Morbidly Obese Monster (PEACH) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Morbidly Obese Monster (PEACH) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
mtbOgre
01-17-08, 05:43 PM I've moved this Post to the Monsters Forum where it belongs: http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=979908

While it can be used for character races it is designed for monsters. Apologies for mislocating it.
Red_Wizards_Rock
01-17-08, 05:55 PM I would only drop there Flight maneuverability by 1 rating and since most creatures have double there land speed than I'd cut it in half, but if it's just there land speed I'd reduce it by 10ft. So if there land speed was 30 there flight speed would be 30, but there Obese so there flight speed would be reduced by 10 and would now be 20.

To be honest that Obese Kobold isn't doing to bad really...well none of his stats are below 6. I was kinda thinking he'd have a lower strength and dex, but I'm running a group of followers for Mystra Trying to stop Kobolds from Eating Baby's...yes baby's. I think I'll put an Obese one at the end more for humor, because it's been alot of humor so far with Kobolds.
mtbOgre
01-17-08, 06:16 PM I would only drop there Flight maneuverability by 1 rating and since most creatures have double there land speed than I'd cut it in half, but if it's just there land speed I'd reduce it by 10ft. So if there land speed was 30 there flight speed would be 30, but there Obese so there flight speed would be reduced by 10 and would now be 20.

Hmm, I'm inclined to leave the maneuverability alone. I'm not sure what you are suggesting here. That if it a creature's flight speed is equal to his land speed it shouldn't be halved only reduced by 10'?

To be honest that Obese Kobold isn't doing to bad really...well none of his stats are below 6. I was kinda thinking he'd have a lower strength and dex, but I'm running a group of followers for Mystra Trying to stop Kobolds from Eating Baby's...yes baby's. I think I'll put an Obese one at the end more for humor, because it's been alot of humor so far with Kobolds.

He's not that much worse at first glance but the reduced move and single action really hurts him. As a small creature the Kobold's biggest advantages are the increase in DEX and their 30' move of which this guys loses both.

Incidentally I forgot to add the Special Qualities into the Corpulent Kobold. I've revised him to reflect this. I've added the Slam Attack and Single action to the Corpulent Kobold now.
M-bark
01-18-08, 12:04 PM I'd say to leave the Constitution as it is for the base creature. They might get fatigued faster, but they would take blows easier than a really skinny monster.
mtbOgre
01-18-08, 01:24 PM I'd say to leave the Constitution as it is for the base creature. They might get fatigued faster, but they would take blows easier than a really skinny monster.

I think you are right here. Rather than reduce the CON I'm thinking of adding another special quality.

Easily Exhausted
After 5 continuous rounds of combat or other intense physical activity must make a DC 10 Constitution check or become exhausted (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/conditionSummary.htm#exhausted), the DC of this check increases by 1 for every round after the 5th.
ArochanoX
01-18-08, 01:31 PM If the base creature can fly, its maneuverability rating drops by 2 ratings. If this would drop the creatures maneuverability rating below clumsy the creature loses it's ability to fly. Flying speed is reduced by 1/2 except when descending.

Why do they get double flying speed when descending? Diving already is twice as fast. Should they fall quadruple times as fast as their normal flying speed? I suggest you leave that.

Creatures with this template are double the normal weight of a creature of their base type. If this moves them to the next larger size rating the creatures reach does not change from that of the base creature.

Well, to be honest, the template would be much more simple and coherent if the template just simply added one size category always not depending on the original weight. It's more simple.

Single Actions Only (Ex)
Morbidly obese monsters have poor reflexes and can perform only a single move action or attack action each round. A morbidly obese monster can move up to its speed and attack in the same round, but only if it attempts a charge.

I think this is overreacting. This should be removed.

Saves
Saves are unaffected except as impacted by ability changes below.

I'd actually place there a fort save penalty. Maybe a -2. I'll explain further later.

Abilities
A morbidly obese monster’s Strength, and Constitution decrease by 2, it's Dexterity decreases by 4, and its Charisma decreases by 2.

I actually think that the strenght and constitution should in fact be higher. Because whenever a creature gains mass, its muscles get trained too. You must've noticed that big (even fat) humans can lift heavier weights than "normal-sized" humans. Even though they wouldn't be more streneous when compared to body weight, they still have more strenght than "normal-sized" humans.
Fat, or very obsese people usually have poor fortitude (as represented by fort save penalty) but good endurance (as represented by constitution bonus).
And why oh why does its charisma get dropped? Because a creature is fat, should it have an impact on one's force of personality?

I propose following ability score changes: Str +4 (less than 1 size increase, which is typically +8), Dex -4 (which is worse than 1 size increase) and Con +2 (which is the same or worse than 1 size increase).

Skills
A morbidly obese monster has no skills.

Feats
A morbidly obese monster loses all feats of the base creature and gains Toughness.

These just don't make any sense. Let's say a human paladin 20 somehow becomes Morbidly Obese. He get's to keep his smite, mount, divine grace, detect evil, spells, BAB, saves and HD, but loses all feats and skill points. Why?

And after all, this template is in the races forum so it is intented to be a template for players, yes? Because if not, there is the monster forum separately. And players need feats and skill points.

You don't list the level adjustment. I think it should be listed and it should be something like +1. (With the modifications I've noted.)
mtbOgre
01-18-08, 02:15 PM Why do they get double flying speed when descending? Diving already is twice as fast. Should they fall quadruple times as fast as their normal flying speed? I suggest you leave that.
As written the creature flies at 1/2 speed during level flight or climbing when the extra weight impairs them. But when diving they dive at the speed normal for their creature type. I think this makes sense... maybe the 1/2 speed itself is part of the problem.

Well, to be honest, the template would be much more simple and coherent if the template just simply added one size category always not depending on the original weight. It's more simple.
I thought about changing the size category but there some problems with this. Having the creature take up 4 times the number of squares on the battle grid is a significant issue and IMO excessive. The creatures reach and height are unaffected. For example a morbidly obese human who is suddenly size large would now take up a 10'x10' area which is unreasonable.

I think this is overreacting. This should be removed.
I wanted a mechanism to reflect the seriously reduced mobility from being so large. Now that I look back at it I tend to agree that this plus the reduced movement are overkill.

I actually think that the strenght and constitution should in fact be higher. Because whenever a creature gains mass, its muscles get trained too. You must've noticed that big (even fat) humans can lift heavier weights than "normal-sized" humans. Even though they wouldn't be more streneous when compared to body weight, they still have more strenght than "normal-sized" humans.
Fat, or very obsese people usually have poor fortitude (as represented by fort save penalty) but good endurance (as represented by constitution bonus).
And why oh why does its charisma get dropped? Because a creature is fat, should it have an impact on one's force of personality?
Hmmm, personal experience (I don't think I ever quite made it to Morbidly Obese... but I got close and know someone who has been there) tells me you are in the ballpark on the strength but I don't think +4 probably just +2.

As for the Constitution... I already reduced the penalty to nothing and I think I'm going to leave it there but I'll seriously consider it in light of your suggested FORT penalty.

These just don't make any sense. Let's say a human paladin 20 somehow becomes Morbidly Obese. He get's to keep his smite, mount, divine grace, detect evil, spells, BAB, saves and HD, but loses all feats and skill points. Why?

Why? Because I cut and pasted the Zombie template and obviously didn't proof it very well before posting it.

And after all, this template is in the races forum so it is intented to be a template for players, yes? Because if not, there is the monster forum separately. And players need feats and skill points.

Hmm... Umm Duh. No this is not really intended for PCs. I don't see why it couldn't would like it to work for them though. I've relocated the top post here: http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=979908

You don't list the level adjustment. I think it should be listed and it should be something like +1. (With the modifications I've noted.)

Hmm... well I don't quite agree with all your changes, I wouldn't put any level adjust on it as I have it posted (or will once I finish with this).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
mtbOgre 01-17-08, 05:43 PM	I've moved this Post to the Monsters Forum where it belongs: http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=979908 While it can be used for character races it is designed for monsters. Apologies for mislocating it.
Red_Wizards_Rock 01-17-08, 05:55 PM	I would only drop there Flight maneuverability by 1 rating and since most creatures have double there land speed than I'd cut it in half, but if it's just there land speed I'd reduce it by 10ft. So if there land speed was 30 there flight speed would be 30, but there Obese so there flight speed would be reduced by 10 and would now be 20. To be honest that Obese Kobold isn't doing to bad really...well none of his stats are below 6. I was kinda thinking he'd have a lower strength and dex, but I'm running a group of followers for Mystra Trying to stop Kobolds from Eating Baby's...yes baby's. I think I'll put an Obese one at the end more for humor, because it's been alot of humor so far with Kobolds.
mtbOgre 01-17-08, 06:16 PM	I would only drop there Flight maneuverability by 1 rating and since most creatures have double there land speed than I'd cut it in half, but if it's just there land speed I'd reduce it by 10ft. So if there land speed was 30 there flight speed would be 30, but there Obese so there flight speed would be reduced by 10 and would now be 20. Hmm, I'm inclined to leave the maneuverability alone. I'm not sure what you are suggesting here. That if it a creature's flight speed is equal to his land speed it shouldn't be halved only reduced by 10'? To be honest that Obese Kobold isn't doing to bad really...well none of his stats are below 6. I was kinda thinking he'd have a lower strength and dex, but I'm running a group of followers for Mystra Trying to stop Kobolds from Eating Baby's...yes baby's. I think I'll put an Obese one at the end more for humor, because it's been alot of humor so far with Kobolds. He's not that much worse at first glance but the reduced move and single action really hurts him. As a small creature the Kobold's biggest advantages are the increase in DEX and their 30' move of which this guys loses both. Incidentally I forgot to add the Special Qualities into the Corpulent Kobold. I've revised him to reflect this. I've added the Slam Attack and Single action to the Corpulent Kobold now.
M-bark 01-18-08, 12:04 PM	I'd say to leave the Constitution as it is for the base creature. They might get fatigued faster, but they would take blows easier than a really skinny monster.
mtbOgre 01-18-08, 01:24 PM	I'd say to leave the Constitution as it is for the base creature. They might get fatigued faster, but they would take blows easier than a really skinny monster. I think you are right here. Rather than reduce the CON I'm thinking of adding another special quality. Easily Exhausted After 5 continuous rounds of combat or other intense physical activity must make a DC 10 Constitution check or become exhausted (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/conditionSummary.htm#exhausted), the DC of this check increases by 1 for every round after the 5th.
ArochanoX 01-18-08, 01:31 PM	If the base creature can fly, its maneuverability rating drops by 2 ratings. If this would drop the creatures maneuverability rating below clumsy the creature loses it's ability to fly. Flying speed is reduced by 1/2 except when descending. Why do they get double flying speed when descending? Diving already is twice as fast. Should they fall quadruple times as fast as their normal flying speed? I suggest you leave that. Creatures with this template are double the normal weight of a creature of their base type. If this moves them to the next larger size rating the creatures reach does not change from that of the base creature. Well, to be honest, the template would be much more simple and coherent if the template just simply added one size category always not depending on the original weight. It's more simple. Single Actions Only (Ex) Morbidly obese monsters have poor reflexes and can perform only a single move action or attack action each round. A morbidly obese monster can move up to its speed and attack in the same round, but only if it attempts a charge. I think this is overreacting. This should be removed. Saves Saves are unaffected except as impacted by ability changes below. I'd actually place there a fort save penalty. Maybe a -2. I'll explain further later. Abilities A morbidly obese monster’s Strength, and Constitution decrease by 2, it's Dexterity decreases by 4, and its Charisma decreases by 2. I actually think that the strenght and constitution should in fact be higher. Because whenever a creature gains mass, its muscles get trained too. You must've noticed that big (even fat) humans can lift heavier weights than "normal-sized" humans. Even though they wouldn't be more streneous when compared to body weight, they still have more strenght than "normal-sized" humans. Fat, or very obsese people usually have poor fortitude (as represented by fort save penalty) but good endurance (as represented by constitution bonus). And why oh why does its charisma get dropped? Because a creature is fat, should it have an impact on one's force of personality? I propose following ability score changes: Str +4 (less than 1 size increase, which is typically +8), Dex -4 (which is worse than 1 size increase) and Con +2 (which is the same or worse than 1 size increase). Skills A morbidly obese monster has no skills. Feats A morbidly obese monster loses all feats of the base creature and gains Toughness. These just don't make any sense. Let's say a human paladin 20 somehow becomes Morbidly Obese. He get's to keep his smite, mount, divine grace, detect evil, spells, BAB, saves and HD, but loses all feats and skill points. Why? And after all, this template is in the races forum so it is intented to be a template for players, yes? Because if not, there is the monster forum separately. And players need feats and skill points. You don't list the level adjustment. I think it should be listed and it should be something like +1. (With the modifications I've noted.)
mtbOgre 01-18-08, 02:15 PM	Why do they get double flying speed when descending? Diving already is twice as fast. Should they fall quadruple times as fast as their normal flying speed? I suggest you leave that. As written the creature flies at 1/2 speed during level flight or climbing when the extra weight impairs them. But when diving they dive at the speed normal for their creature type. I think this makes sense... maybe the 1/2 speed itself is part of the problem. Well, to be honest, the template would be much more simple and coherent if the template just simply added one size category always not depending on the original weight. It's more simple. I thought about changing the size category but there some problems with this. Having the creature take up 4 times the number of squares on the battle grid is a significant issue and IMO excessive. The creatures reach and height are unaffected. For example a morbidly obese human who is suddenly size large would now take up a 10'x10' area which is unreasonable. I think this is overreacting. This should be removed. I wanted a mechanism to reflect the seriously reduced mobility from being so large. Now that I look back at it I tend to agree that this plus the reduced movement are overkill. I actually think that the strenght and constitution should in fact be higher. Because whenever a creature gains mass, its muscles get trained too. You must've noticed that big (even fat) humans can lift heavier weights than "normal-sized" humans. Even though they wouldn't be more streneous when compared to body weight, they still have more strenght than "normal-sized" humans. Fat, or very obsese people usually have poor fortitude (as represented by fort save penalty) but good endurance (as represented by constitution bonus). And why oh why does its charisma get dropped? Because a creature is fat, should it have an impact on one's force of personality? Hmmm, personal experience (I don't think I ever quite made it to Morbidly Obese... but I got close and know someone who has been there) tells me you are in the ballpark on the strength but I don't think +4 probably just +2. As for the Constitution... I already reduced the penalty to nothing and I think I'm going to leave it there but I'll seriously consider it in light of your suggested FORT penalty. These just don't make any sense. Let's say a human paladin 20 somehow becomes Morbidly Obese. He get's to keep his smite, mount, divine grace, detect evil, spells, BAB, saves and HD, but loses all feats and skill points. Why? Why? Because I cut and pasted the Zombie template and obviously didn't proof it very well before posting it. And after all, this template is in the races forum so it is intented to be a template for players, yes? Because if not, there is the monster forum separately. And players need feats and skill points. Hmm... Umm Duh. No this is not really intended for PCs. I don't see why it couldn't would like it to work for them though. I've relocated the top post here: http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=979908 You don't list the level adjustment. I think it should be listed and it should be something like +1. (With the modifications I've noted.) Hmm... well I don't quite agree with all your changes, I wouldn't put any level adjust on it as I have it posted (or will once I finish with this).