Confused about Tumble [Archive] - Wizards Community

Confused about Tumble [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Khazzan
01-27-08, 03:18 PM Probably a simple question, but our group wasn't quite sure:

If a character Tumbles 15' (or otherwise half his movement rate) and ends up in a threatened square, can he then attack the opponent? The skill says that Tumbling is part of movement, so if a Tumble check is part of a move action, and he doesn't go his full movement rate, does he still get an attack in that same round?

I assume that at the end of his Tumble he'd have to make his skill check upon entering the threatened square....DC15 or 25?

One more thing: If the character does indeed get an attack after Tumbling half less than his full movement rate but fails his skill check and the opponent gets an AoO against him, does the character still get an attack as part of his standard action?
JMKoontz
01-27-08, 03:35 PM Characters do not provoke AoO's by moving INTO a threatened square.

per the SRD:
Provoking an Attack of Opportunity
Two kinds of actions can provoke attacks of opportunity: moving out of a threatened square and performing an action within a threatened square.

Moving
Moving out of a threatened square usually provokes an attack of opportunity from the threatening opponent. There are two common methods of avoiding such an attack—the 5-foot step and the withdraw action.

(emphasis mine)

In addition, unless you are dealing with a surprise round, or the character has some condition that prevents him from taking a full round's worth of action, the character can always move ALL of his movement (30 ft as a move action) and then attack as a standard action. The only movement that should prevent the character from attacking would be a DOUBLE MOVE in which the character traded his standard action for a second move action , thus enabeling him to travel 60 ft.

So ... simple answer to your question. Yes, he can tumble 15 feet and still make an attack. If he does not succeed on his tumble check, there should not be any penalty unless he is also moving OUT OF someone's threatened space. Then he'd provoke an AoO.
m o n k
01-27-08, 03:40 PM If a character Tumbles 15' (or otherwise half his movement rate) and ends up in a threatened square, can he then attack the opponent? The skill says that Tumbling is part of movement, so if a Tumble check is part of a move action, and he doesn't go his full movement rate, does he still get an attack in that same round?
As I understand it, yes, the tumbler can attack or perform a standard action. Tumbling is moving. Think of tumbling as the same as moving silently: They are move actions that require skill checks.

One more thing: If the character does indeed get an attack after Tumbling half less than his full movement rate but fails his skill check and the opponent gets an AoO against him, does the character still get an attack as part of his standard action?
Not 100% sure, but I think the tumbler can still attack or perform a standard action. Think of it as similar to how moving out of a threatened square provokes an AoO: The provoker still gets to attack or perform a standard action.
Khazzan
01-27-08, 03:45 PM Characters do not provoke AoO's by moving INTO a threatened square.

*snip*

So ... simple answer to your question. Yes, he can tumble 15 feet and still make an attack. If he does not succeed on his tumble check, there should not be any penalty unless he is also moving OUT OF someone's threatened space. Then he'd provoke an AoO.

Okay, excellent. Yes, we had assumed that tumbling into a threatened square meant a skill check was required.

So you can Tumble out of a threatened square (requiring a skill check) and into another threatened square (which does not require a skill check) and then make an attack against that opponent, as long as you do not exceed your movement rate in the Tumbling move.

Thanks for the clarification. Much appreciated!
Khazzan
01-27-08, 04:05 PM Not 100% sure, but I think the tumbler can still attack or perform a standard action. Think of it as similar to how moving out of a threatened square provokes an AoO: The provoker still gets to attack or perform a standard action.

Excellent... so the AoO doesn't preclude the "completion" of the provoker's round / action.

Thanks guys!
JMKoontz
01-27-08, 05:58 PM So you can Tumble out of a threatened square (requiring a skill check) and into another threatened square (which does not require a skill check) and then make an attack against that opponent, as long as you do not exceed your movement rate in the Tumbling move.

Yes that is correct. However, it should be noted that when leaving the threatened square, if the tumble check fails and the AoO is successful, it could be possible that the tumbler does not get to finish his move such as if he is dropped to 0 HP or below, or entangled or somesuch. In this case, his move ends and he would not be in position to make the attack.
Rulebook
01-28-08, 02:19 AM when in doubt about moving through threatened squares while tumbling, just roll another tumble check if you feel you need to.

not like anybody who tumbles will mind having to hit another dc 15
Vegepygmy
01-28-08, 05:07 PM not like anybody who tumbles will mind having to hit another dc 15My 11th-level wizard with Tumble +9 would certainly mind.
Argo
01-28-08, 05:57 PM Does tumbling qualify you for a "running start" to a Jump check?

I'm picturing those gymnasts doing handsprings across the mat into a huge leap...

That could be very useful.
Legdiwena
01-28-08, 06:20 PM I would say yes, provided you moved the requisite 20 ft in the same round as the jump.
Vegepygmy
01-28-08, 06:51 PM Does tumbling qualify you for a "running start" to a Jump check?All Jump DCs given here assume that you get a running start, which requires that you move at least 20 feet in a straight line before attempting the jump. If you do not get a running start, the DC for the jump is doubled.

Did you move at least 20 feet in a straight line before attempting the jump? If the answer is yes, then you got a "running start."

I would say yes, provided you moved the requisite 20 ft in the same round as the jump.Whether the movement occurs in the same round as the jump is irrelevant.
ToastedAmphibian
01-28-08, 07:20 PM Heh, what if i use sudden leap to move 20ft in a straight line........

Anywho, make sure your only making one tumble check PER OPPONNENT. One tumble check lets you run all the way around a person, you dont need to make a check per square.

Check separately for each opponent you move past

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Khazzan 01-27-08, 03:18 PM	Probably a simple question, but our group wasn't quite sure: If a character Tumbles 15' (or otherwise half his movement rate) and ends up in a threatened square, can he then attack the opponent? The skill says that Tumbling is part of movement, so if a Tumble check is part of a move action, and he doesn't go his full movement rate, does he still get an attack in that same round? I assume that at the end of his Tumble he'd have to make his skill check upon entering the threatened square....DC15 or 25? One more thing: If the character does indeed get an attack after Tumbling half less than his full movement rate but fails his skill check and the opponent gets an AoO against him, does the character still get an attack as part of his standard action?
JMKoontz 01-27-08, 03:35 PM	Characters do not provoke AoO's by moving INTO a threatened square. per the SRD: Provoking an Attack of Opportunity Two kinds of actions can provoke attacks of opportunity: moving out of a threatened square and performing an action within a threatened square. Moving Moving out of a threatened square usually provokes an attack of opportunity from the threatening opponent. There are two common methods of avoiding such an attack—the 5-foot step and the withdraw action. (emphasis mine) In addition, unless you are dealing with a surprise round, or the character has some condition that prevents him from taking a full round's worth of action, the character can always move ALL of his movement (30 ft as a move action) and then attack as a standard action. The only movement that should prevent the character from attacking would be a DOUBLE MOVE in which the character traded his standard action for a second move action , thus enabeling him to travel 60 ft. So ... simple answer to your question. Yes, he can tumble 15 feet and still make an attack. If he does not succeed on his tumble check, there should not be any penalty unless he is also moving OUT OF someone's threatened space. Then he'd provoke an AoO.
m o n k 01-27-08, 03:40 PM	If a character Tumbles 15' (or otherwise half his movement rate) and ends up in a threatened square, can he then attack the opponent? The skill says that Tumbling is part of movement, so if a Tumble check is part of a move action, and he doesn't go his full movement rate, does he still get an attack in that same round? As I understand it, yes, the tumbler can attack or perform a standard action. Tumbling is moving. Think of tumbling as the same as moving silently: They are move actions that require skill checks. One more thing: If the character does indeed get an attack after Tumbling half less than his full movement rate but fails his skill check and the opponent gets an AoO against him, does the character still get an attack as part of his standard action? Not 100% sure, but I think the tumbler can still attack or perform a standard action. Think of it as similar to how moving out of a threatened square provokes an AoO: The provoker still gets to attack or perform a standard action.
Khazzan 01-27-08, 03:45 PM	Characters do not provoke AoO's by moving INTO a threatened square. snip So ... simple answer to your question. Yes, he can tumble 15 feet and still make an attack. If he does not succeed on his tumble check, there should not be any penalty unless he is also moving OUT OF someone's threatened space. Then he'd provoke an AoO. Okay, excellent. Yes, we had assumed that tumbling into a threatened square meant a skill check was required. So you can Tumble out of a threatened square (requiring a skill check) and into another threatened square (which does not require a skill check) and then make an attack against that opponent, as long as you do not exceed your movement rate in the Tumbling move. Thanks for the clarification. Much appreciated!
Khazzan 01-27-08, 04:05 PM	Not 100% sure, but I think the tumbler can still attack or perform a standard action. Think of it as similar to how moving out of a threatened square provokes an AoO: The provoker still gets to attack or perform a standard action. Excellent... so the AoO doesn't preclude the "completion" of the provoker's round / action. Thanks guys!
JMKoontz 01-27-08, 05:58 PM	So you can Tumble out of a threatened square (requiring a skill check) and into another threatened square (which does not require a skill check) and then make an attack against that opponent, as long as you do not exceed your movement rate in the Tumbling move. Yes that is correct. However, it should be noted that when leaving the threatened square, if the tumble check fails and the AoO is successful, it could be possible that the tumbler does not get to finish his move such as if he is dropped to 0 HP or below, or entangled or somesuch. In this case, his move ends and he would not be in position to make the attack.
Rulebook 01-28-08, 02:19 AM	when in doubt about moving through threatened squares while tumbling, just roll another tumble check if you feel you need to. not like anybody who tumbles will mind having to hit another dc 15
Vegepygmy 01-28-08, 05:07 PM	not like anybody who tumbles will mind having to hit another dc 15My 11th-level wizard with Tumble +9 would certainly mind.
Argo 01-28-08, 05:57 PM	Does tumbling qualify you for a "running start" to a Jump check? I'm picturing those gymnasts doing handsprings across the mat into a huge leap... That could be very useful.
Legdiwena 01-28-08, 06:20 PM	I would say yes, provided you moved the requisite 20 ft in the same round as the jump.
Vegepygmy 01-28-08, 06:51 PM	Does tumbling qualify you for a "running start" to a Jump check?All Jump DCs given here assume that you get a running start, which requires that you move at least 20 feet in a straight line before attempting the jump. If you do not get a running start, the DC for the jump is doubled. Did you move at least 20 feet in a straight line before attempting the jump? If the answer is yes, then you got a "running start." I would say yes, provided you moved the requisite 20 ft in the same round as the jump.Whether the movement occurs in the same round as the jump is irrelevant.
ToastedAmphibian 01-28-08, 07:20 PM	Heh, what if i use sudden leap to move 20ft in a straight line........ Anywho, make sure your only making one tumble check PER OPPONNENT. One tumble check lets you run all the way around a person, you dont need to make a check per square. Check separately for each opponent you move past