How to best use Arcane Strike? [Archive] - Wizards Community

How to best use Arcane Strike? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Banatine
05-13-07, 01:13 PM I am playing a lvl 11 duskblade, and I took arcane strike at 9th level, but since I have taken it I haven't really used it much, since I don't really know how to.

What is the best way to use it? the best spell level? I was thinking that it would be 2nd, since I have found very little use of 2nd level spells other than deflect.

Also, is it a good idea to buy a ring of wizardry (II) just to provide spell levels for the use of arcane strike? Or would I be better off buying a ring of wizardry (I), and getting more arcane channelling?
Alvoros Darkleaf
05-13-07, 01:41 PM I have a 15th level duskblade, and don't actually use my Arcane Channel that often, but when I do, I use it most often when other channeled spells will not work...for example when the opponents are immune to certain spell effects, or have very high SR (quite common in our games). For particularly tough opponents, I will just add it on sometimes...particularly if I am full attacking a single opponent, because Arcane strike effects the target multiple times in one round, whereas channelling a spell only effects the target once, even though I am hitting 3 times.

As to the 2nd level spells, I do a lot of scorching ray, see invisiblilty, Swift invisibility, and Dimension hop...I find them all quite valuable...but again...this is required for our DM's style....YMMV.

A feat you may want to consider is Verstatile Spellcaster (RDr). It let's you power a spell with two spells of a lower level....for example...you could burn off two 2nd level spells to power a 3rd level...quite handy.

I find I have more than enough spell slots, so have not considered the wizardry rings.

Alvo
penchant
05-14-07, 01:40 AM Arcane stike is a good general buffer. Burn a spell as a free action, get bonus damage and bonuses to hit. Use it anytime you aren't hitting often or when you aren't getting the damage bonus you like. My bard uses it often when he is called upon to join the fray. It makes up for the 3/4 BAB quite well.
Banatine
05-14-07, 04:25 AM Is it a good idea to combine arcane strike with chanelling? Like using shocking grasp, and burning a spell?

Normally I don't because i don't want to use up my spells too quickly. (My DM makes the majority of our battles very long, but against single opponents, like FF boss battles, with his home made monsters.)
penchant
05-14-07, 02:52 PM Its a good idea to use those spells that you are not likely to use by themselves. Most people avoid shocking grasp at higher levels in lieu of spells with a higher damage cap. However an extra 5d6 electrical damage is a nice capper on an otherwise boosted melee attack.
Ischtan
05-15-07, 12:19 AM In my opinion Arcane Strike is a good option for a Spellthief. If you steal a spell you have no use for, just use it as bonus DMG and TC the next round. And by the way one can increase the damage this way a lot! To steal a spell costs 1d6 of your sneak DMG, now if you steal a 4th lvl spell, next attack you can have +4TC and +4d4 dmg...
Cold Napalm
05-15-07, 12:46 AM arcane strike is good for when you absolutely positively need to do damage. It bypasses SR, DR, ER and any other Rs I forgot.
Fireclave
05-15-07, 01:47 AM arcane strike is good for when you absolutely positively need to do damage. It bypasses SR, DR, ER and any other Rs I forgot.
Like PR :P

Arcane Strike, since it adds to your attack rolls, it is also good for when you really need to hit. The bonus is nameless, so it stacks with any and all other buffs you have up. And it is a free action to activate, so you can count on getting the bonus right now, when you probably need it most. No additional standard actions to buff required.

Also, Arcane Strike works well with feats that allow you to get additional attacks per round since each attack made the round you use Arcane Strike continues to benefit from the additional to-hit and damage. Cleave, Combat Reflexes, and the TWF chain can all make good use of this feat.

As for Rings of Wizardry, if for some reason you find yourself using Arcane Strike alot (and I mean to the point where you're running out of spells per day to power the feat), they might be worth the investment. Rings of Wizardry are more economical for duskblades then they are for most other arcane spell casters. For the spell levels duskblades are able to cast, they get a lot of spells per day; many more spell slots of those levels than a wizard or sorcerer. For example, a 20th level sorcerer with a Ring of Wizardry gets a bonus of six additional 1st level spell slots. A duskblade of the same level gets 10 additional spell per day from the same ring.

