Post/Author/DateTime	Post
MasonMurdoc 10-07-07, 04:48 AM	I was REALLY REALY bored, and was curious. Prophets: Elites: Brutes: Orcs Hunters: Jackels: Kobolds Grunts: Goblins Drones/Buggers: Um....Giant Wasps? Just post your opinion, an discuss it as you please. You can even take it off topic, as I couln't care less. Though, I' appreciate it if you gavee your opinion first.
Naderion 10-07-07, 06:08 AM	Ogre Mages could make good Elites: Tall, strong, intelligent, Lawful Evil, and they can make themself invisible. :D Hunters would maybe trolls, but it is a far stretch. Very strong, great damage, almost invincible, but with one fatal weakness. And prophets would of course be Mind Flayers or Aboleths. :D
MasonMurdoc 10-07-07, 06:13 AM	Ogre Mages could make good Elites: Tall, strong, intelligent, Lawful Evil, and they can make themself invisible. :D Hunters would maybe trolls, but it is a far stretch. Very strong, great damage, almost invincible, but with one fatal weakness. And prophets would of course be Mind Flayers or Aboleths. :D Awesome. Yay!!!
Darth Sephiroth 10-07-07, 09:16 AM	Brutes would work as Ogres considering their preference for massive weapons and the fact that they're bigger than the rest of the characters.
Naderion 10-07-07, 09:34 AM	Or Bugbears, these are not as dumb as ogres. Hobgoblins would make good elites too, if you give them a bunch of class levels as fighters and blackguards.
Return of the Flumph 10-07-07, 11:08 AM	Grunt: goblin Jackal: kobold Elite: hobgoblin Brute: bugbear Hunter: troll Drone: ? Prophet: illithid
Naderion 10-07-07, 11:22 AM	This goblin thing fits to perfectly... Maybe some of the designers were D&D players? :D
MasonMurdoc 10-07-07, 01:05 PM	Brutes would work as Ogres considering their preference for massive weapons and the fact that they're bigger than the rest of the characters. That could work,but they're large ar they not.I'd sy medium would suit them better, while Hunters are large. Or Bugbears, these are not as dumb as ogres. Hobgoblins would make good elites too, if you give them a bunch of class levels as fighters and blackguards. That definatly works. Elites are definatly lawful. Bugbears are big, bu not to big. I like. Grunt: goblin Jackal: kobold Elite: hobgoblin Brute: bugbear Hunter: troll Drone: ? Prophet: illithid Drones could be Spider Eaters. I'm no to keen on he trolls as hunters though, they just on' seem the part. EDIT: Crap, they're to stupid. I love the others though. Alternate ideas for Prophets, and Elites, are Dopplegangers, and Githyanki. Hobgoblins fit with the goblins an bug bears though. Gah! I'm tempted o use this, but it'll slowly estroy the brain cells of my players :S This goblin thing fits to perfectly... Maybe some of the designers were D&D players? :D Your right! haha! They're pretty much goblins with backpacks. Haha! Oh, and Orcs coul take the position of Brutes. They are quite similar. Orcs seem quite fuzzy in D&D. Gray Renders could make good Hunters physically, but everything about Gray Reners oesn' seem o nbe anything like Hunters.
HCL 10-07-07, 04:17 PM	protoss I mean plagiarism I mean what?
DonThelonious 10-07-07, 05:07 PM	Prophets: Illithid Elites: Flind Gnoll Brutes: 1/2 Ogres Hunters: Warforged Jackels: Kobolds Grunts: Goblins Drones/Buggers: Abiel (MM2) My brother and I agree, these are the D&D races that best represent the Covenant. :twocents: and a :cookie:
MasonMurdoc 10-07-07, 05:16 PM	Prophets: Illithid Elites: Flind Gnoll Brutes: 1/2 Ogres Hunters: Warforged Jackels: Kobolds Grunts: Goblins Drones/Buggers: Abiel (MM2) My brother and I agree, these are the D&D races that best represent the Covenant. :twocents: and a :cookie: Wow. I totally agree. Where might I find Flind Gnoll, and 1/2 Ogre? Those 2 cents, and cookie for me? :S
MasonMurdoc 10-07-07, 05:19 PM	protoss I mean plagiarism I mean what? Huh?
