Post/Author/DateTime	Post
EvilVegan 01-21-08, 08:42 AM	Greetings! I'm working on a race. It's a race of primates that live on the side of glacial ice-cliffs above steam vents. Their homes are caves carved into the ice, lined with fur and mud. Their habits involve climbing along the cliff-side, diving into the water (to get mud and catch fish), and gliding from one cliff to the other. Thematically they're a cross between a tarsier (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarsier) and a sugar glider (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sugar_glider) with some diving thrown on for good measure. So how do I balance these: Size: Small Speed: Base land speed is 20 feet. Base swim speed is 20 feet. Base climb speed is 20 feet. +8 to climb and swim checks, may take 10 on them even if distracted or threatened. Glide: Speed while gliding is 40 feet with average maneuverability. May not hover. Drop 5 feet per round while gliding. Jumper: Tarsian's get +8 on jump checks and are always treated as having a running start. (+6 to compensate for speed penalty, +2 racial bonus, so they jump slightly farther than a human) Diving Lungs: Tarsian's can hold their breath for a number of rounds equal to 10 times their constitution score. I mean, the abilities are situationally good, but not overpowering. Any thoughts?
RobbyPants 01-21-08, 08:57 AM	When they glide, are their hands occupied? If so, that prevents abuse of archers and casters staying out of melee. Of course, they'd have to have higher ground to start with anyway... As for the other speeds, I'm not sure a good way to balance them. I don't think the swim speed is too crazy or overpowered. The climb speed might be a bit abuseable. I'd have to reread the rules on climbing again to have a better idea. Dropping it down to a speed of 10, but keeping the +8 bonus and take 10 might help a bit. All in all, if what you presented above is all of the race's abilities, it might be okay as is.
EvilVegan 01-21-08, 02:17 PM	When they glide, are their hands occupied? If so, that prevents abuse of archers and casters staying out of melee. Of course, they'd have to have higher ground to start with anyway... As for the other speeds, I'm not sure a good way to balance them. I don't think the swim speed is too crazy or overpowered. The climb speed might be a bit abuseable. I'd have to reread the rules on climbing again to have a better idea. Dropping it down to a speed of 10, but keeping the +8 bonus and take 10 might help a bit. All in all, if what you presented above is all of the race's abilities, it might be okay as is. Gliding: I'm assuming that under most circumstances it won't be that easy to get a great gliding position. It's more of a free Feather Fall and some occasional "coolness". YMMV. Gliding Restrictions: Light encumbrance only. Hands and feet free. . . charge attacks require Quick Draw or the exotic weapon Tarsian Spear (it's a spear mounting harness for diving charges). Climbing: A 10 ft climb speed would be the same as a normal person climbing. Anyone with a 20 speed can climb 10 feet as a move action on a successful climb check. A human climbing would have a climb speed of 15, but wouldn't get the +8 and "take 10" bonus that comes with a true climb speed. So if I take it to 10 or 15 feet, they would be capable of climbing under duress, but wouldn't be any faster than a human climber. It works for me either way. I think slightly faster than a skilled human is a little more fitting. Other: What would being able to use your feet as easily as hands do in game? I mean, they couldn't wield weapons with both their hands and feet because they would need something to stand on, but . . . if they wanted they could stand on their hands and fight with their feet. Also, if they have long, frog/chameleon-like tongues , would that do anything? I wouldn't think it would have any real effect. So that's two abilities that are flavorful, but need no mechanics to back them up. They have a sticky 5' tongue. They can use their feet as hands, but would need to use their hands as feet while they did so. And I wasn't planning on any other abilities. They're naturally dextrous, but their form is a little clumsy so they can't use it to benefit. They're small, but strong for their size. They're primative, but they have quick minds that can figure things out quickly. The only thing I could think is a Spot and Listen