Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Ieniemienie 06-04-07, 09:48 AM	the title says it all... orcs have imbalanced ability scores: +4 Str, -2 Int, -2 Wis, -2 Cha and light sensitivity. on top of this they look awful and are considered savages. so why play one? If you like a nice strength bonus, play a goliath; have better ability scores and get powerful build for just LA 1. insights on this are highly appreciated.
M1kh43l_P4r4d1s0 06-04-07, 09:49 AM	roleplayability.
Templario 06-04-07, 09:53 AM	cuze orks SMASH puny elf!
Ogg 06-04-07, 09:54 AM	+0 level adjustment. There's very few +0 races that have +4 to any stat. That level really hurts a lot mroe then people first think. I agree, it's not the best race. They should really have at least orc double axe as a martial proficency added. Maybe battle axe or 2 handed axe as free weapon proficiencies as well (adding these to half-orc too) but then again, some people might just want to play them for flavor. Mind you the original monster races were not made to be played as PC's.
Ieniemienie 06-04-07, 10:01 AM	for flavor i like to fireball the orcs and watch their ugly bodies burn to dust, but that's just my thing... now i know where all those smoke clouds on the map come from :D
Millennium 06-04-07, 10:08 AM	For roleplayers: Because it's fun. For roll-players: Because it's a challenge. What else matters?
RobbyPants 06-04-07, 11:51 AM	I do agree that their special abilities are lacking (compared to other races), but as stated by Ogg, they're LA +0. Now, as half-orcs are weaker still, you bascially always choose an orc over a half-orc (mechanically speaking), unless you're a divine caster. As a general rule, a bonus on an ability score is stronger than the offset of the penalty. This is because you can try to pick an appropriate race for a specific class. One thing so many people cry about is how a Str bonus is so much stronger than a mental stat penalty (which is why the orc/half-orc stats are imbalanced). They think it's a sin to create a race with +2 Str/-2 Cha. However, take a look at a race with -2 Str/+2 Cha. It would make a fantastic sorcerer. The problem really lies in that a bonus is more powerful than an equivalent penalty. Very few combinations work to "cancel" eachother out. Perhaps a race with +2 Str/-2 Con would be more balanced (as nobody would want to play it except for archers :P). So, having a +4 Str will typically get you more milage then what you lose on your -2 Int/Wis/Cha. Obviously, orcs don't make great primary casters, but they're great fighters and barbarians, particularly at low levels, when these benifits really add up. If you manage to squeak by a natural 18 into your Str, you'll have a 22 (+6 mod). Now, you'll most likely be using a solid two-handed weapon (like a greatsword). That's 2d6+9 damage per attack (an average of 16 per hit) at level 1! That pretty much pwns anything CR-appropriate at those low levels. Of course, you're a bit of a one-trick pony at that point, and at higher levels, full casters will out-do you anyway ;)
Kursk 06-04-07, 01:39 PM	Why play an Orc? I don't know. They weren't designed as a PC race so the question is kinda mute.
Sul_Zain_Aserbet 06-04-07, 02:03 PM	+4 to strength at a +0 LA is pretty swanky for any martial class, and the penalties to offset that won't matter. That, combined with the fun of role-playing a big bad burly mean greenskin is pretty apealing. Melee choices like the goliath (or half-giant, a personal favorite of mine) are other good alternatives to playing an orc, if humans and demi-humans arent your thing. Couldn't tell ya if they are inferior choices. They might get pwned by an orc at lower levels.
dirkformica 06-04-07, 02:36 PM	Well, it's not really an answer to the question of standard Orcs, but a Dragonborn (Races of the Dragon) Water Orc (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/elementalRacialVariants.htm) would have +4 Str, +4 Con, -2 Dex, -2 Wis, -2 Int, -2 Cha, the Dragonborn features, and no light sensitivity. For a pure brawler with no LA that's not too bad. Also, on the light sensitivity thing, there are those sunglasses in a few books such as Races of the Dragon that eliminate the problem for like 10 gold.
