Intelligent Constructs [Archive] - Wizards Community

Intelligent Constructs [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Wylantern
10-08-07, 06:17 PM Anyone know of a template available to make a construct intelligent?

Or otherwise make a construct intelligent but let them remain a full construct?

This is the premise:

Evil clerics vat grow these human shaped slightly deformed clone-type people to use them as sacrificial victims. These clerics make them intelligent because sentient sacrifices are better than non-intelligent ones. Some of them escape and start congregating as a race and striking back at their former masters.

I'm thinking that they'd be based on a flesh golem, but made through alchemy and cleric spells so not stitched up.

They probably wouldn't have the Berserk ability of normal flesh golems, but more likely a 1/day use of Rage as a barbarian, stackable with barbarian levels.

Anyone have any thoughts?

::EDIT::

They would look something like this:

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d53/wylantern/Steve%20Prescott/Yuzishface.jpg

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d53/wylantern/Steve%20Prescott/Yuzishen.jpg

(by Steve Prescott, from Dungeon 125)
RobbyPants
10-08-07, 06:20 PM A template? No.

Although I don't see why you couldn't just stat up a standard golem from the MM with an Int score. For that matter, if you don't quite like any of them, just follow the construct advancement rules in the MM, give them however many Hit Dice you want, set their base ability scores and feats, and the rest should pretty much stat itself out. After that, give it whatever special abilities you want (like spell immunity, or whatever).
GnomeNinja5
10-08-07, 06:48 PM Awakened Construct from Savage Species.
Wylantern
10-09-07, 12:55 AM Awakened Construct from Savage Species.

That's an excellent idea!

It works just like Awaken right? 3d6 Int and +1d3 Cha?
Garonak
10-09-07, 01:07 AM Not a template, but Maugs got an int score (they even got a bonus to int), 2hd, la+3. Fiend Folio.
Xiuhcoatl
10-09-07, 07:56 AM A template? No.

Incarnate Construct, from Savage Species.
Naderion
10-09-07, 08:08 AM Apparently most constructs are created by binding an elemental spirit to an artificial body. The spirit, that does controll the golem, of course DOES have an Int score, but it hates to be bound into service. If he could, the golem would attack its creator or master or to execute orders in a way not intentioned by the master. Because of this, it's likely the binding process forces the golem into complete submission to follow every order to the latter so the elemental spirit does get no opportunity to harm its master. So I would say a golem does have an Int score, but it has no way to make any use of it because the spirit is forced to execute orders to the letter.
I think a wizard could create a golem that allows the spirit some kind of autonomy and using its Intelligence, but that would drastically increase the danger of the golem finding ways to break loose.
Templario
10-09-07, 08:22 AM Incarnate Construct, from Savage Species.

BUt with Incarnate they'll be turned to Giants :P
Tordak
10-09-07, 09:54 AM BUt with Incarnate they'll be turned to Giants :P

Agreed. Incarnate construct turns a construct in a living creature, humanoid if medium or smaller and giant if large of bigger. At any rate, the creature looses any construct traits. You could build an intelligent construct. There are already some intelligent constructs : the inevitables (MM I). However, they are pretty single minded and don't really fit your purpose. If you want to build intelligent construct from what you've been saying, there always the half-golem template from MMII. It's usually an acquired template in which you add golem parts to a living being and turn them into construct (or not if they succeed at certain save; see MMII for more detail). It wouldn't be a big leap to say that the creature you're talking about are build into these half-golem instead of transformed, the template could easily be adapted. They're almost as strong as full golem, and remain intelligent (though somewhat less intelligent than normal humanoid) and have that hatred for human you might be looking for, and the berserk spirit, which could be turned against their creators. They would make for pretty nasty foes.

The Maugs from Fiend Folio is also a very good idea (from Ganorak post, see above), and you could adapt it so that the maugs were created in that particular way and only exist through that particular process. What I'm trying to say is that this could be your reason why the maugs exist in your game.
Tordak
10-09-07, 10:03 AM Also, Awaken construct gives the construct a constitution score (3d6), an intelligence score (3d6) and a charisma of 3 if the creature had a charisma of 1 (golem), 3d6 if it didn't have a charisma (though it would technically have been an object not a creature). It keeps any scores it already had. It does not work exactly like awaken, though there is nothing stopping you from creating such a spell for construct.
Arscura
10-09-07, 10:11 AM I know of no template. These are ways or construct I know with intelligence.

Awaken Construct spell.
Maugs - Fiend Folio
Thavian Golem - Monster of Faerun
Emerald Golem, Diamont Golem, Sapphire Golem - Monster of Fearun
Nimblewright - MM2
Tordak
10-09-07, 11:14 AM ... and a charisma of 3 if the creature had a charisma of 1 (golem), 3d6 if it didn't have a charisma (though it would technically have been an object not a creature)...

