Iaijitsu Focus as a general skill - alright, or bad idea? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Iaijitsu Focus as a general skill - alright, or bad idea? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
StruckingFuggle
03-09-08, 12:39 AM For those of you who don't know, IF is a Cha-based skill from OA, used to add some extra damage based on the check (capped at DC... 50, I think, resulting in +9d6) to an attack made while drawing a weapon on a flat-footed target.

I think there's more than that; buuuut I can't post more lest I fall afoul of the CoC.

Personally, I can see no problem with this being a general skill in general, non-OA, 3.5 campaigns; other than possibly the flavor and I have no problem with the flavor. So let's not talk about that part, okay?

But then again, I can sometimes have a crazy idea of what's balanced.

Does anyone see any problems of balance with making it a general skill (open to Fighters and other martial classes as it seems to fit, so not the Barbarian or Crusader, but possibly the Swordsage or Warblade)?

Also, as a second but related question, personally, I see Autohypnosis as possibly being close to IF in flavor, and as it is IF doesn't have that many uses... would it be broken to give it some of the functions of AH to IF, even in a non-psionic game (actually, all of them except Memorize and possibly Tolerate Poison)?
aelryinth
03-09-08, 01:44 AM Just use Concentration for both, give it to the appropriate classes, and make Iajitsu a feat to access thru concentration, which you can give for free to weapon specialists or something.

Ditto the Autohypnosis...Concentration, uses free to those with psi or spell casting ability. Others can access with a feat.

===Aelryinth
mplindustries
03-09-08, 01:56 AM I think one of the balancing factors in Iaijitsu is that its tied to Charisma, a dumpstat for most melee builds (never my builds, I love Charisma, but most). Constitution, however, the key stat for Concentration, is generally considered one of the most important melee stat (again never for my builds, but I'm clearly the weird one).

As for balanced as a general skill, I see no reason why not. I find melee classes generally strapped for skills anyway, and it only helps in very specific situations that are difficult to set up.

Now, for the record, I don't have OA, but I know plenty about Iaijitsu just from reading all the forum questions about it. I may be missing something, but it seems fine for normal play.

As for Auto-hypnosis, I can't answer that honestly, because I have no idea of the non-damage facets of Iaijitsu Focus.
StruckingFuggle
03-09-08, 04:33 AM I think one of the balancing factors in Iaijitsu is that its tied to Charisma, a dumpstat for most melee builds (never my builds, I love Charisma, but most). Constitution, however, the key stat for Concentration, is generally considered one of the most important melee stat (again never for my builds, but I'm clearly the weird one).

I considered rolling everything from it into Concentration, except I hit two concerns that struck me as problematic:
First, yes, it's keyed to Con, then, rather than Cha;
Second, it seems like suddenly one skill does an awful lot, perhaps a bit much;
Third, I guess, is a thing of flavor; which I didn't much want to bring up, but Concentration being Con gives it a certain flavor of concentration ('soldiering on' ... so hm, I may give it resist caltrops and death, then), rather than sheer unshakable mental focus (where cha makes sense, or at least the way I've been lead to best conceptualize cha).

As for balanced as a general skill, I see no reason why not. I find melee classes generally strapped for skills anyway, and it only helps in very specific situations that are difficult to set up.
Quite true. It could help rogues, especially throw-based ones, if they got it (maybe, but I don't know), but for fighters it's generally not gonna happen very often unless you build for it; but then, hey - enjoy your power.

As for Auto-hypnosis, I can't answer that honestly, because I have no idea of the non-damage facets of Iaijitsu Focus.
I'm not sure they're very notable, heh. I'm not sure there even are any; I'm afb-ish at the moment and can't check, but have a vaguely feeling it does something else... though I may be confusing that for Autohypnosis.

Hrm. What classes is it fitting for? Fighter. CW Samurai (heh, still not a good class :P). Warblade. Swordsage. Swashbuckler? Knight? Duskblade?
teshen
03-09-08, 07:55 PM Autohypnosis (Wis; Trained Only)
You have trained your mind to gain mastery over your body and the mind’s own deepest capabilities.

Check
The DC and the effect of a successful check depend on the task you attempt.

Ignore caltrop wound DC 18
Memorize DC 15
Resist dying DC 20
Resist fear Fear effect DC
Tolerate poison Poison’s DC
Willpower DC 20

Ignore Caltrop Wound
If you are wounded by stepping on a caltrop, your speed is reduced to one-half normal. A successful Autohypnosis check removes this movement penalty. The wound doesn’t go away—it is just ignored through self-persuasion.

Memorize
You can attempt to memorize a long string of numbers, a long passage of verse, or some other particularly difficult piece of information (but you can’t memorize magical writing or similarly exotic scripts). Each successful check allows you to memorize a single page of text (up to 800 words), numbers, diagrams, or sigils (even if you don’t recognize their meaning). If a document is longer than one page, you can make additional checks for each additional page. You always retain this information; however, you can recall it only with another successful Autohypnosis check.

