Race/teamplate for paladin with LA +1/+2 [Archive] - Wizards Community

Race/teamplate for paladin with LA +1/+2 [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Konor
03-28-07, 12:32 PM Well, aasimar isn't good enough. With it's LA +1 he could be more powerfull. I look for anything which can give me some bonuses to strength, constitution and charisma. Maybe some penalties to dexterity. It could also use some natural armor or other nice stuff, maybe wisdom. I want it to look like this:
+4 str -2 dex +4 con +4 cha LA +2
Half-Celestial teamplate looks great, I can say that it is even a bit too powerfull for LA +4, I really like it. But this +4 is too much. Something between aasimar and half-celestial would be really great.
Any changes in actual races/teamplates aren't involved. My GM just do not agree, bastard.
Jaxgaret
03-28-07, 12:44 PM Well, aasimar isn't good enough. With it's LA +1 he could be more powerfull. I look for anything which can give me some bonuses to strength, constitution and charisma. Maybe some penalties to dexterity. It could also use some natural armor or other nice stuff, maybe wisdom. I want it to look like this: +4 str -2 dex +4 con +4 cha LA +2
Half-Celestial teamplate looks great, I can say that it is even a bit too powerfull for LA +4, I really like it. But this +4 is too much. Something between aasimar and half-celestial would be really great. Any changes in actual races/teamplates aren't involved. My GM just do not agree, bastard.

How's +2 Str, +2 Con, +2 Cha, NA +1, and some other nice bonuses for +1 LA?

Draconic Template, from Races of the Dragon or Draconomicon.

Make a Draconic Goliath for more Str and Con and Powerful Build for a total LA +2.
Warforged Goblin
03-28-07, 01:06 PM Or, for a +1 LA, draconic gold dwarf.

Gold dwarf: +2 Con, -2 Dex
Draconic: +2 Str, +2 Con, +2 Cha

An overall net of +2 Str, +4 Con, -2 Dex, and +2 Cha
"This is my paladin, Sir Tanksalot..."

Edit: Sorry Jax. For some reason I thought you meant a DRAGONBORN goliath. Yeah, regardless of race, the draconic template seems the way to go...
Argaud
03-28-07, 01:06 PM If you don't mind a -2 to Con the half-fey template is LA+2 and gives you +2 dex, +2 wis and +4 cha. Flight. Immunity to enchantment. A lot of slas and quite a fair bit of minor, useful abilities.

Details here: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20040213a
Finfreeze
03-28-07, 01:20 PM Let's see what I can come up with (all LA +2)...

Feral Catfolk: +4 Str, +2 Dex, +2 Con, -4 Int, +2 Wis, +2 Cha
Draconic Catfolk: +2 Str, +4 Dex, +2 Con, +4 Cha
Phrenic Water Orc: +4 Str, +2 Con, +2 Cha
Draconic Feytouched Water Orc: +6 Str, +2 Dex, +2 Con, -2 Int, -2 Wis, +2 Cha (can you have a draconic dragonborn feytouched water orc? Then you could have +4 Con)
Draconic Feral Water Halfling: +4 Str, +4 Con, -4 Int, +2 Wis, +2 Cha
Phrenic Earth Dwarf: +2 Str, -2 Dex, +2 Con, +2 Int, +2 Wis, +2 Cha
Draconic Feytouched Desert Half-Orc: +2 Str, +2 Dex, +2 Con, -2 Int, +4 Cha

Uh, I tried.
Konor
03-28-07, 03:10 PM Thanks guys. Nicely done.
Well, I will play draconic draconic human.
+4 str +4 con +4 cha LA +2
Muahhahaa..
Grod_The_Giant
03-28-07, 03:27 PM If your DM allows the 2 racial HD=+1 LA trade, then you might be able to use Lizardfolk.

+2 Strength, +2 Constitution, -2 Intelligence.
+4 racial bonus on Balance, Jump, and Swim checks.
+5 natural armor bonus.
Natural Weapons: 2 claws (1d4) and bite (1d4).
Special Qualities (see above): Hold breath.
jokey665
03-28-07, 03:27 PM Saint. Topic over.
Konor
03-28-07, 03:32 PM I can ask him. But draconic looks quite well.
Ovistavin
03-28-07, 07:06 PM Thanks guys. Nicely done.
Well, I will play draconic draconic human.
+4 str +4 con +4 cha LA +2
Muahhahaa..