Khatoblepas 06-04-07, 02:45 PM	Because they're pig faced and burly. And they are strong. And they have their own axe. (TIGER CLAW ORC DOUBLE AXE RAAAAAAAR!) And orcs are more awesome than gnomes. So why play a gnome? :P
AMGriffin 06-04-07, 02:52 PM	orcs have imbalanced ability scores: +4 Str, -2 Int, -2 Wis, -2 Cha and light sensitivity. That's true, which is why they've been changed to +4 Str, -2 Dex, -2 Wisdom in my games, but in the original MM version they've got NO physical ability penalties and are one of the only LA+0 races with a +4 to a stat. So they make daaamn good smashers. on top of this they look awful and are considered savages. Excuse me? Last time I checked being a green barbarian that is six and a half feet of solid muscle and has tusks isn't considered awful looking, it is considered looking BADASS. so why play one? Because they're awesome. If you like a nice strength bonus, play a goliath; have better ability scores and get powerful build for just LA 1. Goliaths don't have tusks and they have a dexterity penalty, and that nasty Level Adjustment. Even though I'm not really fond of the MM orc (it's so broken as a melee type) they are incredibly fun to roleplay.
lint trap 06-04-07, 03:22 PM	As every poster is saying, sometimes you'll go with a suboptimal choice for the flavor. Sometimes you just want a Goblin Warmage, a Kobold Psychic Warrior, or a big freakin' Orc. Statistical analysis always takes a backseat to coolness.
Tyberian 06-04-07, 04:50 PM	Don't forget there are also some good prestige classes limited to orcs and half-orcs. Take blood of the warlord, for instance, in Races of Faerun. It allows you to really stack up on followers and really boost there combat capability. Also, Magic Item Compendium has at least one cool item which works best for orcs:Amulet of word twisting. If you are including half-orcs, there is the outcast champion prestige class. Technically, I think, a 1/2 elf may be one also, but I think that is just stupid. ORCS RULE!:plotting: :bounce: :lightbulb :hoppingma :hoppingma :hoppingma :headexplo :headexplo :ahem: :drool: :hoppingma ORCS RULE! ORCS RULE!!!
Aryxbez 06-04-07, 05:01 PM	I think they were more meant as a NPC race more than anything. Also some people prefer to play a full fledged orc like other have already said.
neilthrun 06-04-07, 05:04 PM	The eye of grumsh prestige class.
KurenaiYami 06-04-07, 05:06 PM	Because a large number of WoW players now play D&D and they like orcs?
SilverFoxKnows 06-04-07, 05:46 PM	I would play one for flavor. And if you allow third party books there are a couple of good books for Orcs that have new Feats and weapons.
Cale_Darksun 06-04-07, 06:46 PM	Why play orcs? Because Elves, Dwarves, and men get old. It may not be easy being green, but its still fun as a bucket full of firecrackers.:w00t:
Laucian The Black Hearted 06-04-07, 07:29 PM	I grant all Orcs (Half included) the ability to use the Orc Double Axe for free. I feel it's a great trade for the extra minus. Also, Orcs are pretty much the best fantasy creature ever, next to Trolls.
jollythehappyminotaur 06-04-07, 07:36 PM	heres a better question.... why have you not killed yourself yet? dude orcs are awesome. DND is more than just statistics and + and - to whatever. maybe no one wants to play a goliath because they are not nearly as cool and have no real mythical background. DND is more RPing than anything else. just look on the cover of the book. (DUNGEONS AND DRAGONS) ROLE PLAYING GAME! good job genius. orcs are necessary in a classic mythical setting. they are one of the most important races. not to mention there is nothing more satisfying than :smirk: -me orc smash face!
Nercrominionicon 06-04-07, 07:52 PM	Why play an Orc? For the raw awesomeness of putting a bigass axe in something's face, of course. Just like any proper Viking would do.
Robespierre 06-04-07, 08:13 PM	As every poster is saying, sometimes you'll go with a suboptimal choice for the flavor. Sometimes you just want a Goblin Warmage, a Kobold Psychic Warrior, or a big freakin' Orc. Statistical analysis always takes a backseat to coolness. Quoted FTW. You deserve a cookie :cookie: . Seriously, I don't understand why people don't like the 'savage' races more, I mean come on, hordes of Orcs and armies of Hobgoblins...
