also drop the base creature/race to 1 HD. Their long life can be reflected in high levels of Classes (that way each Fay would be different and their abilities would possibly more accurately reflect their life experiences).
That being said, the ability to manipulate plants and stone plays a part of their history so perhaps rather than granting them the ability outright, I could simply give the Lawful Fay a +1 bonus to caster level with Transmutation spells. This would work well as I plan on writing a Chaotic Fay as well which will be very similar to the Lawful fay but will possibly have a +1 Caster Level to Necromantic Spells.

It should also be noted that the only classes available to the Lawful Fay are Druid, Wizard, and Paladin
That being said. If I make the aforementioned changes, what do you think the CR and LA would be?

I really appreciate your help, and your ideas have gone far into my refining of this creation
Jorda_The_Knight
12-05-07, 03:36 PM Glad I could be of service. The ideas you've presented in the most recent post are much more balanced and are pretty much a LA +0 race now, maybe +1. Keep in mind as well that while Racial HD affect ECL (effective character level) they do not affect Level Adjustment. Good work friend.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Jprostovich 12-04-07, 01:56 PM	I am creating a campaign setting I hope will be rich in detail and background. Of extreme importance to the campaign is the existence of a first race I call True Fay (or just fay) The Fay were the first race on the world I call Qualmara. They were created by the goddess of the world (also named Qualmara) and as such were appointed as guardians and keepers of the natural order. They appear not unlike elves but are taller and far less flighty. In fact, the vast majority of the Fay are Lawful Good. This conflicts with the usual assumption that nature is chaotic and in stead assumes that nature is follows a strict order. Everything has its place in the ecosystem and each serves its purpose. The central conflict of this campaign setting is the fight between the Lawful and the Chaotic. The Fay are the guardians of nature and thus Lawful. As beings highly in-tune with the natural world I want the fay to have abilities to control plants, trees and stone. Finally, the race of Fay is immortal. They are immune to disease and natural death. They can, however be slain. The fay players will encounter are all ancient (they have been alive for thousands of years) however no more Fay can be born into this world due to a tragedy in the setting's history. The Fay (and there are few) alive in present day are very scarce. All that being said, I am stuck when it comes to designing them statistically. Due to their age I imagine they would have more than 1 hit die, yet individually they are not overtly powerful as they must gain levels like any other humanoid. That being said, here is what I have so far. Please let me know what the CR should be, and Level Adjustment (players will not be able to make True Fay Characters at first but perhaps as things evolve...) Name: True Fay Type: Fey Speed: 40 Size: Medium Subtype: Lawful HD: 4d6 (16hp) STR: 8 Dex: 19 CON: 10 Int: 22 WIS: 18 CHA: 18 Skills as Druid special abilities: Speak with animals (continual effect) Long Life: The Fay's long lives grant them the ability to take 20 on any knowledge History Check Nature Command: Once per day per 4HD a fay can use one of the following abilities at caster level 8 Animate Trees (sp) A can animate trees within 180 feet at will, controlling up to two trees at a time (as Treant ability) Animate plants (sp) same as the spell Animate Stone (sp) as Animate Object Spell but only effects stone. Multiple fay can combine their efforts to animate larger stones. Each additional fay contributing to the task adds +2 to the effective caster level. Additional Traits: base attack =1/2 HD Good Reflex and Will saves Skill points 6+int/HD (x4@first level) Low light vision Fay eat, sleep and breathe Damage reduction 10/cold iron Immunity to disease A slain fay cannot be resurrected by spells that restore souls to their bodies. It takes a different magical effect, such as limited wish, wish miracle or true resurrection to restore it to life. Fay do not die from age or natural causes Stats as Character Str -2, Dex +2, Int +4, Wis +2 Favored class: Druid Any help with balancing this creation out is most appreciated as are your Your thoughts and comments Thanks!
Jorda_The_Knight 12-04-07, 06:37 PM	Okay, let's get crackin! I like the idea for a race, I'm big into the fey (or fay, whatever you like) and plant creatures in general. I'm also interested in creating new races and so on so I've got a bit of experience there to draw on. I'll break it down into bullet head points to make it easier to read. This is all just advice mind you, take from it what you will and know that I don't mean to insult or offend you in anyway. Long Life: This ability while seemingly harmless break a lot of rules. I'd suggest something more tame along the lines of a +4 to all Knowledge (History) checks and the ability to make Knowledge (History) checks without first having any ranks in it. This allows all fay to have a better than average understanding and knowledge of history without making them all instant historians. Animate Plants/Trees: With a caster level of 8 and a spell level of 7 it doesn't seem feasible to me that they should have such a strong ability. While I understand why they would it's hard to balance something like this, though you have done a good job capping it with HD. I suppose the only real suggestion I have is to give them one or the other; either animate trees or animate plants. Since both abilities are similar they sort of overlap, and a fay able to use both in a single encounter can really tip the scales. Personally I would go with a straight Animate Plants ability, since the spell works on trees as well as any other plant. DR 10/cold iron: Ouch, now this one would be a real deal breaker for me as a DM. Damage reduction plays a huge part in early combat and even in higher level encounters it can be problematic. More than a few dual wielding rogues and fighters have met their ends due to something as simple as DR 10/cold iron. The other issue here is that cold iron weapons are not common, and in the world you described with so few of the fay left alive why would people be carrying them around anyways? Perhaps breaking it down to DR 5/cold iron will help keeps things more balanced and still give them that edge they should have in combat. Ability Modifiers: These are almost perfect, but I would adjust the Int bonus down to a +2 to match the others. I know they've been around for a long, long time, but elves have long lifespans to and they don't get a bonus to Int. This way you've got all +2 bonuses, which looks more even handed. *Level Adjustment: As you have them right now I would settle for an LA of +4 and may let a +3 slide. With the above adjustments I think a +2 level adjustment would be fair. Hope this helped! :D
Jprostovich 12-04-07, 07:16 PM	Thanks so much for the advice. I am uncomfortable with the level of power available with the Animate Plants/Trees/Stone stuff as well. I also considered removing the ability altogether instead allowing only the wizards and druids the ability just as a spell. My thoughts are as follows: While adjusting the Ability adjustments like you suggested as well as lessoning the DR to 5/cold iron I could also drop the base creature/race to 1 HD. Their long life can be reflected in high levels of Classes (that way each Fay would be different and their abilities would possibly more accurately reflect their life experiences). That being said, the ability to manipulate plants and stone plays a part of their history so perhaps rather than granting them the ability outright, I could simply give the Lawful Fay a +1 bonus to caster level with Transmutation spells. This would work well as I plan on writing a Chaotic Fay as well which will be very similar to the Lawful fay but will possibly have a +1 Caster Level to Necromantic Spells. It should also be noted that the only classes available to the Lawful Fay are Druid, Wizard, and Paladin That being said. If I make the aforementioned changes, what do you think the CR and LA would be? I really appreciate your help, and your ideas have gone far into my refining of this creation
Jorda_The_Knight 12-05-07, 03:36 PM	Glad I could be of service. The ideas you've presented in the most recent post are much more balanced and are pretty much a LA +0 race now, maybe +1. Keep in mind as well that while Racial HD affect ECL (effective character level) they do not affect Level Adjustment. Good work friend.