Sorry I made a mistake, I had in mind that object had no intelligence and charisma, while according to the rules it's no wisdom and charisma. I suppose we can still agree that most object are not very intelligent:D . I also suppose I could have edited my post instead of quoting myself ... O.o
Anguish2
10-09-07, 02:20 PM I imagine that House Cannith would probably go ahead and call these things "warforged".

Okay, that obvious hilarity aside, let's think about the original poster's premise for a moment. These evil clerics are using divinely-granted magic to animate constructs then using divinely-granted magic to make them intelligent so that they can then sacrifice them to appease their divine deity? Um? What is this; Reduntra - Goddess of Futile Exercises?

Any real evil deity is going to issue an apocalyptic message to its followers they'd better stop screwing around with the masturbatory construct awakening and go kill some villagers or something.

Now, tweak this. Some dirty slavers get an idea that they can supply their best customers - the dread cult of Gorgonasticles - with sacrificial bodies without all that inconvenient kidnapping stuff. So the slavers start making intelligent constructs to sell to the cultists. The cultists sacrifice a few batches, their goddess decides she doesn't like the taste of thing and inflicts a case of vile herpes on the head priest. Head priest takes the hint and uses sending to inform the slavers' purchasing department that they won't be wanting any more of those constructs. Slavers have meanwhile made quite a few more expecting high demand. The constructs rise up and massacre the slavers, the cultists, and descend to the Eleventh Outhouse of Hell to find the goddess Reduntra in her lair, and shave her eyebrows off with a sacred razorblade so she eternally looks stupid.

Just a thought.
Xiuhcoatl
10-09-07, 02:33 PM I know of no template. These are ways or construct I know with intelligence.

Awaken Construct spell.
Maugs - Fiend Folio
Thavian Golem - Monster of Faerun
Emerald Golem, Diamont Golem, Sapphire Golem - Monster of Fearun
Nimblewright - MM2

There's also the Warforged.
Arscura
10-09-07, 02:54 PM There's also the Warforged.

Correcting ;)

Awaken Construct spell.
Maugs - Fiend Folio
Thavian Golem - Monster of Faerun
Emerald Golem, Diamont Golem, Sapphire Golem - Monster of Fearun
Nimblewright - MM2
Warforged - MM3, Races of Eberron, Eberron Campaign Setting
Warforged Scout - MM3
Warforged Charger - MM3
Warforged Juggernaut - Eberron Campaign Setting
RobbyPants
10-09-07, 02:59 PM There's also the Warforged.
The OP wanted a full construct. Warforged are livnig constructs.

Although along those lines, the Warforged Juggernaut PrC makes them closer to being full constructs...
Captain_Kobold
10-09-07, 09:21 PM How about the Rudimentary Intelligence feat from Dragon 327?
Garonak
10-10-07, 12:57 AM I don't think mindless creatures get that many feats, not sure though.
Arscura
10-10-07, 06:04 AM I don't think mindless creatures get that many feats, not sure though.

They get none whatsoever.
Zombies only get Toughness as a bonus feat. Not because they may choose one for example
Captain_Kobold
10-10-07, 10:45 AM How about the Rudimentary Intelligence feat from Dragon 327?

Sorry. I misstated that. Rudimentary intelligence is an augmentation applied by the construct creator, not a feat.
Wylantern
10-13-07, 01:04 AM Lets put it this way.

Gods are distant in this setting.

I'm using a variant spellcasting system where spellcasters (all kinds) can burn hit points to aid their spellcasting. These evil clerics use these constructs instead of themselves, burning their slave hit points or killing them outright for power boosts. IE Free Metamagic and such.

Also, they make great meatshields.

In the meantime, these constructs make great slaves, doing all the labour and such.

Here's how I imagine them, adapted from the Maug in Fiend Folio:

Yuzish
Medium Construct
Construct Traits
Eternal Rage: Rage 1/day as a barbarian.
Rapid Repair (Ex): A Yuzish that rests for 1 hour repairs 1 point of damage, so long as it has at least 1 hit point. Rapid repair does not allow a Yuzish to regrow or reattach lost body parts. An individual can assist a Yuzish's self-repair with a Craft (Alchemy) check (DC 15). If the check is successful, the Yuzish repairs 2 hit points per hour of rest. Providing assistance to the Yuzish counts as light activity for the assisting individual, and they can assist only one Yuzish at a time. A Yuzish cannot assist it's own repair.
+4 Craft (Alchemy)
+4 Knowledge (Religion)
LA = 1 or 2 ???

This basically fills the Evil Dude with minions that aren't evil quota.

Thoughts?
Is it suitable for a player race or just NPCs? Or not at all?

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Wylantern 10-08-07, 06:17 PM	Anyone know of a template available to make a construct intelligent? Or otherwise make a construct intelligent but let them remain a full construct? This is the premise: Evil clerics vat grow these human shaped slightly deformed clone-type people to use them as sacrificial victims. These clerics make them intelligent because sentient sacrifices are better than non-intelligent ones. Some of them escape and start congregating as a race and striking back at their former masters. I'm thinking that they'd be based on a flesh golem, but made through alchemy and cleric spells so not stitched up. They probably wouldn't have the Berserk ability of normal flesh golems, but more likely a 1/day use of Rage as a barbarian, stackable with barbarian levels. Anyone have any thoughts? ::EDIT:: They would look something like this: http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d53/wylantern/Steve%20Prescott/Yuzishface.jpg http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d53/wylantern/Steve%20Prescott/Yuzishen.jpg (by Steve Prescott, from Dungeon 125)
RobbyPants 10-08-07, 06:20 PM	A template? No. Although I don't see why you couldn't just stat up a standard golem from the MM with an Int score. For that matter, if you don't quite like any of them, just follow the construct advancement rules in the MM, give them however many Hit Dice you want, set their base ability scores and feats, and the rest should pretty much stat itself out. After that, give it whatever special abilities you want (like spell immunity, or whatever).
GnomeNinja5 10-08-07, 06:48 PM	Awakened Construct from Savage Species.
Wylantern 10-09-07, 12:55 AM	Awakened Construct from Savage Species. That's an excellent idea! It works just like Awaken right? 3d6 Int and +1d3 Cha?
Garonak 10-09-07, 01:07 AM	Not a template, but Maugs got an int score (they even got a bonus to int), 2hd, la+3. Fiend Folio.
Xiuhcoatl 10-09-07, 07:56 AM	A template? No. Incarnate Construct, from Savage Species.
Naderion 10-09-07, 08:08 AM	Apparently most constructs are created by binding an elemental spirit to an artificial body. The spirit, that does controll the golem, of course DOES have an Int score, but it hates to be bound into service. If he could, the golem would attack its creator or master or to execute orders in a way not intentioned by the master. Because of this, it's likely the binding process forces the golem into complete submission to follow every order to the latter so the elemental spirit does get no opportunity to harm its master. So I would say a golem does have an Int score, but it has no way to make any use of it because the spirit is forced to execute orders to the letter. I think a wizard could create a golem that allows the spirit some kind of autonomy and using its Intelligence, but that would drastically increase the danger of the golem finding ways to break loose.
Templario 10-09-07, 08:22 AM	Incarnate Construct, from Savage Species. BUt with Incarnate they'll be turned to Giants :P
Tordak 10-09-07, 09:54 AM	BUt with Incarnate they'll be turned to Giants :P Agreed. Incarnate construct turns a construct in a living creature, humanoid if medium or smaller and giant if large of bigger. At any rate, the creature looses any construct traits. You could build an intelligent construct. There are already some intelligent constructs : the inevitables (MM I). However, they are pretty single minded and don't really fit your purpose. If you want to build intelligent construct from what you've been saying, there always the half-golem template from MMII. It's usually an acquired template in which you add golem parts to a living being and turn them into construct (or not if they succeed at certain save; see MMII for more detail). It wouldn't be a big leap to say that the creature you're talking about are build into these half-golem instead of transformed, the template could easily be adapted. They're almost as strong as full golem, and remain intelligent (though somewhat less intelligent than normal humanoid) and have that hatred for human you might be looking for, and the berserk spirit, which could be turned against their creators. They would make for pretty nasty foes. The Maugs from Fiend Folio is also a very good idea (from Ganorak post, see above), and you could adapt it so that the maugs were created in that particular way and only exist through that particular process. What I'm trying to say is that this could be your reason why the maugs exist in your game.
Tordak 10-09-07, 10:03 AM	Also, Awaken construct gives the construct a constitution score (3d6), an intelligence score (3d6) and a charisma of 3 if the creature had a charisma of 1 (golem), 3d6 if it didn't have a charisma (though it would technically have been an object not a creature). It keeps any scores it already had. It does not work exactly like awaken, though there is nothing stopping you from creating such a spell for construct.
