What book are half-ogres from? [Archive] - Wizards Community

What book are half-ogres from? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
FrostHammer
12-01-07, 04:03 PM I can't find it in the monster manuals. Anyone know?
IdleAltruism
12-01-07, 04:13 PM Races of Destiny
Sargent
12-01-07, 04:15 PM or Savage Species pg217
IdleAltruism
12-01-07, 04:27 PM or Savage Species pg217

3.0 doesn't have correct information. Savage puts them at LA+1, but they are LA+2
FrostHammer
12-01-07, 07:27 PM How much would an item cost if its magical function is to Enlarge a non-humanoid creature? I.E letting a half-ogre become larger? Trying to see if playing a half-ogre is worth it.
Kobold_Avenger
12-02-07, 05:12 PM 3.0 doesn't have correct information. Savage puts them at LA+1, but they are LA+2
No, SS was corect until the +2 versions came out. Or was there Errata that came out after words that said it was +2?
Ecalsneerg
12-03-07, 12:44 PM No, SS was corect until the +2 versions came out.

Arguably, you just disproved your own point.
HARLEYDUDE
12-03-07, 05:15 PM How much would an item cost if its magical function is to Enlarge a non-humanoid creature? I.E letting a half-ogre become larger? Trying to see if playing a half-ogre is worth it.

I'm sorry that I dont have it in front of me, but I play a orog.(basically an underdark ogre. I have a belt of growth from the Magic Item Compendium. I believe it was about 2500gp. My DM hepled me get a belt of Growth with 3 charges per day instead of 1, and i think (again my memory) it was obout 10500 gp or 12000 gp.
I ll check tonight and hopefully get back to you tomorrow.

HD
BugHunter
12-03-07, 08:13 PM I'm sorry that I dont have it in front of me, but I play a orog.(basically an underdark ogre. I have a belt of growth from the Magic Item Compendium. I believe it was about 2500gp. My DM hepled me get a belt of Growth with 3 charges per day instead of 1, and i think (again my memory) it was obout 10500 gp or 12000 gp.
I ll check tonight and hopefully get back to you tomorrow.

HD

According to Races of Faerun the orog is a deep orc not an ogre.

For the OP,

I agree that the belt of growth (3000gp) is the way to go. This will work for a half-orge since it states "As if affected by an enlarge person."
Count Arioch the 28th
12-03-07, 09:48 PM The half ogre was correct in Savage Species at +1 LA. It's not a LA +2 race.
HARLEYDUDE
12-04-07, 11:42 AM According to Races of Faerun the orog is a deep orc not an ogre.

For the OP,

I agree that the belt of growth (3000gp) is the way to go. This will work for a half-orge since it states "As if affected by an enlarge person."

Yep "deep orc" i always get thoses mixed up! thanks bughunter

also thanks for looking up the belt. our game got cancelled last night and I didnt have a chance to look.
HD
Argaud
12-04-07, 03:41 PM How much would an item cost if its magical function is to Enlarge a non-humanoid creature? I.E letting a half-ogre become larger? Trying to see if playing a half-ogre is worth it.
There is not any item that will allow you to do that.

However, there is a feat to turn a half-ogre (giant) into a half-ogre (human) which is an humanoid. It is in Races of Destiny too. Since humanoids can be enlarged you can have a huge half-ogre. It also gives you a few skill points. But now you are also vulnerable to charm person, hold person, dominate person, etc.
zook1shoe666
12-04-07, 11:17 PM The half ogre was correct in Savage Species at +1 LA. It's not a LA +2 race.

the official WotC half-ogre is +2 LA, both in the errata for the SS and in the RoD.
Count Arioch the 28th
12-05-07, 02:18 PM the official WotC half-ogre is +2 LA, both in the errata for the SS and in the RoD.