Sul_Zain_Aserbet 06-04-07, 08:34 PM	Also, Orcs are pretty much the best fantasy creature ever, next to Trolls. Thats how i feel about giants and ogres.
Nobunaga Oda 06-04-07, 09:06 PM	Why NOT play a Orc? +4 to strenght. Grab an Axe and open a can of Barbarian Rage and you are done. Plus Orcs are cool.
Cartigan 06-04-07, 09:57 PM	Because you don't need int, wis, or cha to beat the hell out of stuff?
Optimator 06-04-07, 09:59 PM	I don't know. They weren't designed as a PC race so the question is kinda mute. Isn't it "moot"? Seriously, I don't understand why people don't like the 'savage' races more, I mean come on, hordes of Orcs and armies of Hobgoblins... I play a Hobgoblin every chance I get.
MerlintheTuna 06-04-07, 10:08 PM	Orcs are potent as low-level creatures. As mooks they do well, since they hit more reliably than most races and deal a pretty hefty amount of damage. (Incidentally, I have to say that the decision to give the basic Orc warrior a falchion is terrible. If you eat a crit, that's 4d4+8, average 18. Dead'd for a low level PC, and he's got the widest threat range available at that point.) Basically, if you don't intend to play past level 4 or so, playing as an Orc will serve you well simply because a high strength score can carry a warrior for a few levels, and it's comparatively hard (ECL-wise) to get better at splattering people than by playing as an Orc.
belly120 06-05-07, 04:38 AM	bein big mean and green is fun and ya get to have an awsome orc name like Walla Walla or Wompa Grotsnak, which you can yell as you smash stuff and it sounds like a war cry but its actually you formally introducing yourself via power attack :) come on why would you not want to do that :ayyyy!:
Ariath Ska'Vhor 06-05-07, 04:48 AM	Because I've often had fantasies about adventuring groups consisting of nothing but orcs and elves. That's what I call chemistry!
belly120 06-05-07, 05:07 AM	ha yeah pure balance of brawn and agility 2 wood elf rangers and 2 orc barbarians. 1 orc barbarian/bard (skald), 1 elf druid that would rock :)
Haruspex 06-05-07, 05:22 AM	The stereotypical image of an average Orc is one of brutishness and low intellect (Obould Many-Arrows notwithstanding, but he did get "upgraded"). It's easier to roleplay a simple-minded axe-swinging savage than it is to roleplay an all-knowing sage or master at arms. "The guard refuses your party entry. He says that the ball is invitation only." "Turk smash puny guard man! Smash guard man's dog too!"
belly120 06-05-07, 05:28 AM	that is true but there is the noble savage option with orcs. The orc that left his tribe to go out into the wild and aid those that are not as strong as he. almost paladin like in virtue but still a brute thats a good role play hook :)
BadCatMan 06-05-07, 05:39 AM	There's an Orc Knight in my game. She wears sundark goggles, wields a lance and a guisarme, and rides around on a Warbeast Wolf. Yep, she's a biker orc. My game, set in a corner of the Forgotten Realms, has orcs not unlike Star Trek's Klingons. They have a city, they're accepted. The charisma penalty hurts some Knight abilities, but the strength bonus pretty much takes care of the rest. So far she demolished a raging orc barbarian and 2-3 warriors in one shot with a lance, and wrestled a strong Human Fighter of a few levels higher into submission. If you're not going to get killed on sight, then a full-blooded Orc is a better choice than a Half-Orc if you don't care about Wisdom. Why play an Orc? Answer: RAAARGH!
belly120 06-05-07, 05:53 AM	yeah! i'm loving the loving everyone has for orcs its great. who'd a thought the A typical fantasy villain that so many early parties have to face is secretly so popular as the peoples champion :)
Ogrebear 06-05-07, 09:23 AM	I have played an Orc Mage- dumped an 18 into Int, the 16 into Str, the 17 into Con and had a ball! People didn't expect him to be intelligent, or able to cast and wack stuff! Ok he was not able to stand long in a fight but as long as he avoided being hit he could certainly take people down easy with his huge Str. It was wonderful to pop a few presumptions, scare more than a few NPC's and surprise the party by being an Orc who could up with better plans and strategies than them! Ah... so much fun!