Johnny_Angel 10-07-07, 06:29 PM	Actually, Hunters are abberations as well. They look like big huge monsters, but they're actually a bunch of little worm-like creatures which connect together to make one large creature. I think there's an abberation in D&D which is similar, but I can't recall offhand what it's called. Grunts as Goblins and Elites as Hobgoblins would work pretty well. If you go this route it would probably make sense thematically to make Brutes be Bugbears; just remember that Brutes and Elites don't like each other. Mindflayers work pretty well for the Prophets; if you have the new MM, I'd suggest the Mindflayers of Thoon, but regular Mindflayers work just as well.
MasonMurdoc 10-07-07, 06:39 PM	Actually, Hunters are abberations as well. They look like big huge monsters, but they're actually a bunch of little worm-like creatures which connect together to make one large creature. I think there's an abberation in D&D which is similar, but I can't recall offhand what it's called. Grunts as Goblins and Elites as Hobgoblins would work pretty well. If you go this route it would probably make sense thematically to make Brutes be Bugbears; just remember that Brutes and Elites don't like each other. Mindflayers work pretty well for the Prophets; if you have the new MM, I'd suggest the Mindflayers of Thoon, but regular Mindflayers work just as well. Any idea what book this possible hunter might be in? If not I'll make a few changes to Warforged. I'm not sure about Bugbears as Brutes, they sneaky an stuff, while Orcs are steriotypically going into rages. I'll give them a once per day rage. Just to suit the part. I admit it'd be cool to ave the entire set of goblinoids, but I just don't hink Bugbears fit. Seeing as they clash at some point, causing the civil war. That would be MM5, correct? Is it possible to tell me why they suit prophets more than regular mindflaters, or is that closed content? Abiel seem a bit to big to be buggers, I'm pretty sure they're small
Hellsbells 10-07-07, 06:50 PM	I don't own the game but I've played it at my friends alot. Aren't elites lizardlike? The Arbiter is an elite right?
MasonMurdoc 10-07-07, 07:18 PM	I don't own the game but I've played it at my friends alot. Aren't elites lizardlike? The Arbiter is an elite right? Kinda. I did consider Lizard, but forgot to post my thoughts.
Johnny_Angel 10-07-07, 09:10 PM	Any idea what book this possible hunter might be in? If not I'll make a few changes to Warforged. I'm not sure about Bugbears as Brutes, they sneaky an stuff, while Orcs are steriotypically going into rages. I'll give them a once per day rage. Just to suit the part. I admit it'd be cool to ave the entire set of goblinoids, but I just don't hink Bugbears fit. Seeing as they clash at some point, causing the civil war. That would be MM5, correct? Is it possible to tell me why they suit prophets more than regular mindflaters, or is that closed content? Abiel seem a bit to big to be buggers, I'm pretty sure they're small I can't really go into detail about what's in MM5, suffice to say that the Thoon Flayers are a bit more "religious" than the regular Flayers. I'll look through my books and see if I can find the Hunter-esque creatures.
MasonMurdoc 10-07-07, 09:15 PM	I can't really go into detail about what's in MM5, suffice to say that the Thoon Flayers are a bit more "religious" than the regular Flayers. I'll look through my books and see if I can find the Hunter-esque creatures. Cool. Thanks.
Johnny_Angel 10-07-07, 09:28 PM	Hunters would be similar to the Tsochar. On a side note, Hunters were never conquered by the Covenant; the Covenant fought a war against the Hunters in which they were trying to invade the Hunter Homeworld and lost. The Hunters only joined the Covenant because they had no technology for space travel; the Hunters agreed to provide soldiers for the Covenant in exchange for the Covenant allowing the Hunters to use the Covenant means of travel. Although not exactly the same, I think Gravemind and The Flood could be recreated using an Aboleth and Skum. I'm actually trying to figure out how to do this one on my own. Elites are somewhat Lizardlike, but not exactly. I don't think that regular Lizardfolk would be quite smart enough to be Elites. It's not the best solution (and I know that not everyone has every book,) but Hobgoblins (or possibly Humans) with the Reptilian Template could work. Honestly, if you really wanted to -since you're considering using Flayers as Prophets- Githyanki or Githerazi could be used as Elites. The Master Chief (and other Spartans) would be humans who rolled extremely well for their stats (genetic manipulation) and have a few grafts (cybernetic implants.) The MJOLNIR armor would be created in D&D similar to how some people have created Samus's (from Metroid) Armor - by making it an intelligent magical item. I think you're right about Brutes not being Bugbears. Ogres would probably work, but Orcs may work as well; they're strong and not very smart. Grunts probably would be something similar to Goblins as has been said. I'm honestly unsure about Jackals. I suppose Kobolds might work, but I think Poison Dusk Lizardfolk might work better....I'm unsure though. Edit: Honestly, nearly any race you decide to use will probably work fine. The main thing that got me interested in Halo was -believe it or not- the story line; I think the Halo story would make an awesome D&D campaign. Heck, there have been times when I've wondered if the Eberron background story was influenced by Halo. The basic story is a mastermind alien entity invaded Earth on some crazy religious mission; they view Humans as a blasphemy against their religion and an obstacle they need to erradicate in order to achieve salvation...of course you find out that their religion is totally false, and the actual end result of what they plan to do will kill all life throughout the planes.