I am aware the official errata says it's LA +2. I'm saying that WotC is wrong, and that the half ogre was correct at LA +1.
Orenmir
12-05-07, 03:25 PM I am aware the official errata says it's LA +2. I'm saying that WotC is wrong, and that the half ogre was correct at LA +1.

Pass whatever it is you're smokin'.

Let's compare:

GOLIATH
Powerful Build
Str +4
Dex -2
Con +2

HALF_OGRE
Large Size
Str +6
Dex -2
Con +2
Int -2
Cha -2
Natural Armor +4

Yeah, those are equal!

The stat adjustments might be equal; but, the upgrade from PB to Large and NA +0 to +4 completely warrants an LA boost from +1 to +2.
Kadasbrass
12-05-07, 03:28 PM I am aware the official errata says it's LA +2. I'm saying that WotC is wrong, and that the half ogre was correct at LA +1.

They are a big too strong for LA 1, In addition to the ability scores you get 4 Natural AC I believe, reach of large, and the benefits of the Giant Type. However I do agree with the fact that it has room at LA for a bit more in it.
zook1shoe666
12-05-07, 03:33 PM They are a big too strong for LA 1, In addition to the ability scores you get 4 Natural AC I believe, reach of large, and the benefits of the Giant Type. However I do agree with the fact that it has room at LA for a bit more in it.

agreed, they are a low +2, but still a +2 nonetheless
Count Arioch the 28th
12-05-07, 11:44 PM Pass whatever it is you're smokin'.

Let's compare:

GOLIATH
Powerful Build
Str +4
Dex -2
Con +2

HALF_OGRE
Large Size
Str +6
Dex -2
Con +2
Int -2
Cha -2
Natural Armor +4

You are purposefully ignoring the other racials traits of the Goliath. That makes your argument irrelevant.
Kadasbrass
12-05-07, 11:58 PM You are purposefully ignoring the other racials traits of the Goliath. That makes your argument irrelevant.

Well when you get too it, the only traits he really ignored were the monsterous type and +2 sense motive, the other two traits they get in addition to that rarely come into play. He also ignored the other benefit of the half-ogre which is the giant type.
Orenmir
12-06-07, 10:02 AM You are purposefully ignoring the other racials traits of the Goliath. That makes your argument irrelevant.

Please, bring to light these traits which make the Goliath and Half-Ogre stand toe to toe and make your argument relevant. While you're at it, please make your argument, in general, about why they are equal or why the Half-Ogre should be LA +1.
AtsuiShoto
12-07-07, 08:30 AM Perhaps in the Iron Kingdoms the half-ogre would be a comfortable +1 LA race, but that's only because it would be compared against the ogrun. Given that various d20 products are built on varying default assumptions, I could see where the confusion may come from. D&D, however, is not the Iron Kingdoms; its defaults are balanced differently. By the D&D defaults, a Large creature should almost always have a +2 LA, particularly when it has +6 Strength and +4 NA. Each of these three traits is not potent enough to warrant +2 LA alone, but they are all in the +2 LA territory (essentially, none of them should be found in a +0 LA race, and they would stand out in a +1 LA race).

Don't get me wrong, I like challenging the defaults with things like +0 LA Large races or races with 1000 XP and a level of a specific class at start. Still, to ignore that the defaults exist puts your ideas on very shaky ground.
Mandarbgrim
12-07-07, 09:26 AM I was thinking that Enlarge Person didn't work on a Half-Ogre. It says it only affects humanoids. Strictly speaking a Giant isn't a Humanoid, correct?

As to the other argument, Half-Ogres certainly seem pretty bloody powerful for a +1 LA.
AtsuiShoto
12-07-07, 10:17 AM Giant =/= Humanoid =/= Monstrous Humanoid

Only Humanoid or Humanoid(subtype) qualifies as a Humanoid. This is why I like to take a manifesting class and use those points toward Expansion, which DOES affect non-humanoids.
Qube
12-07-07, 01:15 PM strange, I thoughed half-ogres came from the expanded psionics handbook ...
HernetheHunter
12-07-07, 01:26 PM that would be Half-Giant.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
FrostHammer 12-01-07, 04:03 PM	I can't find it in the monster manuals. Anyone know?
IdleAltruism 12-01-07, 04:13 PM	Races of Destiny
Sargent 12-01-07, 04:15 PM	or Savage Species pg217
IdleAltruism 12-01-07, 04:27 PM	or Savage Species pg217 3.0 doesn't have correct information. Savage puts them at LA+1, but they are LA+2
FrostHammer 12-01-07, 07:27 PM	How much would an item cost if its magical function is to Enlarge a non-humanoid creature? I.E letting a half-ogre become larger? Trying to see if playing a half-ogre is worth it.
Kobold_Avenger 12-02-07, 05:12 PM	3.0 doesn't have correct information. Savage puts them at LA+1, but they are LA+2 No, SS was corect until the +2 versions came out. Or was there Errata that came out after words that said it was +2?
Ecalsneerg 12-03-07, 12:44 PM	No, SS was corect until the +2 versions came out. Arguably, you just disproved your own point.
HARLEYDUDE 12-03-07, 05:15 PM	How much would an item cost if its magical function is to Enlarge a non-humanoid creature? I.E letting a half-ogre become larger? Trying to see if playing a half-ogre is worth it. I'm sorry that I dont have it in front of me, but I play a orog.(basically an underdark ogre. I have a belt of growth from the Magic Item Compendium. I believe it was about 2500gp. My DM hepled me get a belt of Growth with 3 charges per day instead of 1, and i think (again my memory) it was obout 10500 gp or 12000 gp. I ll check tonight and hopefully get back to you tomorrow. HD
BugHunter 12-03-07, 08:13 PM	I'm sorry that I dont have it in front of me, but I play a orog.(basically an underdark ogre. I have a belt of growth from the Magic Item Compendium. I believe it was about 2500gp. My DM hepled me get a belt of Growth with 3 charges per day instead of 1, and i think (again my memory) it was obout 10500 gp or 12000 gp. I ll check tonight and hopefully get back to you tomorrow. HD According to Races of Faerun the orog is a deep orc not an ogre. For the OP, I agree that the belt of growth (3000gp) is the way to go. This will work for a half-orge since it states "As if affected by an enlarge person."
Count Arioch the 28th 12-03-07, 09:48 PM	The half ogre was correct in Savage Species at +1 LA. It's not a LA +2 race.
HARLEYDUDE 12-04-07, 11:42 AM	According to Races of Faerun the orog is a deep orc not an ogre. For the OP, I agree that the belt of growth (3000gp) is the way to go. This will work for a half-orge since it states "As if affected by an enlarge person." Yep "deep orc" i always get thoses mixed up! thanks bughunter also thanks for looking up the belt. our game got cancelled last night and I didnt have a chance to look. HD
Argaud 12-04-07, 03:41 PM	How much would an item cost if its magical function is to Enlarge a non-humanoid creature? I.E letting a half-ogre become larger? Trying to see if playing a half-ogre is worth it. There is not any item that will allow you to do that. However, there is a feat to turn a half-ogre (giant) into a half-ogre (human) which is an humanoid. It is in Races of Destiny too. Since humanoids can be enlarged you can have a huge half-ogre. It also gives you a few skill points. But now you are also vulnerable to charm person, hold person, dominate person, etc.
zook1shoe666 12-04-07, 11:17 PM	The half ogre was correct in Savage Species at +1 LA. It's not a LA +2 race. the official WotC half-ogre is +2 LA, both in the errata for the SS and in the RoD.
