Post/Author/DateTime	Post
honda305 04-02-07, 10:58 PM	Ok...I am playing a 6th level Dragon Shaman (direct out of the PHBII). BAB +4, STR is 14 (+2) and using a morning star. I have Power Attack and Two Weapon Fighting. I planned on him being more of a tank than he really should be (some of that Draconian bravado!). If he does a full round attack, swinging once with the morning star and then shield bashing, how does that work? I am assuming the Shield does 1d3 damage (I have it set up with spikes, but I may need a DMs call, as the PHB says that the spikes turn the shield into a Marial Weapon and Dragon Shamans are only proficient with simple weapons). According to PHB pg. 160, with Two Weapon Fighting, he is normally at -2/-2 to HIT before STR and BAB. So if he goes FULL ROUND ATTACK with morningstar swing and shield bash, how does POWER ATTACK work? I would think I could say -4 to HIT from BAB with morningstar and it would be a total of +0 to hit (STR +2 cancels out -2 for fighting with both weapons). If he hits, it would be 1d8 + 6 (+2 STR, +4 from Power Attack) Then he swings the Shield. It is +4 to hit (-2 for fighting with 2 weapons, +2 strength, +4 BAB) and if it hits it is 1d3 + 2 (Str only) Because Power Attack says I cannot add the BAB subtracted to damage from the light weapon. HOWEVER....if I choose to POWER ATTACK with the morning star, do I lose the corresponding BAB to the shield attack EVEN THOUGH I cannot use the extra damage? Sorry for the confusion...I am back into D&D after a long hiatus since 1st edition.
1hitparry 04-03-07, 12:13 AM	You are correct. Even though you take a penalty to attack even on your off hand, you do not gain any extra damage from power attack assuming you're using a light weapon. This is why most people do not combine power attack and two weapon fighting. Generally there's the two weapon fighting school, which focuses on poisons, sneak attack, and other added damage; and then there's the two handed fighting school, which focuses on maxing damage with power attack, taking advantage of the 1:2 power attack ratio.
antsterr 04-03-07, 02:15 AM	sigh. I love the dragon shaman class but it's very underpowered with out a level of barbarian or fighter tossed in the build. I played one up to barbarian 1 / dragon shaman 6. Not one class skill is weakened by medium or heavy armour and what is the point of a d10 hit die but only simple weapons. [/end rant] Your shield hand is your off hand and only gets 1/2 your str bonus to damage. 1d3+1 Also, any shield used as a weapon is a martial weapon. Additionally, you will loose the bonus to AC given to you by your shield for the next round after performing a shield bash. It's a cool idea, but a I think dragon shaman is the wrong class for that kind of combat.
DemonMonkeyBoy 04-03-07, 04:02 AM	At third lvl look up Over sized TWF in CW. It will allow you to use two morningstars and get full power attack to boot.
Frugal 04-03-07, 10:56 AM	At third lvl look up Over sized TWF in CW. It will allow you to use two morningstars and get full power attack to boot. Not necessarily, depends on how you interpret the "as if it were a light weapon" statement. And to clarify, if you use power attack you take the minus for all attacks in the round, even those that get no benefit to the damage (light weapons).
Frugal 04-03-07, 10:58 AM	Just to add the appropriate part of the power attack feat: You can’t add the bonus from Power Attack to the damage dealt with a light weapon (except with unarmed strikes or natural weapon attacks), even though the penalty on attack rolls still applies. Emphasis mine.
coral85 04-03-07, 11:52 AM	Shields aren't light weapons. They're one handed weapons considered to be light weapons for the purpose of two weapon fighting only right? Wouldn't this mean they recieve two weapon fighting penalties as a light weapon, but because they're one handed weapons they recieve the benefit of power attack? Also, don't forget that off-hand attacks only deal 1/2 str. Don't forget about improve shield bash if you plan on using your shield as an off-hand weapon often, it'll let you keep that all-too-important shield AC.
Frugal 04-03-07, 12:00 PM	Shields aren't light weapons. They're one handed weapons considered to be light weapons for the purpose of two weapon fighting only right? Wouldn't this mean they recieve two weapon fighting penalties as a light weapon, but because they're one handed weapons they recieve the benefit of power attack? Also, don't forget that off-hand attacks only deal 1/2 str. Don't forget about improve shield bash if you plan on using your shield as an off-hand weapon often, it'll let you keep that all-too-important shield AC. Nope, according to the weapon table a light shield is a light weapon and a heavy shield is a one-handed weapon. The rules for shield bash bear this out. I also note that they're both martial weapons so you still have proficiency issues don't you?
coral85 04-03-07, 12:16 PM	Okay, thanks for the clarification, I thought I built an epic Fighter all wrong!