Good low-level cleric feats? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Good low-level cleric feats? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Elrond Hubbard
06-11-07, 02:44 PM About to level up my human cleric to 3rd level. Eberron setting. Feats I have so far are Negotiator (for role-playing purposes) and Least Dragonmark, Sentinel (House Deneith). Domains are Community and Healing.

Character has no Dex. bonus but otherwise has pretty well-rounded stats. Pretty much using him as a healer first, melee fighter second. Don't yet know if I'll need to do much turning in this setting.

I have been planning to take Combat Casting, but I'm not sure.

Any recommendations for feats that are good long-term choices, but would still be useful right away?

Thanks.
dhaga
06-11-07, 04:24 PM If you plan on casting in and around combat, Combat Casting is always a good idea. It really sucks to fizzle a healing spell, especially when a companion is about to drop (possibly dead).
tete
06-11-07, 04:40 PM Improved Initiative - Cast first ask questions later!
Lightning Reflexes - Because your ref save is umm poor.
tyrecian
06-11-07, 10:04 PM you could always start down the DMM/persistent route with Extend Spell Metamagic. It helps to have that extra time in some of your buffs, especially at low levels, and it preps you to take persistent spell later.

You could also take Extra Turning, to also prep you for the 24 hour buffs later. it is also nice to have the ability to burn a few extra turn attempts a day at low levels to get that extra power going up against low undead.

Improved init is always a nice option. Casting First is nice, but with a cleric i have always found my PCs to be reactive rather than needing to go first, i prefer to go after everyone else so that i know where my heals and buffs need be applied. II can wait for me until later levels for my clerics.

Combat Casting is also a nice feat, but often as a cleric you will not be in combat so much that you can't get around without the 5' step, and besides have you maxxed out your concentration yet? I dunno, never really found that +4 to be all that compelling for a feat slot. Not a bad choice, but i would prefer the off-chance failure for flavor and a more powerful feat.

Augment Healing from the CompDivine is another fantastic feat that your players will thank you for. At later levels the +2 per level (spell) really can start to add up.
ratarang
06-12-07, 12:22 AM Never get Combat Casting unless it's a prerequisite for a prestige class or feat. Get Skill Focus:Concentration instead.
tyrecian
06-12-07, 02:31 AM i dont understand, why? SF conc gives you +3

CC gives you +4 and you can attempt to cast in a grapple w/out provoking? You mean that it might be better cause SF allows +3 always when using that skill and CC is only for casting purposes?

i dunno...
tete
06-12-07, 10:04 AM yes thats what he means, I would not take either unless you have a low INT score. You can just fill it with ranks and be good enough. I would take feats to fill things you suck at unless its part of your character to have these flaws. From what you have said that would mean DEX helping feats.
Goat Face
06-12-07, 10:38 AM Alot of prime feats have already been suggested, so I'll suggest Scribe Scroll.

I never regreted taking it with any of the clerics I've played. Extra spells always come in handy...and dependant on your faith, and roleplay, they can make excellent, always welcome, gifts to bestow upon the needy in the name of your god...but that is, of course, up to you.
mostholy2
06-12-07, 11:50 AM For clerics with good CHA, Divine Spell Power from CDiv is very nice considering most of the cleric buff spells are highly CL dependent for their effects.

As the healer in the party Divine Ward from PHB2 is a very nice feat to alleviate the requirement of having to touch the allies you are trying to heal. If you have really good domain spells Domain Spontaneity from CDiv allows you to convert prepared spells into spells on your domain list.
ratarang
06-12-07, 03:27 PM i dont understand, why? SF conc gives you +3

CC gives you +4 and you can attempt to cast in a grapple w/out provoking? You mean that it might be better cause SF allows +3 always when using that skill and CC is only for casting purposes?

i dunno...