Babzidu 06-05-07, 01:42 PM	A better question would be, why not play an orc? Orcs are basically uncharted territory for a fantasy staple character. I mean, drow have Drizzt Do'Urden, elves have Legolas, dwarves have Bruenor Battlehammer and Gimli, and men have Aragorn, Boromir, Capn' Jack Sparrow, Capn' Barbossa...etc, Gnomes, well, who really cares about gnomes? Haflings have Regis and the hobbits, and Half-Elves even have Tanis Half-Elven. Orcs and Half-Orcs? Not so much. Orcs gives players a chance to create an iconic character without being in a famous novel character's shadow. First post=awesome
AMGriffin 06-05-07, 04:26 PM	^So Very true. One of the very richest roleplaying experiences I had (and what made me love half-orcs) was a half-orc character I played over very many sessions. Half-orcs and Orcs (orcs in particular) have gotten ignored far too much over the years. I hope one of the major DnD worlds introduces a half-orc protagonist. I also hope Obould Many-Arrows gets some more depth to him then "evil Orc overlord." Isn't "The Orc King" supposed to be about him?
Ricros 06-05-07, 06:20 PM	Gnomes, well, who really cares about gnomes? Dude! DAVID THE GNOME!
Tyberian 06-05-07, 07:00 PM	I gotta admit, David the Gnome rocked. But I've been partial to orcs and half-orcs since playing Derg the half-orc fighter back in 1st edition in'83....
MerlintheTuna 06-05-07, 07:52 PM	Orcs gives players a chance to create an iconic character without being in a famous novel character's shadow.Much to the (strange) dismay of many a D&D player, Blizzard has done a spectacular job with the mythos of Warcraft. There are quite a few orcs of mention in their lore. It's a great source of names, to boot.
asurademon 06-05-07, 08:26 PM	I really am thinking about playing an orc if I ever get a chance to play D&D again (none of my friends have time to game right now), but I don't really like how gimped their traits are. I think +2 str, +2 con, -2 int, -2 cha would be better, or if you think that makes them to amazing as far as fighters go, just +2 strength, and either -2 int or -2 cha would work. I'm thinking I might play a lawful neutral orc, whom ended up exiled when the tribal leader (whom he was extremely loyal to) was betrayed and killed by a rival, whom then would have gained power. I want him to have been a hunter as much as warrior, so ranger would probably be the best class thematically, despite the fact that having a -2 to wisdom will really suck for that class. If I can get away with it I"ll redo orcs so they have a +2 strength, -2 intelligence or charisma (not sure which penalty is really most fitting for orcs). I'd keep the light sensitivity, and give them a +2 (or maybe a even a +4 to intimidation if I have them keep the charisma penalty, orcs may have a hard time grasping the subtleties of social interaction, but they have a knack for being frightening). Anyways the reason I'd play an orc is because it best fits my character concept. I usually like to play characters with a really high charisma score, but this could be an interesting chance to play one without a good charisma.
AAB 06-05-07, 09:52 PM	you do realize that with your ideal orc the drawbacks would be less severe than with a RAW half-orc, right?
asurademon 06-05-07, 10:45 PM	you do realize that with your ideal orc the drawbacks would be less severe than with a RAW half-orc, right? I'm assuming you're replying to my post. Yes I do realize that, I think half-orcs are quite gimped as well, and would definately change them.
Engilbrand 06-05-07, 11:14 PM	Go the wiki for the Ultimate Classes. They also have Ultimate Races. The Orc is pretty nifty there. Most of the races are a lot more interesting. We're playing an Ultimate game. 1 Orc, 2 Half-orcs. We beat stuff into the ground HARD!
Izzak 06-05-07, 11:38 PM	Orcs are awesome. Who by any means is gonna be your first kill, or be your first killer, an Orc. I'd be one in a heartbeat. I'd go around acting like the Hulk, "KIKOR SMASH".