Killer_Rabbit 10-08-07, 01:43 AM	I was thinking about this the other day acturaly. And i think Orcs would be better Brutes. Perhaps bugbears could be elites? I mean their sneaky, but the again they don't have the rank and file feel of the hobgoblins. Drones could be maybe raptorions?(is that spelt right?) I read that the can fire while flying, and the would be the same size as drones.
Johnny_Angel 10-08-07, 01:47 AM	Elites are extremely rank and file. The different colors of armor on the elites denote rank; also, only nobles are allowed to use the plasma swords. They're warlike and (overal) fairly lawful. I suppose you could use Bugbears as Elites, but -if you're going to use a goblinoid race- I really think that Hobgoblins would more closely resemble elites.
MasonMurdoc 10-08-07, 04:42 AM	yeah, I definaly hink Orcs, are Brutes, and Hobgoblins are Elites. I was wondering about the energy sword. Could it be just the shape of it, which goes to the highest rank or something? Would you have it high ranking Hobgoblins, or Specia units of them, that has some kin of cloaking device, like a ring of invisibility?
Johnny_Angel 10-08-07, 03:14 PM	A ring of invisibility would probably work fine. You might be able to recreate the plasma sword by using a brilliant energy weapon. I think you have a good idea about the high ranking officers of the Hobgoblins (Elites) being given the sword; an easy way to do would be to treat it like a Bastard Sword and just describe it to be shaped the way the Elite Sword is shaped. Just give the high ranking officers of the Hobgoblins a bonus feat for Exotic Weapon: Bastard Sword and make their swords be brilliant energy weapons. It might not be exactly the same as a plasma sword, but it would be pretty close. One possible downfall though could be that your PCs might gain a very beneficial magical item before you intend for them to have such items, but that would be your call.
MasonMurdoc 10-08-07, 05:42 PM	A ring of invisibility would probably work fine. You might be able to recreate the plasma sword by using a brilliant energy weapon. I think you have a good idea about the high ranking officers of the Hobgoblins (Elites) being given the sword; an easy way to do would be to treat it like a Bastard Sword and just describe it to be shaped the way the Elite Sword is shaped. Just give the high ranking officers of the Hobgoblins a bonus feat for Exotic Weapon: Bastard Sword and make their swords be brilliant energy weapons. It might not be exactly the same as a plasma sword, but it would be pretty close. One possible downfall though could be that your PCs might gain a very beneficial magical item before you intend for them to have such items, but that would be your call. I was gonna go with Shock, but Brilliant Energy is alot better. If I use it, which I promised myself I wouldn't do, I'd keep Energy Swords away from them for a while. Hunters would be similar to the Tsochar. On a side note, Hunters were never conquered by the Covenant; the Covenant fought a war against the Hunters in which they were trying to invade the Hunter Homeworld and lost. The Hunters only joined the Covenant because they had no technology for space travel; the Hunters agreed to provide soldiers for the Covenant in exchange for the Covenant allowing the Hunters to use the Covenant means of travel. Although not exactly the same, I think Gravemind and The Flood could be recreated using an Aboleth and Skum. I'm actually trying to figure out how to do this one on my own. Elites are somewhat Lizardlike, but not exactly. I don't think that regular Lizardfolk would be quite smart enough to be Elites. It's not the best solution (and I know that not everyone has every book,) but Hobgoblins (or possibly Humans) with the Reptilian Template could work. Honestly, if you really wanted to -since you're considering using Flayers as Prophets- Githyanki or Githerazi could be used as Elites. The Master Chief (and other Spartans) would be humans who rolled extremely well for their stats (genetic manipulation) and have a few grafts (cybernetic implants.) The MJOLNIR armor would be created in D&D similar to how some people have created Samus's (from Metroid) Armor - by making it an intelligent magical item. I think you're right about Brutes not being Bugbears. Ogres would probably work, but Orcs may work as well; they're strong and not very smart. Grunts probably would be something similar to Goblins as has been said. I'm honestly unsure about Jackals. I suppose Kobolds might work, but I think Poison Dusk Lizardfolk might work better....I'm unsure though. Edit: Honestly, nearly any race you decide to use will probably work fine. The main thing that got me interested in Halo was -believe it or not- the story line; I think the Halo story would make an awesome D&D campaign. Heck, there have been times when I've wondered if the Eberron