SF:C does everything CC does (the grapple bonus isn't specific to CC, it's only +1 over SF:C). But tete is right, I wouldn't take either if you expect the game to go beyond level 6 or so.
Elrond Hubbard
06-12-07, 03:55 PM Thanks, all. Very good suggestions.

In the past I have always taken Combat Casting at low levels without thinking about it. But really it only makes a difference at low levels - once you get your ranks up, it's less and less important. And yes - 5' steps can work wonders in this context.

Extend Spell will be great, but seeing as I'm just now getting access to decent buffs it's really not worth it yet. Don't want to memorize Shield of Faith or Pro. from Evil as 2nd level spells.

Extra Turning will be taken at some point. I'll need that for some feats I would want later... just don't know if I want to take it now or not.

Scribe Scroll is a GREAT suggestion. Never even considered it. I would be eligible for Brew Potion also, but the overall cost of scrolls is so low this might be the feat to go with.

Again, thanks for all the suggestions.
BugHunter
06-12-07, 09:05 PM you could always start down the DMM/persistent route with Extend Spell Metamagic. It helps to have that extra time in some of your buffs, especially at low levels, and it preps you to take persistent spell later.

If you go do the DMM/persistent route you must have the persistent feat before taking DMM this can be found in the CD errata.
tyrecian
06-12-07, 10:54 PM yes but you need Extend to get persistent which is why i was saying taking extend will set him on that route yes?

There is a domain that gives Extend as a power, but i dont think he has it (cant remember).

I understand that buffs at 2nd level are tough with extend, i was thinking about the DMM/Pesistant route anyways, shield other and the bear's endurance are my fav's for a buffing/healing cleric at 2nd level. Bull's strength is also badass :)

ummm Scribe scroll is a great suggestion. I took it with a cleric i played recently (which eventually got killed by an Illythid) and found that it is really nice to be able to put buffs on scrolls, as well as removal spells (like at your level delay poison and lesser restoration). Later too, there are really nice spells that you really would rather have in a HHH that you can get to with a move action rather than having a dedicated spell slot.

As far as it goes, i also took craft wand, although in retrospect it might have been better to take Craft Wondrous Item. However, if you are thinking of going the creation route, wondrous item will cut down on your price issues and makes a great feat if you have a wizard in party who can cast spells into your items as well... meaning you can make almost anything at 50% of price. Remember to charge 10% to your party members so you can get yourself that ring of freedom of movement later. :D

SScroll is a great suggestion, you will never be disappointed, unless your DM refuses to give you downtime (mine was running a module, so i had trouble) it might warrant discussing with the GM/DM before you decide on creation, because often if the DM is taken by surprise they can nerf your feat with circumstance... so check first... much like leadership, the creation feats just rub some DMs the wrong way.
JulesCARV
06-12-07, 11:07 PM Maybe you could take Worldly Focus?
Father Dale
06-13-07, 10:48 AM Its all been set forth above, but for any good-aligned cleric, three feats that I ALWAYS give them are:

Augmented Healing
Scribe Scroll
Extend Spell

For clerics who don't channel positive energy I won't take augmented healing, but still take the other two.

Augmented Healing is just too good for a healer. Its like Power Attack for the Barbarian, its almost a necessity.

Scribe Scroll is fantastic for any divine caster who doesn't have a limited number of spells known. So many of those "really need it now but didn't prepare it today" spells are out there for the cleric.

Extend Spell can work wonders with many cleric buffs, esepcially at higher levels and the 10-min/level buffs like Freedom of Movement and Air Walk. At 16th lvl an Extended Freedom of Movement lasts for 320 mins, or over 5 hours. Its also good for Heroes Feast, making it last for 24 hours. And it also works good on 24 hour spells like Energy Immunity or Mind Blank (if you get it from a domain).

(You can get real cheesy with this if you know beforehand that you have a full day to prepare before heading out. Just prepare a bunch of Extended 24 hours buffs and cast on the party. They will last for 2 days, so you can buff the party on day one and have a full spell list ready to go on day two.

