Post/Author/DateTime	Post
GodGoblin 04-30-08, 05:37 PM	Hey guys, one of my players is thinking of playing a Pseudodragon character. The level adjustment is only +3, but we're starting at level 1 so I'm looking for a racial progression class if one exists. If not, some tips on how to create one myself would be much appreciated, also there are 2 hit dice, would this make the progression class 5 levels long? Thanks in advance. Goblin
ciaran 05-01-08, 12:19 AM	I threw this together for you quick like for ya. Any suggestions to reorganization are welcome. If I missed anything, please point that out too. More LA than HD makes for a character that might die off early on. Tiny Dragon +2 attack & AC, +8 hide, -4 on all the usual Tiny creatures have a reach of 0 feet Dragons use d12 for HD Proficient with no armor. Dragons eat, sleep, and breathe Movement 15 ft -4 str, +2 dex immunity to sleep and paralysis low-light vision Skills: Appraise, Bluff, Diplomacy, Hide, Listen, Knowledge (Arcana), Move Silently, Search, Sense Motive, Spot, Survival level BAB Fort Ref Will skills special 1 +1 +2 +2 +2 (6+i)x4 flight, telethapy, bite 2 - - - - - +2 con, nat ac +2, weapon finesse 3 +2 +3 +3 +3 6+int blindsense, chameleon, sting 4 - - - - - darkvision 60 ft, +2 dex, nat ac +4 5 - - - - - +2 wis, poison, spell resistance 19 Bite: this is a secondary natural attack that deals 1 point of damage. Flight (Ex): The Psuedodragon begins fly speed of 20 ft and average maneuverability. This fly speed increases by ten feet per level, maxing out at 60 ft at 5th level. At 3rd level maneuverability improves to good. Telepathy (Su): Pseudodragons can communicate telepathically with creatures that speak a shared language, provided they are within 20 feet. This range increaes by ten feet per level, maxing out at 60 ft at 5th level. Ability bonus: The dragon gains the listed number as a bonus to the relavent ability. Natural AC: The pseudodragon gains a natural ac bonus of 2 at 2nd level. This increases to 4 at 5th level. Weapon Finesse: this is bonus feat gained at 2nd level. Blindsense (Ex): A pseudodragon can locate creatures within 60 feet by nonvisual means (mostly hearing and scent, but also by noticing vibration and other environmental clues). Opponents the pseudodragon can’t actually see still have total concealment against the pseudodragon. Chameleon (Ex): Pseudodragons gain a chameleonlike ability at 3rd level that grants them a +4 racial bonus on Hide checks. In forests or overgrown areas, this bonus improves to +8. Sting: this is a primary natural attack made with the tail that deals 1d3 points of damage Poison (Ex): In addition to dealing damage with its sting attack, at 5th level the Pseudodragon also delivers poison with it. Initial damage: sleep for 1 minute, secondary damage: sleep for 1d3 hours. Fort DC = 1/2 HD + Con. The Pseudodragon also receives a +2 racial bonus to this DC. Spell Resistance (Su): At 5th level the Pseudodragon gains SR 19. ** I don't know how this scales with additonal HD. **
GodGoblin 05-01-08, 06:06 AM	That sounds pretty good, thanks for the help but i was wondering where during the 5 levels does it gain the hit dice? Also with telepathy starting at 4th level is there any way for it to communicate before then?
zeratulcraft 05-01-08, 06:43 AM	That sounds pretty good, thanks for the help but i was wondering where during the 5 levels does it gain the hit dice? Also with telepathy starting at 4th level is there any way for it to communicate before then? Where it gains BAB is where it's HD are, dragons having Full BAB. And seemingly it can only communicate animal noises, according to it's MM entry.
runestar 05-01-08, 07:29 AM	Skill points should be 6+int mod, as a dragon. I think giving it fly and darkvision at 1st lv might be better, so it can better fulfill its roles. Maybe a limited form of telepathy early on as well.
ciaran 05-01-08, 08:34 AM	Well in order to split everything up evenly you can't get it all. No matter what you do it, you're going to be almost useless in a fight at 1st level, even with bite and flight. Can someone suggest a good breakdown?