bonus. They have huge eyes and directional ears (like a cat). And maybe low-light vision. So, summary: Size: Small Speed: Base land speed is 20 feet. Base swim speed is 20 feet. Base climb speed is 20 feet. +8 to climb and swim checks, may take 10 on them even if distracted or threatened. Low-Light Vision: Ignore partial concealment caused by darkness. Glide: Speed while gliding is 40 feet with average maneuverability. May not hover. Drop 5 feet per round while gliding. Jumper: Tarsian's get +8 on jump checks and are always treated as having a running start. (+6 to compensate for speed penalty, +2 racial bonus, so they jump slightly farther than a human) Diving Lungs: Tarsian's can hold their breath for a number of rounds equal to 10 times their constitution score. Alert: +2 racial bonus to Spot and Listen Illiterate: They have no written language and do not automatically learn to read and write. Language: Tarsian (Speak only) Favored Class: . . . Crusader. (Why not? :D)
EvilVegan 01-21-08, 07:07 PM	I can draw http://evilvegan.wikispaces.com/space/showimage/Tarsian.jpg
RobbyPants 01-22-08, 10:51 AM	All in all, the summary you posted in post 3 looks pretty good. I think it's a decent LA +0. Are you planning on leaving all the stats at +0, or were you thinking about something like -2 Str, +2 Dex for the size? Either way it should be fine. The drawing is cute BTW ;)
Faren 01-22-08, 08:33 PM	If they can use their hands as feet and feet as hands you could give them a boost to their climbing or say that they "swing" through dense jungle easily because they can use either limb interchangeably... such as they swing with their hands to a branch then swing under it using their feet as hands and propel themselves forward rather than stopping on the branch to jump. If you coated the tongue with saliva that's poisonous to humanoid skin, deadly if in the blood stream then you could say that they swing by and whip out a nasty five inch mark across an arm that causes mild damage and hinders the ability slightly to use that arm. You could also say that if someone is cut by the Tarsian Spear that it could be followed up with a tongue lashing that could be very hazardous to the receivers health if it hits the open wound. For that matter, they could be coated with the nasty tongue slime and defeat the purpose of the tongue's implementation, but let's say they're to primal to figure out that trick ;)
EvilVegan 01-24-08, 08:56 AM	If they can use their hands as feet and feet as hands you could give them a boost to their climbing or say that they "swing" through dense jungle easily because they can use either limb interchangeably... such as they swing with their hands to a branch then swing under it using their feet as hands and propel themselves forward rather than stopping on the branch to jump. If you coated the tongue with saliva that's poisonous to humanoid skin, deadly if in the blood stream then you could say that they swing by and whip out a nasty five inch mark across an arm that causes mild damage and hinders the ability slightly to use that arm. You could also say that if someone is cut by the Tarsian Spear that it could be followed up with a tongue lashing that could be very hazardous to the receivers health if it hits the open wound. For that matter, they could be coated with the nasty tongue slime and defeat the purpose of the tongue's implementation, but let's say they're to primal to figure out that trick ;)Brachiation fits their theme quite well, and I'd forgotten it. I'll include it! I don't want their tongue to be poisonous, mostly because I want to avoid an LA. I think maybe a feat chain would compensate. Whiptongue [Racial] Prerequisite: Tarisien 1st level. Benefit: You're trained in using your tongue as a whip. It functions in most ways as a whip with a 5' reach (as opposed to the standard 15'). You do not provoke attacks of opportunity when using your whiptongue (though the type of attack you make could provoke). Normal: Tarsien normally use their tongues for self-cleaning and limited grabbing of slow-moving diminutive prey. Tongue Slime [Racial] Through a combination of diet and exercise you have gained the ability to coat your tongue in a vicious, viscous goo. Prerequisite: Tarsien, Whiptongue Benefit: Tongue slime is mildly poisonous. Fortitude Save DC is 10 + 1/2 level + Constitution modifier. Initial and secondary poison damage is 1-2 dexterity damage.