Feat Creation- Favored Enemy PEACH [Archive] - Wizards Community

Feat Creation- Favored Enemy PEACH [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
AnimeSniper
04-24-08, 04:42 PM Okay a friend of another D&D Group asked me my thoughts on an FE Feat for all other classes other then the Ranger.
My friend she plays as a Rogue currently and has been sent alone do solo missions to help her group; getting the 7 keys for a noble vault that has an item that needs to be destroyed, etc.

My response/ idea was it could be done if the PC had fought/killed enough of a certain enemy type and met a few other requirements, though I don't have my notes right now cause her DM is reviewing them.

I figured that he could take the feat and Get 3 FE slots and every 3-5 Lvs he could increase the damage on them (+2 to +4) like the Ranger class. This feat could be taken numerous time giving access to more enemies.

Your thoughts are appreciated on this endeavor.
Jay_Ibero_911
04-24-08, 05:13 PM Favored Enemy [GENERAL]

Prerequisites: Knowledge (see below) 5 ranks, must have faced at least 3 creatures of the appropriate type (and subtype where applicable, see below)
Benefit: When you take this feat, pick one favored enemy from the ranger favored enemy list. This choice must be one that you have faced in combat at least 3 times, and be one that your knowledge skill pertains to. Once chosen this selection cannot be changed later. You gain a +2 bonus on Bluff, Listen, Sense Motive, Spot, and Survival checks when using these skills against creatures of this type. Likewise, you get a +2 bonus on weapon damage rolls against such creatures.

Special: You can gain this feat multiple times. Each time you take the feat, it applies to a new favored enemy and the bonuses against one of your favored enemies increases by 2. If a specific creature falls into more than one category of favored enemy, your bonuses do not stack; you simply use whichever bonus is higher.

A fighter may select Favored Enemy as one of his fighter bonus feats.

By spending enough feats and skill points, a character (especially a fighter) may be able to advance their favored enemy bonuses faster than a ranger, but it eats up precious feats and skill points.
Nathreet
04-24-08, 05:34 PM Granting FE exactly like a ranger doesn't seem too imba for a feat. But allowing a 2nd feat that stacks with the 1st one (like a ranger at 5th/10th/15th/20th level) should be "more expensive". I'd suggest 5 ranks in the appropriate knowledge skill for the 1st feat, 10 for the 2nd, 15 for the 3rd, and 20 for the 4th. That puts everyone else 1 level behind the ranger, and requires some knowledge skills that most martial classes will have to multi-class to get.

The knowledge skills required are:
knowledge(nature): animal, fey, giant, monstrous humanoid, plant, vermin
knowledge(dungeoneering): aberration, ooze
knowledge(the planes): elementals, all outsiders
knowledge(arcana): constructs, dragons, magical beasts
knowledge(local): all humanoids
knowledge(religion): undead

I pulled that directly from the knowledge skill description, so don't gimme any guff on the monster choices.
ciaran
04-24-08, 06:58 PM Piles of guff comin' atcha. ;)

Here's my suggestion:

Favored Enemy [GENERAL]
Prerequisites: 3 ranks in appropriate knowledge skill (per Nathreet's post), character level 3, must have fought at least 3 types of creatures of the coresponding type.

Benefit: The character gains a +2 bonus on Bluff, Listen, Sense Motive, Spot, and Survival checks when using these skills against creatures of this type. Likewise, he gets a +2 bonus on weapon damage rolls against such creatures.

Special: A fighter may select Favored Enemy as one of his fighter bonus feats. You can gain this feat multiple times. Its effects do not stack. Each time you take the feat, it applies to a new type of creature.

Additional feats would add to your previous choices, but not give you a new enemy for free like an actual ranger... higher prereqs, blah, blah blah. You would also qualify for anything requires the Favered Enemy class feature.
TekknoMancer
04-24-08, 10:18 PM Well, the generic classes (http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/35/sovelior_sage/unearthedNewClasses.html) in Unearthed Arcana allows favored enemy as one of the uses for bonus feats. I would just use that for the feat.
dman11235
04-25-08, 12:23 AM Wait, you're giving out a class feature as a feat? And this is a good idea why? It's a class feature for a reason, so you have to take the class. And there is nothing wrong with a rogue taking a level or two in ranger. In fact, it can be quite a nice two level dip for either a TWF rogue or an archery rogue (yes, they do exist, and yes, some are not swift hunters).
aelryinth
04-25-08, 11:34 AM Wait, you're giving out a class feature as a feat? And this is a good idea why? It's a class feature for a reason, so you have to take the class. And there is nothing wrong with a rogue taking a level or two in ranger. In fact, it can be quite a nice two level dip for either a TWF rogue or an archery rogue (yes, they do exist, and yes, some are not swift hunters).

