Dragon Breeding? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Dragon Breeding? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Evilholyguy
11-24-07, 09:00 PM is there any kind of feat or skill that this would set some rules for?
CrimsonDeath
11-24-07, 09:09 PM No, I'm pretty sure Dragons can breed without making any skill checks. I believe it's a racial trait.

(If that doesn't answer your question, then I didn't understand it. Could you elaborate?)
Evilholyguy
11-24-07, 09:12 PM what i guess im trying to say is there anyway that a player can breed and sell dragon eggs safely?
Mindolin
11-24-07, 09:56 PM You want to try and sell dragon eggs? Short answer, it won't be safe.

Now, the thing is, Dragons in D&D are not the near mindless beasts from some other fantasy series. The least inteliigent is near human, and goes to genius level at highest age catagories. They have weapons that would destroy castles, in their claws and teeth at least, and a breath weapon that can melt stone at higher catagories. If you try and sell one for profit, you will likely make an enemy of the entire race, and Gold Dragons are quite capable of being mean. Your best bet would be to leave off on the true dragons, at least until high high levels, and maybe just breed Wyverns.
CrimsonDeath
11-24-07, 09:58 PM what i guess im trying to say is there anyway that a player can breed and sell dragon eggs safely?

Well, True Dragons are intelligent creatures, so breeding them as beasts of burden would probably be considered slavery, and the effort going into it would made the process a decidedly evil act.

Before I go any further, please note that the next paragraph is completely made up and merely a suggestion subject to DM review. If you don't want to deal with that, just skip it.

With that in mind, I believe it was mentioned in Draconomicon that True Dragons need to reach the Young Adult age category before they become capable of breeding. Coercing the dragons into mating would require some form of social interaction skill. They're too smart for Handle Animal, it'll take too long for Bluff, and they don't get enough out of the deal for Diplomacy, so Intimidate would be your best option. The weakest Young Adult Dragon is the White, at CR 8 and 15 HD. Two CR 8 creatures are, I believe, an EL 9 encounter, so you'd probably need to be around level 13 before you try it (4 levels above the encounter, making it close to trivial for a four-man party to overcome) so they can't hurt you too much the first time you approach them with the idea. You'd also probably need to reliably be able to beat a 15 HD Large creature in an Intimidate check. (They'd get a modified level check of 1d20+19 to resist, so you'd need a +19 to beat one of them half the time.) You'd especially want to make sure no other Dragons found out what you were doing.

Alternatively, the Dominate Monster spell can simply make them do whatever you like.

Creatures of the Dragon type that have an Intelligence score of 1 or 2 can be reared with a Handle Animal check at a -4 penalty, as described in the Handle Animal skill. (That's Core.) Intelligent creatures of the Dragon type other than True Dragons could probably be handled as I described above for True Dragons (including the fact that it's a seriously evil thing to do).

I'm not aware of any feats that specifically address this concept.
Navonod Semaj
11-24-07, 11:16 PM Breeding dragons an evil act?

Silly.

Well, not if you go about it right.

Now, I can't say I have much of a clue as to how to manage the resultant offspring. Draconomicon, however, does cover how to deal with hatching an egg - be careful there, now. But as for getting them to mate? Intimidate checks? Dominate spells? Seriously, I thought you folks would have figured this out by now.

It's simple, really. You need is a spellcaster who can cast Planar Binding or Planar Ally. Bring two dragons (one male, one female) together. Preferably about early evening, while the sun is low in the sky. A diplomacy check may be needed to keep said dragons from fighting if not fo the same color, but crossbreeds could get interesting, so don't discount the possibility. Serve said dragons a liberal dose of hard alchohol. For this purpose, wine or beer may be too low in content to bypass a dragon's immense fortitude save, perhaps several barrels of moonshine spiked with monstrous spider venom would serve better. Get the dragons to talk to one another, maybe some sort of conversation kicker to ease tension. Treasure hoards, ransacking cities, or favorite events in history are nice and non-pressuring ways to break the ice between the two. Make sure to have a nice meal prepared for the two - an appetizer of several sheep, followed by the main course of a dire elk with a side salad of a tree or two garnished in silver pieces.