I think this is a joke, but in case it isn't. You do realize that by the rules you can't apply any template more than once (there are a few exceptions).

Also in Races of the Dragon there is a racial class you can use to upgrade the Draconic template to the Half-Dragon template. You don't have to do this right away, but once you start you have to finish it. It's only 2 levels, but those levels will increase your LA by 2.
Darth Sephiroth
03-28-07, 07:32 PM Draconic Lesser Aasimaar could be a nice plaything for you to use.
Jaxgaret
03-28-07, 07:38 PM Draconic Lesser Aasimaar could be a nice plaything for you to use.

Say Cheese!

But yeah, that would be pretty much optimal.
Nat_20
03-28-07, 07:41 PM I like the idea of a Drow Paladin... Would people would be racist against a Drow, even though your a Champion of good?
Jaxgaret
03-28-07, 08:30 PM I like the idea of a Drow Paladin... Would people would be racist against a Drow, even though your a Champion of good?

I know! I know the answer to this question!

... oh wait, I don't. Because it is campaign-specific and your DM is the ultimate arbiter of such decisions.
Konor
03-29-07, 09:44 AM My favourite idea is Draconic Lesser Aasimar. And the thing about class which increases Draconic teaplate. Can I take the 2 levels in it and return to paladin? I guess not. Or I am wrong?
runestar
03-29-07, 09:57 AM I quite like feytouched or half-fey, but some of their SLAs might be hard to justify for a paladin, RP wise.:(
obrysii
03-29-07, 09:58 AM Draconic Merfolk. LA +2

Str +2, Dex +2, Con +4, Cha +4

Draconic Catfolk. LA +2
Str +2, Dex +4, Con +2, Cha +4
Frugal
03-29-07, 10:00 AM My favourite idea is Draconic Lesser Aasimar. And the thing about class which increases Draconic teaplate. Can I take the 2 levels in it and return to paladin? I guess not. Or I am wrong?

I'd have to look at the template but you can probably take them as your first levels and then enter the Paladin class.
kyros_the_spawnslayer
03-29-07, 10:07 AM For the draconic class thing if I recall correctly you gain your first level into the template and agin some fo the abilites ( I think some skill bonus) along with the features for a lvl 1 character in that class. Then the next two levels you have to spend to advance as a draconic being. From there on you can advance your paladin some more or go for a half-dragon and take the rest of the class, which means your next few levels have to be in the racial class.
Steely_Dan
03-29-07, 10:11 AM Saint. Topic over.

Yep, that template is sick for LA +2. But getting your DM to allow it, or allowing you to qualify for it…
Silverthumb128
03-29-07, 10:15 AM Draconic Spark Aasimar:
+2 Str, +2 Con, +6 Cha, net +2 LA
Jaxgaret
03-29-07, 11:05 AM Yep, that template is sick for LA +2. But getting your DM to allow it, or allowing you to qualify for it…

IIRC there are steep requirements to qualify for the Saint template (several exalted feats perhaps?). You can't *just take it*, like other templates.
feraltibbit
03-29-07, 11:20 AM Well, aasimar isn't good enough. With it's LA +1 he could be more powerfull. I look for anything which can give me some bonuses to strength, constitution and charisma. Maybe some penalties to dexterity. It could also use some natural armor or other nice stuff, maybe wisdom. I want it to look like this:
+4 str -2 dex +4 con +4 cha LA +2
Half-Celestial teamplate looks great, I can say that it is even a bit too powerfull for LA +4, I really like it. But this +4 is too much. Something between aasimar and half-celestial would be really great.
Any changes in actual races/teamplates aren't involved. My GM just do not agree, bastard.