background story was influenced by Halo. The basic story is a mastermind alien entity invaded Earth on some crazy religious mission; they view Humans as a blasphemy against their religion and an obstacle they need to erradicate in order to achieve salvation...of course you find out that their religion is totally false, and the actual end result of what they plan to do will kill all life throughout the planes. Can't believe I missed this post. Where is the Tsocnar you speak of? Thats the kind of thing that makes me love hunters. I've been thinking of a Flood like creature for the campaign I do. I may check out the Halo thread in a bit. I'll alter them to my needs. I actually considered Githyanki. They could fill the roll farely well, 'cept they're mostly pirates. I'll read up on Githarazi in a sec. Using The Covenant as a cameo is a risky thing to do, but having a Spartan would not impress your players that much. Not mine anyway. How much would their CR, an LA go up if I gave them this: Natura Rage: When an Orc reaches exacly or below 25% HP they go into a bloodthirsty rage. This works like the Barbarian class ability. I have an idea for spike grenades if anyone cares. It involves rumble sticks which is like dynamite, and is dwarvern. Just stick spikes on and your good. Not sure if I can mention the book though as it's not WotC Wheres the Reptilian template?
Johnny_Angel 10-08-07, 07:01 PM	Savage Species has the Reptilian Template. I'm honestly unsure of where the Tsochar were first presented, but the book that I have in which they appear is Lords of Madness. I'm unsure about how the rage ability would change the CR and LA of Orcs. Adjusting CRs and LAs is probably something that other members of the board would be more skilled at. In my humble opinion, I don't think the CR would change very much, but I'd say the LA would become a +1....otherwise there would be no reason to play regular Orcs. As far as the cameo....the great thing about D&D is that you could probably have the "Covenant" make an appearance without the players knowing who or what they are supposed to be at first. You could use the same idea and just tweak a few details and make a few things look different. Something like a Spartan might be too over the top, but even that could possibly be disguised.
Return of the Flumph 10-08-07, 07:17 PM	Githyanki works quite well for the hobgoblins, but if you use that orcs will NOT work for brutes. Brutes are supposed to be somewhat more powerful than elites, and an orc does not in any way measure up to a githyanki. If you use hobgoblins for elites, orcs can be brutes. If you use githyanki, the brutes should be bugbears. Tsochari have a similar internal anatomy to the hunters, but are otherwise absolutely nothing like them. I really don't think there is an accurate hunter analogue in DnD. Trolls were just the closest thing I could think of. Interesting how someone mentioned Thoon for the prophets. When I first read the MM5, the first thing I thought when reading the Thoon entry was "holy crap, these guys remind me of the Flood."
Johnny_Angel 10-08-07, 07:32 PM	Githyanki works quite well for the hobgoblins, but if you use that orcs will NOT work for brutes. Brutes are supposed to be somewhat more powerful than elites, and an orc does not in any way measure up to a githyanki. If you use hobgoblins for elites, orcs can be brutes. If you use githyanki, the brutes should be bugbears. Tsochari have a similar internal anatomy to the hunters, but are otherwise absolutely nothing like them. I really don't think there is an accurate hunter analogue in DnD. Trolls were just the closest thing I could think of. Interesting how someone mentioned Thoon for the prophets. When I first read the MM5, the first thing I thought when reading the Thoon entry was "holy crap, these guys remind me of the Flood." I haven't read MM5 very much, so you probably have a better opinion on Thoon than I do. I agree that the choices for Elites and Brutes go hand in hand. If Elites = Hobgoblins then Brutes should = Orcs If Elites = Gith then Brutes should = Bugbears I think that Hobgoblins and Orcs for Elites and Covenant would work extremely well -especially if you're using Goblins for Grunts. The one thing to remember about Hunters is that the Hunter form is only one form of the little wormlike creatures which make up the "hunters." The main reason I mentioned the Tsochari is because they also have the ability to take "different forms" by wearing the flesh of other creatures; it's not a perfect analogue, but I think it would work; I also chose them because they are aberrations -which I thought would work well for a D&D version of Covenant. Like I said in a prior post though, you could use just about any collection of races to create a Covenant in D&D, the story line [and multiplayer] is the main thing which made the game a success.