Neutronium_Dragon 06-05-07, 11:42 PM	> Because I've often had fantasies about adventuring groups consisting of > nothing but orcs and elves. That could actually happen fairly easily in Eberron, between the very different from generic cultures of both races in that setting and the fact that they don't have the stereotypical enmity with one another.
Sul_Zain_Aserbet 06-05-07, 11:45 PM	WAAAAAAAGH!!!!!!! 'Cause ork boyz is da biggist an' da toughest
Another Gnome 06-06-07, 04:15 AM	Yeah, full-blooded orcs are a decent alternative for half-orcs. And that bad rep orcs have won't really make a difference in most situations where it wouldn't make a difference to a half-orc. Joe Farmer: "Whoa! What the hell is that?!" Bob the Bard: "Hm? Oh, that's just our buddy Krush." Joe Farmer: "But... he's like... seven and a half feet tall!" Bob the Bard: "Seven-foot-two, to be precise." Joe Farmer: "And he's got a green skin!" Bob the Bard: "It's closer to gray, actually... You have a pink skin. I have a brown skin. Ellie here has a blue skin with orange stripes and purple polka dots." Ellie: "Hi." Bob the Bard: "So I kinda fail to see your point." Joe Farmer: "Yes, well, but she looks kind of elfish... except for the tail, and those floating light... thingies over her head... uh... either way that's nothing out of the ordinary for an adventurer! But that greenskin is obviously an orc!" Bob the Bard: "I'm telling you, it's gray..." Joe Farmer: "I ain't talking to no orcs!" Bob the Bard: "Have you ever seen a half-orc?" Joe Farmer: "No. Why?" Bob the Bard: "Krush is a half-orc." Joe Farmer: "Oh no, I'm not that stupid! I can tell an orc when I see one! They raid our village every month and kill all our menfolk and take our women to their lair where they... well, that's besides the point, I'm not going to just wait for that orc to murder me!" Bob the Bard: "Krush has been standing still for the entirety of this conversation, you know. Don't you suppose there's this distinct possibility that he might actually not care one bit about ripping you in half and rolling your head down the road, seeing as he hasn't in fact done it already?" Joe Farmer: "He wouldn't dare! We may be in the middle of nowhere with no eyewitnesses or authorities within twenty miles, and I may not have even a walking stick to defend myself with, but that doesn't mean he can just attack me as he pleases!" Bob the Bard: "..." * * * Krush: "Er... hey Bob, wasn't that supposed to prove that orcs can do as well as half-orcs? I'm not so sure we did that..." Bob the Bard: "Nevermind. Just, just keep walking, okay?" Krush: "I was just thinking, maybe we s--" Bob the Bard: "You're not paid for your thinking!" Krush: "Sorry."
JulesCARV 06-06-07, 04:55 AM	Orcs are great as the sort of "quintessential adventurer" -- the type who faces danger with reckless bravado, breaks and enters, kills, and loots corpses without conscience or scruple, and bears pain and hardship with indifference.
katakraos 06-06-07, 06:03 AM	Why? Just for the fun of it, man! :D
Babzidu 06-06-07, 12:31 PM	^So Very true. One of the very richest roleplaying experiences I had (and what made me love half-orcs) was a half-orc character I played over very many sessions. Half-orcs and Orcs (orcs in particular) have gotten ignored far too much over the years. I hope one of the major DnD worlds introduces a half-orc protagonist. I also hope Obould Many-Arrows gets some more depth to him then "evil Orc overlord." Isn't "The Orc King" supposed to be about him? Thank you, AMGriffin. I don't know about "The Orc King", I havn't even heard of it until now, but I will pick it up. Oh, and for the guy who said something about Warcraft orcs, I play WoW and Warcraft 3, but I was talking about DnD orcs. They do have nice names on Warcraft, though.
Kursk 06-06-07, 12:41 PM	Isn't it "moot"? Yes. Posting BC (before coffee) is risky.
AMGriffin 06-06-07, 08:14 PM	Orcs in Warcraft are too cool, they're so friggin' great. The savage, less intelligent DND variety are fun too however.
baby_kamikaize_kobold 06-06-07, 10:44 PM	Orc are a basis in the low level adventurer's diet. If you want a good book for orcs try Wrath and Rage by green ronin publishing.