Count Arioch the 28th 12-05-07, 02:18 PM	the official WotC half-ogre is +2 LA, both in the errata for the SS and in the RoD. I am aware the official errata says it's LA +2. I'm saying that WotC is wrong, and that the half ogre was correct at LA +1.
Orenmir 12-05-07, 03:25 PM	I am aware the official errata says it's LA +2. I'm saying that WotC is wrong, and that the half ogre was correct at LA +1. Pass whatever it is you're smokin'. Let's compare: GOLIATH Powerful Build Str +4 Dex -2 Con +2 HALF_OGRE Large Size Str +6 Dex -2 Con +2 Int -2 Cha -2 Natural Armor +4 Yeah, those are equal! The stat adjustments might be equal; but, the upgrade from PB to Large and NA +0 to +4 completely warrants an LA boost from +1 to +2.
Kadasbrass 12-05-07, 03:28 PM	I am aware the official errata says it's LA +2. I'm saying that WotC is wrong, and that the half ogre was correct at LA +1. They are a big too strong for LA 1, In addition to the ability scores you get 4 Natural AC I believe, reach of large, and the benefits of the Giant Type. However I do agree with the fact that it has room at LA for a bit more in it.
zook1shoe666 12-05-07, 03:33 PM	They are a big too strong for LA 1, In addition to the ability scores you get 4 Natural AC I believe, reach of large, and the benefits of the Giant Type. However I do agree with the fact that it has room at LA for a bit more in it. agreed, they are a low +2, but still a +2 nonetheless
Count Arioch the 28th 12-05-07, 11:44 PM	Pass whatever it is you're smokin'. Let's compare: GOLIATH Powerful Build Str +4 Dex -2 Con +2 HALF_OGRE Large Size Str +6 Dex -2 Con +2 Int -2 Cha -2 Natural Armor +4 You are purposefully ignoring the other racials traits of the Goliath. That makes your argument irrelevant.
Kadasbrass 12-05-07, 11:58 PM	You are purposefully ignoring the other racials traits of the Goliath. That makes your argument irrelevant. Well when you get too it, the only traits he really ignored were the monsterous type and +2 sense motive, the other two traits they get in addition to that rarely come into play. He also ignored the other benefit of the half-ogre which is the giant type.
Orenmir 12-06-07, 10:02 AM	You are purposefully ignoring the other racials traits of the Goliath. That makes your argument irrelevant. Please, bring to light these traits which make the Goliath and Half-Ogre stand toe to toe and make your argument relevant. While you're at it, please make your argument, in general, about why they are equal or why the Half-Ogre should be LA +1.
AtsuiShoto 12-07-07, 08:30 AM	Perhaps in the Iron Kingdoms the half-ogre would be a comfortable +1 LA race, but that's only because it would be compared against the ogrun. Given that various d20 products are built on varying default assumptions, I could see where the confusion may come from. D&D, however, is not the Iron Kingdoms; its defaults are balanced differently. By the D&D defaults, a Large creature should almost always have a +2 LA, particularly when it has +6 Strength and +4 NA. Each of these three traits is not potent enough to warrant +2 LA alone, but they are all in the +2 LA territory (essentially, none of them should be found in a +0 LA race, and they would stand out in a +1 LA race). Don't get me wrong, I like challenging the defaults with things like +0 LA Large races or races with 1000 XP and a level of a specific class at start. Still, to ignore that the defaults exist puts your ideas on very shaky ground.
Mandarbgrim 12-07-07, 09:26 AM	I was thinking that Enlarge Person didn't work on a Half-Ogre. It says it only affects humanoids. Strictly speaking a Giant isn't a Humanoid, correct? As to the other argument, Half-Ogres certainly seem pretty bloody powerful for a +1 LA.
AtsuiShoto 12-07-07, 10:17 AM	Giant =/= Humanoid =/= Monstrous Humanoid Only Humanoid or Humanoid(subtype) qualifies as a Humanoid. This is why I like to take a manifesting class and use those points toward Expansion, which DOES affect non-humanoids.
Qube 12-07-07, 01:15 PM	strange, I thoughed half-ogres came from the expanded psionics handbook ...
HernetheHunter 12-07-07, 01:26 PM	that would be Half-Giant.