Return of the Flumph 10-08-07, 07:45 PM	Covenant as Aberrations? Aside from the hunters, they seemed much more like (monstrous?) humanoids to me. The Flood are clearly aberrations.
Johnny_Angel 10-08-07, 08:14 PM	Covenant as Aberrations? Aside from the hunters, they seemed much more like (monstrous?) humanoids to me. The Flood are clearly aberrations. I only considered aberrations due to the fact that Covenant were aliens; aberrations in D&D are supposed to be alien to the material plane. Also, it was mentioned that Mind Flayers might be the prophets, so I was sticking with the somewhat alien heirarchy. My idea was to have the Flood simply be a different form of aberration. It's still an idea that I'm formulating, so I'm interested to hear other ideas as well. I suggested possibly an Aboleth (serving a similar role as Gravemind) with Skum (serving a similar role as the rest of the Flood.) Other thoughts I had were Yellow Musk zombies, but I didn't feel that they would be nearly intelligent enough nor coordinated enough. Another alternative idea I had was that the Prophets would be 3 Elder Brains working in conjuction with one another; Mind Flayers would be Elites, and the other races would be various other creatures which the Flayers and "Prophets" had conquered. Monstrous Humanoids would work as well though, and there are several races I could think of that would work using this vision.
MasonMurdoc 10-08-07, 08:30 PM	I'm gonna go with Orcs, and Hobgoblins. They fit with Goblins. Kobolds look similar to Jackels, thats what made me choose them. I may just take the Huners, and Drones from the Halo hread in the D20 Design section. Huners coud fit if you take away there fuel rod. Drones also coul fit farely well. You have bird people, why not bug peaple? I think this thread has beaten me into submission. I'm a bit of a cameo freak. I'm gonna disguise them alot though. I won't use the Energy, except of the head Hobgoblin. I was gonna have the Graviy Hammer, and only give it to the head Orc. THat could be a Sonic Greathammer, couldn't it? Certain terms will be changed, like "The Great Journey", to something like "The Eternal Light" or something cheesy like that. Nothing will be reffere to by there codename(Elites, Brutes, Hunters etc), as I never saw the point of them anyway, and it'd be a big give away. I don't suppose any of you know how to say Truth, Mercy, and REgret in Undercommon do you? I think this has been the easiest to disguise cameo I've ver considered using. The rage ability I mentioned wouldn't be a new Orc, just an adition to the existing one.
BaseDeltaZero 10-08-07, 08:51 PM	This is really, really silly. If you want it as a joke, that's one thing... I'm not a big fan of 'joke' campaigns. I'd rather just stat the Covenant all out. THat could be a Sonic Greathammer, couldn't it? Hardly. Maybe a greathammer that deals 20d8 (or more) sonic damage to all within 10' (except weilder). That thing hits hard. The Flood are clearly aberrations. Maybe. They could also be undead. I only considered aberrations due to the fact that Covenant were aliens; aberrations in D&D are supposed to be alien to the material plane. Also, it was mentioned that Mind Flayers might be the prophets, so I was sticking with the somewhat alien heirarchy. Well, the Covenant aren't alien to the material plane. The distinction of 'aberration' from everything else is arbitrary at best. It just seems to be a matter of how weird it is. If you want a joke, it's fine to go with existing stuff, but if you want to accurately represent the covenant, you need to stat everything from scratch. Also, the treasure should be a Warthog. I don't know why they'd have one, but Warthogs are awesome.
MasonMurdoc 10-08-07, 09:40 PM	This is really, really silly. If you want it as a joke, that's one thing... I'm not a big fan of 'joke' campaigns. I'd rather just stat the Covenant all out. Wow, that's really strange. When I saw I got a reply, I had a feeling it was negative criticism. I'm psychic. Awesome! To be honest I disagree with you about it only being good as a joke. Risky, but not a joke. Care to ellaborate why you feel that? Erm...I forgot how to spell ellaborae. O_o Hardly. Maybe a greathammer that deals 20d8 (or more) sonic damage to all within 10' (except weilder). That thing hits hard. True, it was pretty powerful, an was a pain in the keister on multiplayer. his is D&D though. It wouln' hurt to make it a tad sensible. Don't you agree? Maybe. They could also be undead. Maybe. I think abberation suits them more myself. I don't think anything could be used to use them, and Gravemind. I'd rather steal, and alter them from the Halo thread. Well, the Covenant aren't alien to the material plane. The distinction of 'aberration' from everything else is arbitrary at best. It just seems to be a matter of how weird it is. I agree. Humanoid-like races suit there roles better in my opinion. If you want a joke, it's fine to go with existing stuff, but if you want to accurately represent the covenant, you need to stat everything from scratch. Once again, I disagree with the joke thing. Just risky and needs to be done right. As for stating up he races myself. Pfft! Not likely. I'm a teenager. Exerting ourself damages our braincells...or...something. Huh? Also, the treasure should be a Warthog. I don't know why they'd have one, but Warthogs are awesome. Now who's being silly? Haha! True though. Warthogs kick booty. I can imagine it now, Rogue in the drivers seat, fighter on the turret, with the spellcaster launching fireballs from the side seat. Haha!!!!