Nat_20 06-06-07, 11:00 PM	When i make characters, i look at only like five races, i dont like any others, human, elf, catfolk, warforged, and orc... I dont want to waste my time as anything else cuz i can have fun roll playing as these races... and Orcs with a 18 Int are by FAR one of the funnest races to play on account of the fact that you are a huge gray brute with a huge weapon that can to quantum physics in your head faster than most of the population of NPCs can pick their noses... And i've played many orcs with high Int and Cha scores and was the party battle planner and diplomat... I kicked butt and was the face of a respectable party... now that is fun... Ohh yeah... anyone ever play an Orc Warlock?? good times man, good times...
AAB 06-06-07, 11:05 PM	Ohh yeah... anyone ever play an Orc Warlock?? good times man, good times... hideous blow?
Ieniemienie 06-07-07, 07:33 AM	When i make characters, i look at only like five races, i dont like any others, human, elf, catfolk, warforged, and orc... I dont want to waste my time as anything else cuz i can have fun roll playing as these races... and Orcs with a 18 Int are by FAR one of the funnest races to play on account of the fact that you are a huge gray brute with a huge weapon that can to quantum physics in your head faster than most of the population of NPCs can pick their noses... And i've played many orcs with high Int and Cha scores and was the party battle planner and diplomat... I kicked butt and was the face of a respectable party... now that is fun... Ohh yeah... anyone ever play an Orc Warlock?? good times man, good times...how many milion point buy would you need to pull that one off? or have you got a buck load of magic items? (no offence;) )
Laucian The Black Hearted 06-07-07, 08:26 AM	Believe it or not, some of us still roll our stats.
DwarfPcfan 06-07-07, 08:52 AM	Why are orcs cool? Thats like asking why the Incredible Hulk is cool BECAUSE THEY ARE BIG MEAN DESTRUCTION MACHINES!!!! Want to know why orcs are cool start reading the new Hulk mini-series "World war HulK"
Radijs 06-07-07, 08:55 AM	http://www.warhammeralliance.com/forums/images/avatars/avatar042.gifWaaaaaagh!!http://www.warhammeralliance.com/forums/images/avatars/avatar042.gif
Optimator 06-07-07, 12:19 PM	Much to the (strange) dismay of many a D&D player, Blizzard has done a spectacular job with the mythos of Warcraft. There are quite a few orcs of mention in their lore. It's a great source of names, to boot. I know, right?
Sul_Zain_Aserbet 06-07-07, 12:42 PM	http://www.warhammeralliance.com/forums/images/avatars/avatar042.gifWaaaaaagh!!http://www.warhammeralliance.com/forums/images/avatars/avatar042.gif May Gork and Mork lead you to victory. Your waagh! is bigger than mine.
danzibr 06-07-07, 12:59 PM	Excuse me? Last time I checked being a green barbarian that is six and a half feet of solid muscle and has tusks isn't considered awful looking, it is considered looking BADASS. AMGriffin, awesome. Sigged. Here's a :cookie: Dan
Bionecrosis 06-07-07, 02:38 PM	Flavor.
zzo38 06-07-07, 02:44 PM	For roleplayers: Because it's fun. For roll-players: Because it's a challenge. Or, of course, for people that like to do both.
bigsnarf 06-07-07, 04:21 PM	I have a good question,why do half orcs suck?No really,+2 to STR and darkvision is nothing!Lets look at the 3.5 dwarf,they are one of the best fighting races out of the players handbook.They get a free exotic weapon prof. if they are a warrior class,and can move in eavy armour as it was nothing!Also they get skill bonus to craft if its with stone or metal,and alot of other stuff.And our beloved half orcs get crap!In first edition they made great assassins!A +2 to STR does not help after you get to mid level.Also they are thought as orcs for when you have a PvP combat so dwarves just love to kill em.This is what I think orcs should get,RAGE!!!!!!!!!!.yep a free once a day RAGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!because half orcs dont get mad,they get ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRGE!!!!!!! ME KILL DWARF!!!!!!!!!Does that seem OK?is it to hard to ask?