That said, with as many spells per day that duskblades get, you probably shouldn't find yourself in want or need of more. If you find yourself running out of spells per day often at higher levels it would probably be easier on your wallet to reevaluate and change your tactics. Rings of Wizardry can get really expensive.
Chimaera2000
05-15-07, 06:19 AM It's best used as a full attack, preferably alongside your Arcane Channeling-powered full attack.

I'm not familiar with the duskblade's upper-level spells, so I can't offer anything more specific.
dragon221284
05-16-07, 01:50 AM <--- level 23 Duskblade and i used this feat very very often :)
use it with fullattacks and with a channeled Vamp touch, burn out your max spelllevel (out of 3rd level, cos vamp touch)
wonlee76
05-16-07, 10:19 AM For an added boost to damage, Arcane Strike + Power Attack works really good too.
Banatine
05-16-07, 11:26 AM Thanks for the feedback, everyone, but now i have another question.

Since using a spell for arcane strike is a free action that doesn't provoke AoO's, can you do it more than once in a turn?

(I am assuming no, because otherwise I can buy those rings of wizardry and get access to all sorts of god-threateningly high damage levels.)
TheCobra
05-16-07, 11:32 AM Since using a spell for arcane strike is a free action that doesn't provoke AoO's, can you do it more than once in a turn?

Yeah, but it doesn't stack. Though maybe it'd let you roll xd4 more than once and pick the best. I'm not sure about that.
Eerongal
05-16-07, 11:35 AM Thanks for the feedback, everyone, but now i have another question.

Since using a spell for arcane strike is a free action that doesn't provoke AoO's, can you do it more than once in a turn?

(I am assuming no, because otherwise I can buy those rings of wizardry and get access to all sorts of god-threateningly high damage levels.)

I would say no, since more than likely it's one of those moves that is better described as a swift action, yet came out before swift actions were around.
TheCobra
05-16-07, 11:54 AM Unless errata has come out, it's still a free action. If they'd wanted to limit it to once per turn, they'd have done that. Also, the feat only applies to one melee weapon with each use. If you want the bonus on two short swords, you have to use the feat twice in one round.
Banatine
05-16-07, 12:54 PM I would say it should be limited to one spell per turn, since i just worked out that if i had 4 rings of wizardry (theoretically), at lvl 20 I could burn all my spells and perform a full attack with +214 to hit and +214d4 damage on each swing (assuming that untyped bunuses stack with each other), meaning a total of (unless is it possible to miss with that bonus) +856d4 damage.

Not taking into account the damage of my longsword, with an avarage of 428 damage coming from that arcane blowout per attack, most gods will be hard pressed to pass the DBMD rolls (and still unlikely to survive if they do!). For that reason, I think it really should be limited to 1 spell per turn.

(Not often you see people trying to limit their own power around here, is it?)
solbergb
05-16-07, 12:58 PM Use it whenever you are standing next to somebody and you don't think that your full attack without it will get him dead. Use a big enough spell to be sure you'll make him dead.

That's the essentials of it. The rest is finetuning and specific to exact situations. I would err on using it fairly routinely when you can full attack vs not using it and "saving" spells for later. If in doubt, burn a lower level spell.
wonlee76
05-16-07, 01:04 PM Maybe my memory is bad, but I thought Arcane Strike limited the amount of spell slots being used to be no higher than your BAB. Kind of like Power Attack.
Banatine
05-16-07, 01:12 PM Maybe my memory is bad, but I thought Arcane Strike limited the amount of spell slots being used to be no higher than your BAB. Kind of like Power Attack.