Return of the Flumph 10-08-07, 10:18 PM	The gravity hammer is a Maul of the Titans with the sonic burst property added on. For the Flood, you should use either Tsochari (from Lords of Madness; they work much better for the Flood than they do for the Hunters) or the Mind Flayers of Thoon from MM5. Aboleth and skum have the creepiness down, but the fact that they are not parasites is a big flaw.
MasonMurdoc 10-08-07, 10:28 PM	The gravity hammer is a Maul of the Titans with the sonic burst property added on. For the Flood, you should use either Tsochari (from Lords of Madness; they work much better for the Flood than they do for the Hunters) or the Mind Flayers of Thoon from MM5. Aboleth and skum have the creepiness down, but the fact that they are not parasites is a big flaw. Where might I find this Maul of the Titans? I'll be sure to check out the Tsochari if I can get hold of the book. Oh, and what the heck is a Flumph?
Return of the Flumph 10-09-07, 12:07 AM	Where might I find this Maul of the Titans? I'll be sure to check out the Tsochari if I can get hold of the book. Oh, and what the heck is a Flumph? The Maul of the Titans is a magic item in the DMG. At least, it was in the 3E DMG...I think its in 3.5 as well. Check the SRD. A flumph is the ultimate DnD inside joke.
Johnny_Angel 10-09-07, 01:41 AM	I'm not sure why this campaign idea would be considered a joke, but oh well...to each their own. I think a campaign which was based somewhat on the Halo storyline would be a cool campaign. Just because something isn't a fantasy story or a fantasy game doesn't mean it can't be used to influence a fantasy game; I actually think it's good to look outside the traditional fantasy genre for inspiration. Heck, I'd play in a campaign based on Walker Texas Ranger as long as it was fun. Anyway, I'm glad someone started this thread because I got some feedback on a few ideas I had and got to hear some ideas that other people had. I had considered starting a Halo thread on my own, but I wasn't sure if it was something that would interest anyone else on the boards. Flumph, you've made some good points about the Tsochar being used as Flood; that probably would work well. The main reason I considered Aboleths is because they have the whole mastermind (Gravemind) thing going for them; even though they aren't parasites, they do create Skum by using living creatures. Tsochar definately are more parasitic though.
Return of the Flumph 10-09-07, 02:55 AM	You could say that aboleth and tsochar are the same species, with the aboleth developing from the fusion of several tsochar-infested creatures. Now boost the aboleth's intelligence a couple of points, and bam, Gravemind. One more thing, though; since Gravemind is supposed to be way more powerful than anything the Covenant can throw, using illithids as Prophets might not be a good idea if you use aboleths as gravemind. If you want to do the aboleth thing, I suggest you have your prophets be dopplegangers; much less powerful than mind flayers and aboleths, but still very smart, very crafty, and skilled at manipulating and controlling others.
Johnny_Angel 10-09-07, 03:38 AM	You could say that aboleth and tsochar are the same species, with the aboleth developing from the fusion of several tsochar-infested creatures. Now boost the aboleth's intelligence a couple of points, and bam, Gravemind. One more thing, though; since Gravemind is supposed to be way more powerful than anything the Covenant can throw, using illithids as Prophets might not be a good idea if you use aboleths as gravemind. If you want to do the aboleth thing, I suggest you have your prophets be dopplegangers; much less powerful than mind flayers and aboleths, but still very smart, very crafty, and skilled at manipulating and controlling others. Perhaps I should reverse my idea. The Prophets could be 3 Aboleths working together; controlling an army made up of various races. Mindflayers serving a powerful Elder Brain could play the role of Gravemind and the Flood.