Just go with the Dragonborn Template in Races of the Dragon; no ECL, pick-n-choose, worship Bahamut, LG. 2 EZ:D !
Ovistavin
03-29-07, 02:15 PM For the draconic class thing if I recall correctly you gain your first level into the template and agin some fo the abilites ( I think some skill bonus) along with the features for a lvl 1 character in that class. Then the next two levels you have to spend to advance as a draconic being. From there on you can advance your paladin some more or go for a half-dragon and take the rest of the class, which means your next few levels have to be in the racial class.

I believe the racial class works this way (I am away from my book, so this is from memory): For a Draconic Human Paladin would have the benefits of a 1st level Paladin and a Level 1 Draconic as a 1st level character. I say this because the 1st level of the Draconic class has only minor abilities that are not worth a level alone, it is a 4 level class that increases the LA of the creature by 3 and the class doesn't provide any HD.

At level 2 the character must take the 2nd level of the Draconic class, but can stop after that and level up as Paladin. At some later point the Draconic template can be upgraded to the Half-Dragon template by taking levels 3 & 4 of the racial class (once level 3 is taken then the 4th level must be next).

I don't think a racial class prohibited by the Paladin's multiclass restriction, but I am not sure.
Warforged Goblin
03-29-07, 02:31 PM I don't think a racial class prohibited by the Paladin's multiclass restriction, but I am not sure.

You are completely correct all around. In addition, racial character levels, and paragon class levels, never count towards multiclassing or restrict taking other classes.
JulesCARV
03-29-07, 02:34 PM Phrenic dragonborn incarnate construct warforged saint.

I think that that comes out to LA +2, total.
Frugal
03-29-07, 02:36 PM Just as a follow-up, it's coming back to me that the racial class for the draconic template was a way to progress and gradually become a half-dragon. If memory serves, you don't take both the draconic template and the classes, it's a way to start at level 1 and work up and gradually gain abilities and apply the LA instead of taking the hit all at once.
Darth Sephiroth
03-29-07, 07:13 PM Yeah, the Draconic Lesser Aasimaar has the Dragonblood subtype which gives you a lot of fun things to play with if you glance through the dragonblood substitution levels. Plus I think you end up with a +4 or more to charisma out of it.
Konor
03-30-07, 02:46 PM I checked things up and Draconic Lesser Aasimar without any racial levels is even too strong. For LA +1 I have +2 str +2 con +2 wis +4 cha, NA +1 and all aasimar things only except charm resistances. Well, it follows the rules.
Darth Sephiroth
03-31-07, 12:03 AM I checked things up and Draconic Lesser Aasimar without any racial levels is even too strong. For LA +1 I have +2 str +2 con +2 wis +4 cha, NA +1 and all aasimar things only except charm resistances. Well, it follows the rules.

It also adds the Dragonblooded subtype which gives other fun things to play with
Konor
03-31-07, 04:31 PM Strange thing... I thought my DM won't allow me to play this guy. But he suprised me by saying this "Well, I will allow you to be a munchkin, but this time I create my own campaign and I will be a DM-munchkin, too. If you do I will do same."
He evolves. When he created self-made campaign last time he just allowed me to use teamplates like half-dragon, or half-celestial. "I create it, so you guys need to be powerful."
This time it sounded like future-bloodbath.
Darth Sephiroth
03-31-07, 06:18 PM Well there is the Celestial birth option to make it even more powerful by regaining your Outsider status. There are also the Outsider Wings that let you fly again
Optimator
03-31-07, 06:19 PM I always dug the Human Saint.
Konor
04-01-07, 01:12 PM Darth Sephiroth, where I can find this Celestial Birth guy? Any book?
The_Shaman
04-01-07, 03:54 PM I think ordinary draconic races should do quite well. It's among the better combat +1 templates. Draconic human should still get the bonus feat and skill points, and paladins can definitely use more of either.
Templario
04-02-07, 09:26 AM Just as a follow-up, it's coming back to me that the racial class for the draconic template was a way to progress and gradually become a half-dragon. If memory serves, you don't take both the draconic template and the classes, it's a way to start at level 1 and work up and gradually gain abilities and apply the LA instead of taking the hit all at once.