AAB 06-07-07, 05:26 PM	you should use fewer exclamation points. but dwarves aren't as good as you think they are (don't get me wrong, they're spectacular). they do NOT get a free exotic weapon proficiency, they treat it as a martial weapon. a dwarf wizard will still not be able to use a waraxe or an urgrosh. while they can move their normal rate in heavy armor it is ONLY as fast as any other medium creature wearing the same armor, so it is actually as though they get a 10-foot penalty to speed when wearing light armor or no armor. i personally enjoy playing a half-orc now and then. it can be fun.
Sul_Zain_Aserbet 06-07-07, 05:37 PM	Yeah, i feel half-orcs lack luster. They get a pretty neat PrC featured in RD but thats about it. And the PrC is more on the fun side than powerful side. Personally, i feel that any instance a half-orc would shine an orc would shine brighter, shy of diplomacy-NPC issues. That personal opinion aside, there are plenty of people i'm sure that would give the half-orc props. For the same ECL, orcs get +2 more strength and an additional -2 in a stat that the typical orc character wont miss anyways. And for a one level dip in orc paragon you can do away with the whole light sensitivity thing. Orc paragon is pretty nifty, btw.
bigsnarf 06-07-07, 05:47 PM	But they should get the RAGE!!!!!!!!!oops,sorry about the exclamation points.A half orc is great for role playing but they have something missing.Perhaps they SHOULD get a +2 for intimidation skill checks,they are intimidating are they not?The orc blood thing is weak because when does a group of PC's ever come across a orc only magic item,but they sometimes see a orc bane weapon.I think that 3.5 missed something on the whole half orc thing.Like I said,at mid level +2 to strength does not help much. But thats my opinion,I can be wrong.
Sul_Zain_Aserbet 06-07-07, 06:13 PM	But they should get the RAGE!!!!!!!!!oops,sorry about the exclamation points.A half orc is great for role playing but they have something missing.Perhaps they SHOULD get a +2 for intimidation skill checks,they are intimidating are they not?The orc blood thing is weak because when does a group of PC's ever come across a orc only magic item,but they sometimes see a orc bane weapon.I think that 3.5 missed something on the whole half orc thing.Like I said,at mid level +2 to strength does not help much. But thats my opinion,I can be wrong. Half-orc paragons learn to tap into thier furious heritage and can rage
bigsnarf 06-07-07, 06:29 PM	Is that in one of the "Races of"books?I only have Stone and Dragon.
Broxigar 06-11-07, 07:15 PM	It's already been said, but I'll say it again: Orcs and Half-orcs offer excellent oppritunities for roleplaying and good back stories. My favorite role is a Orc or Half-orc fighter, Broxigar (or Brox by those in his party). His back story is that he was raised by humans (his bologicial mother, in the Half-orc's case). Because of his loyalty and the usefulness of his natural strength, Broxigar was accepted and even well liked by the people of his small village. Then one day while Broxigar was out gathering food, he returned home and found his village under attack by a band of Orc marauders. He quickly ran to his adoptive mothers house, none of the attacking Orcs stopped him, thinking Broxigar to be a member of their tribe. He arrived just in time to see his mother cut in half at the end of a Orc falcion. Until that day, Brox had been known as something of a gentle giant by the villagers, as he had never hurt anyone or lifted a weapon in his life. But seeing his mother so violently murdered caused Broxigar to snap, and the gentle Orc who defied previously unchallenged assumptions died that day. With tears of rage in his eyes and a battlecry on his lips, Broxigar took up a fallen Orc's greataxe and brutally slaughtered every single Orc in the tribe, including their cheiftan and the shaman. Broxigar now travels the world, seeking oppritunities to test his incredible martial skill on the field of battle. Broxigar hates nothing more than his own people, and he viciously attacks any Orc's he sees without a second thought. Over the course of my roleplaying career, Broxigar has accomplished some pretty remarkable things, including single handedly slaying the entire crew of a pirate ship, besting a level 10 vampire fighter in single combat and founding a legacy greataxe which he calls Foerender. On another note, Radijs my friend, you are a wonderful human being.