And finally almost every cleric I make will take Domain Spontaneity at least once. It just opens up so many options as far as spell preparation; I can't imagine playing a higher level cleric without it.
Salick
06-13-07, 11:24 AM The feat sacred purification from PHII allows you to use turn undead to heal 1d8+Cha in a 60' burst and also to damage undead a like amount. A friend has this feat in a low lvl game I am currently playing and it makes a huge difference healing after combats.
BW0222
06-13-07, 01:25 PM tyrecian,

i dont understand, why? SF conc gives you +3

CC gives you +4 and you can attempt to cast in a grapple w/out provoking? You mean that it might be better cause SF allows +3 always when using that skill and CC is only for casting purposes?

Combat casting does not allow you to cast spells in a grapple without provoking. If only gives you a +4 when casting defensively.

You can not cast any spell in a grapple if it has somatic components. In adddion, spells with material components require you to get the component into your hand which is typically an opposed grapple check. Next, it is a DC 20 + spell level check to get the spell off due to violent motion. Finally, you provoke provided from anyone threaten your square -- which often includes your opponent if he has a light or natural weapon.

Skill focus concentration is a constant +3. It applies in all cases. Casting while riding, during a wind storm, if you are taking continuous damage, folks who ready attacks against you, when hit during a full round spell, etc. The 1 difference in the specific case of casting defensively is easily made up for all the other cases when you have it.

Skill focus concentration is a great feat for any caster with a feat to spare. Bad guys love readying action for when you are spellcasting or tossing up continuous damaging spells to try to prevent casters from getting their spells off.

i dunno...
Elrond Hubbard
06-13-07, 02:14 PM Didn't know about Augment Healing. That may be the best feat at this point for my character, since it looks like downtime might be at a premium for a while. Awfully long wait for another feat, though, and it would be nice to scribe some scrolls in the meantime....