You're not obligated to follow the progression, Draconic is a template in its own (Draconomicon has the same template applied to a bugbear or something like it). Buut you can follow the progression if you wish
MagicMouth
04-02-07, 01:26 PM Half-Vampire from Libris Mortis.

+2 Str, +2 Dex, +2 Cha. Damage Reduction, Fast Healing, Resistances and Charm Gaze are nice, and you get some other abilities as well. All for +2 LA. Probably best for a more skillful paladin (like somenone with the Shadowbane Inquisitor PrC), but still useful for most.
Frugal
04-02-07, 01:46 PM You're not obligated to follow the progression, Draconic is a template in its own (Draconomicon has the same template applied to a bugbear or something like it). Buut you can follow the progression if you wish

Right, but what I meant was that the progression is an alternate way to acquire the template, if you wanted to spread it over several levels and start at level 1. But if you were starting at a higher level with the template, you couldn't then take the progression because you already have the template, it's an either/or option.

Although you could maybe start at a higher level and pick up the progression at the point where you have the draconic template and continue on the progression to earn the half-dragon template.....
InsanePsychoRabbit
04-02-07, 03:29 PM Half-Vampire from Libris Mortis.

+2 Str, +2 Dex, +2 Cha. Damage Reduction, Fast Healing, Resistances and Charm Gaze are nice, and you get some other abilities as well. All for +2 LA. Probably best for a more skillful paladin (like somenone with the Shadowbane Inquisitor PrC), but still useful for most.
You mean like Blade?

Actually, IMO, that template works really well from both a mechanical and roleplaying standpoint, and it doesn't scream munchkinism the way some other suggestions have. (On a semi-related note, I had an angsty half-vampire ranger/fighter/sworn slayer specializing in vampires for a while and I really liked him.)