Arscura 10-09-07, 10:11 AM	I know of no template. These are ways or construct I know with intelligence. Awaken Construct spell. Maugs - Fiend Folio Thavian Golem - Monster of Faerun Emerald Golem, Diamont Golem, Sapphire Golem - Monster of Fearun Nimblewright - MM2
Tordak 10-09-07, 11:14 AM	... and a charisma of 3 if the creature had a charisma of 1 (golem), 3d6 if it didn't have a charisma (though it would technically have been an object not a creature)... Sorry I made a mistake, I had in mind that object had no intelligence and charisma, while according to the rules it's no wisdom and charisma. I suppose we can still agree that most object are not very intelligent:D . I also suppose I could have edited my post instead of quoting myself ... O.o
Anguish2 10-09-07, 02:20 PM	I imagine that House Cannith would probably go ahead and call these things "warforged". Okay, that obvious hilarity aside, let's think about the original poster's premise for a moment. These evil clerics are using divinely-granted magic to animate constructs then using divinely-granted magic to make them intelligent so that they can then sacrifice them to appease their divine deity? Um? What is this; Reduntra - Goddess of Futile Exercises? Any real evil deity is going to issue an apocalyptic message to its followers they'd better stop screwing around with the masturbatory construct awakening and go kill some villagers or something. Now, tweak this. Some dirty slavers get an idea that they can supply their best customers - the dread cult of Gorgonasticles - with sacrificial bodies without all that inconvenient kidnapping stuff. So the slavers start making intelligent constructs to sell to the cultists. The cultists sacrifice a few batches, their goddess decides she doesn't like the taste of thing and inflicts a case of vile herpes on the head priest. Head priest takes the hint and uses sending to inform the slavers' purchasing department that they won't be wanting any more of those constructs. Slavers have meanwhile made quite a few more expecting high demand. The constructs rise up and massacre the slavers, the cultists, and descend to the Eleventh Outhouse of Hell to find the goddess Reduntra in her lair, and shave her eyebrows off with a sacred razorblade so she eternally looks stupid. Just a thought.
Xiuhcoatl 10-09-07, 02:33 PM	I know of no template. These are ways or construct I know with intelligence. Awaken Construct spell. Maugs - Fiend Folio Thavian Golem - Monster of Faerun Emerald Golem, Diamont Golem, Sapphire Golem - Monster of Fearun Nimblewright - MM2 There's also the Warforged.
Arscura 10-09-07, 02:54 PM	There's also the Warforged. Correcting ;) Awaken Construct spell. Maugs - Fiend Folio Thavian Golem - Monster of Faerun Emerald Golem, Diamont Golem, Sapphire Golem - Monster of Fearun Nimblewright - MM2 Warforged - MM3, Races of Eberron, Eberron Campaign Setting Warforged Scout - MM3 Warforged Charger - MM3 Warforged Juggernaut - Eberron Campaign Setting
RobbyPants 10-09-07, 02:59 PM	There's also the Warforged. The OP wanted a full construct. Warforged are livnig constructs. Although along those lines, the Warforged Juggernaut PrC makes them closer to being full constructs...
Captain_Kobold 10-09-07, 09:21 PM	How about the Rudimentary Intelligence feat from Dragon 327?
Garonak 10-10-07, 12:57 AM	I don't think mindless creatures get that many feats, not sure though.
Arscura 10-10-07, 06:04 AM	I don't think mindless creatures get that many feats, not sure though. They get none whatsoever. Zombies only get Toughness as a bonus feat. Not because they may choose one for example
Captain_Kobold 10-10-07, 10:45 AM	How about the Rudimentary Intelligence feat from Dragon 327? Sorry. I misstated that. Rudimentary intelligence is an augmentation applied by the construct creator, not a feat.
Wylantern 10-13-07, 01:04 AM	Lets put it this way. Gods are distant in this setting. I'm using a variant spellcasting system where spellcasters (all kinds) can burn hit points to aid their spellcasting. These evil clerics use these constructs instead of themselves, burning their slave hit points or killing them outright for power boosts. IE Free Metamagic and such. Also, they make great meatshields. In the meantime, these constructs make great slaves, doing all the labour and such. Here's how I imagine them, adapted from the Maug in Fiend Folio: Yuzish Medium Construct Construct Traits Eternal Rage: Rage 1/day as a barbarian. Rapid Repair (Ex): A Yuzish that rests for 1 hour repairs 1 point of damage, so long as it has at least 1 hit point. Rapid repair does not allow a Yuzish to regrow or reattach lost body parts. An individual can assist a Yuzish's self-repair with a Craft (Alchemy) check (DC 15). If the check is successful, the Yuzish repairs 2 hit points per hour of rest. Providing assistance to the Yuzish counts as light activity for the assisting individual, and they can assist only one Yuzish at a time. A Yuzish cannot assist it's own repair. +4 Craft (Alchemy) +4 Knowledge (Religion) LA = 1 or 2 ??? This basically fills the Evil Dude with minions that aren't evil quota. Thoughts? Is it suitable for a player race or just NPCs? Or not at all?