My rebuttal is....you're giving out bonus feats as class features? BUt those are available to fighters! They are bonus feats for a reason, so you have to take the class to get them!

Class features are nothing special. And it already exists as a feat. THE FR campaign has a level 1 feat where you can take a FE based on the area you grew up in...and then other FE feats exist that can advance it from there.

REally, this is hardly imbalanced, given how iffy FE is to begin with.

===Aelryinth
dman11235
04-25-08, 01:14 PM aelrynth: You know my stance on fighters. That is the reason they are not a very well designed class (well, the main reason).

Note how I didn't say it wasn't balanced, I said it was a bad idea. And regional feats are a little different than normal feats (and usually aren't that powerful, I can find some major cheese with that feat). Besides, if you give out FE as a feat, you'd have straight scouts with the Swift Hunter feat, letting them have an additional FE over the ranger/scout mix, and other just plain wrong things. And no, this does not make them feat starved, they have bonus feats every 4 levels, and they'd be able to take this feat before the massive amounts of feats that they can't take until later.

Once again, class features as feats are bad ideas in normal campaign settings. If you're using the generic classes, well, it's still not class features as feats per se, but it's similar.
aelryinth
04-26-08, 01:04 PM Swift Hunter is an irrelevant argument. You still have to have at least one ranger level for ranger levels to stack. 0 ranger levels because you got FE from a feat still means you don't have any ranger levels, ergo, nothing stacks and you don't qualify.

The whole 'exclusivity' on class features vs feats is an argument in and of itself, and we're on opposite sides. I have no problem with feats existing for pretty much any dippable class feature in the game...it's a balance issue. Indeed, feats are usually PRICIER to use then dipping a class, given all the other freebies you can get for dipping. High level abilities? Maybe. But if classes can grab high level fighter feats, I have no problem with fighters being able to grab high level class features. *** for Tat, as they say.

==Aelryinth
dman11235
04-26-08, 03:02 PM If you have 0 apples and then add 5, do you have no apples? If you have 0 levels and add 5, do you have 0 levels?
Grey_Mage
04-26-08, 03:38 PM Wait, you're giving out a class feature as a feat? And this is a good idea why? It's a class feature for a reason, so you have to take the class. And there is nothing wrong with a rogue taking a level or two in ranger. In fact, it can be quite a nice two level dip for either a TWF rogue or an archery rogue (yes, they do exist, and yes, some are not swift hunters).

have you looked at Forgotten realms? A number of their regional feats are favored enemy abilities- in fact they state it, and that they stack with favored enemy. Alot of them are far more powerful however. Luck of heros, tireless, saddleback, blooded even. Compare those to the most high powered feats you can find in eberron, or greyhawk and they come out looking pretty strong for most characters. Well, theres a few that are more powerful from Greyhawk, but only a couple. Unfortuneatly there doesnt appear to be a FE for undead *sighs*.
dman11235
04-26-08, 04:27 PM Once again, how are they good ideas? Besides, regional feats/=general feats. And FR specific makes it even worse. I already addressed this concern if you would have read the rest of the thread. Also, all the regional feats I've seen (which is to say not many, I don't ever use premade settings) have been something like a bonus to a specific skill.
aelryinth
04-27-08, 07:12 PM Regional feats are actually more along the power level of what feats should be at. 4thE made that pretty clear by how it is ramping up feats.

And if you have no ranger levels, and are required to have ranger levels so that they can stack with something else, how is that working? You're assuming the FE is the only pre-req...I'm assuming actual scout and ranger levels are, or the feat doesn't work.

In other words, if you must have RL>0 to get RL+5, and you have RL=0, you don't get +5, yes?