Konor, trust me, you do not want a DM munchkin. I have had two so far, and it isn't fun.
Konor
04-04-07, 09:04 AM Yeah... At last he didn't allowed me to use Lesser Aasimar. But I've found fun things in Dragon Magazine. Half-Undead. For example one of them (Death-Touched) have nice ability modificators. -2 con +2 wis +4 cha plus Chill Touch once/day per your HD. LA +1. But I am still searching it.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Konor 03-28-07, 12:32 PM	Well, aasimar isn't good enough. With it's LA +1 he could be more powerfull. I look for anything which can give me some bonuses to strength, constitution and charisma. Maybe some penalties to dexterity. It could also use some natural armor or other nice stuff, maybe wisdom. I want it to look like this: +4 str -2 dex +4 con +4 cha LA +2 Half-Celestial teamplate looks great, I can say that it is even a bit too powerfull for LA +4, I really like it. But this +4 is too much. Something between aasimar and half-celestial would be really great. Any changes in actual races/teamplates aren't involved. My GM just do not agree, bastard.
Jaxgaret 03-28-07, 12:44 PM	Well, aasimar isn't good enough. With it's LA +1 he could be more powerfull. I look for anything which can give me some bonuses to strength, constitution and charisma. Maybe some penalties to dexterity. It could also use some natural armor or other nice stuff, maybe wisdom. I want it to look like this: +4 str -2 dex +4 con +4 cha LA +2 Half-Celestial teamplate looks great, I can say that it is even a bit too powerfull for LA +4, I really like it. But this +4 is too much. Something between aasimar and half-celestial would be really great. Any changes in actual races/teamplates aren't involved. My GM just do not agree, bastard. How's +2 Str, +2 Con, +2 Cha, NA +1, and some other nice bonuses for +1 LA? Draconic Template, from Races of the Dragon or Draconomicon. Make a Draconic Goliath for more Str and Con and Powerful Build for a total LA +2.
Warforged Goblin 03-28-07, 01:06 PM	Or, for a +1 LA, draconic gold dwarf. Gold dwarf: +2 Con, -2 Dex Draconic: +2 Str, +2 Con, +2 Cha An overall net of +2 Str, +4 Con, -2 Dex, and +2 Cha "This is my paladin, Sir Tanksalot..." Edit: Sorry Jax. For some reason I thought you meant a DRAGONBORN goliath. Yeah, regardless of race, the draconic template seems the way to go...
Argaud 03-28-07, 01:06 PM	If you don't mind a -2 to Con the half-fey template is LA+2 and gives you +2 dex, +2 wis and +4 cha. Flight. Immunity to enchantment. A lot of slas and quite a fair bit of minor, useful abilities. Details here: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20040213a
Finfreeze 03-28-07, 01:20 PM	Let's see what I can come up with (all LA +2)... Feral Catfolk: +4 Str, +2 Dex, +2 Con, -4 Int, +2 Wis, +2 Cha Draconic Catfolk: +2 Str, +4 Dex, +2 Con, +4 Cha Phrenic Water Orc: +4 Str, +2 Con, +2 Cha Draconic Feytouched Water Orc: +6 Str, +2 Dex, +2 Con, -2 Int, -2 Wis, +2 Cha (can you have a draconic dragonborn feytouched water orc? Then you could have +4 Con) Draconic Feral Water Halfling: +4 Str, +4 Con, -4 Int, +2 Wis, +2 Cha Phrenic Earth Dwarf: +2 Str, -2 Dex, +2 Con, +2 Int, +2 Wis, +2 Cha Draconic Feytouched Desert Half-Orc: +2 Str, +2 Dex, +2 Con, -2 Int, +4 Cha Uh, I tried.
Konor 03-28-07, 03:10 PM	Thanks guys. Nicely done. Well, I will play draconic draconic human. +4 str +4 con +4 cha LA +2 Muahhahaa..
Grod_The_Giant 03-28-07, 03:27 PM	If your DM allows the 2 racial HD=+1 LA trade, then you might be able to use Lizardfolk. +2 Strength, +2 Constitution, -2 Intelligence. +4 racial bonus on Balance, Jump, and Swim checks. +5 natural armor bonus. Natural Weapons: 2 claws (1d4) and bite (1d4). Special Qualities (see above): Hold breath.
jokey665 03-28-07, 03:27 PM	Saint. Topic over.
Konor 03-28-07, 03:32 PM	I can ask him. But draconic looks quite well.
Ovistavin 03-28-07, 07:06 PM	Thanks guys. Nicely done. Well, I will play draconic draconic human. +4 str +4 con +4 cha LA +2 Muahhahaa.. I think this is a joke, but in case it isn't. You do realize that by the rules you can't apply any template more than once (there are a few exceptions). Also in Races of the Dragon there is a racial class you can use to upgrade the Draconic template to the Half-Dragon template. You don't have to do this right away, but once you start you have to finish it. It's only 2 levels, but those levels will increase your LA by 2.
Darth Sephiroth 03-28-07, 07:32 PM	Draconic Lesser Aasimaar could be a nice plaything for you to use.
Jaxgaret 03-28-07, 07:38 PM	Draconic Lesser Aasimaar could be a nice plaything for you to use. Say Cheese! But yeah, that would be pretty much optimal.
Nat_20 03-28-07, 07:41 PM	I like the idea of a Drow Paladin... Would people would be racist against a Drow, even though your a Champion of good?