Sacred Purification is great but I would need Sacred Healing first, which is basically a half-assed version of Augment Healing. Doesn't look like it's worth it.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Elrond Hubbard 06-11-07, 02:44 PM	About to level up my human cleric to 3rd level. Eberron setting. Feats I have so far are Negotiator (for role-playing purposes) and Least Dragonmark, Sentinel (House Deneith). Domains are Community and Healing. Character has no Dex. bonus but otherwise has pretty well-rounded stats. Pretty much using him as a healer first, melee fighter second. Don't yet know if I'll need to do much turning in this setting. I have been planning to take Combat Casting, but I'm not sure. Any recommendations for feats that are good long-term choices, but would still be useful right away? Thanks.
dhaga 06-11-07, 04:24 PM	If you plan on casting in and around combat, Combat Casting is always a good idea. It really sucks to fizzle a healing spell, especially when a companion is about to drop (possibly dead).
tete 06-11-07, 04:40 PM	Improved Initiative - Cast first ask questions later! Lightning Reflexes - Because your ref save is umm poor.
tyrecian 06-11-07, 10:04 PM	you could always start down the DMM/persistent route with Extend Spell Metamagic. It helps to have that extra time in some of your buffs, especially at low levels, and it preps you to take persistent spell later. You could also take Extra Turning, to also prep you for the 24 hour buffs later. it is also nice to have the ability to burn a few extra turn attempts a day at low levels to get that extra power going up against low undead. Improved init is always a nice option. Casting First is nice, but with a cleric i have always found my PCs to be reactive rather than needing to go first, i prefer to go after everyone else so that i know where my heals and buffs need be applied. II can wait for me until later levels for my clerics. Combat Casting is also a nice feat, but often as a cleric you will not be in combat so much that you can't get around without the 5' step, and besides have you maxxed out your concentration yet? I dunno, never really found that +4 to be all that compelling for a feat slot. Not a bad choice, but i would prefer the off-chance failure for flavor and a more powerful feat. Augment Healing from the CompDivine is another fantastic feat that your players will thank you for. At later levels the +2 per level (spell) really can start to add up.
ratarang 06-12-07, 12:22 AM	Never get Combat Casting unless it's a prerequisite for a prestige class or feat. Get Skill Focus:Concentration instead.
tyrecian 06-12-07, 02:31 AM	i dont understand, why? SF conc gives you +3 CC gives you +4 and you can attempt to cast in a grapple w/out provoking? You mean that it might be better cause SF allows +3 always when using that skill and CC is only for casting purposes? i dunno...
tete 06-12-07, 10:04 AM	yes thats what he means, I would not take either unless you have a low INT score. You can just fill it with ranks and be good enough. I would take feats to fill things you suck at unless its part of your character to have these flaws. From what you have said that would mean DEX helping feats.
Goat Face 06-12-07, 10:38 AM	Alot of prime feats have already been suggested, so I'll suggest Scribe Scroll. I never regreted taking it with any of the clerics I've played. Extra spells always come in handy...and dependant on your faith, and roleplay, they can make excellent, always welcome, gifts to bestow upon the needy in the name of your god...but that is, of course, up to you.
mostholy2 06-12-07, 11:50 AM	For clerics with good CHA, Divine Spell Power from CDiv is very nice considering most of the cleric buff spells are highly CL dependent for their effects. As the healer in the party Divine Ward from PHB2 is a very nice feat to alleviate the requirement of having to touch the allies you are trying to heal. If you have really good domain spells Domain Spontaneity from CDiv allows you to convert prepared spells into spells on your domain list.
ratarang 06-12-07, 03:27 PM	i dont understand, why? SF conc gives you +3 CC gives you +4 and you can attempt to cast in a grapple w/out provoking? You mean that it might be better cause SF allows +3 always when using that skill and CC is only for casting purposes? i dunno... SF:C does everything CC does (the grapple bonus isn't specific to CC, it's only +1 over SF:C). But tete is right, I wouldn't take either if you expect the game to go beyond level 6 or so.
Elrond Hubbard 06-12-07, 03:55 PM	Thanks, all. Very good suggestions. In the past I have always taken Combat Casting at low levels without thinking about it. But really it only makes a difference at low levels - once you get your ranks up, it's less and less important. And yes - 5' steps can work wonders in this context. Extend Spell will be great, but seeing as I'm just now getting access to decent buffs it's really not worth it yet. Don't want to memorize Shield of Faith or Pro. from Evil as 2nd level spells. Extra Turning will be taken at some point. I'll need that for some feats I would want later... just don't know if I want to take it now or not. Scribe Scroll is a GREAT suggestion. Never even considered it. I would be eligible for Brew Potion also, but the overall cost of scrolls is so low this might be the feat to go with. Again, thanks for all the suggestions.
BugHunter 06-12-07, 09:05 PM	you could always start down the DMM/persistent route with Extend Spell Metamagic. It helps to have that extra time in some of your buffs, especially at low levels, and it preps you to take persistent spell later. If you go do the DMM/persistent route you must have the persistent feat before taking DMM this can be found in the CD errata.