===Aelryinth
dman11235
04-27-08, 07:19 PM Wait, you are assuming that ranger levels are required? Go read the feat. I see no mention of ranger levels required. I see 1 favoured enemy and 1d6/+1 AC skirmish. And since when is 0 not a number? 0+5=5. Not 0. If you have 0 ranger levels, and 10 scout levels, 0+10 is 10, so you have 10 ranger levels for FE.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
AnimeSniper 04-24-08, 04:42 PM	Okay a friend of another D&D Group asked me my thoughts on an FE Feat for all other classes other then the Ranger. My friend she plays as a Rogue currently and has been sent alone do solo missions to help her group; getting the 7 keys for a noble vault that has an item that needs to be destroyed, etc. My response/ idea was it could be done if the PC had fought/killed enough of a certain enemy type and met a few other requirements, though I don't have my notes right now cause her DM is reviewing them. I figured that he could take the feat and Get 3 FE slots and every 3-5 Lvs he could increase the damage on them (+2 to +4) like the Ranger class. This feat could be taken numerous time giving access to more enemies. Your thoughts are appreciated on this endeavor.
Jay_Ibero_911 04-24-08, 05:13 PM	Favored Enemy [GENERAL] Prerequisites: Knowledge (see below) 5 ranks, must have faced at least 3 creatures of the appropriate type (and subtype where applicable, see below) Benefit: When you take this feat, pick one favored enemy from the ranger favored enemy list. This choice must be one that you have faced in combat at least 3 times, and be one that your knowledge skill pertains to. Once chosen this selection cannot be changed later. You gain a +2 bonus on Bluff, Listen, Sense Motive, Spot, and Survival checks when using these skills against creatures of this type. Likewise, you get a +2 bonus on weapon damage rolls against such creatures. Special: You can gain this feat multiple times. Each time you take the feat, it applies to a new favored enemy and the bonuses against one of your favored enemies increases by 2. If a specific creature falls into more than one category of favored enemy, your bonuses do not stack; you simply use whichever bonus is higher. A fighter may select Favored Enemy as one of his fighter bonus feats. By spending enough feats and skill points, a character (especially a fighter) may be able to advance their favored enemy bonuses faster than a ranger, but it eats up precious feats and skill points.
Nathreet 04-24-08, 05:34 PM	Granting FE exactly like a ranger doesn't seem too imba for a feat. But allowing a 2nd feat that stacks with the 1st one (like a ranger at 5th/10th/15th/20th level) should be "more expensive". I'd suggest 5 ranks in the appropriate knowledge skill for the 1st feat, 10 for the 2nd, 15 for the 3rd, and 20 for the 4th. That puts everyone else 1 level behind the ranger, and requires some knowledge skills that most martial classes will have to multi-class to get. The knowledge skills required are: knowledge(nature): animal, fey, giant, monstrous humanoid, plant, vermin knowledge(dungeoneering): aberration, ooze knowledge(the planes): elementals, all outsiders knowledge(arcana): constructs, dragons, magical beasts knowledge(local): all humanoids knowledge(religion): undead I pulled that directly from the knowledge skill description, so don't gimme any guff on the monster choices.
ciaran 04-24-08, 06:58 PM	Piles of guff comin' atcha. ;) Here's my suggestion: Favored Enemy [GENERAL] Prerequisites: 3 ranks in appropriate knowledge skill (per Nathreet's post), character level 3, must have fought at least 3 types of creatures of the coresponding type. Benefit: The character gains a +2 bonus on Bluff, Listen, Sense Motive, Spot, and Survival checks when using these skills against creatures of this type. Likewise, he gets a +2 bonus on weapon damage rolls against such creatures. Special: A fighter may select Favored Enemy as one of his fighter bonus feats. You can gain this feat multiple times. Its effects do not stack. Each time you take the feat, it applies to a new type of creature. Additional feats would add to your previous choices, but not give you a new enemy for free like an actual ranger... higher prereqs, blah, blah blah. You would also qualify for anything requires the Favered Enemy class feature.
TekknoMancer 04-24-08, 10:18 PM	Well, the generic classes (http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/35/sovelior_sage/unearthedNewClasses.html) in Unearthed Arcana allows favored enemy as one of the uses for bonus feats. I would just use that for the feat.
dman11235 04-25-08, 12:23 AM	Wait, you're giving out a class feature as a feat? And this is a good idea why? It's a class feature for a reason, so you have to take the class. And there is nothing wrong with a rogue taking a level or two in ranger. In fact, it can be quite a nice two level dip for either a TWF rogue or an archery rogue (yes, they do exist, and yes, some are not swift hunters).