Ah, true it does limit the attack bonus granted by the feat. However, it does not limit the extra damage in the same way, so the damage I can deal remains unchanged, and if hitting would cause a problem, then I use my 4 quick casts on true strikes.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Banatine 05-13-07, 01:13 PM	I am playing a lvl 11 duskblade, and I took arcane strike at 9th level, but since I have taken it I haven't really used it much, since I don't really know how to. What is the best way to use it? the best spell level? I was thinking that it would be 2nd, since I have found very little use of 2nd level spells other than deflect. Also, is it a good idea to buy a ring of wizardry (II) just to provide spell levels for the use of arcane strike? Or would I be better off buying a ring of wizardry (I), and getting more arcane channelling?
Alvoros Darkleaf 05-13-07, 01:41 PM	I have a 15th level duskblade, and don't actually use my Arcane Channel that often, but when I do, I use it most often when other channeled spells will not work...for example when the opponents are immune to certain spell effects, or have very high SR (quite common in our games). For particularly tough opponents, I will just add it on sometimes...particularly if I am full attacking a single opponent, because Arcane strike effects the target multiple times in one round, whereas channelling a spell only effects the target once, even though I am hitting 3 times. As to the 2nd level spells, I do a lot of scorching ray, see invisiblilty, Swift invisibility, and Dimension hop...I find them all quite valuable...but again...this is required for our DM's style....YMMV. A feat you may want to consider is Verstatile Spellcaster (RDr). It let's you power a spell with two spells of a lower level....for example...you could burn off two 2nd level spells to power a 3rd level...quite handy. I find I have more than enough spell slots, so have not considered the wizardry rings. Alvo
penchant 05-14-07, 01:40 AM	Arcane stike is a good general buffer. Burn a spell as a free action, get bonus damage and bonuses to hit. Use it anytime you aren't hitting often or when you aren't getting the damage bonus you like. My bard uses it often when he is called upon to join the fray. It makes up for the 3/4 BAB quite well.
Banatine 05-14-07, 04:25 AM	Is it a good idea to combine arcane strike with chanelling? Like using shocking grasp, and burning a spell? Normally I don't because i don't want to use up my spells too quickly. (My DM makes the majority of our battles very long, but against single opponents, like FF boss battles, with his home made monsters.)
penchant 05-14-07, 02:52 PM	Its a good idea to use those spells that you are not likely to use by themselves. Most people avoid shocking grasp at higher levels in lieu of spells with a higher damage cap. However an extra 5d6 electrical damage is a nice capper on an otherwise boosted melee attack.
Ischtan 05-15-07, 12:19 AM	In my opinion Arcane Strike is a good option for a Spellthief. If you steal a spell you have no use for, just use it as bonus DMG and TC the next round. And by the way one can increase the damage this way a lot! To steal a spell costs 1d6 of your sneak DMG, now if you steal a 4th lvl spell, next attack you can have +4TC and +4d4 dmg...
Cold Napalm 05-15-07, 12:46 AM	arcane strike is good for when you absolutely positively need to do damage. It bypasses SR, DR, ER and any other Rs I forgot.
Fireclave 05-15-07, 01:47 AM	arcane strike is good for when you absolutely positively need to do damage. It bypasses SR, DR, ER and any other Rs I forgot. Like PR :P Arcane Strike, since it adds to your attack rolls, it is also good for when you really need to hit. The bonus is nameless, so it stacks with any and all other buffs you have up. And it is a free action to activate, so you can count on getting the bonus right now, when you probably need it most. No additional standard actions to buff required. Also, Arcane Strike works well with feats that allow you to get additional attacks per round since each attack made the round you use Arcane Strike continues to benefit from the additional to-hit and damage. Cleave, Combat Reflexes, and the TWF chain can all make good use of this feat. As for Rings of Wizardry, if for some reason you find yourself using Arcane Strike alot (and I mean to the point where you're running out of spells per day to power the feat), they might be worth the investment. Rings of Wizardry are more economical for duskblades then they are