runestar 05-01-08, 09:28 AM	Well, I feel it makes an excellent scout as it possess excellent senses (low light vision, darkvision, blindsense), good flight speed, tiny size (which helps in sneaking) and telepathy (which allows it to communicate readily with the party without giving anyone away. This makes it very ideal as an improved familiar. As a PC...it appears much more tricky, as its main mode of attack is via its sleep poison (and delivery is risky and unreliable). You have to wait until ECL6 before you can take your 1st lv. I think I will have to frontload a few abilities to make it survivable. Add flight(60ft-good to its list of starting racial abilities. Screw the +2str it gets at ECL3 and adjust starting str modifier to -4, rather than -6. Lv1) weapon finesse (b), bite, sting, poison, NA+2, 1st dragon HD Lv2) +2dex, chameleon Lv3) +2con, blindsense 60ft, NA+3, 2nd dragon HD Lv4) +2dex, telepathy 60ft Lv5) +2wis, sr19+class lv, NA+4 This way, it can at least contribute in combat with a 5-ft reach sting which puts them to sleep. Did I miss out anything?
GodGoblin 05-01-08, 09:58 AM	That one sounds good aswell, i think ciarana is more balanced though, poisen at 1st level is a bit harsh im thinkiong about mabye limiting it to x times per day and increase this as we go up until 5th when its at will. also how does the stinger get 5ft reach? This is my attempt using the 2 already posted as a base, rather than just have the dragon abitlities i made them advance as it grows, im unsure if that was good idea or not but il read your feedback and modifications where neccisary. Movement 15 ft -4 str, +2 dex immunity to sleep and paralysis low-light vision flight 30ft average manoeuvrability Skill points- 6+int x4 at first level and 6+int at 3rd level Skills: Diplomacy, Hide, Listen, Search, Sense Motive, Spot, Survival BaB and saves go up with HD Lv1) weapon finesse, bite, 10ft telepathy, AC+2, 1st HD Lv2) +2con, chameleon, Blindsense 20ft, 40ft flight- average, sting 1d3 Lv3) AC+3, telepathy 30ft, 50ft flight- average, 2nd HD Lv4) +2dex, blindsense 40ft, 50ft flight- good Lv5) +2wis, sr19, AC+4, blindsense 60ft, telepathy 60ft, poison, 60ft flight good Thanks for the help so far guys. The player is thinking about taking psion as a class after its proggression levels are done, but were unsure if it will be that affective because of all the manifesting levels it will lose, any tips on what class would be good for this sort of character would be a big help.
ciaran 05-01-08, 06:35 PM	Its a tough balance. I wanted to keep certain abilities off of 1st level to kind of show the little dragon coming into adulthood. I think I'll add to the skill list too.
GodGoblin 05-02-08, 01:43 PM	Its a tough balance. I wanted to keep certain abilities off of 1st level to kind of show the little dragon coming into adulthood. I think I'll add to the skill list too. Yeah I've discussed this with my player and were pretty sure were adding move silently to the list because its a rather small creature and we like the idea of skulking around predators and not getting eaten. I agree with the idea of it coming into adulthood but from a game point of view he will be absolutely ineffective at level 1 so were toying with the idea of flight so that it can at least be a scout of some sort other wise we really cant think of a role for him. Were pretty set on at least some telepathy at level 1. we were also discussing the class choice, before we were thinking of psion but the other party members are a wizard and Druidic avenger, so they will both already have 5 levels of spell casting so now were considering rogue or scout Thanks for all the help so far.
Prime32 05-02-08, 02:23 PM	One thing I have suggested before is this: Instead of +3 LA, the pseudodragon must take 3 levels of commoner. You might be able to break down a pseudodragon commoner 3 into a more balanced 5-level class, without the problems that come with having lower HD than the rest of the party.
ciaran 05-02-08, 05:32 PM	I shifted around things to have the requested items at 1st. It is pretty important for a few things to be there. :) The free feat jumped to 2nd though! You could alter the Half-Dragon paragon class to work well with this. If you player can stay out of trouble this could be fun.