Resist Dying
You can attempt to subconsciously prevent yourself from dying. If you have negative hit points and are losing hit points (at 1 per round, 1 per hour), you can substitute a DC 20 Autohypnosis check for your d% roll to see if you become stable. If the check is successful, you stop losing hit points (you do not gain any hit points, however, as a result of the check). You can substitute this check for the d% roll in later rounds if you are initially unsuccessful.

Resist Fear
In response to any fear effect, you make a saving throw normally. If you fail the saving throw, you can make an Autohypnosis check on your next round even while overcome by fear. If your Autohypnosis check meets or beats the DC for the fear effect, you shrug off the fear. On a failed check, the fear affects you normally, and you gain no further attempts to shrug off that particular fear effect.

Tolerate Poison
You can choose to substitute an Autohypnosis check for a saving throw against any standard poison’s secondary damage or effect. This skill has no effect on the initial saving throw against poison.

Willpower
If reduced to 0 hit points (disabled), you can make an Autohypnosis check. If successful, you can take a normal action while at 0 hit points without taking 1 point of damage. You must make a check for each strenuous action you want to take. A failed Autohypnosis check in this circumstance carries no direct penalty—you can choose not to take the strenuous action and thus avoid the hit point loss. If you do so anyway, you drop to -1 hit points, as normal when disabled.

Action
None. Making an Autohypnosis check doesn’t require an action; it is either a free action (when attempted reactively) or part of another action (when attempted actively).

Try Again
Yes, for memorize and willpower uses, though a success doesn’t cancel the effects of a previous failure. No for the other uses.

Special
If you have the Autonomous feat, you get a +2 bonus on Autohypnosis checks.

Synergy
If you have 5 or more ranks in Autohypnosis, you get a +2 bonus on Knowledge (psionics) checks.
If you have 5 or more ranks in Concentration, you get a +2 bonus on Autohypnosis checks.

Iaijutsu also lets you make checks to do extra damage to inanimate objects, and replaces your initiative in an iaijutsu duel. It also lets you gauge your opponent, similar to the optional sense motive uses... but it is more limited with iaijutsu.

I would suggest keeping the skill more or less as is, but maybe folding the autohypnosis resist fear ability into it... you focus on your target, ignoring anything you feel... and maybe the alter the 'psychic duel' mechanics and power them off the iaijutsu skill rather than a will save... actually that may be too much. :thinks:

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
StruckingFuggle 03-09-08, 12:39 AM	For those of you who don't know, IF is a Cha-based skill from OA, used to add some extra damage based on the check (capped at DC... 50, I think, resulting in +9d6) to an attack made while drawing a weapon on a flat-footed target. I think there's more than that; buuuut I can't post more lest I fall afoul of the CoC. Personally, I can see no problem with this being a general skill in general, non-OA, 3.5 campaigns; other than possibly the flavor and I have no problem with the flavor. So let's not talk about that part, okay? But then again, I can sometimes have a crazy idea of what's balanced. Does anyone see any problems of balance with making it a general skill (open to Fighters and other martial classes as it seems to fit, so not the Barbarian or Crusader, but possibly the Swordsage or Warblade)? Also, as a second but related question, personally, I see Autohypnosis as possibly being close to IF in flavor, and as it is IF doesn't have that many uses... would it be broken to give it some of the functions of AH to IF, even in a non-psionic game (actually, all of them except Memorize and possibly Tolerate Poison)?
aelryinth 03-09-08, 01:44 AM	Just use Concentration for both, give it to the appropriate classes, and make Iajitsu a feat to access thru concentration, which you can give for free to weapon specialists or something. Ditto the Autohypnosis...Concentration, uses free to those with psi or spell casting ability. Others can access with a feat. ===Aelryinth
mplindustries 03-09-08, 01:56 AM	I think one of the balancing factors in Iaijitsu is that its tied to Charisma, a dumpstat for most melee builds (never my builds, I love Charisma, but most). Constitution, however, the key stat for Concentration, is generally considered one of the most important melee stat (again never for my builds, but I'm clearly the weird one). As for balanced as a general skill, I see no reason why not. I find melee classes generally strapped for skills anyway, and it only helps in very specific situations that are difficult to set up. Now, for the record, I don't have OA, but I know plenty about Iaijitsu just from reading all the forum questions about it. I may be missing something, but it seems fine for normal play. As for Auto-hypnosis, I can't answer that honestly, because I have no idea of the non-damage facets of Iaijitsu Focus.
StruckingFuggle 03-09-08, 04:33 AM	I think one of the balancing factors in Iaijitsu is that its tied to Charisma, a dumpstat for most melee builds (never my builds, I love Charisma, but most). Constitution, however, the key stat for Concentration, is generally considered one of the most important melee stat (again never for my builds, but I'm clearly the weird one). I considered rolling everything from it into Concentration, except I hit two concerns that struck me as problematic: First, yes, it's keyed to Con, then, rather than Cha; Second, it seems like suddenly one skill does an awful lot, perhaps a bit much; Third, I guess, is a thing of flavor; which I didn't much want to bring up, but Concentration being Con gives it a certain flavor of concentration ('soldiering on' ... so hm, I may give it resist caltrops and death, then), rather than sheer unshakable mental focus (where cha makes sense, or at least the way I've been lead to best conceptualize cha). As for balanced as a general skill, I see no reason why not. I find melee classes generally strapped for skills anyway, and it only helps in very specific situations that are difficult to set up. Quite true. It could help rogues, especially throw-based ones, if they got it (maybe, but I don't know), but for fighters it's generally not gonna happen very often unless you build for it; but then, hey - enjoy your power. As for Auto-hypnosis, I can't answer that honestly, because I have no idea of the non-damage facets of Iaijitsu Focus. I'm not sure they're very notable, heh. I'm not sure there even are any; I'm afb-ish at the moment and can't check, but have a vaguely feeling it does something else... though I may be confusing that for Autohypnosis. Hrm. What classes is it fitting for? Fighter. CW Samurai (heh, still not a good class :P). Warblade. Swordsage. Swashbuckler? Knight? Duskblade?
teshen 03-09-08, 07:55 PM	Autohypnosis (Wis; Trained Only) You have trained your mind to gain mastery over your body and the mind’s own deepest capabilities. Check The DC and the effect of a successful check depend on the task you attempt. Ignore caltrop wound DC 18 Memorize DC 15 Resist dying DC 20 Resist fear Fear effect DC Tolerate poison Poison’s DC Willpower DC 20 Ignore Caltrop Wound If you are wounded by stepping on a caltrop, your speed is reduced to one-half normal. A successful Autohypnosis check removes this movement penalty. The wound doesn’t go away—it is just ignored through self-persuasion. Memorize You can attempt to memorize a long string of numbers, a long passage of verse, or some other particularly difficult piece of information (but you can’t memorize magical writing or similarly exotic scripts). Each successful check allows you to memorize a single page of text (up to 800 words), numbers, diagrams, or sigils (even if you don’t recognize their meaning). If a document is longer than one page, you can make additional checks for each additional page. You always retain this information; however, you can recall it only with another successful Autohypnosis check. Resist Dying You can attempt to subconsciously prevent yourself from dying. If you have negative hit points and are losing hit points (at 1 per round, 1 per hour), you can substitute a DC 20 Autohypnosis check for your d% roll to see if you become stable. If the check is successful, you stop losing hit points (you do not gain any hit points, however, as a result of the check). You can substitute this check for the d% roll in later rounds if you are initially unsuccessful. Resist Fear In response to any fear effect, you make a saving throw normally. If you fail the saving throw, you can make an Autohypnosis check on your next round even while overcome by fear. If your Autohypnosis check meets or beats the DC for the fear effect, you shrug off the fear. On a failed check, the fear affects you normally, and you gain no further attempts to shrug off that particular fear effect. Tolerate Poison You can choose to substitute an Autohypnosis check for a saving throw against any standard poison’s secondary damage or effect. This skill has no effect on the initial saving throw against poison. Willpower If reduced to 0 hit points (disabled), you can make an Autohypnosis check. If successful, you can take a normal action while at 0 hit points without taking 1 point of damage. You must make a check for each strenuous action you want to take. A failed Autohypnosis check in this circumstance carries no direct penalty—you can choose not to take the strenuous action and thus avoid the hit point loss. If you do so anyway, you drop to -1 hit points, as normal when disabled. Action None. Making an Autohypnosis check doesn’t require an action; it is either a free action (when attempted reactively) or part of another action (when attempted actively). Try Again Yes, for memorize and willpower uses, though a success doesn’t cancel the effects of a previous failure. No for the other uses. Special If you have the Autonomous feat, you get a +2 bonus on Autohypnosis checks. Synergy If you have 5 or more ranks in Autohypnosis, you get a +2 bonus on Knowledge (psionics) checks. If you have 5 or more ranks in Concentration, you get a +2 bonus on Autohypnosis checks. Iaijutsu also lets you make checks to do extra damage to inanimate objects, and replaces your initiative in an iaijutsu duel. It also lets you gauge your opponent, similar to the optional sense motive uses... but it is more limited with iaijutsu. I would suggest keeping the skill more or less as is, but maybe folding the autohypnosis resist fear ability into it... you focus on your target, ignoring anything you feel... and maybe the alter the 'psychic duel' mechanics and power them off the iaijutsu skill rather than a will save... actually that may be too much. :thinks: