Pseudodragon Cohort [Archive] - Wizards Community

Pseudodragon Cohort [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
The_Shaman
03-02-07, 04:13 PM Hi, I'm planning a dragon-flavored barbarian/sorcerer (or, if the DM gives me a lot of flak about it, maybe dragon shaman), probably going into EK or a form of DD later on. I was thinking about a draconic cohort as per the Draconomicon feat, to go along with my character and act as a sidekick for the mighty hero :) . Now, with the feat pseudodragon ECL becomes almost non-existant, and I was thinking about giving it character levels. I have two questions though:

- can pseudodragons speak? It's said they are telepathic, and vocalize animal noises, but I was wondering if I could make it a bard. Now, dancing is pretty much out of the question, and I don't think I will be giving it a musical instrument. If that doesn't work either, the little one is getting to be a dragon shaman; who says pseudodragons have no breath weapon?
- can they get a standard array of scores instead of the 10/11s they have as an example? Their charisma is a bit low and it would be good if they could be tweaked a little. An elite array would be even better, but I think it might impact their CR.

Thanks in advance!
Darth Sephiroth
03-02-07, 07:13 PM If you take Sorcerer Levels take a look at the Improved Familiar feat, it lets you have a pseudodragon as your familiar.
Krusk
03-02-07, 07:38 PM If you do make it a bard, id suggest for an instrument some sort of wind chime rigged on its tail. Or maybe those little cymbals that monkeys have? http://www.completegamester.com/pages/windup2/NEW-WINDUPS/Wind-Ups/monkey-cymbals1.jpg ?

Maybe it could also telepathically sing you words of encouragement?
HomebrewedMonster
03-02-07, 08:02 PM A 7th level caster with Improved Familiar can have a psuedodragon. Now as the dragon cohort, its easy take its hit dice and add its LA to find its Effective Character Level.

The psuedodragon is in the SRD http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/pseudodragon.htm

A pseudodragon is a 5th level character, so you can get it at 6th level with Leadership.
They can only speak telepahtically, but in a lot of DnD novels and fiction they can talk freely. Its really the DM's choice.
The real sweet part about pseudodragons is they have 60ft blindsense.
Thomar_of_Uointer
03-02-07, 10:32 PM I don't think the Leadership feat or any of its variants describe how you determine the abilities of your cohorts. I would say you just use 28 point buy, or whatever method you used for the rest of the party.

Pseudodragons can vocalize animal noises, in other words they can squeak, hiss, and yowl, just like any other pet besides a parrot. They can also communicate telepathically, though unlike standard telepathy, this is only limited to Common and Sylvan.

As for advancement, I would say sorcerer is a very cool option for support as a mage.
Kn1ves
03-02-07, 10:51 PM Pseudodragon Swordsage :plotting:
paladin2019
03-03-07, 12:28 AM A pseudodragon is a 5th level character, so you can get it at 6th level with Leadership.

If it's 5th level, then the Leader has to be 7th. 3.5 changed the 3E rule from a max cohort level of one level below the Leader's to two.
HomebrewedMonster
03-03-07, 11:20 AM I don't think the Leadership feat or any of its variants describe how you determine the abilities of your cohorts. I would say you just use 28 point buy, or whatever method you used for the rest of the party.

When you take a monster as a cohort you use the stats from the MM.

If it's 5th level, then the Leader has to be 7th. 3.5 changed the 3E rule from a max cohort level of one level below the Leader's to two.

Correct, I meant to mention Dragon Cohort from Draconomicon. It reduces a dragon cohort's ECL by two.
The_Shaman
03-03-07, 03:13 PM If you take Sorcerer Levels take a look at the Improved Familiar feat, it lets you have a pseudodragon as your familiar.

I know, but look at it this way: I'm spending a feat either way. If it's a familiar, it will probably have around the same HPs as a cohort (1/2 mine), a little better NA, but if it dies I have a serious problem. Also, it won't have any more powers than the ones any familiar has - in fact, a normal familiar will have more special abilities as afaik improved familiars get the abilities for a master several levels lower. Many of the good abilities will either be off-limit due to my low sorcererer level (and afaik having an improved familiar penalized your class level for the purposes of familiar abilities) and one of the best - using it as a toucher - will only be of limited use since as a multi-class mage I won't be using a lot of offensive spells anyway. If it's a cohort, first I don't have to worry so much about it, second it can have skills different than mine, and third it can have class levels and all the goodies they bring. Plus, I find the idea of a little knowledgeable dragonkin quite cute :) . I wonder... since it can vocalize animal sounds, would that mean it can, say, mimic songbirds for its bardic music?

So what's the ruling of using an ability score array for cohorts? With its adjustments of +2 con, +2 wis (apart from the +4 dex -4 str for being tiny) it might be a bit of a problem if I were to use the standard 10-11 array.
ressurrector
03-03-07, 03:25 PM In my game I allow cohorts the same ability array I use for heroic NPCs or PCs.
Essentially they are treated the same way they would be if they were a player character (except second-fiddle and 2 levels lower)
As to the official rule, I have no idea.
Willie the Duck
03-03-07, 03:28 PM undefined.

As to spellcasting, I'd let it take natural spell to cast in it's 'form without hands or human mouth' (not quite what the feat says, but definately in the flavor).
The_Shaman
03-03-07, 03:32 PM Yeah, there was a feat like that in Savage Species for races that can't provide the verbal or somatic components. Well, it should be able to handle the verbal components somewhat, but the somatic ones can be a bit of a pain :)
Krusk
03-03-07, 07:20 PM There is also a feat in the planar handbook about doing spells without verbal components.
The_Shaman
03-05-07, 05:00 PM BTW, doesn't the Draconic Cohort reduce ECL by 3, not 2?