While the two are enjoying dinner together, this is where the cleric comes in. Cast you planar ally/binding spell to call forth the petitioner form of the Late Barry White from it's resting place on the upper planes. Mr White's Soul, like all summoned creatures, will expect payment for his services, so be sure to have a similar sized meal like the one you prepared for your two dragons available for his consumption. Once the meal (for both parties) is finished, order the Barry White to work his magic. All theese factors together, and it's just about assured that you will have an egg ready for hatching in short order.

If this doesn't work (say, the male dragon is a lecherous jerk), and you manage to survive the fallout, consider moving to a different RPG and trying to breed a simpler form of creature. I've heard of amateurs having great success with chocobos! It's just a matter of gathering the right nuts, racing around like a nitwit, and shelling out $16.99 for the player's guide.
CrimsonDeath
11-24-07, 11:32 PM Breeding dragons an evil act?

Forcing sentient creatures to reproduce so that you can sell their offspring into a life of servitude?

Yeah, sounds pretty evil to me.
Ace_of_time
11-24-07, 11:55 PM You could just play a dragon and sell off your own off spring. I think that would be easier but might be more evil? :schemes:
Lokiyn
11-24-07, 11:59 PM See, now i remember a campaign where the northern rules of an icy kingdom (made most of its money through rare northern plants and materials) where the judicial application of Curses, (Greater/lesser/Familial/etc) had linked each member of the nobility to a white dragon.

Neither the Humans nor the Dragon half of the equation could live or breed without the others.

(As in female nobility had female dragons and would become pregnant at the same time, but only of course with a member of the male nobility etc)

Of course it lengthened the life spans and we glossed over most of it, mostly it was an excuse to have the nobility have white dragon mounts/companions.

Although it would conceivable be possible if you worked with the breeding pair of dragons

For example you work with a pair of dragons to make sure that thier offspring are cared for by appropriate peoples. Since dragons live so long the parents and the caretakers would generally work together, sort of like a basic school into humanoid society, once the caretaker dies the offspring is no longer required to stay and has gotten its most vulnerable portion of growing (first 50 years or so) out of the way with free food and care.
Evilholyguy
11-25-07, 09:44 AM Forcing sentient creatures to reproduce so that you can sell their offspring into a life of servitude?

Yeah, sounds pretty evil to me.

I wasnt thinking along the lines of a servant. I was thinking maybe as a familiar or something like that. Heck if I don't sell them I could always foster them (read dragon magazine issue #320) any ways thanks for all the help everyone!
celestialkin
11-29-07, 09:30 AM \If this doesn't work (say, the male dragon is a lecherous jerk), and you manage to survive the fallout, consider moving to a different RPG and trying to breed a simpler form of creature.

Or, if the female dragon can polymorph tell the male dragon to get lost and continue the date yourself.

A half-dragon egg is better than no egg. :D
celestialkin
11-29-07, 09:50 AM See, now i remember a campaign where the northern rules of an icy kingdom (made most of its money through rare northern plants and materials) where the judicial application of Curses, (Greater/lesser/Familial/etc) had linked each member of the nobility to a white dragon.

Neither the Humans nor the Dragon half of the equation could live or breed without the others.

(As in female nobility had female dragons and would become pregnant at the same time, but only of course with a member of the male nobility etc)

Of course it lengthened the life spans and we glossed over most of it, mostly it was an excuse to have the nobility have white dragon mounts/companions.

Although it would conceivable be possible if you worked with the breeding pair of dragons

For example you work with a pair of dragons to make sure that thier offspring are cared for by appropriate peoples. Since dragons live so long the parents and the caretakers would generally work together, sort of like a basic school into humanoid society, once the caretaker dies the offspring is no longer required to stay and has gotten its most vulnerable portion of growing (first 50 years or so) out of the way with free food and care.

Take a look at Dragon Magazine #320 if you ever get a chance. It has a whole article on fostering a dragons, and why a dragon would trust one of it's eggs to another creature.

Also, why not try something a bit simpler OP? Why not just steal/kidnap dragon eggs? Why go through the trouble of capturing and dominating full grown dragons when you can just skip to the egg selling?