Jaxgaret 03-28-07, 08:30 PM	I like the idea of a Drow Paladin... Would people would be racist against a Drow, even though your a Champion of good? I know! I know the answer to this question! ... oh wait, I don't. Because it is campaign-specific and your DM is the ultimate arbiter of such decisions.
Konor 03-29-07, 09:44 AM	My favourite idea is Draconic Lesser Aasimar. And the thing about class which increases Draconic teaplate. Can I take the 2 levels in it and return to paladin? I guess not. Or I am wrong?
runestar 03-29-07, 09:57 AM	I quite like feytouched or half-fey, but some of their SLAs might be hard to justify for a paladin, RP wise.:(
obrysii 03-29-07, 09:58 AM	Draconic Merfolk. LA +2 Str +2, Dex +2, Con +4, Cha +4 Draconic Catfolk. LA +2 Str +2, Dex +4, Con +2, Cha +4
Frugal 03-29-07, 10:00 AM	My favourite idea is Draconic Lesser Aasimar. And the thing about class which increases Draconic teaplate. Can I take the 2 levels in it and return to paladin? I guess not. Or I am wrong? I'd have to look at the template but you can probably take them as your first levels and then enter the Paladin class.
kyros_the_spawnslayer 03-29-07, 10:07 AM	For the draconic class thing if I recall correctly you gain your first level into the template and agin some fo the abilites ( I think some skill bonus) along with the features for a lvl 1 character in that class. Then the next two levels you have to spend to advance as a draconic being. From there on you can advance your paladin some more or go for a half-dragon and take the rest of the class, which means your next few levels have to be in the racial class.
Steely_Dan 03-29-07, 10:11 AM	Saint. Topic over. Yep, that template is sick for LA +2. But getting your DM to allow it, or allowing you to qualify for it…
Silverthumb128 03-29-07, 10:15 AM	Draconic Spark Aasimar: +2 Str, +2 Con, +6 Cha, net +2 LA
Jaxgaret 03-29-07, 11:05 AM	Yep, that template is sick for LA +2. But getting your DM to allow it, or allowing you to qualify for it… IIRC there are steep requirements to qualify for the Saint template (several exalted feats perhaps?). You can't just take it, like other templates.
feraltibbit 03-29-07, 11:20 AM	Well, aasimar isn't good enough. With it's LA +1 he could be more powerfull. I look for anything which can give me some bonuses to strength, constitution and charisma. Maybe some penalties to dexterity. It could also use some natural armor or other nice stuff, maybe wisdom. I want it to look like this: +4 str -2 dex +4 con +4 cha LA +2 Half-Celestial teamplate looks great, I can say that it is even a bit too powerfull for LA +4, I really like it. But this +4 is too much. Something between aasimar and half-celestial would be really great. Any changes in actual races/teamplates aren't involved. My GM just do not agree, bastard. Just go with the Dragonborn Template in Races of the Dragon; no ECL, pick-n-choose, worship Bahamut, LG. 2 EZ:D !
Ovistavin 03-29-07, 02:15 PM	For the draconic class thing if I recall correctly you gain your first level into the template and agin some fo the abilites ( I think some skill bonus) along with the features for a lvl 1 character in that class. Then the next two levels you have to spend to advance as a draconic being. From there on you can advance your paladin some more or go for a half-dragon and take the rest of the class, which means your next few levels have to be in the racial class. I believe the racial class works this way (I am away from my book, so this is from memory): For a Draconic Human Paladin would have the benefits of a 1st level Paladin and a Level 1 Draconic as a 1st level character. I say this because the 1st level of the Draconic class has only minor abilities that are not worth a level alone, it is a 4 level class that increases the LA of the creature by 3 and the class doesn't provide any HD. At level 2 the character must take the 2nd level of the Draconic class, but can stop after that and level up as Paladin. At some later point the Draconic template can be upgraded to the Half-Dragon template by taking levels 3 & 4 of the racial class (once level 3 is taken then the 4th level must be next). I don't think a racial class prohibited by the Paladin's multiclass restriction, but I am not sure.
Warforged Goblin 03-29-07, 02:31 PM	I don't think a racial class prohibited by the Paladin's multiclass restriction, but I am not sure. You are completely correct all around. In addition, racial character levels, and paragon class levels, never count towards multiclassing or restrict taking other classes.
JulesCARV 03-29-07, 02:34 PM	Phrenic dragonborn incarnate construct warforged saint. I think that that comes out to LA +2, total.
Frugal 03-29-07, 02:36 PM	Just as a follow-up, it's coming back to me that the racial class for the draconic template was a way to progress and gradually become a half-dragon. If memory serves, you don't take both the draconic template and the classes, it's a way to start at level 1 and work up and gradually gain abilities and apply the LA instead of taking the hit all at once.
Darth Sephiroth 03-29-07, 07:13 PM	Yeah, the Draconic Lesser Aasimaar has the Dragonblood subtype which gives you a lot of fun things to play with if you glance through the dragonblood substitution levels. Plus I think you end up with a +4 or more to charisma out of it.
Konor 03-30-07, 02:46 PM	I checked things up and Draconic Lesser Aasimar without any racial levels is even too strong. For LA +1 I have +2 str +2 con +2 wis +4 cha, NA +1 and all aasimar things only except charm resistances. Well, it follows the rules.
Darth Sephiroth 03-31-07, 12:03 AM	I checked things up and Draconic Lesser Aasimar without any racial levels is even too strong. For LA +1 I have +2 str +2 con +2 wis +4 cha, NA +1 and all aasimar things only except charm resistances. Well, it follows the rules. It also adds the Dragonblooded subtype which gives other fun things to play with
Konor 03-31-07, 04:31 PM	Strange thing... I thought my DM won't allow me to play this guy. But he suprised me by saying this "Well, I will allow you to be a munchkin, but this time I create my own campaign and I will be a DM-munchkin, too. If you do I will do same." He evolves. When he created self-made campaign last time he just allowed me to use teamplates like half-dragon, or half-celestial. "I create it, so you guys need to be powerful." This time it sounded like future-bloodbath.
Darth Sephiroth 03-31-07, 06:18 PM	Well there is the Celestial birth option to make it even more powerful by regaining your Outsider status. There are also the Outsider Wings that let you fly again
Optimator 03-31-07, 06:19 PM	I always dug the Human Saint.
Konor 04-01-07, 01:12 PM	Darth Sephiroth, where I can find this Celestial Birth guy? Any book?
The_Shaman 04-01-07, 03:54 PM	I think ordinary draconic races should do quite well. It's among the better combat +1 templates. Draconic human should still get the bonus feat and skill points, and paladins can definitely use more of either.
Templario 04-02-07, 09:26 AM	Just as a follow-up, it's coming back to me that the racial class for the draconic template was a way to progress and gradually become a half-dragon. If memory serves, you don't take both the draconic template and the classes, it's a way to start at level 1 and work up and gradually gain abilities and apply the LA instead of taking the hit all at once. You're not obligated to follow the progression, Draconic is a template in its own (Draconomicon has the same template applied to a bugbear or something like it). Buut you can follow the progression if you wish
MagicMouth 04-02-07, 01:26 PM	Half-Vampire from Libris Mortis. +2 Str, +2 Dex, +2 Cha. Damage Reduction, Fast Healing, Resistances and Charm Gaze are nice, and you get some other abilities as well. All for +2 LA. Probably best for a more skillful paladin (like somenone with the Shadowbane Inquisitor PrC), but still useful for most.
Frugal 04-02-07, 01:46 PM	You're not obligated to follow the progression, Draconic is a template in its own (Draconomicon has the same template applied to a bugbear or something like it). Buut you can follow the progression if you wish Right, but what I meant was that the progression is an alternate way to acquire the template, if you wanted to spread it over several levels and start at level 1. But if you were starting at a higher level with the template, you couldn't then take the progression because you already have the template, it's an either/or option. Although you could maybe start at a higher level and pick up the progression at the point where you have the draconic template and continue on the progression to earn the half-dragon template.....
InsanePsychoRabbit 04-02-07, 03:29 PM	Half-Vampire from Libris Mortis. +2 Str, +2 Dex, +2 Cha. Damage Reduction, Fast Healing, Resistances and Charm Gaze are nice, and you get some other abilities as well. All for +2 LA. Probably best for a more skillful paladin (like somenone with the Shadowbane Inquisitor PrC), but still useful for most. You mean like Blade? Actually, IMO, that template works really well from both a mechanical and roleplaying standpoint, and it doesn't scream munchkinism the way some other suggestions have. (On a semi-related note, I had an angsty half-vampire ranger/fighter/sworn slayer specializing in vampires for a while and I really liked him.) Konor, trust me, you do not want a DM munchkin. I have had two so far, and it isn't fun.
Konor 04-04-07, 09:04 AM	Yeah... At last he didn't allowed me to use Lesser Aasimar. But I've found fun things in Dragon Magazine. Half-Undead. For example one of them (Death-Touched) have nice ability modificators. -2 con +2 wis +4 cha plus Chill Touch once/day per your HD. LA +1. But I am still searching it.