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
The_Shaman 03-02-07, 04:13 PM	Hi, I'm planning a dragon-flavored barbarian/sorcerer (or, if the DM gives me a lot of flak about it, maybe dragon shaman), probably going into EK or a form of DD later on. I was thinking about a draconic cohort as per the Draconomicon feat, to go along with my character and act as a sidekick for the mighty hero :) . Now, with the feat pseudodragon ECL becomes almost non-existant, and I was thinking about giving it character levels. I have two questions though: - can pseudodragons speak? It's said they are telepathic, and vocalize animal noises, but I was wondering if I could make it a bard. Now, dancing is pretty much out of the question, and I don't think I will be giving it a musical instrument. If that doesn't work either, the little one is getting to be a dragon shaman; who says pseudodragons have no breath weapon? - can they get a standard array of scores instead of the 10/11s they have as an example? Their charisma is a bit low and it would be good if they could be tweaked a little. An elite array would be even better, but I think it might impact their CR. Thanks in advance!
Darth Sephiroth 03-02-07, 07:13 PM	If you take Sorcerer Levels take a look at the Improved Familiar feat, it lets you have a pseudodragon as your familiar.
Krusk 03-02-07, 07:38 PM	If you do make it a bard, id suggest for an instrument some sort of wind chime rigged on its tail. Or maybe those little cymbals that monkeys have? http://www.completegamester.com/pages/windup2/NEW-WINDUPS/Wind-Ups/monkey-cymbals1.jpg ? Maybe it could also telepathically sing you words of encouragement?
HomebrewedMonster 03-02-07, 08:02 PM	A 7th level caster with Improved Familiar can have a psuedodragon. Now as the dragon cohort, its easy take its hit dice and add its LA to find its Effective Character Level. The psuedodragon is in the SRD http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/pseudodragon.htm A pseudodragon is a 5th level character, so you can get it at 6th level with Leadership. They can only speak telepahtically, but in a lot of DnD novels and fiction they can talk freely. Its really the DM's choice. The real sweet part about pseudodragons is they have 60ft blindsense.
Thomar_of_Uointer 03-02-07, 10:32 PM	I don't think the Leadership feat or any of its variants describe how you determine the abilities of your cohorts. I would say you just use 28 point buy, or whatever method you used for the rest of the party. Pseudodragons can vocalize animal noises, in other words they can squeak, hiss, and yowl, just like any other pet besides a parrot. They can also communicate telepathically, though unlike standard telepathy, this is only limited to Common and Sylvan. As for advancement, I would say sorcerer is a very cool option for support as a mage.
Kn1ves 03-02-07, 10:51 PM	Pseudodragon Swordsage :plotting:
paladin2019 03-03-07, 12:28 AM	A pseudodragon is a 5th level character, so you can get it at 6th level with Leadership. If it's 5th level, then the Leader has to be 7th. 3.5 changed the 3E rule from a max cohort level of one level below the Leader's to two.
HomebrewedMonster 03-03-07, 11:20 AM	I don't think the Leadership feat or any of its variants describe how you determine the abilities of your cohorts. I would say you just use 28 point buy, or whatever method you used for the rest of the party. When you take a monster as a cohort you use the stats from the MM. If it's 5th level, then the Leader has to be 7th. 3.5 changed the 3E rule from a max cohort level of one level below the Leader's to two. Correct, I meant to mention Dragon Cohort from Draconomicon. It reduces a dragon cohort's ECL by two.
The_Shaman 03-03-07, 03:13 PM	If you take Sorcerer Levels take a look at the Improved Familiar feat, it lets you have a pseudodragon as your familiar. I know, but look at it this way: I'm spending a feat either way. If it's a familiar, it will probably have around the same HPs as a cohort (1/2 mine), a little better NA, but if it dies I have a serious problem. Also, it won't have any more powers than the ones any familiar has - in fact, a normal familiar will have more special abilities as afaik improved familiars get the abilities for a master several levels lower. Many of the good abilities will either be off-limit due to my low sorcererer level (and afaik having an improved familiar penalized your class level for the purposes of familiar abilities) and one of the best - using it as a toucher - will only be of limited use since as a multi-class mage I won't be using a lot of offensive spells anyway. If it's a cohort, first I don't have to worry so much about it, second it can have skills different than mine, and third it can have class levels and all the goodies they bring. Plus, I find the idea of a little knowledgeable dragonkin quite cute :) . I wonder... since it can vocalize animal sounds, would that mean it can, say, mimic songbirds for its bardic music? So what's the ruling of using an ability score array for cohorts? With its adjustments of +2 con, +2 wis (apart from the +4 dex -4 str for being tiny) it might be a bit of a problem if I were to use the standard 10-11 array.
ressurrector 03-03-07, 03:25 PM	In my game I allow cohorts the same ability array I use for heroic NPCs or PCs. Essentially they are treated the same way they would be if they were a player character (except second-fiddle and 2 levels lower) As to the official rule, I have no idea.
Willie the Duck 03-03-07, 03:28 PM	undefined. As to spellcasting, I'd let it take natural spell to cast in it's 'form without hands or human mouth' (not quite what the feat says, but definately in the flavor).
The_Shaman 03-03-07, 03:32 PM	Yeah, there was a feat like that in Savage Species for races that can't provide the verbal or somatic components. Well, it should be able to handle the verbal components somewhat, but the somatic ones can be a bit of a pain :)
Krusk 03-03-07, 07:20 PM	There is also a feat in the planar handbook about doing spells without verbal components.
The_Shaman 03-05-07, 05:00 PM	BTW, doesn't the Draconic Cohort reduce ECL by 3, not 2?