for most other arcane spell casters. For the spell levels duskblades are able to cast, they get a lot of spells per day; many more spell slots of those levels than a wizard or sorcerer. For example, a 20th level sorcerer with a Ring of Wizardry gets a bonus of six additional 1st level spell slots. A duskblade of the same level gets 10 additional spell per day from the same ring. That said, with as many spells per day that duskblades get, you probably shouldn't find yourself in want or need of more. If you find yourself running out of spells per day often at higher levels it would probably be easier on your wallet to reevaluate and change your tactics. Rings of Wizardry can get really expensive.
Chimaera2000 05-15-07, 06:19 AM	It's best used as a full attack, preferably alongside your Arcane Channeling-powered full attack. I'm not familiar with the duskblade's upper-level spells, so I can't offer anything more specific.
dragon221284 05-16-07, 01:50 AM	<--- level 23 Duskblade and i used this feat very very often :) use it with fullattacks and with a channeled Vamp touch, burn out your max spelllevel (out of 3rd level, cos vamp touch)
wonlee76 05-16-07, 10:19 AM	For an added boost to damage, Arcane Strike + Power Attack works really good too.
Banatine 05-16-07, 11:26 AM	Thanks for the feedback, everyone, but now i have another question. Since using a spell for arcane strike is a free action that doesn't provoke AoO's, can you do it more than once in a turn? (I am assuming no, because otherwise I can buy those rings of wizardry and get access to all sorts of god-threateningly high damage levels.)
TheCobra 05-16-07, 11:32 AM	Since using a spell for arcane strike is a free action that doesn't provoke AoO's, can you do it more than once in a turn? Yeah, but it doesn't stack. Though maybe it'd let you roll xd4 more than once and pick the best. I'm not sure about that.
Eerongal 05-16-07, 11:35 AM	Thanks for the feedback, everyone, but now i have another question. Since using a spell for arcane strike is a free action that doesn't provoke AoO's, can you do it more than once in a turn? (I am assuming no, because otherwise I can buy those rings of wizardry and get access to all sorts of god-threateningly high damage levels.) I would say no, since more than likely it's one of those moves that is better described as a swift action, yet came out before swift actions were around.
TheCobra 05-16-07, 11:54 AM	Unless errata has come out, it's still a free action. If they'd wanted to limit it to once per turn, they'd have done that. Also, the feat only applies to one melee weapon with each use. If you want the bonus on two short swords, you have to use the feat twice in one round.
Banatine 05-16-07, 12:54 PM	I would say it should be limited to one spell per turn, since i just worked out that if i had 4 rings of wizardry (theoretically), at lvl 20 I could burn all my spells and perform a full attack with +214 to hit and +214d4 damage on each swing (assuming that untyped bunuses stack with each other), meaning a total of (unless is it possible to miss with that bonus) +856d4 damage. Not taking into account the damage of my longsword, with an avarage of 428 damage coming from that arcane blowout per attack, most gods will be hard pressed to pass the DBMD rolls (and still unlikely to survive if they do!). For that reason, I think it really should be limited to 1 spell per turn. (Not often you see people trying to limit their own power around here, is it?)
solbergb 05-16-07, 12:58 PM	Use it whenever you are standing next to somebody and you don't think that your full attack without it will get him dead. Use a big enough spell to be sure you'll make him dead. That's the essentials of it. The rest is finetuning and specific to exact situations. I would err on using it fairly routinely when you can full attack vs not using it and "saving" spells for later. If in doubt, burn a lower level spell.
wonlee76 05-16-07, 01:04 PM	Maybe my memory is bad, but I thought Arcane Strike limited the amount of spell slots being used to be no higher than your BAB. Kind of like Power Attack.
Banatine 05-16-07, 01:12 PM	Maybe my memory is bad, but I thought Arcane Strike limited the amount of spell slots being used to be no higher than your BAB. Kind of like Power Attack. Ah, true it does limit the attack bonus granted by the feat. However, it does not limit the extra damage in the same way, so the damage I can deal remains unchanged, and if hitting would cause a problem, then I use my 4 quick casts on true strikes.