MasonMurdoc 10-09-07, 04:48 AM	I did consider Dopplegangers, but Mindflayers seemed more Prophety. The thing about Halo is, I reckon he was actually inside every bit of it, all the way roun, so woud be F-ing huge. Garganuan's the biggest size catergory isn't it? Is there a gargantuan Aberation out there? EDIT: Another reason Dopplegangers, would be better prophets than Mindflayers, is that Mindflayers are aberrations themselves an no beter than he flood, except they don't have that whole hivemind thing going on. Dopplegangers on the other han, are just Monstrous Humanoids, so it doesn't seem as odd.
Naderion 10-09-07, 07:15 AM	You could also be a little bit creative. If you want to use aboleths as the flood, you could make that a cabal of aboleths once created a magical mutations of their normal scums that does sometimes or at the end of its life produce a mass of tiny parasits that infect new victims with the stuff that turns them into scums. Then they started a powerful magical ritual, that accidently or on purpose fused them together in one single creature and caused massive mutation and growth over centuries or millenia, resulting in one gigantic, immortal creature with the minds of a whole cabal of aboleths. In theory, there's the D&D size category C+. Following the size-progression, that would be creatures of up to 256 feet (80m) length and 128 feet (40 m) height. If still not massive enough you can make it even larger if you want. The PCs won't be able to seriously harm it anyway. :D
MasonMurdoc 10-09-07, 08:07 AM	You could also be a little bit creative. If you want to use aboleths as the flood, you could make that a cabal of aboleths once created a magical mutations of their normal scums that does sometimes or at the end of its life produce a mass of tiny parasits that infect new victims with the stuff that turns them into scums. Then they started a powerful magical ritual, that accidently or on purpose fused them together in one single creature and caused massive mutation and growth over centuries or millenia, resulting in one gigantic, immortal creature with the minds of a whole cabal of aboleths. In theory, there's the D&D size category C+. Following the size-progression, that would be creatures of up to 256 feet (80m) length and 128 feet (40 m) height. If still not massive enough you can make it even larger if you want. The PCs won't be able to seriously harm it anyway. :D Kind of stoppe meeing creative there didn't ya? haha. I like that idea, it's pretty cool. I think it would be best to stay away from Gravemind though.
MasonMurdoc 10-11-07, 02:23 PM	Hunters: They woul have to be Ogres or Trols I guess. I don't now much about them though. Drones: Nycter from MM3. They aren' much like them. They're little bat people.
Gazalem 10-11-07, 06:27 PM	Was the monster you were thinking of for the hunter a "worm that walks" it fits the profile a little but would be way to powerful. And i don't think any kind of mind flayer would be appropriate for a prophet they are supposed to be highly intelligent but completely unable to defend themselves without technology or another race protecting them.
Gazalem 10-11-07, 06:28 PM	Oh and i don't think raptorans would fit as drones they are a chaotic good people and have a sophisticated culture. drones are a hive society.
MasonMurdoc 10-11-07, 07:27 PM	Was the monster you were thinking of for the hunter a "worm that walks" it fits the profile a little but would be way to powerful. And i don't think any kind of mind flayer would be appropriate for a prophet they are supposed to be highly intelligent but completely unable to defend themselves without technology or another race protecting them. I didn't think much of the hunters being "walking worms", insead it would probably not to try to make it perfec but to use something that could fit there roll, like Ogres, or Trolls. Well, nearly every race ever created for D&D has ben able to hol it's own, so there isn't anything as frail as a prophet. They coul be a race thats mentally powerful, but phsically frail, but they usually have some kin of powerful ability that a mental skill ties to. Oh and i don't think raptorans would fit as drones they are a chaotic good people and have a sophisticated culture. drones are a hive society. Drones have always been a pain in the butt, wether its trying to shoot them, or trying to come up with a race that coul take there part. I hate buggers.