Orion Polaris 06-11-07, 07:28 PM	I never got why Orcs don't have an attack bonus against other races. I mean they've been warring for as long as they've been a race, if Dwarves and Gnomes can get an attack roll bonus against their traditional enemies, why shouldn't Orcs?
Optimator 06-11-07, 07:53 PM	I think it is because their lifespans are shorter and therefore don't get to pass on enough tactical and anecdotal stories and strategies to warrant a full-on racial bonus. That is probably from Races of War by K and crew. There probably isn't an official reason though.
Anthony_Rancor 06-12-07, 03:14 PM	Why play an orc? If your english isnt so good no one will notice. They are big bad and scary. They are fun to play and write a back story for. you get to give them cool names like Moosh. My first character was a Half Orc, I love them!!!!!
Anodai 06-12-07, 03:27 PM	I like orcs, and once they reach lvl 8 in my world they get powerful build (su they get big and choppy like in Warhammer) i also remove light sensitivity. they may be better than other races like that once they get to lvl 8 but if your at level 8 the sorcerer already kicks your ass with levitate+ fireball, so no LA for them.
Anodai 06-12-07, 03:30 PM	On another note, Radijs my friend, you are a wonderful human being. Don't you mean a wonderful humanoid being? :smirk:
Ogrebear 06-13-07, 08:36 AM	One of the other reasons to love Orcs is that the background can be so easily changed to fit into many different world set-ups. Need Klingon like honour bound warriors? Use Orcs! Need a Roman style expansionist Empire (good or evil)? Use Orcs! Need to break some stereotypes about dumb monsters? Use Orcs with class levels who are LG Paladins! Want something the standard party wont expect? Throw in a Orc Wizard! Want something weird? Have the players come across a colony of Orc Werebears living in woods at peace! Need a story of redemption? Use Orcs trying to escape their evil past by helping their neighbours and 'being good' Add some comedy by making their attempts a little bumbling... Want to break everything the players expect? Take them to a place where there are few Half Orcs but full Orcs are fully accepted members of society and education has removed a lot of their 'dumbness'! Do something different: have the players make Orcs, but use the same adventures with Humans as the villains!
Radijs 06-13-07, 10:07 AM	Thank you both!
Optimator 06-13-07, 03:37 PM	One of the other reasons to love Orcs is that the background can be so easily changed to fit into many different world set-ups. Need Klingon like honour bound warriors? Use Orcs! Need a Roman style expansionist Empire (good or evil)? Use Orcs! Need to break some stereotypes about dumb monsters? Use Orcs with class levels who are LG Paladins! Want something the standard party wont expect? Throw in a Orc Wizard! Want something weird? Have the players come across a colony of Orc Werebears living in woods at peace! Need a story of redemption? Use Orcs trying to escape their evil past by helping their neighbours and 'being good' Add some comedy by making their attempts a little bumbling... Want to break everything the players expect? Take them to a place where there are few Half Orcs but full Orcs are fully accepted members of society and education has removed a lot of their 'dumbness'! Do something different: have the players make Orcs, but use the same adventures with Humans as the villains! When I read the first two, I immediately thought of Hobgoblins.
Sunic_Flames 06-13-07, 04:51 PM	When I read the first two, I immediately thought of Hobgoblins. Seconded. Also... Seriously, I don't understand why people don't like the 'savage' races more. I play 'savage' races all the time. Not all of them actually fit that mold, but the stereotype exists.
Ogrebear 06-14-07, 08:28 AM	When I read the first two, I immediately thought of Hobgoblins. I understand what you mean but to me Goblins, Orcs, and Hobgoblins are representative of Tolkeins lesser Orcs, Orcs, and Uruk Hai (I know my spelling is off). I tend to see all these as forms of Orcs. Having said that there is no reason not to use Orcs like this. Why not have a setting with an honourable, neutral-good Klingon like Orc Empire in conflict with a LE Hobgoblin one with lots of Human Kingdoms in the Middle that need fighting/diplomacy/tricking etc? Got to break the mould sometimes and Orcs are flexible enough to be the race that can be everything!
Optimator 06-15-07, 02:13 AM	Agreed.