tyrecian 06-12-07, 10:54 PM	yes but you need Extend to get persistent which is why i was saying taking extend will set him on that route yes? There is a domain that gives Extend as a power, but i dont think he has it (cant remember). I understand that buffs at 2nd level are tough with extend, i was thinking about the DMM/Pesistant route anyways, shield other and the bear's endurance are my fav's for a buffing/healing cleric at 2nd level. Bull's strength is also badass :) ummm Scribe scroll is a great suggestion. I took it with a cleric i played recently (which eventually got killed by an Illythid) and found that it is really nice to be able to put buffs on scrolls, as well as removal spells (like at your level delay poison and lesser restoration). Later too, there are really nice spells that you really would rather have in a HHH that you can get to with a move action rather than having a dedicated spell slot. As far as it goes, i also took craft wand, although in retrospect it might have been better to take Craft Wondrous Item. However, if you are thinking of going the creation route, wondrous item will cut down on your price issues and makes a great feat if you have a wizard in party who can cast spells into your items as well... meaning you can make almost anything at 50% of price. Remember to charge 10% to your party members so you can get yourself that ring of freedom of movement later. :D SScroll is a great suggestion, you will never be disappointed, unless your DM refuses to give you downtime (mine was running a module, so i had trouble) it might warrant discussing with the GM/DM before you decide on creation, because often if the DM is taken by surprise they can nerf your feat with circumstance... so check first... much like leadership, the creation feats just rub some DMs the wrong way.
JulesCARV 06-12-07, 11:07 PM	Maybe you could take Worldly Focus?
Father Dale 06-13-07, 10:48 AM	Its all been set forth above, but for any good-aligned cleric, three feats that I ALWAYS give them are: Augmented Healing Scribe Scroll Extend Spell For clerics who don't channel positive energy I won't take augmented healing, but still take the other two. Augmented Healing is just too good for a healer. Its like Power Attack for the Barbarian, its almost a necessity. Scribe Scroll is fantastic for any divine caster who doesn't have a limited number of spells known. So many of those "really need it now but didn't prepare it today" spells are out there for the cleric. Extend Spell can work wonders with many cleric buffs, esepcially at higher levels and the 10-min/level buffs like Freedom of Movement and Air Walk. At 16th lvl an Extended Freedom of Movement lasts for 320 mins, or over 5 hours. Its also good for Heroes Feast, making it last for 24 hours. And it also works good on 24 hour spells like Energy Immunity or Mind Blank (if you get it from a domain). (You can get real cheesy with this if you know beforehand that you have a full day to prepare before heading out. Just prepare a bunch of Extended 24 hours buffs and cast on the party. They will last for 2 days, so you can buff the party on day one and have a full spell list ready to go on day two. And finally almost every cleric I make will take Domain Spontaneity at least once. It just opens up so many options as far as spell preparation; I can't imagine playing a higher level cleric without it.
Salick 06-13-07, 11:24 AM	The feat sacred purification from PHII allows you to use turn undead to heal 1d8+Cha in a 60' burst and also to damage undead a like amount. A friend has this feat in a low lvl game I am currently playing and it makes a huge difference healing after combats.
BW0222 06-13-07, 01:25 PM	tyrecian, i dont understand, why? SF conc gives you +3 CC gives you +4 and you can attempt to cast in a grapple w/out provoking? You mean that it might be better cause SF allows +3 always when using that skill and CC is only for casting purposes? Combat casting does not allow you to cast spells in a grapple without provoking. If only gives you a +4 when casting defensively. You can not cast any spell in a grapple if it has somatic components. In adddion, spells with material components require you to get the component into your hand which is typically an opposed grapple check. Next, it is a DC 20 + spell level check to get the spell off due to violent motion. Finally, you provoke provided from anyone threaten your square -- which often includes your opponent if he has a light or natural weapon. Skill focus concentration is a constant +3. It applies in all cases. Casting while riding, during a wind storm, if you are taking continuous damage, folks who ready attacks against you, when hit during a full round spell, etc. The 1 difference in the specific case of casting defensively is easily made up for all the other cases when you have it. Skill focus concentration is a great feat for any caster with a feat to spare. Bad guys love readying action for when you are spellcasting or tossing up continuous damaging spells to try to prevent casters from getting their spells off. i dunno...
Elrond Hubbard 06-13-07, 02:14 PM	Didn't know about Augment Healing. That may be the best feat at this point for my character, since it looks like downtime might be at a premium for a while. Awfully long wait for another feat, though, and it would be nice to scribe some scrolls in the meantime.... Sacred Purification is great but I would need Sacred Healing first, which is basically a half-assed version of Augment Healing. Doesn't look like it's worth it.