Johnny_Angel 10-12-07, 12:08 AM	I thought this Halo Themed video was cool: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-QfQWOkzV0
BaseDeltaZero 10-12-07, 04:02 AM	Mason Murdoc - I didn't mean to offend you. I just think that any campaign which featured the covenant, and yet was not HALO, would be quite transparent - maybe it's just because I'm obsessed, but I'd think I spot it for what it was ten minutes in, and thereafter be unable to take it seriously. Also, the shoe-horning of existing creatures into covenant roles seems to... add an element of parody to it. If it were obvious outright, it might actually be better, but with different creatures trying to behave like them, it'd be like all those movies that come out after a good one, trying to be just like it. Once again, I disagree with the joke thing. Just risky and needs to be done right. As for stating up he races myself. Pfft! Not likely. I'm a teenager. Exerting ourself damages our braincells...or...something. Huh? Eh. I'm a teenager, I've statted piles of stuff. Heck... I've actually statted warthogs and Sangheilli... (I actually did give my PCs a warthog in their current campaign - it's a modern campaign, and the item in question was found abandoned)
MasonMurdoc 10-12-07, 09:01 AM	I thought this Halo Themed video was cool: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-QfQWOkzV0 I wish my computer had sound :( Mason Murdoc - I didn't mean to offend you. I just think that any campaign which featured the covenant, and yet was not HALO, would be quite transparent - maybe it's just because I'm obsessed, but I'd think I spot it for what it was ten minutes in, and thereafter be unable to take it seriously. Also, the shoe-horning of existing creatures into covenant roles seems to... add an element of parody to it. If it were obvious outright, it might actually be better, but with different creatures trying to behave like them, it'd be like all those movies that come out after a good one, trying to be just like it. Your probably right, but I never had any intenion of using it, as tempting as it was. "I was just curious as to what could take the roles of each race. Eh. I'm a teenager, I've statted piles of stuff. Heck... I've actually statted warthogs and Sangheilli... (I actually did give my PCs a warthog in their current campaign - it's a modern campaign, and the item in question was found abandoned) Damn. I was hoping you'd all be over 20 so I could blame teenagerism. I really wanna be in a halo campaign now. *cries* I think a frien of mine is working on one, but I doubt it.
Naderion 10-12-07, 10:50 AM	I fact I think it's a remarkable inspiration. Everybody knows the orc hord and it gets old, but how to make a goblin horde, that's actually cool and not just a horde of deformed green garden gnomes. You can let the goblins be goblins and bugbears be bugbears, but if you put honor and duty into hobgoblins and make them strong warriors with some class levels, and all of a sudden you have a real and terrible army of goblinoids who still behave like goblinoids. If you make it like "a group of heroes lures a goblin warband away from a vulnerable city and discovers an anicient temble in the wild and it turns out it is full of tiny aberrations", then of course it would look like a parody for everyone who played halo. But the covenant certainly is an ispiration for cool monstrous armies and not just raging hordes.
MasonMurdoc 10-12-07, 12:20 PM	I fact I think it's a remarkable inspiration. Everybody knows the orc hord and it gets old, but how to make a goblin horde, that's actually cool and not just a horde of deformed green garden gnomes. You can let the goblins be goblins and bugbears be bugbears, but if you put honor and duty into hobgoblins and make them strong warriors with some class levels, and all of a sudden you have a real and terrible army of goblinoids who still behave like goblinoids. If you make it like "a group of heroes lures a goblin warband away from a vulnerable city and discovers an anicient temble in the wild and it turns out it is full of tiny aberrations", then of course it would look like a parody for everyone who played halo. But the covenant certainly is an ispiration for cool monstrous armies and not just raging hordes. Awesomely put. I was actually wondering how you would play them out if you chose to, but you just put it perfectly.
OrionArisen 10-12-07, 12:25 PM	I don't know...putting the Jackals as a Kobold strikes me as a tad...off beat. The Jackals are nothing like Kobolds sans the irrational hate of Grunts/Goblins.
Prime32 10-12-07, 02:41 PM	I think feral garguns (Races of Stone) would make good Brutes - they're Medium creatures with Powerful Build, a few Hit Dice and Natural Armour. I support hobgoblins for Elites.
MasonMurdoc 10-12-07, 08:55 PM	I don't know...putting the Jackals as a Kobold strikes me as a tad...off beat. The Jackals are nothing like Kobolds sans the irrational hate of Grunts/Goblins. They're the only thing that I could think of. What might you suggest? I think feral garguns (Races of Stone) would make good Brutes - they're Medium creatures with Powerful Build, a few Hit Dice and Natural Armour. I support hobgoblins for Elites. So they are. Tis a shame really. Orcs are cool. Feral Garguns take he role of Brutes then. Damn those Drones!!! Oh to make the profits frail, make them venerable(sp?) dopplegangers -6 in all traits can make you pretty frail. Maybe there shapeshifting capabilities are what they used to be either. Perhaps they coul be a spellcasting, or Psionic class. I'm sure they're pretty powerful mentally. Looks like going for the wormy style of hunters will have to be left out. Ogres could fill the role, and fit in with the selected races. Trolls coul to, but I on't like their pointy noses.