Also, you could try breeding Linorms (MM 2 .140). They seem to be desperate for a new generation of offspring, so it might help.
Evilholyguy
11-29-07, 02:34 PM k thanks everyone!
Kiioro
11-29-07, 02:57 PM Or, if the female dragon can polymorph tell the male dragon to get lost and continue the date yourself.

A half-dragon egg is better than no egg. :D

That's something that me and a few friends were asking ourselves. If the dragon(ess) polymorphs, doesn't that mean that your children would be human? If you wanted to have a half dragon you'd have to... well, mate with the dragoness in her original form.

(That then deviated to a talk that I could continue in the Mature Topic forum, including how the Perform (Drums) skills become quite useful and such). But, skipping that...

Does that mean she'd have to cast Enlarge on you (and with that I mean the whole person, don't get me wrong) and Reduce on her? Or do polymorphed dragons don't get their genes polymorphed?
celestialkin
11-29-07, 09:02 PM That's something that me and a few friends were asking ourselves. If the dragon(ess) polymorphs, doesn't that mean that your children would be human? If you wanted to have a half dragon you'd have to... well, mate with the dragoness in her original form.

I've wondered that myself. Maybe a few too many times....

Then again, love conquers all.

(That then deviated to a talk that I could continue in the Mature Topic forum, including how the Perform (Drums) skills become quite useful and such). But, skipping that...

Does that mean she'd have to cast Enlarge on you (and with that I mean the whole person, don't get me wrong) and Reduce on her? Or do polymorphed dragons don't get their genes polymorphed?

Buy the Book of Erotic Fantasy (http://www.amazon.com/Book-Erotic-Fantasy-Gwendolyn-Kestrel/dp/097420451X). It even has the penalties for each size difference between the couple. But again, I really can't say much more here.:hides:
Kiioro
11-30-07, 02:24 PM Already got the BoEF, hehehe... but the Drums thing was for the flavor or it.

Another Dragon Breeding question.

Red Dragon + Blue Dragon = Purple Dragon???
Ace_of_time
12-06-07, 12:20 AM According to what I read you have to be one type and then add half dragon to that. Could be wrong.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Evilholyguy 11-24-07, 09:00 PM	is there any kind of feat or skill that this would set some rules for?
CrimsonDeath 11-24-07, 09:09 PM	No, I'm pretty sure Dragons can breed without making any skill checks. I believe it's a racial trait. (If that doesn't answer your question, then I didn't understand it. Could you elaborate?)
Evilholyguy 11-24-07, 09:12 PM	what i guess im trying to say is there anyway that a player can breed and sell dragon eggs safely?
Mindolin 11-24-07, 09:56 PM	You want to try and sell dragon eggs? Short answer, it won't be safe. Now, the thing is, Dragons in D&D are not the near mindless beasts from some other fantasy series. The least inteliigent is near human, and goes to genius level at highest age catagories. They have weapons that would destroy castles, in their claws and teeth at least, and a breath weapon that can melt stone at higher catagories. If you try and sell one for profit, you will likely make an enemy of the entire race, and Gold Dragons are quite capable of being mean. Your best bet would be to leave off on the true dragons, at least until high high levels, and maybe just breed Wyverns.
CrimsonDeath 11-24-07, 09:58 PM	what i guess im trying to say is there anyway that a player can breed and sell dragon eggs safely? Well, True Dragons are intelligent creatures, so breeding them as beasts of burden would probably be considered slavery, and the effort going into it would made the process a decidedly evil act. Before I go any further, please note that the next paragraph is completely made up and merely a suggestion subject to DM review. If you don't want to deal with that, just skip it. With that in mind, I believe it was mentioned in Draconomicon that True Dragons need to reach the Young Adult age category before they become capable of breeding. Coercing the dragons into mating would require some form of social interaction skill. They're too smart for Handle Animal, it'll take too long for Bluff, and they don't get enough out of the deal for Diplomacy, so Intimidate would be your best option. The weakest Young Adult Dragon is the White, at CR 8 and 15 HD. Two CR 8 creatures are, I believe, an EL 9 encounter, so you'd probably need to be around level 13 before you try it (4 levels above the encounter, making it close to trivial for a four-man party to overcome) so they can't hurt you too much the first time you approach them with the idea. You'd also probably need to reliably be able to beat a 15 HD Large creature in an Intimidate check. (They'd get a modified level check of 1d20+19 to resist, so you'd need a +19 to beat one of them half the time.) You'd especially want to make sure no other Dragons found out what you were doing. Alternatively, the Dominate Monster spell can simply make them do whatever you like. Creatures of the Dragon type that have an Intelligence score of 1 or 2 can be reared with a Handle Animal check at a -4 penalty, as described in the Handle Animal skill. (That's Core.) Intelligent creatures of the Dragon type other than True Dragons could probably be handled as I described above for True Dragons (including the fact that it's a seriously evil thing to do). I'm not aware of any feats that specifically address this concept.
Navonod Semaj 11-24-07, 11:16 PM	Breeding dragons an evil act? Silly. Well, not if you go about it right. Now, I can't say I have much of a clue as to how to manage the resultant offspring. Draconomicon, however, does cover how to deal with hatching an egg - be careful there, now. But as for getting them to mate? Intimidate checks? Dominate spells? Seriously, I thought you folks would have figured this out by now. It's simple, really. You need is a spellcaster who can cast Planar Binding or Planar Ally. Bring two dragons (one male, one female) together. Preferably about early evening, while the sun is low in the sky. A diplomacy check may be needed to keep said dragons from fighting if not fo the same color, but crossbreeds could get interesting, so don't discount the possibility. Serve said dragons a liberal dose of hard alchohol. For this purpose, wine or beer may be too low in content to bypass a dragon's immense fortitude save, perhaps several barrels of moonshine spiked with monstrous spider venom would serve better. Get the dragons to talk to one another, maybe some sort of conversation kicker to ease tension. Treasure hoards, ransacking cities, or favorite events in history are nice and non-pressuring ways to break the ice between the two. Make sure to have a nice meal prepared for the two - an appetizer of several sheep, followed by the main course of a dire elk with a side salad of a tree or two garnished in silver pieces. While the two are enjoying dinner together, this is where the cleric comes in. Cast you planar ally/binding spell to call forth the petitioner form of the Late Barry White from it's resting place on the upper planes. Mr White's Soul, like all summoned creatures, will expect payment for his services, so be sure to have a similar sized meal like the one you prepared for your two dragons available for his consumption. Once the meal (for both parties) is finished, order the Barry White to work his magic. All theese factors together, and it's just about assured that you will have an egg ready for hatching in short order. If this doesn't work (say, the male dragon is a lecherous jerk), and you manage to survive the fallout, consider moving to a different RPG and trying to breed a simpler form of creature. I've heard of amateurs having great success with chocobos! It's just a matter of gathering the right nuts, racing around like a nitwit, and shelling out $16.99 for the player's guide.
CrimsonDeath 11-24-07, 11:32 PM	Breeding dragons an evil act? Forcing sentient creatures to reproduce so that you can sell their offspring into a life of servitude? Yeah, sounds pretty evil to me.
Ace_of_time 11-24-07, 11:55 PM	You could just play a dragon and sell off your own off spring. I think that would be easier but might be more evil? :schemes:
Lokiyn 11-24-07, 11:59 PM	See, now i remember a campaign where the northern rules of an icy kingdom (made most of its money through rare northern plants and materials) where the judicial application of Curses, (Greater/lesser/Familial/etc) had linked each member of the nobility to a white dragon. Neither the Humans nor the Dragon half of the equation could live or breed without the others. (As in female nobility had female dragons and would become pregnant at the same time, but only of course with a member of the male nobility etc) Of course it lengthened the life spans and we glossed over most of it, mostly it was an excuse to have the nobility have white dragon mounts/companions. Although it would conceivable be possible if you worked with the breeding pair of dragons For example you work with a pair of dragons to make sure that thier offspring are cared for by appropriate peoples. Since dragons live so long the parents and the caretakers would generally work together, sort of like a basic school into humanoid society, once the caretaker dies the offspring is no longer required to stay and has gotten its most vulnerable portion of growing (first 50 years or so) out of the way with free food and care.
Evilholyguy 11-25-07, 09:44 AM	Forcing sentient creatures to reproduce so that you can sell their offspring into a life of servitude? Yeah, sounds pretty evil to me. I wasnt thinking along the lines of a servant. I was thinking maybe as a familiar or something like that. Heck if I don't sell them I could always foster them (read dragon magazine issue #320) any ways thanks for all the help everyone!
celestialkin 11-29-07, 09:30 AM	\If this doesn't work (say, the male dragon is a lecherous jerk), and you manage to survive the fallout, consider moving to a different RPG and trying to breed a simpler form of creature. Or, if the female dragon can polymorph tell the male dragon to get lost and continue the date yourself. A half-dragon egg is better than no egg. :D
celestialkin 11-29-07, 09:50 AM	See, now i remember a campaign where the northern rules of an icy kingdom (made most of its money through rare northern plants and materials) where the judicial application of Curses, (Greater/lesser/Familial/etc) had linked each member of the nobility to a white dragon. Neither the Humans nor the Dragon half of the equation could live or breed without the others. (As in female nobility had female dragons and would become pregnant at the same time, but only of course with a member of the male nobility etc) Of course it lengthened the life spans and we glossed over most of it, mostly it was an excuse to have the nobility have white dragon mounts/companions. Although it would conceivable be possible if you worked with the breeding pair of dragons For example you work with a pair of dragons to make sure that thier offspring are cared for by appropriate peoples. Since dragons live so long the parents and the caretakers would generally work together, sort of like a basic school into humanoid society, once the caretaker dies the offspring is no longer required to stay and has gotten its most vulnerable portion of growing (first 50 years or so) out of the way with free food and care. Take a look at Dragon Magazine #320 if you ever get a chance. It has a whole article on fostering a dragons, and why a dragon would trust one of it's eggs to another creature. Also, why not try something a bit simpler OP? Why not just steal/kidnap dragon eggs? Why go through the trouble of capturing and dominating full grown dragons when you can just skip to the egg selling? Also, you could try breeding Linorms (MM 2 .140). They seem to be desperate for a new generation of offspring, so it might help.
Evilholyguy 11-29-07, 02:34 PM	k thanks everyone!
Kiioro 11-29-07, 02:57 PM	Or, if the female dragon can polymorph tell the male dragon to get lost and continue the date yourself. A half-dragon egg is better than no egg. :D That's something that me and a few friends were asking ourselves. If the dragon(ess) polymorphs, doesn't that mean that your children would be human? If you wanted to have a half dragon you'd have to... well, mate with the dragoness in her original form. (That then deviated to a talk that I could continue in the Mature Topic forum, including how the Perform (Drums) skills become quite useful and such). But, skipping that... Does that mean she'd have to cast Enlarge on you (and with that I mean the whole person, don't get me wrong) and Reduce on her? Or do polymorphed dragons don't get their genes polymorphed?
celestialkin 11-29-07, 09:02 PM	That's something that me and a few friends were asking ourselves. If the dragon(ess) polymorphs, doesn't that mean that your children would be human? If you wanted to have a half dragon you'd have to... well, mate with the dragoness in her original form. I've wondered that myself. Maybe a few too many times.... Then again, love conquers all. (That then deviated to a talk that I could continue in the Mature Topic forum, including how the Perform (Drums) skills become quite useful and such). But, skipping that... Does that mean she'd have to cast Enlarge on you (and with that I mean the whole person, don't get me wrong) and Reduce on her? Or do polymorphed dragons don't get their genes polymorphed? Buy the Book of Erotic Fantasy (http://www.amazon.com/Book-Erotic-Fantasy-Gwendolyn-Kestrel/dp/097420451X). It even has the penalties for each size difference between the couple. But again, I really can't say much more here.:hides:
Kiioro 11-30-07, 02:24 PM	Already got the BoEF, hehehe... but the Drums thing was for the flavor or it. Another Dragon Breeding question. Red Dragon + Blue Dragon = Purple Dragon???
Ace_of_time 12-06-07, 12:20 AM	According to what I read you have to be one type and then add half dragon to that. Could be wrong.