aelryinth 04-25-08, 11:34 AM	Wait, you're giving out a class feature as a feat? And this is a good idea why? It's a class feature for a reason, so you have to take the class. And there is nothing wrong with a rogue taking a level or two in ranger. In fact, it can be quite a nice two level dip for either a TWF rogue or an archery rogue (yes, they do exist, and yes, some are not swift hunters). My rebuttal is....you're giving out bonus feats as class features? BUt those are available to fighters! They are bonus feats for a reason, so you have to take the class to get them! Class features are nothing special. And it already exists as a feat. THE FR campaign has a level 1 feat where you can take a FE based on the area you grew up in...and then other FE feats exist that can advance it from there. REally, this is hardly imbalanced, given how iffy FE is to begin with. ===Aelryinth
dman11235 04-25-08, 01:14 PM	aelrynth: You know my stance on fighters. That is the reason they are not a very well designed class (well, the main reason). Note how I didn't say it wasn't balanced, I said it was a bad idea. And regional feats are a little different than normal feats (and usually aren't that powerful, I can find some major cheese with that feat). Besides, if you give out FE as a feat, you'd have straight scouts with the Swift Hunter feat, letting them have an additional FE over the ranger/scout mix, and other just plain wrong things. And no, this does not make them feat starved, they have bonus feats every 4 levels, and they'd be able to take this feat before the massive amounts of feats that they can't take until later. Once again, class features as feats are bad ideas in normal campaign settings. If you're using the generic classes, well, it's still not class features as feats per se, but it's similar.
aelryinth 04-26-08, 01:04 PM	Swift Hunter is an irrelevant argument. You still have to have at least one ranger level for ranger levels to stack. 0 ranger levels because you got FE from a feat still means you don't have any ranger levels, ergo, nothing stacks and you don't qualify. The whole 'exclusivity' on class features vs feats is an argument in and of itself, and we're on opposite sides. I have no problem with feats existing for pretty much any dippable class feature in the game...it's a balance issue. Indeed, feats are usually PRICIER to use then dipping a class, given all the other freebies you can get for dipping. High level abilities? Maybe. But if classes can grab high level fighter feats, I have no problem with fighters being able to grab high level class features. *** for Tat, as they say. ==Aelryinth
dman11235 04-26-08, 03:02 PM	If you have 0 apples and then add 5, do you have no apples? If you have 0 levels and add 5, do you have 0 levels?
Grey_Mage 04-26-08, 03:38 PM	Wait, you're giving out a class feature as a feat? And this is a good idea why? It's a class feature for a reason, so you have to take the class. And there is nothing wrong with a rogue taking a level or two in ranger. In fact, it can be quite a nice two level dip for either a TWF rogue or an archery rogue (yes, they do exist, and yes, some are not swift hunters). have you looked at Forgotten realms? A number of their regional feats are favored enemy abilities- in fact they state it, and that they stack with favored enemy. Alot of them are far more powerful however. Luck of heros, tireless, saddleback, blooded even. Compare those to the most high powered feats you can find in eberron, or greyhawk and they come out looking pretty strong for most characters. Well, theres a few that are more powerful from Greyhawk, but only a couple. Unfortuneatly there doesnt appear to be a FE for undead sighs.
dman11235 04-26-08, 04:27 PM	Once again, how are they good ideas? Besides, regional feats/=general feats. And FR specific makes it even worse. I already addressed this concern if you would have read the rest of the thread. Also, all the regional feats I've seen (which is to say not many, I don't ever use premade settings) have been something like a bonus to a specific skill.
aelryinth 04-27-08, 07:12 PM	Regional feats are actually more along the power level of what feats should be at. 4thE made that pretty clear by how it is ramping up feats. And if you have no ranger levels, and are required to have ranger levels so that they can stack with something else, how is that working? You're assuming the FE is the only pre-req...I'm assuming actual scout and ranger levels are, or the feat doesn't work. In other words, if you must have RL>0 to get RL+5, and you have RL=0, you don't get +5, yes? ===Aelryinth
dman11235 04-27-08, 07:19 PM	Wait, you are assuming that ranger levels are required? Go read the feat. I see no mention of ranger levels required. I see 1 favoured enemy and 1d6/+1 AC skirmish. And since when is 0 not a number? 0+5=5. Not 0. If you have 0 ranger levels, and 10 scout levels, 0+10 is 10, so you have 10 ranger levels for FE.